Does God exist?

[mrgoodstuff]

Praying is meditation, just puts you in the zone.

The focus that it is "god" or something OUTSIDE of you, is that often times enough things outside of us have to "bless" us.

 

[backseatjuan]

I prefer to think YES. Think about it for a minute, who created universe? Don't have to think about universe in 40 billion light years distance, big bang, multiverse and all that, just have to think about higgs field. The matrix of matter. It always existed you say? I hear you, but, matter is energy condensed, where did the energy come from?

There was this movie, The Mothman Prophecies, something from another dimension, such that it could see time itself, contacted people. Just like in this movie we could exist inside a lake, not realizing that above water there are beings watching us.

Those damn illuminati what force or beings contact during their yearly bohemian groove fvck fest? Devil himself or God?

There is something, and even more there are somethings out of our physical world reality, that do exist. Be it force or field that react to certain vibration, or extra-dimensional aliens, or devil, or God.


Duality come to us recently, with the advent of Christianity. Prior there was no good or evil. I think the most accurate religion that has understand of God is Buddhism.

 

[zekko]

The focus that it is "god" or something OUTSIDE of you, is that often times enough things outside of us have to "bless" us.

If there is a God, then God would also be something that is inside of you. Depending on your religion, I suppose.

 

[Deep Dish]

Evidence points toward an intelligent designer.

“Any possible universe could be explained as the work of some sort of designer. Even a universe that is completely chaotic, without any laws or regularities at all, could be supposed to have been designed by an idiot.”

—Steven Weinberg, 1969 Noble Prize winning physicist

 

[Serenity]

We are bipedal bipolar animals. Neither an Epicurean, nor a Stoic be... rather be both.

It's hard to be dogmatic, one way or the other, about God. If it helps you live your life happily and abundantly, then believe on pragmatic grounds.

I think that's exactly why many believe it. Openly being an atheist will close a few doors in life even though that's religious discrimination. Many people are impossible to convince of anything else because they have strong personal interests in believing it. It's like asking them to give away everything in life, it's not gonna happen.

 

[Tenacity]

I believe that Intelligent Design proves the existence of SOME type of being higher than human existence. Now whether there's a heaven, hell, etc.....that's up for anybody's personal belief system. But there is surely Intelligent Design and I'm not sure a BIG BANG in the sky created everything.

But I stand on what I said earlier, that I don't believe this creator has day-to-day control over what happens to us in life. What happens to us in this life is a direct AND indirect result of OUR personal choices, the personal choices of others around us, and the personal choices of other men/women whose actions have influence on our daily lives.

- It's like I said, instead of praying all day damn......fight back by acquiring resources, power, and influence.

- Fight back by making intelligent decisions with your body, time, energy, finances, and where you decide to live, work, and associate with.

- Instead of praying for blessings, focus on self-improvement, set goals, and go out there and GET what the fvck it is you want.

- And for the life of me, please do not give 10% of your GROSS to a pot belly, pulpit, scamming a.ss Pastor who uses your hard earned money to buy limos, houses, cars, etc., to show off in front of you about how God has "blessed him". If you want to GIVE to a cause, go directly to the cause and give to it. Don't give shyt to Non Profits, especially Churches, as most of them are scams who play on your emotions to get you to open your pocket book.

 

[ChristopherColumbus]

I think that's exactly why many believe it. Openly being an atheist will close a few doors in life even though that's religious discrimination. Many people are impossible to convince of anything else because they have strong personal interests in believing it. It's like asking them to give away everything in life, it's not gonna happen.

Sure, but to keep it at the philosophic level, the nature of metaphysical reality is open-ended... there are no bookends to our beliefs, there are no proofs. Kant is the philosopher who best explains this.

But then we are wired a certain way to have metaphysical belief, but this does not rest solely on rational principles... or if they do, they can not be rationalized. Rationality at best serves as a series of signs pointing one way or the other. The way in which we go seems to involve other faculties, and then our own personal will [I think it is this kind of reasonable belief that separates faith from fanaticism]. Why one person chooses to be a theist and another an atheist remains a mystery, just as much as the act of free will itself does. This is also why I prefer Kant, and then the latter existentialists, as they perceive the primary Will has over Reason.

There seem to be certain notions/ instincts we have which serve in not only regulating our convictions, but in developing a fuller more magnanimous life. This is perhaps expressed better in poetry than philosophy:

The Fossicker

He saw the open-endedness of life,
Forsook careers, never took a wife.
Property, to him, was but legal fiction,
And systems no more than weighty diction;
An inner instinct would never die,
And from enclosure he’d ever fly
To gaze upon the lie of the land,
Or absorb himself in what lay at hand.

He marveled that it should be at all,
For in the intellect, there was no fall.
As for the seasons, he’d correspond;
Among them were none he found less fond,
But to each he would sing their praises
As if they’d lined up to bring him favors.
Indeed, he thought he were the richest man
There on the bank-side with pan in hand.

 

[guru1000]

“Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent.
Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent.
Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil?
Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?”

― Epicurus

Logical fallacy here for Epicurus. The assumption is that "evil" serves no greater purpose, and if "evil" were a necessary precedent toward establishing "good," then "evil" is inherently "good."

Same diametrical concept would apply to "pain" and "growth." Pain is "evil" and "growth is "good," but one must experience "pain" before one "grows." Thus, "pain" is inherently good.

 

[Bible_Belt]

I thought this was funny:
http://m.mlb.com/news/article/203860150/tim-tebow-hits-home-run-in-instructional-ball/
Tebow homers on first instructional league pitch

 

[speed dawg]

But I stand on what I said earlier, that I don't believe this creator has day-to-day control over what happens to us in life. What happens to us in this life is a direct AND indirect result of OUR personal choices, the personal choices of others around us, and the personal choices of other men/women whose actions have influence on our daily lives.

We have freedom of choice, no doubt about that. Sure we have direct and indirect control over 80% of our lives......but what about the other 20%?

- It's like I said, instead of praying all day damn......fight back by acquiring resources, power, and influence.

- Fight back by making intelligent decisions with your body, time, energy, finances, and where you decide to live, work, and associate with.

- Instead of praying for blessings, focus on self-improvement, set goals, and go out there and GET what the fvck it is you want.

You can do all these things, and you're never ful-filled, happy, etc. Why is that? What pushed Michael Phelps to the brink of suicide? No, there's something more than just going out and accomplishing the spoils of the earth.

What I am asking you to do is look deep down and ask YOURSELF these questions. Not outward answers, like what you would say here. What do you REALLY believe deep down? I think we all know that there is a higher power at play, even if we won't admit it openly.

At the end of the day, if asked if we have control over our own lives, and I had to answer yes or no, I would say no. Even though we may have 80% control, we don't have CONTROL, because it's not 100%.

 

[BetterCallSaul]

I think God exists, yes. There are many personal reasons why I believe this and frankly I have no desire to share those with anyone. But I will share a couple of them which I've come to find make sense for most people I talk to.

First, we as people have the ability to do something completely different than what would be expected in nature given the behaviors of animals. An animal attacks another animal, they usually fight. Some people can simply sit there and let another person attack them without doing anything. Some people will defend others who are not their family.

Second, we as a people are able to grasp the mathematical concept of infinity.

 

[speed dawg]

I think God exists, yes. There are many personal reasons why I believe this and frankly I have no desire to share those with anyone. But I will share a couple of them which I've come to find make sense for most people I talk to.

First, we as people have the ability to do something completely different than what would be expected in nature given the behaviors of animals. An animal attacks another animal, they usually fight. Some people can simply sit there and let another person attack them without doing anything. Some people will defend others who are not their family.

Second, we as a people are able to grasp the mathematical concept of infinity.

Yeah, anyone who still clings to the possibility that we evolved from animals is simply dumb, at this point. Study after study says that while evolution is real, there are certain lines it cannot cross, and always stays within certain boundaries. For instance, a bird will always be a bird, it won't eventually morph into a dog. Also, you cannot create human from a test tube. Scientists have tried this forever, and while holding nearly all variables at the perfect state ( ie impossible in nature), the DNA or whatever they created was useless. It can't happen, except through supernatural means.

 

[guru1000]

I think God exists, yes. There are many personal reasons why I believe this and frankly I have no desire to share those with anyone. But I will share a couple of them which I've come to find make sense for most people I talk to.

First, we as people have the ability to do something completely different than what would be expected in nature given the behaviors of animals. An animal attacks another animal, they usually fight. Some people can simply sit there and let another person attack them without doing anything. Some people will defend others who are not their family.
.

This is not evidence of God, but rather that we differ from animals in that we have choice in spite of instinct.

The greater evidence of God lies in the transcendental intelligence of how life and the universe operate in perfect harmony and order without a physical being to which to attribute such intelligence to, as well as the mountains of testimonies purported by the affiants of NDE's. Couple this with carnal limitations of our awareness constricted by five mammalia senses, and we can extrapolate that we don't have the omniscient awareness to see all that is actually occurring.

I would further argue that those who subscribe to reality limited to what can be perceived strictly by their five senses are foolish. Just because we can't see, feel, hear, touch, or taste gravity, does not mean that it does not exist. More practical, absent of evidence for or against, is to say that "it" may exist. Even more practical to say that because "it" cannot be unequivocally proven nor disproven, better to take the position of what empowers YOU most.

 

[corrector]

I think the question should not really be if God exists or not, but whether we are going to heaven or hell after we die. I'd be allot more concerned about that. Arguing His existence would be futile at this point. Here is my issue:

1) There are thousands upon thousands of youtube videos of testimonies of people who gave their life to Jesus Christ from various other religions. You see very few testimonies of Christians who became atheists or changed to another religion at all on youtube. Do a channel search for yourself.
2) There are plenty of youtube videos that talk about people who are Christians who thought they were saved ending up in hell because Jesus looks at if you even harbour lust on another woman or anything in your heart and anything could go against you. You read the comments section and lots of people praise God and are blessed watching these videos of how unsuspecting Christians are thrown into hell for stuff like masturbating once a month or whatever.

Therefore, it's not a question if God exists, the question is He is merciful to you or not to you when you encounter Him on judgment day after you die.

Now we know that He sent His Son Jesus to die for our sins and that sins keeps us from being in fellowship with God. But just saying a sinner's prayer and making a commitment to the Lord is not even enough on these videos. You actually really also have to repent of sins, big time, and you can't toy with a pet sin either. At least according to the preponderance of such videos that are out there.

Take one of them for example here:

At this point, should we be even arguing whether God exists or not?

 

[corrector]

- So for example, guys praying to God to "bring them a good woman" is stupid because I don't believe God has control over our day-to-day operations. Instead of praying to God to bring you a good woman, you should seek out some other type of MAN (or WOMAN) who can provide guidance in helping you find a good woman or bringing you a good woman directly.

I prayed for a broken lightbulb to work rather than call an electrician, and it worked. Therefore, I have seen first hand that God is very much in control of day to day operations and is interested in saving money from using an electrician to fix a broken lightbulb. I have been one of those who have prayed for a good woman and have not seen that type of prayer answered. Maybe some prayers are easier to get answered than others.

- Another example, instead of praying to God for "financial blessings and to get your financial house in order", you should seek out supply/demand to figure out what skills you can provide to the market in exchange for the market providing you income/revenue. You would then pay off any costs of supplying said demand from the income/revenue you received and the profits (minus taxes) will be what you have left over. Then you would seek out budgeting, spending control, etc. All of these are MAN-MADE principles based on Social Sciences.

Yeah, but in some places these type of options are very limited. Also if what you are saying is true then why is the wealth distribution extremely skewed? God can give you an idea and then you can make an invention and patent it and make your millions. People may also have allot of issues out there that require intervention, especially if you are poor and Black.

- Don't pray to God for peace, seek out a group of men (an army) that can help bring about peace.

You seem to believe allot in seeking out other people. Good thing you haven't been stabbed in the back that often enough to be jaded.

- Don't pray to God for healing, seek out a man (doctor) that can treat the symptoms, explain the disease, and whose partnered with other men (drug manufacturers) that can eliminate the disease.

Lots of healing testimonies around of God healing someone directly. God can use doctors too if the faith is running on low-empty.
Doctors can still make nasty mistakes, you can get anti-bacteria resistant bugs from the hospital and end up with a infection that kills you quickly. Not to mention you could also get a life-threatening side-effect with the wrong drug. Therefore, even going to a doctor you really need to pray.

 

[guru1000]

I think the question should not really be if God exists or not, but whether we are going to heaven or hell after we die. I'd be allot more concerned about that. Arguing His existence would be futile at this point. Here is my issue:

1) There are thousands upon thousands of youtube videos of testimonies of people who gave their life to Jesus Christ from various other religions. You see very few testimonies of Christians who became atheists or changed to another religion at all on youtube. Do a channel search for yourself.
2) There are plenty of youtube videos that talk about people who are Christians who thought they were saved ending up in hell because Jesus looks at if you even harbour lust on another woman or anything in your heart and anything could go against you. You read the comments section and lots of people praise God and are blessed watching these videos of how unsuspecting Christians are thrown into hell for stuff like masturbating once a month or whatever.

At this point, should we be even arguing whether God exists or not?

Umm ...

Your two points don't evidence God, as there is no first-hand witness of a deity. Instead, you have testimonies of talks and acts for God, but without witness of God.

You are more programmed than you think. I do believe in a higher-power, but not through the lens of social programming.

Now we know that He sent His Son Jesus to die for our sins and that sins keeps us from being in fellowship with God.

No we don't know. This, again, is religious programming.

 

[corrector]

Umm ...

Your two points don't evidence God, as there is no first-hand witness of a deity. Instead, you have testimonies of talks and acts for God, but without witness of God.

You are acknowledging that I have testimonies of talks and acts for God, without the witness of God? What do you mean by that?

Have you seen any of these testimonies yourself? Listen to their voice? Looked at their face? I assure you most of them sound very real, as though they had an experience.

There is another issue with your logic, and it is not sound. How do you know that you won't die if you did see God first-hand? I would make an analogy, if a being exists that upon contact with you, your physical body would evaporate, would you really still want to see that being? The "holiness" of God would be an analogy to that.

Manifestations of a holy God caused people to fear for their lives. Exodus 20:19 -- "let not God speak to us....lest we die". This is because He is perfect, and we are not. Isaiah said "woe unto me a man of unclean lips". He thought he was perfect, he was called to be a prophet! It goes on and on. You are not holy therefore you can not see God and live.

Then there is this other aspect that God is a spirit. If He is in another realm to the physical world, then you have to acknowledge other realms or dimensions exists beyond the 5-senses (touch, taste, smell, feeling, etc...) So, the point is your request for proof is not reasonable based on the above premises. You have to start questioning what is absolute holiness? Is there other dimensions? Are there other realms that exist? What do you make of scientists who have discovered there are more than 4 dimensions in space and possibly up to ten?

You are more programmed than you think. I do believe in a higher-power, but not through the lens of social programming.

Why do you believe in a higher-power if you are saying there is no evidence of God?

No we don't know. This, again, is religious programming.

Fair enough. This is something that you have to be drawn into. Why would people post all of these different tesimonies, NDE's and dreams on youtube for then? They are not in it for the money? Allot of these videos are contrary to "social programming". Social programming/religious programming does not see miracles, believes everything is okay after they die if they say a prayer at one point in their lives no matter how they live afterwards, and in some cases, some Christians don't believe in an after-life.

Why would you think these videos are even popular or are social programming since the content on them is very harsh and not what is talked about much out there?

 

[guru1000]

You are acknowledging that I have testimonies of talks and acts for God, without the witness of God? What do you mean by that?

What I mean is that a third-party testimony could be reliable (although we have to question the sanity and examine the perception of the witness) if they witnessed God, but these third parties to whom you refer in your two bulleted points have not witnessed God, but rather performed acts for God.

There is another issue with your logic, and it is not sound. How do you know that you won't die if you did see God first-hand? I would make an analogy, if a being exists that upon contact with you, your physical body would evaporate, would you really still want to see that being? The "holiness" of God would be an analogy to that.

My inability to witness God due to my "unholiness" is not evidence of God.

Manifestations of a holy God caused people to fear for their lives. Exodus 20:19 -- "let not God speak to us....lest we die". This is because He is perfect, and we are not. Isaiah said "woe unto me a man of unclean lips". He thought he was perfect, he was called to be a prophet! It goes on and on. You are not holy therefore you can not see God and live.

This is a book. I can also write a book of stories and deem it true.

Then there is this other aspect that God is a spirit. If He is in another realm to the physical world, then you have to acknowledge other realms or dimensions exists beyond the 5-senses (touch, taste, smell, feeling, etc...) So, the point is your request for proof is not reasonable based on the above premises. You have to start questioning what is absolute holiness? Is there other dimensions? Are there other realms that exist? What do you make of scientists who have discovered there are more than 4 dimensions in space and possibly up to ten?

This was my argument in Post 35. Why are you stealing my lines and trying to use them against me? LOL. I recited that as to show that we shouldn't be so gullible to state that there is no God because we cannot perceive him.

Why do you believe in a higher-power if you are saying there is no evidence of God?

I said there is no evidence of God. I did not state I don't believe in God. Again, I do believe in God, but not through the lens of religious/social texts or constructs, but rather through my own independent evaluation. Understand?

 

[speed dawg]

No we don't know. This, again, is religious programming.

Yeah, we really do. All the historical evidence, if examined without bias, says that Jesus Christ was born of a virgin, lived 33 years, was crucified by the Romans at the request of the Jews, and came back from the dead. Just because you don't want this to be true, doesn't make it untrue.

Christianity is the only religion based on supernatural events that actually occurred.

 

[guru1000]

Yeah, we really do. All the historical evidence, if examined without bias, says that Jesus Christ was born of a virgin, lived 33 years, was crucified by the Romans at the request of the Jews, and came back from the dead. Just because you don't want this to be true, doesn't make it untrue.

Show me the evidence that Jesus came back from the dead. If you can evidence this, I will change my position regarding Jesus. But you can't. Try if you like, and I'll me more than happy to demonstrate that your evidence is inconclusive.

Though, even if you could evidence Jesus were resurrected--which you can't--this is still not evidence of God. But let's begin with this claim of Jesus begin resurrected. Show me the evidence, and I will show you your programming.