Rather, dihydrotestosterone is dihydrotestosterone for women. It is the libido-causing steroid for both sexes. Here's a chart of steroidogenesis.JohnChops said:
Date Report: Never before have I suspected a girl using me for a free dinner.
- Thread starter sageproduct
- Start date
dating is for losers, you should have invited her to do stuff with you, you would have done anyways even without knowing her
pros:
+ it`s free
+ she`ll know you faster
+ the vibe is casual you can make it into anything
cons:
- only works for guys who have left behind the bs of what they supposed to be or do
pros:
+ it`s free
+ she`ll know you faster
+ the vibe is casual you can make it into anything
cons:
- only works for guys who have left behind the bs of what they supposed to be or do
Atom Smasher
Master Don Juan
I just read through this thread and I must say there is some excellent instruction to be gotten here. Most of the replies have been very insightful and represent some effective lessons in what to do/what not to do.
I'm 55, and even I know that the paradigm of "dating" works against you. Only invite girls to join you in this or that, never present it as a "date". Dates are too formal and carry expectations with them, in both genders.
I'd like to add here a couple of things. Never balk at paying. This has been an expectation since the beginning of time, and it's there for a reason. It DISPLAYS that you are a provider and protector, both of which speak volumes to her on a subconsious level. What a man has to do in courting is not "fair", but it is offset by the fact that a woman, when she submits to you, will be your servant, washing your clothes, cooking for you, etc. A fair trade.
I recommend that every man entirely forgets about the "new-think" of splitting the bill on a first get-together. Pay the bill and demonstrate your power.
Next, NEVER eat salad at dinner, lol. A man eats MEAT. I know very well that a lot of you younger guys don't get this but take it to the bank that eating a salad at a meal appears very unbecoming to women. It is an allegory for the hunter who couldn't bag his prey and therefore has to eat shrubbery. Ordering a nice chunk of meat is the modern allegory for a good kill hunting-wise. She wants a successful hunter. I know this will sound nonsensical to some, but it is a nuance that is true, nonetheless.
I think you definitely demanded "payment" with that kiss attempt. You already know you blew a lot of things but I give you props for being in the game and also for putting yourself out there by telling us the full story and taking the heat.
So in summary, we guys need to get away form the "equal pay" paradigm. "Fairness" is a mental construct based not on reality. Look at paying as an investment, for it is a demonstration of power and provision 100% of the time in a woman's mind. It is CERTAINLY fair to demand parity in other areas, but not here.
As has been mentioned, you would have been better off with just bowling alley hot dogs & fries. You introduced a whole new level of formality that strained things, but it was certainly understandable.
The answer to her text about kissing should have been:
"Yes, you should have."
She sounds like a nice girl, actually. I would give her another shot, for sure. Throw some fries and maybe a burger down her gullet next time and pay without hesitation and WITHOUT talking about that subject. It will cover a multitude of sins.
I'm 55, and even I know that the paradigm of "dating" works against you. Only invite girls to join you in this or that, never present it as a "date". Dates are too formal and carry expectations with them, in both genders.
I'd like to add here a couple of things. Never balk at paying. This has been an expectation since the beginning of time, and it's there for a reason. It DISPLAYS that you are a provider and protector, both of which speak volumes to her on a subconsious level. What a man has to do in courting is not "fair", but it is offset by the fact that a woman, when she submits to you, will be your servant, washing your clothes, cooking for you, etc. A fair trade.
I recommend that every man entirely forgets about the "new-think" of splitting the bill on a first get-together. Pay the bill and demonstrate your power.
Next, NEVER eat salad at dinner, lol. A man eats MEAT. I know very well that a lot of you younger guys don't get this but take it to the bank that eating a salad at a meal appears very unbecoming to women. It is an allegory for the hunter who couldn't bag his prey and therefore has to eat shrubbery. Ordering a nice chunk of meat is the modern allegory for a good kill hunting-wise. She wants a successful hunter. I know this will sound nonsensical to some, but it is a nuance that is true, nonetheless.
I think you definitely demanded "payment" with that kiss attempt. You already know you blew a lot of things but I give you props for being in the game and also for putting yourself out there by telling us the full story and taking the heat.
So in summary, we guys need to get away form the "equal pay" paradigm. "Fairness" is a mental construct based not on reality. Look at paying as an investment, for it is a demonstration of power and provision 100% of the time in a woman's mind. It is CERTAINLY fair to demand parity in other areas, but not here.
As has been mentioned, you would have been better off with just bowling alley hot dogs & fries. You introduced a whole new level of formality that strained things, but it was certainly understandable.
The answer to her text about kissing should have been:
"Yes, you should have."
She sounds like a nice girl, actually. I would give her another shot, for sure. Throw some fries and maybe a burger down her gullet next time and pay without hesitation and WITHOUT talking about that subject. It will cover a multitude of sins.
backbreaker
Master Don Juan
I agree with everything in your post execpt this. in particular beucase I am always on a diet of some sort and I really watch what I eat / calorie count and i'm not throwing that out to impress a broad. I'm not going to **** up a week's worth of macros just to make a girl think i'm more manly and frankly if a woman thinks less of me beucase i watch my waistline she can kiss my black ass lol. my wife could give a flying **** if i'm eating steak or Cesar salad if anything she wants me eating salad.
especially like if the date was spure the moment and i didnt' have time to plan for it, like usually i do my diet for the entire week on sunday morning and plan out what i'm going to eat everyday so if out of the blue i'm going to go out to eat i'm going to eat the most calorie dense thing they have on the menu when we go out on thursday if i only had 3-4 hours to plan it.
those are the same women who dont' like the fact that i dress up or dont' like the fact that i don't listen to their fav type of music. to me that's a woman showing me she's not worth taking seriously, i shouldn't change a god damn thing to impress that broad.
I'm with you on the tab though that's so silly so much ass is lost trying to go dutch. pick up the god damn 32 dollar bill at chilli's and call it a day. **** eat off the 2 for 20 menu lol
Atom Smasher
Master Don Juan
Don't even talk to me, salad eater... 
I should have qualified my assertion by saying it applies to initial meals, during which time she's getting an idea of whom you are. Naturally this doesn't apply in an established relationship. I still say that ordering a salad while she's chewing on meat displays a negative counterpoint that she is aware of subconsciously.
Now matter how one chooses to couch it, both parties are altering their normal behavior in order to make a good impression, even those who say they aren't. It's simply the human condition, the hard-wired mating ritual.
At any rate, hopefully you and I can get some of these cheap-ass guys to spring a few bucks for a meal, eh bb?
I should have qualified my assertion by saying it applies to initial meals, during which time she's getting an idea of whom you are. Naturally this doesn't apply in an established relationship. I still say that ordering a salad while she's chewing on meat displays a negative counterpoint that she is aware of subconsciously.
Now matter how one chooses to couch it, both parties are altering their normal behavior in order to make a good impression, even those who say they aren't. It's simply the human condition, the hard-wired mating ritual.
At any rate, hopefully you and I can get some of these cheap-ass guys to spring a few bucks for a meal, eh bb?
You essentially upped your VALUE in her eyes by showing her that, if she wants you, she has to at times do things that you like to do. You are SOMETHING after all. You are NOT FREE. If she wants to hang with you, it's going to cost her something — time, effort, money.
Quote taken from The SoSuave Guide to Women and Dating, which you can read for FREE.
B
BeDJ
Guest
I'm with Atom on this one, ordering a salad will turn women off. I remember ordering one a few years back on a second date and the chick was like WTF? Granted, she was a little weird, but lesson learned.
If she offers to pay, I would let her. It reflects interest and investment on her end and I would pay for drinks or something afterwards. Most of my successful dates have came after telling the girl, you get drinks I'll get bowling. A test of interest if you will. If she complies with no hesitation, definite IoI. A few bucks shouldn't make or break the date.
If she offers to pay, I would let her. It reflects interest and investment on her end and I would pay for drinks or something afterwards. Most of my successful dates have came after telling the girl, you get drinks I'll get bowling. A test of interest if you will. If she complies with no hesitation, definite IoI. A few bucks shouldn't make or break the date.
sageproduct
Banned
Thx for the replies.
Lol that you guys bring up the salad part. She actually said, "I'm not the kind of girl who's afraid to eat a lot of food on a date." My response was, "I'm not the kind of guy who's afraid to order a salad on a date."
It really was unfortunate that we ended up getting dinner. I mean, I had just eaten a bunch of food with my family before going, so I actually didn't feel like eating at all, but she hadn't eaten a thing all day. Unfortunately, as soon as I asked if she was hungry and she told me that, I felt like it'd just be cruel of me not to take her somewhere to eat. Without thinking things through I walked her into the nearest food place, which happened to be an Italian sit-down restaurant.
What gets me sometimes is that if I'm going on a first date with a girl, she'll almost always assume we're going to dinner. I hate how cliche dinner is. The first date I ever got with a girl from cold approaching, I asked her if she was hungry just to be polite - but she took it to mean I was suggesting that we go grab dinner and said "I'm starving."
So Atom and BB let's say you were on a first date and the girl offered to pay her half. Would you guys refuse and insist on paying the whole thing? My one-itis last year would say "I'll get the tip" and leave cash on the table before I could do anything, and another time she slipped me a $10 on a $20 dinner. Paying/not paying was never something that I believed in strongly one way or the other, so I've never been insistent on anything.
Anyway, I've gone ghost on her since the date. Today, it is 5 days since our date, so I will call her up in a few hours...will post update.
Lol that you guys bring up the salad part. She actually said, "I'm not the kind of girl who's afraid to eat a lot of food on a date." My response was, "I'm not the kind of guy who's afraid to order a salad on a date."
It really was unfortunate that we ended up getting dinner. I mean, I had just eaten a bunch of food with my family before going, so I actually didn't feel like eating at all, but she hadn't eaten a thing all day. Unfortunately, as soon as I asked if she was hungry and she told me that, I felt like it'd just be cruel of me not to take her somewhere to eat. Without thinking things through I walked her into the nearest food place, which happened to be an Italian sit-down restaurant.
What gets me sometimes is that if I'm going on a first date with a girl, she'll almost always assume we're going to dinner. I hate how cliche dinner is. The first date I ever got with a girl from cold approaching, I asked her if she was hungry just to be polite - but she took it to mean I was suggesting that we go grab dinner and said "I'm starving."
So Atom and BB let's say you were on a first date and the girl offered to pay her half. Would you guys refuse and insist on paying the whole thing? My one-itis last year would say "I'll get the tip" and leave cash on the table before I could do anything, and another time she slipped me a $10 on a $20 dinner. Paying/not paying was never something that I believed in strongly one way or the other, so I've never been insistent on anything.
Anyway, I've gone ghost on her since the date. Today, it is 5 days since our date, so I will call her up in a few hours...will post update.
Naughty Ninja
Banned
sageproduct said:
Dude IMO If I ask a chick out it's because I want to go there and I pay. Simple as that. I'm not trying to impress them it's just a place I feel like going.
On a side note: LMAO at the salad tossers in this thread! hahahaha
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ItAzJD0o9NQ
Atom Smasher
Master Don Juan
If she offered, I would probably say, "That's ok, I got it", and if she insisted I would let her. Or I might say, "You get the tip then".
Purefilth
Master Don Juan
"Then YOU can have MY tipAtom Smasher said:
"
sageproduct
Banned
Igetit!
Moderator
BeginningDJ said:
Heh..you're right man. It's stupid.....DAMN it seems so stupid that something as minor as ordering a salad would have an effect on a woman's attraction.....BUT IT DOES.
I remember an episode of "Seinfeld" where Jerry went on a date and when the waiter came by,the woman order steak and a baked potato,while Jerry only order a salad. You should have seen the look on the woman's face. :crackup:
Right when Jerry did that,HE KNEW he made a mistake. The whole rest of the episode he spends all his time trying to prove how "manly" his is by eating meat for the chick.
Here's the salad scene......
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4XttdO1yipo
sageproduct
Banned
Did my act of going ghost on her for 5 days turn her off?
So I was doing my laundry a few hours ago and stepped outside for a minute to give her a call. She answered very faintly, so I asked if she could hear me. She then asked, "Who is this?"
Lol. Did she delete my number as a reaction to me ignoring her for 5 days? Did she "next" me, assuming I'm not interested/am a player for going ghost on her?
Whatever. I got the conversation going, we caught up a bit. Apparently she was napping when I called and woke her up. Then, about 5 minutes into the conversation, this stray cat walks up to me and starts nuzzling me. I freak out a bit and tell her what's going on, then she excuses herself and says she's going to go back to sleep and that we can talk later.
It's weird man. She seems like she's a good girl and all, but I honestly couldn't give less of a sh1t about her. I have a history of always getting too needy, getting way too attached way too early with girls, but I literally feel ZERO attachment to this girl. Maybe it's cuz it's the first time I've ever legitimately had more than 1 plate (I had 3 dates last week), or maybe it's because I have one-itis for the other girl.
So I was doing my laundry a few hours ago and stepped outside for a minute to give her a call. She answered very faintly, so I asked if she could hear me. She then asked, "Who is this?"
Lol. Did she delete my number as a reaction to me ignoring her for 5 days? Did she "next" me, assuming I'm not interested/am a player for going ghost on her?
Whatever. I got the conversation going, we caught up a bit. Apparently she was napping when I called and woke her up. Then, about 5 minutes into the conversation, this stray cat walks up to me and starts nuzzling me. I freak out a bit and tell her what's going on, then she excuses herself and says she's going to go back to sleep and that we can talk later.
It's weird man. She seems like she's a good girl and all, but I honestly couldn't give less of a sh1t about her. I have a history of always getting too needy, getting way too attached way too early with girls, but I literally feel ZERO attachment to this girl. Maybe it's cuz it's the first time I've ever legitimately had more than 1 plate (I had 3 dates last week), or maybe it's because I have one-itis for the other girl.
Tell her a little about yourself, but not too much. Maintain some mystery. Give her something to think about and wonder about when she's at home.
Quote taken from The SoSuave Guide to Women and Dating, which you can read for FREE.
backbreaker
Master Don Juan
i'm not saying you aren't right. I'm saying i really don't give a ****. It's one of those things that if you are going to crituqe me on that, then you can go.Atom Smasher said:Don't even talk to me, salad eater...
I should have qualified my assertion by saying it applies to initial meals, during which time she's getting an idea of whom you are. Naturally this doesn't apply in an established relationship. I still say that ordering a salad while she's chewing on meat displays a negative counterpoint that she is aware of subconsciously.
Now matter how one chooses to couch it, both parties are altering their normal behavior in order to make a good impression, even those who say they aren't. It's simply the human condition, the hard-wired mating ritual.
At any rate, hopefully you and I can get some of these cheap-ass guys to spring a few bucks for a meal, eh bb?
that's just like you knowing my drug histlory, a girl thinking i'm a square beucase i won't drink. and it's happened. you know what, GTFO. there are some things i'm just not gonna do to impress a girl regardless of what it makes her think of me. I'm not changing my sobriety date to impress a *****. i'm not eating **** i don't want to eat to impress a *****. this coming from a guy who was once 5'8 and 240 i'm anal about my food. if she wants to go she can catch a cab. i'm not dying.
ps- let me re explain, i do drink from time to time when i say soberity date i mean crack cocaine. but I make it a rule to never drink around someone i've not been around before. that's how i got hooked in the first place, drinking with a girl who then broke out a white bag and now after like 3-4 beers i'm like **** it lol. i won't drink around someone unless i know they aren't that type of person. so if a new girl i'm dating thinks i'm a square if id ont' drink i really don't care.
B
BeDJ
Guest
Women are natural plate spinners because they have plentiful options. You can hit all their hot buttons and do everything right, yet they can drop you the next moment.sageproduct said:
Some may say that 'forgetting' your number could be a sh*t test, but this is way too early for that situation. She has very little interest in you at best. You played it well by ghosting for 5 days. Women who are interested in you will not confuse you or 'forget' your number. The best thing you can do now is delete hers and if she hits you up to hang out later, take it from there. Reflect on how you handled this girl and learn from experience.
Read this.
buzzin_frog
Don Juan
- Joined
- Feb 6, 2013
- Messages
- 172
- Reaction score
- 107
How about that she is not interested in you? Ah, yes that makes sense. She doesn't remember you = no bueno. You could of figured that one out after your first date.sageproduct said:
buzzin_frog
Don Juan
- Joined
- Feb 6, 2013
- Messages
- 172
- Reaction score
- 107
LMAO way to try to answer for meDown Low said:I didn't hear you lay out your experience with Muslims. :cricket: Oh that's right. You don't have any.
Besides, you're the one who said she's a master manipulator. How'd she get all that experience with men?
More of your nonsense!! She lost any interest she had in him when he ruined the date. So in your eyes this makes her a HPD LMAO :crackup:
Keep wearing that tinfoil hat
dosquito said:
Too quick? I could see that she had no interest in him. She confirmed that on the date and with his follow up phone call. You are wrong.
backbreaker
Master Don Juan
sarge,
here's some very practical advice.
you need to do a 180 on this. and in general. you are looking for signs that she is interested. that's not how you screen.
you need to look for obvious signs as to keep her around
i've never had a girl that wasn't digging me that didnt' make it bone clear that she was digging me. maybe not sex per say but there was no question about it.
this girl, she might not have given you any tale tell signs of being uninterested but she hasn't giving you any to show you that she is interested either.
this is how you become an oriber. keeping around girls who dont' have CLEAR interest in you.
Right now you are being Jupiter lol. you aren't Venus you aren't close to her. you aren't pluto you have some half ass decent qualities she likes about you. you are Jupiter. i'm not going to piss him off but i'm not going to go out of my way to **** him either.
i've been on dates with girls who are conflicted about what to do like they like 2 men or something like that. they will still give you attention and show you they like you beucase they do like you. this girl doesn't really like you. ironically enough your very first reaction was probably dead to rights; she's using you for a free meal
DJ's, guys with plates, drop plates like this. drop this broad.
here's some very practical advice.
you need to do a 180 on this. and in general. you are looking for signs that she is interested. that's not how you screen.
you need to look for obvious signs as to keep her around
i've never had a girl that wasn't digging me that didnt' make it bone clear that she was digging me. maybe not sex per say but there was no question about it.
this girl, she might not have given you any tale tell signs of being uninterested but she hasn't giving you any to show you that she is interested either.
this is how you become an oriber. keeping around girls who dont' have CLEAR interest in you.
Right now you are being Jupiter lol. you aren't Venus you aren't close to her. you aren't pluto you have some half ass decent qualities she likes about you. you are Jupiter. i'm not going to piss him off but i'm not going to go out of my way to **** him either.
i've been on dates with girls who are conflicted about what to do like they like 2 men or something like that. they will still give you attention and show you they like you beucase they do like you. this girl doesn't really like you. ironically enough your very first reaction was probably dead to rights; she's using you for a free meal
DJ's, guys with plates, drop plates like this. drop this broad.
Peace and Quiet
If you currently have too many women chasing you, calling you, harassing you, knocking on your door at 2 o'clock in the morning... then I have the simple solution for you.
Just read my free ebook 22 Rules for Massive Success With Women and do the opposite of what I recommend.
This will quickly drive all women away from you.
And you will be able to relax and to live your life in peace and quiet.