Come on now

[Blurry]

I have recently started to realize that I don't quite care for the "Techniques" aspect on this site as in routines to try and escalate. I find that although they probably work, they are just substitutes for confidence. What is great about this site is that it tries to get you to improve yourself. Striving to be a better man is great and should never be looked down on.

As for the bitterness, I will bet you that 90% of people on this site have had bad experiences with women. Although it may seem to some to be no big deal, from personal experience it is terrible to be led on by a girl for 2 years because you were too much of a beta to realize that you never had a chance from the outset. This sort of thing happens much more often to men than it does to women.

As to your statement that guys are jerks, many of them are and I would count myself as one of them. The reason for this is that being a nice guy simply isn't attractive as it does not demonstrate either strength or confidence. I assure you if being nice would bring guys success, I am sure more people would act accordingly. As to your point that only a certain low class of women respond to guys being jerks, I have noticed this across all social classes. Nice guys are never successful until women look to get married. Then however many of them will have to deal with being a doormat to their partners.

I'm not going off of what people have written on this forum, but on what I have seen in the world. All in all, I really thought your first post was well written, but was too much of an emotional response.

 

[C-quenced]

All I want to do is ask some questions and give a perspective of a woman who has never cheated on a man, used a man for money or manlipulated a lover to the point where he hates my guts. Some of my comments you won't like and some you will.

I've got some interesting replies to my questions which i am grateful for. I can't be bothered to reply to the insulting replies anymore, I've become aclimatized to the insults now.

But I was wondering, I work in the arts and mix with a lot these alpha types, and one of the reasons why I came across this site was because of a male accquintance who's a hardcore player. He's got all the stuff you AFCs apparently dream of ( still don't know what an AFC is though). He's tall, very good looking, gets 9 and 10s all the time and he's a millionaire. The works. I've seen him work the women and it's very impressive. He's very charming, witty and extremely sharp. But the thing is despite all of the success, he doesn't seem very happy.
I was chatting to him the other day and for a moment his polished front slipped and he like a lot of the men on this site revealed a deep distrust of women. Saying things like he has to be careful with women, because most just want him for his money and status. I asked him why he doesn't simply find a nice woman to settle down with, after all if he was clever enough to become a millionaire, he should be clever enough to find a good woman. At that point the shield went up and he just replied, well that's easier said than done. I know he was lying.
I've noticed quite a few very successful men are like that. They're just really miserable. And loads them have addition issues, usually drugs or alcohol or of course sex. Many people I know who mix in the same circles have also noticed it. Funny they put all that effort into become really successful and a substantial amount of them end up pretty unhappy.

I just wonder what some you more thoughtful posters think.

How come this millionaire didn't pay you off to go on a one way trip somewhere, to a far desolate place that way you may expel yourself from the rest of humanity? Things are already bad enough as it is.

Assuming this "alpha" who conveniently lead you to this site isn't fictional, have you ever considered the likelihood that his sudden mistrust of women is reasonably concise? After all he IS experienced. On the other hand there are an even larger portion of males who don't measure up to that level of success (financially and with women) yet STILL hold the exact same views. I can't speak on behalf of all males (and neither can you) but from my experience they usually AREN'T unhappy or miserable. They're pissed off because all their lives they held women to higher standards and expectations only to finally open their eyes one day and realize that society has lied to them from a very young age, and women by their very nature are depressing and preposterous creatures. Please don't accuse me of being a misogynist. As difficult as it may be for some to believe I promise you that I am not.

If your self proclaimed genius and understanding of men was on par with the understanding of women by some of the male members here you wouldn't be making such an emotional, insecure and desperate attempt to steer the views of the members on this place. Just because a mans views and thoughts runs totally contrary to what you feel is right, and challenges YOUR beliefs it does NOT mean it's wrong. I don't know if it's even feasible for you to grasp that.

 

[Amazing]

You arguing with a girl who has issues because she feels guys shouldn't "play" girls.

There is nothing to talk about, she needs to work through issues and then look to have a relationship - if she wasn't blind she would realize only like 6% of guys here even get laid nevermind can be labeled as "players"

 

[C-quenced]

You arguing with a girl who has issues because she feels guys shouldn't "play" girls.

There is nothing to talk about, she needs to work through issues and then look to have a relationship - if she wasn't blind she would realize only like 6% of guys here even get laid nevermind can be labeled as "players"

Good point. There really is nothing to talk about.

 

[At a loss]

Again interesting posts. Thank you. 

 

[At a loss]

@ amazing, I am well aware that a large amont of men on this site don't get laid. That doesn't mean some of the comments aren't interesting.

 

[DonGorgon]

@ Dongorgon, Oh yes , my lovely I can process it.  And after reading your  posts, I can tell you really don't get out much, or meet that many girls.

lol..such a simple come back (indicates the estrogenical mental debilitation i mentioned..) .. argue with a woman that does not like you and she will call you ugly, lame or broke..lol

Fact is most men dont get alot of girls so your attack is very general and trite.lol 90% of men dont get alot of girls hence why the accepted average success rate of most men is only 10% .

BUT actually i have 3 F buddies on my team now and a new random slut per week so im doing ok i think.. but no i still cant compete even with a woman as average as you cause there are so many men competing for so few women..

 

[5string]

I was going to type, "Why are some of us attempting a rational argument with a non-rational being?" but then I thought the better of it because maybe, just maybe in the future some of the seeds we are planting today will take root in this girl's mind. I don't know how old she is but she certainly has a lot of growing up to do, so I hold out some hope for her.

Voice, you are right. It gets very depressing when we discover that the noble attributes we strove for all our lives (kindness, thoughtfulness, self-sacrifice, tolerance, helpfulness and gentleness) have become attributes that almost all women despise us for. It is an absolute shock to the system to discover this, and it can become a lifelong struggle because many men would rather be kind and thoughtful and revile the thought of having to become what I'll loosely call "alpha" in order to attract even a very plain woman.

In answer to your question, Voice, it seems to me that women end up here out of curiosity first, then they emotionally react to what they are sure to label "misogyny", and then they embark on a mission to "fix" us and to set us straight. That's what our little crusader is engaged in right now.

Most women who hang here are clearly on the aggressive side and are FAR from representative of women at large. Needless to say, they also crave attention and her tingleometer is red-lining with this thread. I don't want to venture to guess how many attention-induced orgasms we have provided her thus far, but I'm sure the number is up there.

She (they) are here for an emotional spike which is one of the very few stimuli in their dreary and dreadfully boring lives.

For most women, life is attention, and attention is life.

Atom Smasher is spot on. The best post on this thread IMO.

And to our little "crusader". Why are you here? Validation? Attention? Don't sit here and tell me that "there are so many good women out there looking for a really nice guy". Absolute BS! That is not what you truly want, at least most of you. You little jewels want a bad boy to screw you into next week and settle for some lame a$$ chump to take care of you and your baby. And when you hook your lame a$$ chump, you'll cheat and go screw the next guy that makes your gina tingle without a second thought and without any remorse whatsoever. That's just the way most of you are.

You go have your attention induced orgasm now. :flowers:

 

[Boilermaker]

@ amazing, I am well aware that a large amont of men on this site don't get laid. That doesn't mean some of the comments aren't interesting.

Irrationality at its peak. I'd recommend Stuart Sutherland's classic to you, but you probably wouldn't find the time to read it. Do you have any evidence to support that claim?
The men in this site are within the most successful percentile among the average AFCs (oh, and you DO know what an AFC is, because you looked it up the first time you saw it), however thinking that we are creepy losers might relieve some of your psychological pain. Why don't you start reading more from our leader RT? ... I know you know much more than you pretend to.

Your promiscuous winks to our "thoughtful" posters seem to be working as I see that you are becoming friends with people your age... Let me guess.. You are not young anymore .. Your expiration date is a distant memory.. Right?

.. and you claim you never manipulate people .. Haha, yeah sure!

Admit it. You are fascinated by us. You envy us. You like our culture. You want to be seduced by us but you can't. Because something's wrong with you. Because you want to compete. You want to be clever. You want to be a man.

Otherwise, why would you be here among us, dear George Sand?

 

[DonGorgon]

men, what has happened? all this female blaming, all this bitterness, all this bs about how women have it better than us? really?.

some folks just think it looks soo cool when they ask very grave questions like this.. dude i have gone over how and why men are in the position they are in soo many times.. i have explained it in great detail but many men are to depressed or to weak to accept the reality so they fight is and run inn circles chasing illusion..

but here it is as simple as possible..

CAPITALISM + FEMINISM (male over population + gayness) = DEATH OF MASCULINITY


white men have gender and race advantage with every thing except sex and sex is one of the most valuable things to men cause its hard for most men to get hence sex (vagina ) is worth alot of money and that gives women alot of power since they have a monopoly on all the vaginas and dictate when all sex happens or does not happen.... get it??

 

[DonGorgon]

lets be serious....you act like men as well dont think logically because of testeosterone. weve all let logic go out the window before because we were thinking with our dik.

but hey ive seen enough of your posts on this forum to know not to take you seriously.

You know very little..

You have seen my posts and are no capable of accepting such logic and truth cause your mind is clearly feminized beyond repair

you are either a gay man, a woman posting on here as a "man", a feminized man or a captain save a ho simp and thats fine cause living like that attracts women.. women love men like you cause you let them push their feminist agenda with no resistance at all.. You are the man who helps women blame men for all the BS that is going on these days.. you say you beat the game no you mess up the game for most other straight men..

Sad part is you will still be treated like crap by most women after a while but lucky for them you will just blame your self..lol

 

[DonGorgon]

Warrior your lack of objectivity and bias as a male is typical. I could bring you a plethora of statistics and facts that tear all those sties apart but it would change how none of you think here. And Voice, funny exageration about one Ceo to thousands of alimony seeking women...how about thousands of single moms abandoned by guys they thought cared about them. And before you say the girl was prolly sleeping around, calm that ish...because there a loads of guys who knock up and leave perfectly normal women who dont sleep around. And as we know thats a huge reason why men have to do the things we do to prove we are worth fvking.

We cant act like no priveledge exists for those of us lucky to be born men. Women have a lot more to worry about in terms of crap we can do to them in life vs what we as men have to worry about a woman doing to us. We control the world and you know it. Stop letting the bitterness in knowing that womens only bargaining chip is sex, stop letting that cloud your logic men. And women own this one arena in life only because men allow it.

^^^This reads like it was written by a woman on her period!!! No straight man would type like that.. WTF?? lol

 

[Forty0ztoFreedom]

Jaylan has that liberal mindset that people of a certain creed should pay for the actions of that creed. Its all about 'groups' and 'labels' and making things some subjective kind of 'fair.' The innocent guy screwed over by an overcompensating system deserves it, or has no right to complain or call it unjust, simply because the odds typically should have worked better for him. Reverse prejudice is the new 'fair.'

 

[Jaylan]

hey don. re read what i wrote again. really sit and try to comprehend those things. though i even doubt thats possible. its a waste of my time responding point by point to things i have already addressed. so this is my sum it all response to you perpetually negative folk:

You Mad?

 

[PDubb75]

I realize that the conversation has somewhat shifted from some previous points that were made, but I just read through this whole thread now and want to hit on a few things from earlier on. My apologies for the length of the post...

@ At a loss... I am fairly new to this site. I recently got out of a 6.5 year relationship with a girl I was best friends with for half of my life. I was planning on marrying this girl, and all that. She had been "the girl" for over 10 years. I noticed her attention shifting a bit right before we moved in together. Her new job started taking over her life, as she made a lot of new friends. I am not the jealous type, but a gut feeling had me question if she was cheating on me with this one guy in particular. I eventually brought it up to her and it turned into the biggest sh!t show. She couldn't believe I would accuse her of that and kept reassuring me that I was who she wanted to spend her life with, and how she could not wait to move in with me.

Aside from her "reassurance", I called off my search for a wedding ring for a bit. I didn't want to be planning my future when I still had that feeling in my gut. Keep in mind, at this point and up until this point, I was an AFC (Average Frustrated Chump) that would do whatever I thought would please her, no matter what.

Fast forward 5 months (to November 2010), we are now living together, things are going pretty well, my "gut feeling" had subsided, we had just gone on a great cruise together, and I started looking into rings again. Then, randomly on a Sunday (while I'm still sleeping) she comes into the room and wakes me up to break up with me. Blah Blah Blah, you know the next few details.

We worked it out that I would stay in the apartment until I found a new place, which was about 2 weeks later. She didn't have a full time job, so she needed a co-signer on the apartment, and told me her mom would do it. At the time her mom was supposed to sign on, I get a story from my ex saying "my mom changed her mind and refuses to co-sign... so I had a friend sign onto the lease." I'll give you 1 guess who this "friend" was. A month later (while living together in my apartment) they got engaged.

EDIT: She also owes me thousands of dollars which she completely agreed to, and now is denying. But anyway...

Now, I know... not all women are like this. I'm very aware of that. But even through that bullsh!t, I am not bitter towards women. My reason for telling this story is that it made me come to this site looking for some guidance on how to get back out there, since I had never really experienced single life outside of high school. I feel I was stuck in that kind of position because I was an AFC. I wanted to learn from my mistakes, so that situation never happened again. I was shocked at the information I found here. To the point I almost walked away from Day 1. I thought to myself "This stuff is insane. How is this supposed to get me girls? These people have some serious issues."

I then read a post written by an ex-member named Pook, and some things really clicked. I decided to stick around here. The more I read and the more I tried to go out and observe, the clearer this all was and made sense. This information has been passed around this site alone for at least 10 years. Why do you think people come back here? Because they enjoy getting wrong information that does not help them? This information is shared here because it works. It's spot on, in many cases. I'll bet you that at least 95% of the guys here tried what you feel we should all be doing. That didn't/doesn't work, which is why they are here getting different advice. And anyone that has stuck around, that's because these methods are working better for them.

I am with you on the bitterness, and some of the negativity. But, as far as the methods being used, I am not in your court.

 

[Jaylan]

^ What a friggin whoore

 

[5string]

PDubb...great post.

With regard to your ex, I'm sorry. Nevertheless, you are now a better man.

Two things I got from what you said. One, trust the little guy that sits on your shoulder. He's usually right. Two, you can trust a woman until she proves you wrong as in your case. As said before, what they actually do is what counts, not what they say.

I wish you luck.

 

[zekko]

It gets very depressing when we discover that the noble attributes we strove for all our lives (kindness, thoughtfulness, self-sacrifice, tolerance, helpfulness and gentleness) have become attributes that almost all women despise us for. It is an absolute shock to the system to discover this, and it can become a lifelong struggle because many men would rather be kind and thoughtful and revile the thought of having to become what I'll loosely call "alpha" in order to attract even a very plain woman.

That's a very interesting paragraph, and I know what you mean, and I've felt a bit of the pain that you speak of. But honestly, when you struggle to develop noble attributes, you don't really do it just to attract women, do you? It would be rather hollow if you did, really. It is disappointing however, to find that many women do not appreciate those attributes.

Also, how strong and noble are those attributes if you drop them to become an @sshole, just becaue you read somewhere that women like jerks?

I've had successes with women, and I've had failures. But I can't say I've ever changed myself into something I'm not just to get women. I've never acted like an @sshole in order to get a girl to like me (not intentionally anyway)

Bottom line, you don't really have to corrupt yourself to attract women. Maybe it makes it easier for some, but it isn't necessary. Not sure what you mean when you say "alpha", sounds like you mean jerk game. You don't have to be a jerk, but you should be masculine. If it's a quality girl, and she respects you as masculine, she's not going to despise you for having "noble attributes". Not all women are the type who are writing proposals to serial killers in prison.

 

[Forty0ztoFreedom]

I've been thinking lately about being 'noble' and being the 'good guy.' And honestly, I was reading these internet commenters who were basically blasting Ryan Dunn for drunk driving . . Yeah its kind of random, but they were saying the most heartless, awful things about a guy who just died and is being grieved over by innocent family members and friends (despite what he did/drank). These people show no remorse for their ugliness. It kind of struck me:

JUST WHO IN THE F*CK ARE WE BEING NOBLE TO?

There are so many people in the world that aren't just 'jerks.' They are slime, without common decency. This includes men and women. Why the hell should we be noble or good to these people, which make up a huge part of the human race?

 

[At a loss]

@PDubb 75

Thanks for that insightful post. Really impressed by your measured, mature attitude to what your ex did to you. What a nightmare.