Are "women's high expectations" in dating actually made up by men?

[PRW63]

Men have expectations in women. These expectations can be unrealistic. Reality slaps men in the face, and they come here to SS to piss and moan about it.

The guy wanting a hot chick is not Hypergamy

 

[rjc149]

The guy wanting a hot chick is not Hypergamy

How is the chick wanting the hot guy hypergamy then?

 

[rjc149]

That is an old worn out argument to many of us. I means the person saying it doesn't know what Hypergamy really is and how it is intertwined with the female biology. There is Macro-Hypergamy and Micro-Hypergamy and men don't have menstrual cycles.

This was obviously before Anthony "Dream" Johnson went "wacko" on the Rule Zero guys.

“Hypergamy” is specifically a female practice in its strict definition, but only pertains to women marrying a man of higher socioeconomic status. It has nothing to do with her hooking up with “Chad” or a taller, better looking, more muscular etc man. This is RT’s own spin on it which reeks of resentment and contempt for women, that seeking the most attractive mate is something women are somehow “guilty” of.

So, taking RT’s spin on hypergamy that “leveling up” also includes replacing a mate with a more sexually attractive one, how are men not also hypergamous?

 

[BeExcellent]

Advice from the old lady:

Ya know @rjc149 I’ve pointed the very same thing out a number of times but the echo chamber here gets irritated with that and says I’m a prisoner of my biology etc. etc.

Nope. It’s just confirmation bias.

Confirmation bias is a prebaked idea shopping for something to prove it out. There’s a fair bit of that around here and I wonder at times if the less successful (in real life in the field) can see it. I kinda doubt it because they don’t spend enough time socializing with women. That and/or they have repulsively negative attitudes, and few things are more unattractive than that no matter what you look like & how tall you are.

Then there are some of the jaded more experienced dudes on here that postulate and propagate their theories…other experiencesd posters typically see through that kind of lock step dogmatic ideology…thankfully. But I digress.

Standards can be whatever one imagines and is willing to hold out for. Standards are based in two things: 1. Our individual preferences and 2. Our own market value. As an example I do prefer a man 6’0 or taller. My father was 6’4”, my boyfriend is 6’3” and the vast majority of men I have dated seriously are over 6’0. I did marry a guy who is 5’11…but he owned a nightclub, was a brilliant dancer and was sexy AF. So what if he was not quite 6’0. In his case it didn’t matter.

Be that guy.

There is also such a thing as too tall. I briefly dated a man once who was 6’8”. I didn’t like that as it was awkward on the dance floor and trying to kiss him required me standing on a curb for example even in very tall shoes (I’m 5’6”). He was freakishly tall and it was not ideal. He also had terrible taste in clothing and took his dog EVERYWHERE. So Nah. Pass.

I went out with a man short enough that I was taller than him in platform heels. Didn’t like that either. I don’t like the sense of towering over the man (who I’m supposed to defer to). It feels odd to me.

So I like men between 6’0 and 6’. At 6’3” my boyfriend is right in that sweet spot. But I’m attractive enough that I can hold out for my standards. So I’ve not had to settle. Not every chick is that fortunate (and many let themselves go physically too and there is really no excuse for that.)

So you can have whatever standards you please. I’m sure the pasty white pimply fat dudes who live in mom’s basement would love to date a bikini model. Yeah. That’s gonna work out.

Typically people match up fairly closely in terms of attractiveness. There are exceptions but that is most typically the case. When an individual’s expectations are well outside reasonable reality? Well that’s where you find bitter people who refuse to glance in a mirror and be accountable for life as they have created it.

 

[rjc149]

Ya know @rjc149 I’ve pointed the very same thing out a number of times but the echo chamber here gets irritated with that and says I’m a prisoner of my biology etc. etc.

Yep, they tell me I'm a feminist, and there was a thread where they actually accused me of being a woman.

Some perspective on what you wrote:

The female preference for height is not an individual preference. It's a universal preference held by all women. Whether or not the physical logistics of a 5'2 girl dancing with, kissing, and having sex with a 6'4 man make or break the relationship, all women find height to be a sexually appealing physical characteristic. Yes, taller than them, but also simply tall. Taller than other guys.

The more options a woman has (whether by high physical attractiveness, or on OLD), the more that preference can be written as a requirement. For some very attractive women, 6' is a requirement -- and that's the segment of the female population the red pill woke guys here like to focus on.

Yes, it's a truth that between two men, who are identical in every way, the taller one will be picked by 10 out of 10 women. If I were standing next to a 6'3 clone of myself, 10 out of 10 women would pick the clone. Obviously.

The same truth exists between two identical women. 10 out of 10 men will pick a woman's clone with nicer tits.

Would I prefer dating a woman with nicer tits? Of course. Does that mean I would never date a flat-chested woman who has it going on in other departments? That's a stupid question. Will most women, who universally prefer taller men, date a man under 6' who has it going on in other departments? Stupid question.

If I were a really, really attractive, high SMV guy, could I rule out flat-chested women? Yes. Would I necessarily? Ariana Grande doesn't rule out dating guys who are 5'7.

What the bitter misogynist posters here refuse to acknowledge is that 6' is a more attractive height than under 6' -- but the taller man is not always more attractive. Male sex appeal encompasses a range of personal attributes, physical and otherwise, that is not all subordinated to height. They're gonna cry until they're blue in the fvcking face that I'm wrong, that sex appeal is height and height alone. Let 'em cry, the b!tches.

What they also refuse to accept is that physical attributes correlating with sexual attractiveness is a universal truth of human biological evolution and sociology. It's not gendered. Women are judged much much more strictly for their physical appearance than we are judged. They are summarized by their physical appearance rather than who they are much more commonly than we are. And the contempt they feel for that, not just the less attractive women but the more attractive ones too, the rage that feminists spit at men, is simply the inverse of "red pill wokeness."

The red pill woke dudes here are just inverted feminists with d!cks, feeling the same sting of rejection and dismissal that average-looking women have felt their entire lives.

 

[Zimbabwe]

The red pill woke dudes here are just inverted feminists with d!cks.

There is nothing productive about insulting other users for their opinions, this isn't reddit where we punish any form of dissent.

Yes, it's a truth that between two men, who are identical in every way, the taller one will be picked by 10 out of 10 women. If I were standing next to a 6'3 clone of myself, 10 out of 10 women would pick the clone. Obviously.

If two men were identical in every way but one had a better personality, guess who she would pick? You can do this with any trait, so this in my opinion is not a good point to make.

Women are judged much much more strictly for their physical appearance than we are judged. They are summarized by their physical appearance rather than who they are much more commonly than we are. And the contempt they feel for that, not just the less attractive women but the more attractive ones too, the rage that feminists spit at men, is simply the inverse of "red pill wokeness."

Because men are inherently more visual, while women are more emotional. You can't change biology.

So I like men between 6’0 and 6’. At 6’3” my boyfriend is right in that sweet spot. But I’m attractive enough that I can hold out for my standards. So I’ve not had to settle. Not every chick is that fortunate (and many let themselves go physically too and there is really no excuse for that.)

Let's take an example of a top tier woman like Nicole Kidman, both the guys she married were 5'9 and under. It's not "settling" as you put it. Women are not as visual as men, the vast majority of top tier male celebs are under 5'10.

Typically people match up fairly closely in terms of attractiveness. There are exceptions but that is most typically the case. When an individual’s expectations are well outside reasonable reality? Well that’s where you find bitter people who refuse to glance in a mirror and be accountable for life as they have created it.

Women who hold out for the mythical Giga Chad that doesn't actually exist end up sad and alone. Attractive women are not in short supply so I'm pretty curious what you bring to the table besides your looks?

 

[SW15]

Well every guys problems could be solved by finding a quality woman. Now, where do you find them? They sure aren’t in abundance. I’m only 5’10 and I have been rejected several times by women 5’4-5’8” because they had a hang up on height.

Yes. 5'10" is a less than ideal height. I've had similar things happen but have also had tall-ish extended girlfriends too.

 

[BeExcellent]

Yep, they tell me I'm a feminist, and there was a thread where they actually accused me of being a woman.

Some perspective on what you wrote:

The female preference for height is not an individual preference. It's a universal preference held by all women. Whether or not the physical logistics of a 5'2 girl dancing with, kissing, and having sex with a 6'4 man make or break the relationship, all women find height to be a sexually appealing physical characteristic. Yes, taller than them, but also simply tall. Taller than other guys.

The more options a woman has (whether by high physical attractiveness, or on OLD), the more that preference can be written as a requirement. For some very attractive women, 6' is a requirement -- and that's the segment of the female population the red pill woke guys here like to focus on.

Yes, it's a truth that between two men, who are identical in every way, the taller one will be picked by 10 out of 10 women. If I were standing next to a 6'3 clone of myself, 10 out of 10 women would pick the clone. Obviously.

The same truth exists between two identical women. 10 out of 10 men will pick a woman's clone with nicer tits.

Would I prefer dating a woman with nicer tits? Of course. Does that mean I would never date a flat-chested woman who has it going on in other departments? That's a stupid question. Will most women, who universally prefer taller men, date a man under 6' who has it going on in other departments? Stupid question.

If I were a really, really attractive, high SMV guy, could I rule out flat-chested women? Yes. Would I necessarily? Ariana Grande doesn't rule out dating guys who are 5'7.

What the bitter misogynist posters here refuse to acknowledge is that 6' is a more attractive height than under 6' -- but the taller man is not always more attractive. Male sex appeal encompasses a range of personal attributes, physical and otherwise, that is not all subordinated to height. They're gonna cry until they're blue in the fvcking face that I'm wrong, that sex appeal is height and height alone. Let 'em cry, the b!tches.

What they also refuse to accept is that physical attributes correlating with sexual attractiveness is a universal truth of human biological evolution and sociology. It's not gendered. Women are judged much much more strictly for their physical appearance than we are judged. They are summarized by their physical appearance rather than who they are much more commonly than we are. And the contempt they feel for that, not just the less attractive women but the more attractive ones too, the rage that feminists spit at men, is simply the inverse of "red pill wokeness."

The red pill woke dudes here are just inverted feminists with d!cks, feeling the same sting of rejection and dismissal that average-looking women have felt their entire lives.

For the most part agree. I have good boobs but not stripper silicone bolt ons, lol. An E cup on a small frame. I’ve never had a guy leave me on account of boobs, but then I’m usually the one doing the breaking up. He wants to see perfect boobs? There’s the strip club for that here & there.

As to @Zimbabwe read some of my content. Look up the thread How to Spot a Unicorn. You’ll learn a fair amount about me there. Or read any of my content. It’s pretty consistent. My intent was to answer the OP’s question, not hijack the thread.

Cheers

 

[rjc149]

There is nothing productive about insulting other users for their opinions, this isn't reddit where we punish any form of dissent.

While I appreciate the effort to keep the dialogue civil, 1) my statement was not directed at a specific individual and 2) I don't subscribe to the notion that all opinions are valid simply because they are held. Woke red pill and black pill isn't an opinion. It's a perspective on dating and women, which spawns a number of toxic opinions and viewpoints, that I have no issue calling out, undermining, lampooning, or insulting as invalid or degenerate. It's not your job to moderate.

If two men were identical in every way but one had a better personality, guess who she would pick? You can do this with any trait, so this in my opinion is not a good point to make.

You've missed the point. Yes, she would pick the male with the superior attribute, all else being identical except for that attribute. The point being, that height is a physical trait that women judge and compare with other men. It's simply not the defining attribute of attractiveness.

Because men are inherently more visual, while women are more emotional. You can't change biology.

We're in agreement here. This is why men are able to compensate for physical shortcomings by evoking emotional responses from women -- personality, charm, game, presence, status etc.

 

[BadBoy89]

When an individual’s expectations are well outside reasonable reality? Well that’s where you find bitter people who refuse to glance in a mirror and be accountable for life as they have created it.

Im theory you are right, but reality is the height of a man cannot be changed. Even you won’t give a man a 2nd look under 6’0.

If a woman is overweight, she can fix it. If a woman has a big nose, she can fix it (I know tons who have done it), if a woman if uneducated, she can fix it. Even is a woman is not attractive, she can generally fix it. A man cannot fix his height.

It is what it is and you have to go with what God gave you, but I’ve said it before:

This site should have the disclaimer: “in order to get decent looking young women, the genetics have to be ok, and THEN a man can improve himself. If the genetics are not OK, it will be very difficult for a man to get a decent looking young women no matter how much he improves himself.”

 

[rjc149]

I’m usually the one doing the breaking up.

As is usually the case with relationships. Women, by the nature of sexual dynamics, have more "offers" being presented to them (whether seeking offers or not) and are usually the ones to end a relationship and move to a new one.

I've "nexted" women for having physical shortcomings that turned me off, once those shortcomings were revealed (in bed). So I don't hold it against women for doing the same. We're all human.

 

[Barrister]

Im theory you are right, but reality is the height of a man cannot be changed. Even you won’t give a man a 2nd look under 6’0.

If a woman is overweight, she can fix it. If a woman has a big nose, she can fix it (I know tons who have done it), if a woman if uneducated, she can fix it. Even is a woman is not attractive, she can generally fix it. A man cannot fix his height.

It is what it is and you have to go with what God gave you, but I’ve said it before:

This site should have the disclaimer: “in order to get decent looking young women, the genetics have to be ok, and THEN a man can improve himself. If the genetics are not OK, it will be very difficult for a man to get a decent looking young women no matter how much he improves himself.”

Height can’t be changed. But for a woman there are things that can’t be changed either. Face shape, body type, etc. You just pre-selected ones that she can. And I would argue that height is not nearly as self-limiting at attracting great looking women as a lot of you guys on here seem to act. I have a buddy who is 5’9 who routinely pulls great looking women around his same height or a little less. It’s not that big a deal.

The only disclaimer this site needs is that it is a Red Pill forum that has been infused with Black Pill ideas like the one you just wrote.

 

[Zimbabwe]

While I appreciate the effort to keep the dialogue civil, 1) my statement was not directed at a specific individual and 2) I don't subscribe to the notion that all opinions are valid simply because they are held. Woke red pill and black pill isn't an opinion. It's a perspective on dating and women, which spawns a number of toxic opinions and viewpoints, that I have no issue calling out, undermining, lampooning, or insulting as invalid or degenerate. It's not your job to moderate.

Nobody is going to change their opinion if you hurl insults, I think civil discussions while respecting the viewpoints of others would be better. I may not agree with what another user has to say but they have every right to share that opinion.

I'm not trying to moderate, all I'm doing is providing constructive criticism, if both sides just insult each we would get nowhere.

We are all on the same side here.

 

[Focal core]

But according to you, a woman's hypergamy is an automatic, reptilian response that she acts upon immediately, in every instance. But married men never start fvcking their hot secretaries.

Ok so i take it you dont bang a hot 9 at the pub when she wants to.. Alright made sense

 

[Focal core]

Advice from the old lady:

Ya know @rjc149 I’ve pointed the very same thing out a number of times but the echo chamber here gets irritated with that and says I’m a prisoner of my biology etc. etc.

Nope. It’s just confirmation bias.

Confirmation bias is a prebaked idea shopping for something to prove it out. There’s a fair bit of that around here and I wonder at times if the less successful (in real life in the field) can see it. I kinda doubt it because they don’t spend enough time socializing with women. That and/or they have repulsively negative attitudes, and few things are more unattractive than that no matter what you look like & how tall you are.

Then there are some of the jaded more experienced dudes on here that postulate and propagate their theories…other experiencesd posters typically see through that kind of lock step dogmatic ideology…thankfully. But I digress.

Standards can be whatever one imagines and is willing to hold out for. Standards are based in two things: 1. Our individual preferences and 2. Our own market value. As an example I do prefer a man 6’0 or taller. My father was 6’4”, my boyfriend is 6’3” and the vast majority of men I have dated seriously are over 6’0. I did marry a guy who is 5’11…but he owned a nightclub, was a brilliant dancer and was sexy AF. So what if he was not quite 6’0. In his case it didn’t matter.

Be that guy.

There is also such a thing as too tall. I briefly dated a man once who was 6’8”. I didn’t like that as it was awkward on the dance floor and trying to kiss him required me standing on a curb for example even in very tall shoes (I’m 5’6”). He was freakishly tall and it was not ideal. He also had terrible taste in clothing and took his dog EVERYWHERE. So Nah. Pass.

I went out with a man short enough that I was taller than him in platform heels. Didn’t like that either. I don’t like the sense of towering over the man (who I’m supposed to defer to). It feels odd to me.

So I like men between 6’0 and 6’. At 6’3” my boyfriend is right in that sweet spot. But I’m attractive enough that I can hold out for my standards. So I’ve not had to settle. Not every chick is that fortunate (and many let themselves go physically too and there is really no excuse for that.)

So you can have whatever standards you please. I’m sure the pasty white pimply fat dudes who live in mom’s basement would love to date a bikini model. Yeah. That’s gonna work out.

Typically people match up fairly closely in terms of attractiveness. There are exceptions but that is most typically the case. When an individual’s expectations are well outside reasonable reality? Well that’s where you find bitter people who refuse to glance in a mirror and be accountable for life as they have created it.

Thank you mam.. Its honest.. And brutal truth here a 5'7 women attractive will ALWAYS wanted a 6.. Im right guy living in a fantasy and denial.. Outrageous.

 

[Robert28]

Yes. 5'10" is a less than ideal height. I've had similar things happen but have also had tall-ish extended girlfriends too.

Would you believe tall women eye fvck me whenever I’m in public and always make it a point to be super nice to me when I talk to them, but online dating they wouldn’t even consider me? So weird!

 

[Zimbabwe]

Would you believe tall women eye fvck me whenever I’m in public and always make it a point to be super nice to me when I talk to them, but online dating they wouldn’t even consider me? So weird!

Online is the only place women seem to care about height, even then they are terrible at judging size. I was on a date where the woman was surprised i was 5'9 because i was the exact same height as her supposed 5'11 friend. My friend from college told me he was 5'9 despite being a couple inchs shorter than me.

There was even a tinder date that claimed her ex 12 inchs, which by the way is physically impossible.

 

[BeExcellent]

Im theory you are right, but reality is the height of a man cannot be changed. Even you won’t give a man a 2nd look under 6’0.

If a woman is overweight, she can fix it. If a woman has a big nose, she can fix it (I know tons who have done it), if a woman if uneducated, she can fix it. Even is a woman is not attractive, she can generally fix it. A man cannot fix his height.

It is what it is and you have to go with what God gave you, but I’ve said it before:

This site should have the disclaimer: “in order to get decent looking young women, the genetics have to be ok, and THEN a man can improve himself. If the genetics are not OK, it will be very difficult for a man to get a decent looking young women no matter how much he improves himself.”

Meh. Funny enough my own son, who is 19 and red pilled is sought after by women. He is 5’9” maybe but handsome AF with game, style & swagger. He has a steady gf and is IN CHARGE of that relationship. He will dress me down if he feels it is warranted (which I respect). He is a young man after my fathers mold.

A real man. And stature be damned women love him.

It’s about swagger too. Height is not everything.

Be that guy. Trust me.

 

[Grounded eagle]

Yep, they tell me I'm a feminist, and there was a thread where they actually accused me of being a woman.

Some perspective on what you wrote:

The female preference for height is not an individual preference. It's a universal preference held by all women. Whether or not the physical logistics of a 5'2 girl dancing with, kissing, and having sex with a 6'4 man make or break the relationship, all women find height to be a sexually appealing physical characteristic. Yes, taller than them, but also simply tall. Taller than other guys.

The more options a woman has (whether by high physical attractiveness, or on OLD), the more that preference can be written as a requirement. For some very attractive women, 6' is a requirement -- and that's the segment of the female population the red pill woke guys here like to focus on.

Yes, it's a truth that between two men, who are identical in every way, the taller one will be picked by 10 out of 10 women. If I were standing next to a 6'3 clone of myself, 10 out of 10 women would pick the clone. Obviously.

The same truth exists between two identical women. 10 out of 10 men will pick a woman's clone with nicer tits.

Would I prefer dating a woman with nicer tits? Of course. Does that mean I would never date a flat-chested woman who has it going on in other departments? That's a stupid question. Will most women, who universally prefer taller men, date a man under 6' who has it going on in other departments? Stupid question.

If I were a really, really attractive, high SMV guy, could I rule out flat-chested women? Yes. Would I necessarily? Ariana Grande doesn't rule out dating guys who are 5'7.

What the bitter misogynist posters here refuse to acknowledge is that 6' is a more attractive height than under 6' -- but the taller man is not always more attractive. Male sex appeal encompasses a range of personal attributes, physical and otherwise, that is not all subordinated to height. They're gonna cry until they're blue in the fvcking face that I'm wrong, that sex appeal is height and height alone. Let 'em cry, the b!tches.

What they also refuse to accept is that physical attributes correlating with sexual attractiveness is a universal truth of human biological evolution and sociology. It's not gendered. Women are judged much much more strictly for their physical appearance than we are judged. They are summarized by their physical appearance rather than who they are much more commonly than we are. And the contempt they feel for that, not just the less attractive women but the more attractive ones too, the rage that feminists spit at men, is simply the inverse of "red pill wokeness."

The red pill woke dudes here are just inverted feminists with d!cks, feeling the same sting of rejection and dismissal that average-looking women have felt their entire lives.

You’re actually talking about black pilled guys.They're the ones who think like that.In extremes.

 

[Grounded eagle]

Im theory you are right, but reality is the height of a man cannot be changed. Even you won’t give a man a 2nd look under 6’0.

If a woman is overweight, she can fix it. If a woman has a big nose, she can fix it (I know tons who have done it), if a woman if uneducated, she can fix it. Even is a woman is not attractive, she can generally fix it. A man cannot fix his height.

It is what it is and you have to go with what God gave you, but I’ve said it before:

This site should have the disclaimer: “in order to get decent looking young women, the genetics have to be ok, and THEN a man can improve himself. If the genetics are not OK, it will be very difficult for a man to get a decent looking young women no matter how much he improves himself.”

Seeing guys getting so bent out of shape because of height is rather disappointing I must say.