Are all marriages as bad as they seem?

[ThisIsSparta]

A triple digit notch count is difficult to achieve so it's considered an achievement in the seduction community.



What's it like going from a poon chaser with a triple digit notch count to a monogamously married guy? I know one man in real life who did this and he's transformed into a classic beta male. It's possible this guy was always a beta but he's disguised himself well when he was getting one night stands and casual sex. It's gotten so bad with this guy. There have been times when I've asked him to socialize where he's told me the "he had to check with his wife" before committing to get together with me on a Saturday afternoon. That's pathetic and very beta.

Its what happens when people are PickUpArtists and used to talk their way into pvssy. Without being redpilled to a certain degree, you walk into a gunfight with a knife, thinking happy wife-happy life will just work out fine as it got you pvssy in the past.

I’ve been a member of this form for years. I have a triple digit notch count. I’ve been on the other side of this- spinning plates and chasing poon. I am telling you based on experience there are benefits to being married.

Your experience on marriage is not existent after 8 months.

Good luck, hope everything turns out well for you.

 

[Divorced w 3]

All or nothing statements are absolutely ridiculous. Of course marriage is a good thing when you find the right person. It’s a partnership.

 

[ThisIsSparta]

All or nothing statements are absolutely ridiculous. Of course marriage is a good thing when you find the right person. It’s a partnership.

Playing Roulette is also a good thing when you win.

The divorce rate is at 50%.
From the remaining 50%, how many men are in it not because they are happy but:

*they cant afford a divorce
*dont want to lose their kids
*think they need to "man up and do the right thing"
*are afraid to die alone
*stick with the old harpy because they are simps that lack options on other women

Whatever percentage you come up with, the majority of men dont get what they signed up for and every one of them thought they found "the right person" or thought they could "work things out if they just did the right thing".

 

[EyeBRollin]

But a man shouldn't get married because society looks at him with respect or some bs like that, its like saying this man married a single mother, raised her kid, became the father that kid needed, society will see him as a hero, as the man who stepped up, but in reality he's a cvck.

That is not and has never been the primary reason to get married. The primary reason to wed is to build a nuclear family. Social proof is just one of the external benefits.

Apart from taxes and I guess children, I don't see any valid point of getting married.

Children are what we are biologically inclined to do… procreate. Most people want to have kids. If a person doesn’t want to have kids I would agree the incentive to be married is diminished.

 

[Epicwinguy]

You’re giving up on dating at 30??? I’m 31 and my dating life has never been better. Currently seeing 3 girls in their early 20s…
get your money up and work on your social value and looks

I have years to go before I have both a decent income and the right schedule to meet women. By then I will be too old for attractive women.

 

[EyeBRollin]

Playing Roulette is also a good thing when you win.

The divorce rate is at 50%.
From the remaining 50%, how many men are in it not because they are happy but:

Whatever percentage you come up with, the majority of men dont get what they signed up for and every one of them thought they found "the right person" or thought they could "work things out if they just did the right thing".

The statistics are correct but the premise is misleading. Again, there are benefits that come from entering marriage. The most significant being having and raising children.

If we use the statistics, we can say every relationship that doesn’t eventually lead to marriage
(or one dies in it) is a failure. The guy who had 6 long term relationships is 0/6, or 0%. Following the logic, why ever enter into a LTR with a woman?

The odds of success are literally zero, yet people continue to do it…

 

[ThisIsSparta]

The statistics are correct but the premise is misleading. Again, there are benefits that come from entering marriage. The most significant being having and raising children.

If we use the statistics, we can say every relationship that doesn’t eventually lead to marriage
(or one dies in it) is a failure. The guy who had 6 long term relationships is 0/6, or 0%. Following the logic, why ever enter into a LTR with a woman?

The odds of success are literally zero, yet people continue to do it…

Having and raising children without marriage is totally fine. People have been doing it since a couple of 100.000 years.
No law will make you or your wife a better parent.

The difference between marriage/non marriage relationships lies in the risk/reward ratio. While a man can afford to fail in 6 non marital LTR, he will end up on the streets after 6 failed marriages, unless he is Jeff Bezos. Some men end up on the streets after their first failed marriage.
Nothing a marriage provides is worth the risk of being ruined for life.

 

[EyeBRollin]

Having and raising children without marriage is totally fine.

Statistically it is suboptimal.

The difference between marriage/non marriage relationships lies in the risk/reward ratio. While a man can afford to fail in 6 non marital LTR, he will end up on the streets after 6 failed marriages,

Completely missed the point. A non-marriage LTR is certain to fail. Why even bother?

 

[SW15]

I think married guys get a combination of lazy and busy, then eventually forget about keeping their woman in the same frame that got her.

I think I'm seeing that with my friend who has 100+ notches but now has to "check with the wife" at times when he wants to see me. I have no doubt that other married male friends I know have "checked with the wife" before seeing me but they don't express the sentiment. Expressing the sentiment makes a man look like he has a weak frame.

A non-marriage LTR is certain to fail. Why even bother?

Most marriages fail too. That's why I've talked about the idea that monogamous relationships typically have a shelf life of goodness of about 5 years (and that's with a good frame). There are plenty of monogamous relationships that last more than 5 years, but the relationship lives on mainly because of how good it was at some past moment in time and not based on the quality of the current relationship.

The fact that most monogamous relationships fail at some point (marriage or no marriage) is why some people believe the monogamous relationship model doesn't work.

There are 9 relationship paths that men can follow. Most men follow Option #1 from the article below, which is monogamous marriage. Options #7-9 are open relationship/poly type models. I've been doing Options 3 & 6 over the years.

The Only 9 Options for Men as They Age - Alpha Male 2.0

-By Caleb Jones As I’ve discussed before, most men, even Alpha Males, have no intention on being players for the rest of their lives. At some point, even the horniest players will want to “settle down” in some form or fashion. Today I’m going to...

alphamale20.com

 

[ThisIsSparta]

Statistically it is suboptimal.

Completely missed the point. A non-marriage LTR is certain to fail. Why even bother?

Well thats just wrong.

There are non-contract relationships that last for the rest of peoples lifetime and marriages fail just as often as any non-contract relationships.

The difference is married people stay longer in their failed relationships for mentioned reasons.

People being in a marriage doesnt mean their relationship didnt fail and it by far doesnt mean they are happy...... so why even bother and take the risk?

 

[SW15]

The difference is married people stay longer in their failed relationships for mentioned reasons.

People being in a marriage doesnt mean their relationship didnt fail and it by far doesnt mean they are happy...... so why even bother and take the risk?

A marriage often postpones the inevitable. For instance, a marriage might fail after 10-12 years of total relationship time, whereas a non-marital relationship might fail in 4-6 years. Marriage has a way of keeping people in zombie relationships for longer periods of time.

 

[EyeBRollin]

marriages fail just as often as any non-contract relationships.

They do not. Elderly folks are either married, widowed, or die alone. It is rare to see an older person with a girlfriend / boyfriend.

 

[radha]

The US divorce rate among educated people is lower at around 30%. Then I think it's even lower for educated people that cohabitated for at least a year before marriage. However it's still a poor legal structure for a man in the US. The nuclear family is without a doubt optimal for raising children but the man is constantly in a position of high risk if it's a legally recognized marriage. Since the beginning of our species men and women have pair bonded until children reached adulthood. We just need to figure out a better legal structure than marriage though.

 

[nzrod]

Which is why I don't want to get married. Is there such a thing as a woman who doesn't want kids?

I dont think any well balanced woman doesnt want kids. I dated one who didnt want kids, but then she was jealous of the time I spent with mine.

 

[nzrod]

...

One of my closest friends for the first 6 months was doing all the nice dating stuff like city breaks , holidays , nice bars and restaurants, telling us about his sex marathons and generally having a blast

Today he his living with her and engaged.......i can't remember the last time he mentioned something about sex with her , there are very rarely any nice dates posted on social media anymore and their wedding planning has become a very expensive and stressful soap opera
....

Its a bit of a double ended sword because people think that by getting married and having children it will make the core relationship stronger.

When in reality it does the opposite , it actually takes it to breaking point and when you mix that in with a general decline in effort from both partners the outcome is rarely what most expect

If that relationship isn't built on very very solid foundations it will fall to bits after marriage / children

^This.

 

[SW15]

The US divorce rate among educated people is lower at around 30%. Then I think it's even lower for educated people that cohabitated for at least a year before marriage. However it's still a poor legal structure for a man in the US. The nuclear family is without a doubt optimal for raising children but the man is constantly in a position of high risk if it's a legally recognized marriage. Since the beginning of our species men and women have pair bonded until children reached adulthood. We just need to figure out a better legal structure than marriage though.

Divorce rate is a meaningless statistic. The article below explains why. I'll put in a couple of quotes from it.

Divorce Statistics - Alpha Male 2.0

I often point to the current high divorce rates as evidence of human beings not being creatures capable of, or even desirous of, absolute long-term monogamy, vastly preferring short-term monogamy and/or temporary marriages instead. Usually I refer to either the “standard” divorce rate most often...

alphamale20.com

Talking about the "divorce rate" is tricky, because the often quoted "standard" divorce rate of "50%" is what's called the "divorce to marriage ratio". It's not actually the divorce rate. It's the ratio of marriages to divorces in a given country that occur within a given individual year. As you might imagine, that really doesn't tell you much

The divorce rate is only 33%!"

First of all, even if that's true, which I will demonstrate in a moment it's not, 33% is still really terrible... The reality is that looking at that one stat doesn't tell the true story. Far more than one out of three people get divorced. Why? Because:

1. That stat doesn't take into account the number of adults who have never been married or haven't been married yet. As I'll be showing you in a minute, that's a hell of a lot of people.

2. That stat doesn't take into account people currently married who haven't divorced their spouses yet, but who will at some point in the next few decades. Which again, as I will show in a minute, is a titanic number of people, both numerically and in terms of percentages.
Add those two together, and now that 33% figure is suddenly way off. As in, way too low.

Your risk of divorce is not about whether or not you've been divorced yet. Rather, it's based around the odds of you ever getting divorced at any point throughout your entire lifespan. I'm talking about the odds of you getting divorced, even once, at any time, from age 18 to 82, which is the average life expectancy of someone in the Western world.

Divorce rate undercounts both #1 and #2, but the undercount of #2 is the more relevant factor.

 

[Ricky]

one interesting thing is….
if you had asked me a few years ago to predict with accuracy who in the neighborhood i live would divorce in the next few years… i am not surprised by the 2 couples i know that did but i am equally surprised by a couple of couples who haven’t

 

[SW15]

one interesting thing is….
if you had asked me a few years ago to predict with accuracy who in the neighborhood i live would divorce in the next few years… i am not surprised by the 2 couples i know that did but i am equally surprised by a couple of couples who haven’t

Most of my local area social circle got married between 2015-2021. There was a big flurry of weddings around 2017, so that's why there are a bunch of babies right now in my social circle. I devoted a thread to this occurrence recently.

Pregnancy Announcements Everywhere! Life When Your Blue Pill Social Circle Starts Having Babies

Yesterday, I was on my Instagram and saw a pregnancy announcement from an acquaintance's wife in my social circle. I don't particularly like her. I find it annoying to be around her the 1-2 times a year I ever randomly see her in person. Right now, there are 3 women from my local area social...

www.sosuave.net

There have yet to be any divorces among the post 2015 marriages in my local area social circle. I have cousins and some friends from cities where I previously lived who got divorced. All were married prior to 2015. I wasn't at all surprised with any of divorces I mentioned but was surprised with the timing of the divorces. Those marriages that ended in divorce all lasted longer than I thought they would last.

Some of the marriages in my current social circle have also lasted longer than I thought too. I would have thought I would have seen at least one divorce by now in that 2015-2021 marrying cohort.

Married couples are good at not letting single male outsiders know how lousy their marriages are when their marriages are lousy.

 

[SW15]

I sometimes feel out of place when I see my friends married, with their wives berating them, nagging them, their children screaming and running around, fvck its like wtf am I doing here?

Single, marginally attached or unattached, and childless men are not comfortable around married men and their children.

 

[Epicwinguy]

Single, marginally attached or unattached, and childless men are not comfortable around married men and their children.

Because children are annoying and married men are not people I relate to. Plus a lot are very pushy about marriage and fatherhood being the purpose of life that everyone must fulfill.