Another Online Field Report

[Mister Big]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match Dates

Originally posted by al77
I think persoanly that women are not intelligent, they judge us by very superficial stuff, and believe it is 100% true.

I disagree. Women ARE intelligent (at least the ones I date), but they focus on different things than men do. Your disdain for women will effect your game if only subconsiously, so don't disrespect their entire gender. I would have to say that I have met just as many as#hole men as b#tches in my life, probably more. Every person is different and most are worth a chance to see if being around them enhances your life.

Both men and women are very superficial. I think those that admit and embrace their desires no matter how superficial really enjoy their lives. I enjoy having sex, talking to, and spending time doing fun things with very hot, very sexual, very intelligent women. These are superficial criteria to an extent, but its what floats mine and just about every other guys boats. Don't fight human nature and your own instincts. Go with it.

 

[al77]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match Dates

Originally posted by Mister Big
I disagree. Women ARE intelligent (at least the ones I date), but they focus on different things than men do.

Your disdain for women will effect your game if only subconsiously, so don't disrespect their entire gender.

Well.. I am not talkign about just superficial, thats right we all are to some extent. I am talking about VERY superficial.
Example: if a guy calls her more oten than she thinks he is supposed to call her... thats it, "he is desperate". Does it make any sense? if instead of one call she received two.. "omg he is desperate.. should I dump him? oooo". So basically women love to exaggerate things and believe that it is so important if "he calls NOT often before LTR"..."he calls often in LTR".. "he put toilet seat down"... Does make any sense to put any importance in those petty things??

he wears stylish clothes (do you really care what she is wearing if she is hot for you?...

Yeah, men are superficial, they love hot women's bodies.. but at least they dont beat around the bush what they want and what they dont want. Men initiall know what they want...they do not dount much about it. And women know that.

Women dont say what they want, and often dont even know what they want... and judge us based on some superstitions sort of...Dont you find it odd?

 

[Mister Big]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match Dates

Originally posted by al77
Example: if a guy calls her more oten than she thinks he is supposed to call her... thats it, "he is desperate". Does it make any sense? if instead of one call she received two.. "omg he is desperate.. should I dump him? oooo". So basically women love to exaggerate things and believe that it is so important if "he calls NOT often before LTR"..."he calls often in LTR".. "he put toilet seat down"... Does make any sense to put any importance in those petty things??

The examples you noted are easy to avoid and deal with by applying proven approaches found in the DJ bible. Read this as you will learn to appreciate the differences between men and women and won't judge these differences.

Originally posted by al77
he wears stylish clothes (do you really care what she is wearing if she is hot for you?...

A sense of style demonstrates a person who cares about her appearance and wants to feel secure and attractive. An obsessive style is just annoying and demonstrates real insecurity. A woman should care what she wears to some extent for me to be attracted to her beyond just looking hot, but that helps. I guess I'm superficial, but isn't everyone?

Originally posted by al77
Women dont say what they want, and often dont even know what they want... and judge us based on some superstitions sort of...Dont you find it odd?

Women are cryptic because men need to translate what they say. The more you understand about them by reading and applying approaches, the more comfortable and successful you will be. Women leave clues, sometimes very vague clues, to help us understand what they want. We need to pay attention and respond accordingly.

A woman who is unsure what she wants is an easy target to seduce once you get them comfortable. I've seen it time and time again. The degree that the women takes some of the issues above creates some decisions for you to make in the process. If she is really obsessed about the superficial, NEXT. Let me repeat, NEXT. Get yourself several options and you'll count yourself lucky for identifying them early so you didn't waste your time. I find these types to be in the minority (as long as they are not really dumb) once you get under the surface. I hope this helps.

 

[al77]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match Dates

Originally posted by Mister Big

Women are cryptic because men need to translate what they say. The more you understand about them by reading and applying approaches, the more comfortable and successful you will be. Women leave clues, sometimes very vague clues, to help us understand what they want. We need to pay attention and respond accordingly.

A woman who is unsure what she wants is an easy target to seduce once you get them comfortable. I've seen it time and time again.

Interesting logic "Women are cryptic because men need to translate what they say.". Because men need to...?
Men dont want to. The reason why women are cryptic is not because men want to translate from ******** to some normal languages.

Anyway why they are so cryptic? To make life harder for men? It looks like a mine field: you go.. go.. one little mistake and you are blown up...I am just having hard time enjoying walking on that mine field. Why dont they state what they want? Why they always play those frigging games with men...and in every women's profile I read "no games"... it sounds like a bad saracsm to me.

Probably you advanced in DJsim so much that just forgot how AFC think. Well.. it is a good thing anyway, but I woudl rather appreciate some details than just a reference to the DJ bible without a specific chapter to read.

For a seducer almost any women is an easy target. It is about his skills I guess. It seem you "magically" acquireed them in a quite short period of time. I wish I know how you did that.

 

[Mister Big]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match Dates

Originally posted by al77
Interesting logic "Women are cryptic because men need to translate what they say.". Because men need to...?
Men dont want to. The reason why women are cryptic is not because men want to translate from ******** to some normal languages.

I don't think you are getting the point here. Men and women are different but we are both human. Agreed? We need to try to understand each other to coexist and have fun together. That's a basic premise you'll need to come to grips with before proceeding. I don't want to get scientific, but we both have different instinctually and environmentally driven behaviors. Anyway, these tendencies are and have been studied especially on this site which is a deep resource. When you understand "why" women do what they do, it helps in not taking dating and individual experiences so seriously. Let go of obsessing about the differences and work to overcome the challenges and turn them into opportunities. It is possible.

An example for myself is not talking so much and listening more to women. I was a blow hard before with women, trying to impress them and overwhelming every conversation. Now, I hear their subtle clues and avoid the risk of putting my foot in my mouth before I have established high interest level. This and being very positive has helped me tremendously. If you want to get laid, these are important tips and thoroughly documented elsewhere. Much of the bible wasn't as relevant for me because I already knew what I was doing with some of the seduction. I still suck at cold approaches which is my main goal now. Search and choose the info that applies to you and work it in the real world.

About games. Women love games, but don't want to be lied to and played by fu*cking liers. The games they hate are the cruel head games that some men play on them after they've been seduced. I don't lie to women. I'm honest about dating others. If they don't like it, I urge them to be happy and consider not dating me if it bothers them. I don't put up with the flakey behavior that they use to establish leverage. I just don't allow them the opportunity anymore. Many find the fact I'm with others a bit of a turn on as this validates me and puts them into the competitive "game" which they are predestined to play. The seduction "game" is another they love. The player "lying" game is one they don't put up with for long. I hate lying, but I do tell a few white lies to create space when women want to see more of me like "i am busy with work" or "i am going to NYC with friends" etc.

I haven't even scratched the surface of learning the DJ approach.
This isn't magic. Its a development process that requires you keep your eyes on the ball at all times. The ball is your own growth not individual successes. It takes patience. Don't let early challenges keep you from growing.

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match Dates

Originally posted by Mister Big
...An example for myself is not talking so much and listening more to women. I was a blow hard before with women, trying to impress them and overwhelming every conversation. Now, I hear their subtle clues and avoid the risk of putting my foot in my mouth before I have established high interest level. This and being very positive has helped me tremendously. If you want to get laid, these are important tips and thoroughly documented elsewhere. Much of the bible wasn't as relevant for me because I already knew what I was doing with some of the seduction. I still suck at cold approaches which is my main goal now. Search and choose the info that applies to you and work it in the real world.

We should see about having our threads merged. I was explaining this very same thing in another thread about conversationalist. We all know that women can not completely keep a secret so they are always showing their hand. We're just so set to task that we miss these subtle clues. Fish for them ans use them as bait to land the big one.

D@mn, I've been in Minnesota too long. I can't help but keep using these stupid fishing analogies.... :crazy:

 

[al77]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match Dates

Originally posted by Mister Big
I don't think you are getting the point here. Men and women are different but we are both human. Agreed? We need to try to understand each other to coexist and have fun together.


About games. Women love games.... I hate lying, but I do tell a few white lies to create space when women want to see more of me like "i am busy with work" or "i am going to NYC with friends" etc.

Agree. We have to understand them. Moreover this specific part, or game about being busy is a very good example. Lets get more practical (since I agree with with most cocepts here...in theory).
What other women's games are inportant to recognize and be able to play? Can you outline them? Or maybe refer to the DJ bible chapter\post?

I notice that the young a woman the better she repond to ****y lines. The older ones may not respond well to it at all. Is that rue in your experience?

 

[Mister Big]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match Dates

Originally posted by al77
I notice that the young a woman the better she repond to ****y lines. The older ones may not respond well to it at all. Is that rue in your experience?

The C & F approach seems to apply to all women. The younger ones seem to require more playful, innocent dialogue where you're sexual intentions are below the surface. At least this is what I am doing, but I wonder if being more aggressive in the right way would also benefit me. I find that younger girls tend to hide their interest level more because they are being approached all the time, so you really need to pay attention to the clues they provide. Many times they don't even know if they are attracted to you right away because you are an older man, so they don't respond initially. I can't tell you the number of times I lost out on an opportunity with an attractive, younger woman because I missed a subtle clue or failed to motivate their view of me as a sexual opportunity.

For example, I was talking to a hot 19 yo receptionist at my hair salon recently. I wasn't trying too hard with my C&F because she was so young and I thought she wasn't interested because she has a BF. She told the owner that is a friend of mine that she thought I was very cute and liked me. Thinking back, she left me several clues such as responding to my C&F, mentioning a BF but then continuing to flirt with me, returning EC, and having natural and sexy BL. I portrayed a fun guy without coming on too strong and she picked up my vibe in this case. I avoided pursuing her up to this point because I don't need the drama of breaking up her relationship and seeing her at the place every month. That could get weird, but I might try her again soon.

I am still developing my approaches with younger women and need to work on being more aggressive so my advice is limited to a few examples. The older ones tend to respond more to a more seductive, aggressive style. I believe they are much more comfortable with their sexuality and desires and can be more receptive in a very short time. They don't hide their interest level and recognize what they want sooner due to experience. I guess that's why I go after them more often.

 

[al77]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match Dates

Originally posted by Mister Big
The C & F approach seems to apply to all women.

For example, I was talking to a hot 19 yo receptionist at my hair salon recently.

I am still developing my approaches with younger women and need to work on being more aggressive so my advice is limited to a few examples. The older ones tend to respond more to a more seductive, aggressive style. I believe they are much more comfortable with their sexuality and desires and can be more receptive in a very short time. They don't hide their interest level and recognize what they want sooner due to experience. I guess that's why I go after them more often.

Mr Big, you got really big balls if you talk to 19 yo...I just cannot see what you can gain from that kind of interactions: they usually dont want any sex with a decent guy, but sleep often with some drunk guys at the dorms. Again usually so young girls incredible flaky and immature. You dont have any allergies to flakiness? I do.

Anyway, I was wondering... do older women really like ****y approach? They are much more mature (usually), and often want to be treated nicely...get married.. they know better what qualitie sthey look for in a man. Especially in emails they expect guys to be very polite and funny. ****y is for somebody under 30-32.
What do you think?

 

[Mister Big]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match Dates

Originally posted by al77
Mr Big, you got really big balls if you talk to 19 yo...I just cannot see what you can gain from that kind of interactions: they usually dont want any sex with a decent guy, but sleep often with some drunk guys at the dorms. Again usually so young girls incredible flaky and immature. You dont have any allergies to flakiness? I do.

Anyway, I was wondering... do older women really like ****y approach?

You'll need to relax more and not overanalyze or categorize women.

Remember, younger women are still women and many are very attracted to older guys. Younger and older women can both be immature. Age is not as much of an issue as you believe. We are all consenting adults. Younger women have less experience but are swamped with offers from men of all ages if they are attractive. If any woman is flakey early on with me, young or old, this is a sure sign of bad things to come. NEXT.

Creating high interest levels is really the key. With older women, sometimes EC, kino, and politeness is a good strategy. They definitely appreciate this approach more in general, but I am pretty consistent with mixing in C&F no matter what the age. Be yourself. Once you establish some interest, C&F as long as it is not rude works great with older women. It reminds them of when they were younger and approached all the time. A good feeling for them. Other women respond strongly to C&F initially and then want the other techniques to follow. There is no one perfect approach for all woman.

Many times, really hot/young women are only approachable through C&F. That's why it is a critical skill that is detailed at length here. These women put up walls as a defense mechanism to push off all the AFCs (with their ackward politeness) or all the creeps (with their crudeness) who are just a waste of their valuable time. You'll need to differentiate yourself and be comfortable with whatever approach you choose.

 

[al77]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match Dates

Originally posted by Mister Big


1. You'll need to relax more and not overanalyze or categorize women.

2. Remember, younger women are still women and many are very attracted to older guys. Younger and older women can both be immature. Age is not as much of an issue as you believe.

3. Once you establish some interest, C&F as long as it is not rude works great with older women.

4. Creating high interest levels is really the key.

1. Yeah...right. If I knew how...can.. I would have done it loong time ago. Thats not obvious how to.

2. Younger women are in their party stage. if you can capitalize on that, if you are a cool dude at any party - sure. Otherwise, younger girls has only disadvantages: more likely they are flaky,
less loyal, they have tons of offers, they are not serious about just one guy, their sexuality is not developed.. means they dont even want sex really.. they want to have sex with a _cool guy_ much more just to brag about it to some of her gf. But it is just IMHO.

3. Yes! Very good point!! Thanks!

4. By the way.. how would you go about establish high IL? Any hints?

 

[Mister Big]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match Dates

Originally posted by al77
By the way.. how would you go about establish high IL? Any hints?

Use your eyes and smile to communicate your vibe without being creepy. It's a balancing act you'll need to work in the real world to master. Every woman's different and some are not approachable due to many reasons. Don't take it personally. Listen, listen, listen and engage them with conversation they enjoy. Their clues should become stronger fairly quickly if they have interest.

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match Dates

Originally posted by Mister Big
Use your eyes and smile to communicate your vibe without being creepy. It's a balancing act you'll need to work in the real world to master. Every woman's different and some are not approachable due to many reasons. Don't take it personally. Listen, listen, listen and engage them with conversation they enjoy. Their clues should become stronger fairly quickly if they have interest.

BINGO!

 

[Mister Big]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match Dates

Originally posted by Francisco d'Anconia
BINGO!

When talking to some women, it takes them a little time to realize you are a sexual opportunity for them. This happens with people that are working or engaged in limited social activity recently. I love when they finally "get it" and have an epiphany about your intentions. Because you avoid being creepy, you'll rarely offend anyone even if they are not interested due to a BF or other reasons. With commited women, you can still have fun for awhile flirting with them. All of them turn into little sexy girls no matter what their age. This initial transformation is my favorite moment of seduction except for the end of great sex of course.

 

[al77]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match Dates

Originally posted by Mister Big
Use your eyes and smile to communicate your vibe without being creepy.

Listen, listen, listen and engage them with conversation they enjoy. Their clues should become stronger fairly quickly if they have interest.

What kind of vibe? If I communicate "I want you" kind of vibe, she'll either get scared immediately with "he is a player", or label it as "He's desperate". Are you talking about some other kind of vibes?

I know I should "engage them" ... I wonder how I can engage them in a convo that will raise her IL?
"Listen" is a good piece for keep the convo going.. agree. How to raise her IL? Any hints?

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Match D

Originally posted by Mister Big
When talking to some women, it takes them a little time to realize you are a sexual opportunity for them. This happens with people that are working or engaged in limited social activity recently. I love when they finally "get it" and have an epiphany about your intentions. Because you avoid being creepy, you'll rarely offend anyone even if they are not interested due to a BF or other reasons. With commited women, you can still have fun for awhile flirting with them. All of them turn into little sexy girls no matter what their age. This initial transformation is my favorite moment of seduction except for the end of great sex of course.

It's as if I'm reading what I've written in the past... You hit on something that speaks volumes; women need to get the 'epiphany' about where you are coming from. This means that you don't tell them but yet they find out as if they have found the cure for cellulite!

You know you've gotten to that point with a woman when she takes your hand and asks why you aren't dating anyone. This is the point when they are officially in the "I'm gonna really need to qualify myself to this guy" mode. At least she will if she feels she is deserving and has enough going for herself to keep you interested.

 

[Mister Big]

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Followup to Both Mat

Originally posted by Francisco d'Anconia
women need to get the 'epiphany' about where you are coming from.

You know you've gotten to that point with a woman when she takes your hand and asks why you aren't dating anyone. This is the point when they are officially in the "I'm gonna really need to qualify myself to this guy" mode.

This mode is a real emotional rollercoaster for women. They love to be on the edge of qualifying themselves and not knowing whether you will ask them out. Have fun and prolong this initial state to build a lot of IL which pays dividends down the road. Getting them to this point requires being your fun, charming, and naughty self, using EC, body language, etc., but acting like you don't give a f#ck if they bite or not. If they are interested, they all fall into a submissive position and are ripe to be seduced.

 

[Mister Big]

Update on the Online Chicks

Psychology Woman
I had her over my place last night because I am too busy to date her out right now. I played it cool and funny and wound up sleeping with her which was very nice. She had some pent up energy and admitted to masturbating frequently. BINGO. She had such a little petite body, She's about 5'3 and 100#s and in addition to running her business used to be a professional cheerleader in her 20's. She had some decent moves but I more than held my own in our workout. We are going to NYC this weekend. I played this scenario well by not being too interested (pure AFC). This was due to having other options that required my "attention," so I really didn't have a choice but to ignore her interest. This sh%t is working like a charm.

Attorney Woman
NEXTED.

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Re: Update on the Online Chicks

Originally posted by Mister Big
Attorney Woman
NEXTED.

This is interesting, I've been going out with more doctors and women in the health field and forgoing the lawyers myself. It may seem cliché and stereotypical but the health care women seem to be for giving and open while lawyers tend to be cold and argumentative. Have you noticed this?

 

[Mister Big]

Re: Re: Update on the Online Chicks

Originally posted by Francisco d'Anconia
This is interesting, I've been going out with more doctors and women in the health field and forgoing the lawyers myself. It may seem cliché and stereotypical but the health care women seem to be for giving and open while lawyers tend to be cold and argumentative. Have you noticed this?

The doctor was very communicative. Sometimes, she does go into analysis mode and I have to stop her from this tendency. Being physical with her gets her brain focused on one thing (we know what that is) and she appreciates being dominated from time to time. The lawyer wasn't argumentative but she was more guarded and less emotional. I never cracked through the exterior although I connected with her physically and I am sure I could have got her eventually. With the lawyer, I worked off visual cues while the doctor loved to share ideas, sometimes very sexual ideas. The lawyer just wasn't hot enough or sexy enough to keep my interest.

Both behaviors are likely to be a result of each woman's respective fields. Doctors in the psychology field are likely to interact with other women more often, so retain more feminity while lawyers are in a male dominated profession. Both needed some touch to let go of their professional exteriors. Obviously, I liked the doctor much better, as she is a kinky little sexypot. The lawyer was less attractive and less responsive. Bad combination.

I'd like to get out there with these types of women more often, so I could form an expert opinion from many experiences. I was surprised I found both of these women online. Thank you match.com.