Am i taking too many supplements?

Hockey Playa

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Here is a list of what im taking. It feels like im pooping pills every 2 seconds.
-Multivitamins
-Green tea extract
-Fish oil capsules
-Vitamin C
-CLA
-Creatine kre-alkalyn
-Protein
-Vegetable Green powder

they all seem like they serve a purpose it just doesnt seem that natural, my parents always bug the hell out of me, saying im taking way too much sh1t, even though they are totally uneducated on the subject.
 

stronglifts

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Well it isn't natural.

Why don't you try getting all your vitamins/minerals/anti-oxidants/fats/... from food?

I'd drop everything except for the fish oil (and maybe whey)
 

Francisco d'Anconia

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stronglifts said:
Well it isn't natural.

Why don't you try getting all your vitamins/minerals/anti-oxidants/fats/... from food?

I'd drop everything except for the fish oil (and maybe whey)
I'd keep the green powder too, it works well with protein powder.
 

Hockey Playa

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stronglifts said:
Well it isn't natural.

Why don't you try getting all your vitamins/minerals/anti-oxidants/fats/... from food?

I'd drop everything except for the fish oil (and maybe whey)
u seriously think i should drop all of that? no way. I just start my creatine, and definately gonna see it out. I dunno why you would tell me to drop the multi vitamins either. My diet isnt that great, one problem being my mom is a lousy cook. So i eat out alot ( even though i order the healthiest stuff i can). Is there an actual medical problem with taking this many supplements? or are u just suggesting do it naturally to save money?
 

Ll Principe

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Hockey; I posted on one of the supplement threads a few days ago... Read what I wrote...

To answer your question: Most people will say DONT for "health" reasons that arent proven( just drink alot of water so you dont get a kidney stone) and will also say for PRICE reasons aswell that you wasting your money but if you read my post about supplements, just page down and find a thread about supplements that I took about 5 different types, multi, creatine, whey, zma , cla, phedra and i had an amazing body after 6 months of gyming 5 days a week and having 6 meals a day!! I stress this AGAIN...

Diet/gym= 80%
Supplements= 20%

Of your TOTAL OUTCOME.
 

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stronglifts

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Hockey Playa said:
u seriously think i should drop all of that? no way. I just start my creatine, and definately gonna see it out. I dunno why you would tell me to drop the multi vitamins either. My diet isnt that great, one problem being my mom is a lousy cook. So i eat out alot ( even though i order the healthiest stuff i can). Is there an actual medical problem with taking this many supplements? or are u just suggesting do it naturally to save money?
-Multivitamins => get it from veggies & fruit
-Green tea extract => drink green tea
-Fish oil capsules => I'd go for fish oil
-Vitamin C => veggies & fruit
-CLA => get it from diet
-Creatine kre-alkalyn => discussable
-Protein => discussable
-Vegetable Green powder => green veggies


It's your body, it's your call. I won't tell you what to do. You ask for opinions, this is what you get.


From the little info you give us, i advise you:
-fix your diet
-stop counting on your mom: learn to cook
-stop eating outside: learn to cook again.

A healthy diet consisting of veggies, fruit, meat, fish, healthy fats,... will give you anything you need to lift big weights & achieve a great body.


Never should one count on supplements to do the job.
 

Ll Principe

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stronglifts: Would you agree with me that supplements constitutes 20% of the total outcome and that diet/gym counts 80%?
 

stronglifts

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Ll Principe said:
stronglifts: Would you agree with me that supplements constitutes 20% of the total outcome and that diet/gym counts 80%?
The only supplements I used in the last 10 years are:
-whey
-fish oil
-vitamins
-anti-oxidants


Currently I'm only using fish oil. The rest I get from my diet. Progress is steady (weekly PRs) & I look great.

A lot can be achieved without all the supplements that are available. If you want proof, check the athletes that lived before all the supplements became available (anyone before 1940-1950). They were strong, healthy & looked great.

Supplements seldomly help you achieve what they promess. I believe creatine works (but never used it). I've also seen many athletes counting on supplements (including steroids) and forgetting about the basics.

Supplements should only be used by athletes close to their genetics. Those are at the advanced/elite level. I'm not at that level (yet). Few people are. Probably 1% reach the elite level.

You've asked about outcome, here's what's needed for success;
* Solid training program (involving heavy training & recovery)
* Solid nutrition (proteins, fats, carbs, veggies, fruit, fiber, hydratation,...)
* Healthy lifestyle (sleep, stress, general health)

Many think about supplements before fixing the above.
 

spesmilitis

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-Multivitamins

Maybe. If you are eating healthy, you probably don't need to take as much as regular people.

-Green tea extract

Drink green tea. Don't like green tea. Rip the tea bag and emply contents into glass of water. Gulp down the water.

-Fish oil capsules

YES.

-Vegetable Green powder

I would only reccomend this if you are doing something edurance related. Some MMAer at sherdog.net swear by this stuff. However, if you are just doing lifting, I wouldn't reccomend it. Just eat more veggies.
 

spesmilitis

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Strong, what antioxidents do you use?

Also, is 1% among athletes or just the normal population? I think 1% if the fraction of people do even do squats and dead.
 

stronglifts

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spesmilitis said:
Strong, what antioxidents do you use?

Also, is 1% among athletes or just the normal population? I think 1% if the fraction of people do even do squats and dead.
These are the one I used to take: http://www.beverlyintl.com/antioxidant-compound.html

Don't use them anymore.

Doesn't matter if its 1% of population or 1% of athletes, you get the picture.
 

Warboss Alex

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stronglifts said:
The only supplements I used in the last 10 years are:
-whey
-fish oil
-vitamins
-anti-oxidants


Currently I'm only using fish oil. The rest I get from my diet. Progress is steady (weekly PRs) & I look great.

A lot can be achieved without all the supplements that are available. If you want proof, check the athletes that lived before all the supplements became available (anyone before 1940-1950). They were strong, healthy & looked great.

Supplements seldomly help you achieve what they promess. I believe creatine works (but never used it). I've also seen many athletes counting on supplements (including steroids) and forgetting about the basics.

Supplements should only be used by athletes close to their genetics. Those are at the advanced/elite level. I'm not at that level (yet). Few people are. Probably 1% reach the elite level.

You've asked about outcome, here's what's needed for success;
* Solid training program (involving heavy training & recovery)
* Solid nutrition (proteins, fats, carbs, veggies, fruit, fiber, hydratation,...)
* Healthy lifestyle (sleep, stress, general health)

Many think about supplements before fixing the above.
Generally I agree with what you say, but I can't agree with only 1% of people need additional supplementation. I'd say 1% don't and 99% do - you can't compare today with half a century ago because food processing methods have became such that much of the nutritional value of food is destroyed before it even hits the shelves.

Ask your grandparents to compare the fruit and veg of today with what they used to eat; I'm sure their sources were farms, markets and the like. In supermarkets today the produce available has most likely been flown halfway across the world (EU regulations for Europe - I'm sure the supermarkets in Belgium show the source of foodstuffs) and processed heavily. The methods used to bulk produce tasty (marketable) foods robs them of their antioxidant content. Like blueberries - they're supposed to be small and fairly sour, but we get big, fat, juicy sweet ones. Great tasting so people buy them, but with a fraction of the antioxidants found if you were picking blueberries from the wild. Remember also that pollution and pesticide levels were way lower way back when; this will also destroy nutrients.

Unless you're growing your own produce, or buy organic all the time (and even that's no guarantee of quality), you need the additional micronutrients that you most likely won't be getting from food. And then on top of that, you're weight training and trying to make your body grow/improve/lose fat/whatever. This requires additional micronutrients for optimum efficiency.

Yeah, it'd be ideal if you can get the right micronutrients from food. But like I said, unless you can buy organic or have access to homegrown produce, you won't get it from a supermarket.

There's no need to down a hundred pills a day. What supplements you take will depend on your goals (obviously a strength trainer will need more of the b-vitamins, zinc, iron etc) whereas an endurance athlete won't. But you cannot rely on your diet alone - sad but true.

Great example I know of: I grew up in Cyprus and at the fruit and veg markets there we'd buy vegetables which still had dirt on them 'cause they were picked just a few minutes before being sold. If I wanted to buy the same vegetables here in England, I'd get them out of a plastic packet having being bulk produced, and flown in from New Zealand or South Africa. How can you say you're getting just as much goodness out of both types?

By the way - Hockey Playa, you have a minimal supplementation scheme which is nothing to worry about. You don't need CLA if you're taking fish oil though, and you should be eating your veggies instead of getting them in powdered form.
 

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Ll Principe said:
stronglifts: Would you agree with me that supplements constitutes 20% of the total outcome and that diet/gym counts 80%?
this formula is absurd. i thought it the first time you posted it, and i'm writing it now. one reason is that folks can't even agree on what is and is not a supplement.

for only one but very important example: i don't consider whey to be a supplement. it's main component is a macronutrient -- to me, that's a food. but many guys still call it a supplement since you find it in supplement stores, the supermarket supplement shelves, etc. AND many guys can't resist making whey more complicated than it has to be.

now, for the punchline: can you get really friggin huge without whey? yes, yes, absolutely yes. BUT do most lifters of any seriousness (and many others) use whey to fill in protein gaps today? yes, of course. but they could get all that protein from eggs, red meat, and beyond, and do just fine.

and to me, that's the most useful "supplement" out there, from a "making gains" standpoint.

fish oil & multivitamins are in there not for lifting gains but to balance out known deficiencies in modern diets BUT we can also be certain that you would be better off IF you could get that nutrition from whole foods. for all our arrogance, we moderns still know less (scientifically) about soil & nutrients than some people from the past knew (intuitively and/or from experience). http://www.t-nation.com/readTopic.do?id=1487590

creatine is another you might play with IF you have the money & you've been doing this awhile. BUT (A-Unit's penchant for ALL CAPS for EMPHASIS is clearly infecting me) BUT recognize that most of the gains you will see & feel have more to do with pump than performance. the performance gains MAY be there, but unless you're being damn diligent with your records, what you'll notice is the pump. stop taking it...it goes away.

and if you take one of these caffeine-creatine-Arginine-essential amino-electrolyte-kitchen sink mixes, how will you ever know which component is helping your workouts most? (hint: I'm pretty sure it's the caffeine).
 

Throttle

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Warboss Alex said:
Generally I agree with what you say, but I can't agree with only 1% of people need additional supplementation. I'd say 1% don't and 99% do - you can't compare today with half a century ago because food processing methods have became such that much of the nutritional value of food is destroyed before it even hits the shelves.
just make sure you're we're distinguishing between 'nutritional' (gap-filling) supplementation -- a sad necessity -- and 'performance' supplementation, where the hype ALWAYS gets ahead of reality, once the $$$ (or pounds-sterling) get involved. even otherwise very responsible men and women get sloppy with their 'performance' supplement advice when they're getting a commission or kickback.

By the way - Hockey Playa, you have a minimal supplementation scheme which is nothing to worry about. You don't need CLA if you're taking fish oil though, and you should be eating your veggies instead of getting them in powdered form.
amen amen. advice to live by, HP. and drink your green tea rather than pop a pill. that cuts your supps nearly in half, which will become your refrain with your parents. tell them you'll give up whey when they buy you enough redmeat & eggs (as if). and when they're on diuretics, beta-blockers, statins, CCBs, baby aspirin and more you can return the favor by pointing out how unhealthy & unnatural such a regimen must be (I know I do -- hi dad!!! :flowers: )
 

Hockey Playa

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lol thanks for the advice guys. I agree with everything. The only reason im popping the green tea pills, is because of the enormous amounts ive heard, I have to consume. Something like 8 cups a day. No way i can fit that in my schedule. I have a cup for breakfast everyday, and another one if im lucky. I dont go overboard with the extract, maybe 1-2 a day.

I am also skeptical about the Vegge Green powder too, the only reason i have it , is because it came free in a package with my fish oil. IT says it gives u 6-8 of your daily vegetable servings though, which ihve had a hard time achieving.

CLA i know WBA told me it was unneccessary in the past :). I never considered using it before. The hot clerk at the nutrition store suckered me into buying it lol. She said it burns fat around the midsection(which im trying to do, for my abs to show). But ya ill probably drop that too

thanks guys
 

Throttle

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Hockey Playa said:
The hot clerk at the nutrition store suckered me into buying it lol.
lol, did you get her number? tell her if it doesn't work, she owes you a date, and must demonstrate better ways to burn off your midsection :D

I am also skeptical about the Vegge Green powder too, the only reason i have it , is because it came free in a package with my fish oil. IT says it gives u 6-8 of your daily vegetable servings though, which ihve had a hard time achieving.
well, i find it hard to believe it will actually accomplish anything like that (and i looked up the ingredients for some such powders, and at least some are definitely not made out of veggies we humans typically feed on)

but as an aside, i'm curious, does anybody here eat 6-8 servings a day of veggies (i would say you don't count, WBA, but i'm still curious, lol).

i checked and even on what i consider a good day I top out around a can green beans/peas/etc. (typically 3.5 1/2 cup servings) or the equivalent PLUS a decent sized salad (usually based primarily on romaine or baby spinach). even if that adds up to 6-8 servings, that's a pretty fantastic claim for any powder!
 

stronglifts

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Warboss Alex said:
Food processing methods have became such that much of the nutritional value of food is destroyed before it even hits the shelves.
I agree with what you say Warboss Alex. Nutritional value is certainly lower than it used to be. If you have the budget (I don't right now), go organic makes a big difference.

To me it's weighing the benefits vs. the risks. Maybe eating veggies/fruit doesn't give you all the nutritional value you need. But what does supplements give you beside the nutritional value? Supplements are chemical (ok some claim to be whole food), which has its own consequences.

Risks vs. benefits. To each his own.
 

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Throttle said:
...but as an aside, i'm curious, does anybody here eat 6-8 servings a day of veggies (i would say you don't count, WBA, but i'm still curious, lol).
I'm lucky if I can eat 3 or 4. It's usually a serving or two at lunch and hopefully a couple for dinner. That's why I've started supplementing with mega green powder in my morning protein shake. Add a banana, some berries and I'm good to go! :up:
 

Francisco d'Anconia

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Ll Principe said:
Hockeyplaya: just so u know CLA worked for me.
Out of curiosity, how long did you take CLA and what exactly did it do for you?
 

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