Alert: Major Fvckup - Still Salvageable?

AlphaAchiever

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Hi, this is my first post here, I love this forum as well as Heartiste and Rational Male, it has helped me a lot during the last 18 months. By the way, Im 39 and she is 29.

Ok, here is my story. I met this chick from Match, a solid HB9, top 3 girl I have ever dated. We had a great first date, I took her to this local bar where we went for drinks.

My frame is ****y & funny and we are having a good time, she is giving me strong indicators of interest, she is laughing, relaxed and she looks at me nonstop during the whole night.

I´m gradually escalating kinowise, I touch her sholders, arms, stomack, legs, hands as we are sitting next to each other on bar stools. Two hours passed, and I wanna take this one to the next level (kiss her to begin with). So, I tell her that we will leave the bar (its raining outside, and she says that she will get a cab. I´m fine with that, my next move is to isolate her outside under the umbrella and give her a kiss, thats what I do, she resists first, then I just smile at her, then we walk a couple of feet, and then I go in for the kiss again, and now she accepts it, then I say, you know we can go to my place for drinks (I live nearby). She nicely declines my offer but tells me that I could ride along in the cab (good indicator of interest) and I agree, hey, its raining like crazy. So we get in the cab and continue making out and then she drops me off at my place and we say goodbye.

This was on a thursday, and I decided to not contact her until sunday to set up date number 2. I text her on sunday and ask her if she had done any trampolining during the weekend (we talked about that on date 1). She answered no, and she thanked me for date 1. We also played the game “Angry Game” during our first date, which I won 4 times in a row, (you stare at each other and as soon as you start laughing, you loose. So, I asked her if she wanted revenge in the angry game and she agreed.

So, we set up this date 2 on thursday (picknick by the sea, in the evening). I bring wine and she bring some tuna sallad. We meet up and ride together on my bike, I wanted her to hold on to me while riding the bike, just to get some kino going from the start.

Anyways, we arrive on this great spot, the sun is shining and everything is fine. We start eating and drinking and as soon as we are done eating I touch her hand a little and we are just having a good time chatting about her upcoming party and what her friends are like. Then I go for the kiss and she reciprocate. Then I lay on top of her, and we continue kissing and I do push pull all the time. I also kid around that we should go skinna dipping, and she plays along, yeah maybe later.

Well, the sun sets and its about time to leave, I suggest that we head over to my place for some drinks and she says she will think about it during the bike ride home. Ok, now we are on our way back and we are riding on a gravelled road and then all of a sudden i get this fix idea that I should skid with the bike while she is on the back (yeah its totally crazy, but I´m a little drunk and this is what I do) and of course we fall, she is having a dress and wearing a designer jacket. Anyways, our speed is not high, maybe 10 mph but we fall and hurt ourselves, she get scratchmarks on her hand and her right knee and start bleeding and then she says that her jacket cost 2000 dollars and we have a look at it, but thankfully, its not ruined. She also says that it is really bad for a girl to get scars on her legs and I can of course understand that. Im just, wtf did just happen here? I really screwed up. She is really upset, not crying, but shocked and she asked why I did this and I just said, I dont know.

Well, she wanna go home as soon as possible and I agree, thats a good idea. I suggest that we head home to my place first since its on the way and I would give her bandaid, but she decline. We continue our bike ride and I stop frequently to check up on her and hold her. She get a little less upset and finally on the bridge, we look at the view (its a nice sunset) and we kiss a little bit, I just felt I had to reconnect some how. Then when we are almost at my place, I ask her again if she would like to come up to my place to get a bandaid and smoke a peace pipe (symbolically) by having a glass of wine. She agrees to this and we head to my place and we fix her wound. Then we have a glass of wine and then we start making out, but after 10 minutes, she says that she would like to go home. I agree, and ask her if she wants to walk (its about 15 minutes) and she says she would like that, I ask her if I could follow her to her door and she agrees. So, we walk over to her apartment, and I hold her hand and we are having a good conversation. We switch position while walking and she grabs my other hand. Then we reach her apartment and we kiss again and I ask her if she would like to hang out on sunday (now is thursday) and she says that I could call her on sunday because she is meeting a friend in the afternoon but that we maybe could meet during the evening.

Even though I managed to handle the aftermath quite decent I knew that this could mean trouble, I knew she would talk to her friends and they would most likely side with her and think that I am a real idiot. Ok, so the next morning I sent her a text and ask her how she is doing and tell her that I hope she will have a great day. She does not respond to my text and I decide to lay low until sunday.

So, yesterday (sunday), I give her a call and she doesnt answer, I wait 2,5 hrs and then text her I am really sorry for what happened and that I would like to make it up to her by cooking her dinner. She respond in 50 minutes and says thank you for my text, but adds that she felt really bad after the date and that we might be too differrent and she said it was nice getting to know me and ends with, “have a great autumn”

I havent responded to this (now 18 hrs), I´m just thinking going no contact, but since i didnt get to fvck her, if feels really ****ty, and besides, she seems to be a cool girl with potential. Anyways, Sosuave fighters, is there anything I can do to salvage this, I would really appreciate your thoughts on this. And also, how could I have handled this differently?
 

HalfPUAHalfAFC

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* The bike thing was a deal killer. Since you did it intentionally and she, as you surmise, ran it by her friends and they told her to forget you (they are herd animals my friend).

* You asked to go by your apartment too many times.

Add it up and she's reading your behavior as calculative and manipulative. Good game deactivates their radar; they don't notice it.

So, basically, she doesn't trust you or feel comfortable around you any more.

It's done. Stick a fork in it and move on.

And stop doing stupid crap like that bike move you did. Ugh....
 

AlphaAchiever

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HalfPUAHalfAFC said:
* The bike thing was a deal killer. Since you did it intentionally and she, as you surmise, ran it by her friends and they told her to forget you (they are herd animals my friend).

* You asked to go by your apartment too many times.

Add it up and she's reading your behavior as calculative and manipulative. Good game deactivates their radar; they don't notice it.

So, basically, she doesn't trust you or feel comfortable around you any more.

It's done. Stick a fork in it and move on.

And stop doing stupid crap like that bike move you did. Ugh....
Thank you for your answer. Yeah, her friends most likely influenced her, I think that I might have come around this if we have dated for a little longer, but this was too early.

About the apartment thing, its possible, I asked too many times, however, I felt that it would be even worse if she just left "the scene" right away.

How would she read my behavior as calculative, like I wanted to put her in this situation?

Yeah, its the trust thing, for sure, I just wish I could do something about it...
 

Greasy Pig

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Definitely go ghost. If she contacts you, that's good but don't try to force the action again with her. Any attempts at that now will only push her further away.
Give her a chance to miss you and to get over the fvcked up bike incident.
She might wake up one day and realised she overreacted and hit you up.
And remember: A woman who is really into you will forgive any minor mistakes you make.
 

AlphaAchiever

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Greasy Pig said:
Definitely go ghost. If she contacts you, that's good but don't try to force the action again with her. Any attempts at that now will only push her further away.
Give her a chance to miss you and to get over the fvcked up bike incident.
She might wake up one day and realised she overreacted and hit you up.
And remember: A woman who is really into you will forgive any minor mistakes you make.
Yeah, Im going NC for sure, its now been more than 24 hrs since she texted me, so my urge to reply has decreased. So, lets assume she would hit me up, you are saying that I should wait for her to initiate a meet up and just remain friendly and indifferent/aloof?

I have another date coming up on wednesday, but Im still curious about this possible development.
 

Greasy Pig

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Yeah, play it cool if she reaches out to you. Don't call her on her flakiness or act butthurt about the rejection.
But don't ask her out. Let her chase you. She ditched you once, so the ball is in her court.
 

AlphaAchiever

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Greasy Pig said:
Yeah, play it cool if she reaches out to you. Don't call her on her flakiness or act butthurt about the rejection.
But don't ask her out. Let her chase you. She ditched you once, so the ball is in her court.
Yupp, lets see if things develop
 

Genesis5

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Too much too soon man. You look desperate as fvck constantly asking her to your apartment.

The bike thing sealed the deal, IMO. That was your bad, better luck next time. You already apologized there, no need to be sorry because shes not calling you back, you look weak.

Next girl, keep it light and casual, escalate as fast as you want, but honestly dude don't be chugging at ideas to get her alone because you dont have the balls to have game on your dates. I would of played a little harder to get.

Also - I see a lot of you wait like 3,4 days after first date.. That's not really necessary.
 

AlphaAchiever

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Genesis5 said:
Too much too soon man. You look desperate as fvck constantly asking her to your apartment.

The bike thing sealed the deal, IMO. That was your bad, better luck next time. You already apologized there, no need to be sorry because shes not calling you back, you look weak.

Next girl, keep it light and casual, escalate as fast as you want, but honestly dude don't be chugging at ideas to get her alone because you dont have the balls to have game on your dates. I would of played a little harder to get.

Also - I see a lot of you wait like 3,4 days after first date.. That's not really necessary.
Hey man, thanks for your input. Yeah, I might have asked her too many times, I agree.

I did not apologize there (at the scene) though, otherwise I wouldnt apologize later on.

About the isolation thing, I might have had some opportunities at the bar, however, most of the time it was very crowded and people standing pretty close, wasnt totally optimal.

I think the 3-4 day thing before contacting could be shortened, however, I usually have my first dates on wed and thursdays, therefore, I dont wanna contact them on friday or saturday, but sunday is fine. What are your thoughts on that?
 

Genesis5

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AlphaAchiever said:
Hey man, thanks for your input. Yeah, I might have asked her too many times, I agree.

I did not apologize there (at the scene) though, otherwise I wouldnt apologize later on.

About the isolation thing, I might have had some opportunities at the bar, however, most of the time it was very crowded and people standing pretty close, wasnt totally optimal.

I think the 3-4 day thing before contacting could be shortened, however, I usually have my first dates on wed and thursdays, therefore, I dont wanna contact them on friday or saturday, but sunday is fine. What are your thoughts on that?
Never be afraid to offend a girl, if you were at the bar and the feeling was right, dont wait for some magical under the umbrella moment, lean in close and give her a kiss. You don't have to make out, but at least let her know you're not afraid of what people think and you have a direction.

You should of apologized at the scene.. Remember, if you ARE going to call back an event from a date, make sure its a POSITIVE one, and not something negative that happened.

You're human, you make mistakes, if this was the hinge that broke the door, then really she wasn't all that interested. Sounds like to me she saw you as an AFC chump anyways, sorry to break it to you like that I know.
 

Genesis5

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As far as what I think about date timing. It's up to you man, play the game how YOU want to play it.

This is why we stress spin more plates. So if it doesn't work out, it doesn't work out.

I don't play that "oh im so busy on fridays and sat because I'm too cool for your ass" game.. If i have free time. I have free time. Last saturday I went on 4 dates, one in the AM, one for lunch, one for dinner, and one at night.
 

AlphaAchiever

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Genesis5 said:
Never be afraid to offend a girl, if you were at the bar and the feeling was right, dont wait for some magical under the umbrella moment, lean in close and give her a kiss. You don't have to make out, but at least let her know you're not afraid of what people think and you have a direction.

You should of apologized at the scene.. Remember, if you ARE going to call back an event from a date, make sure its a POSITIVE one, and not something negative that happened.

You're human, you make mistakes, if this was the hinge that broke the door, then really she wasn't all that interested. Sounds like to me she saw you as an AFC chump anyways, sorry to break it to you like that I know.
You have got some good points, I appreciate it.

Yeah, if I meet a girl out at a bar, I dont have a problem kissing her, but then its usually a little bit later and I´m more drunk. I might try that when the next opportunity opens, I have kissed girls on the first date, 2 out of 4 times lately, but then I have isolated first.

Yeah, I think I should have appologized there, I guess it was just such a sick event, I didnt really knew what to do. I totally agree that you should make sure it is on a positive note when you call back.

Well, Im not gonna drag myself down too much from this, hopefully I will learn more and become more confident.
 

Genesis5

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If you need to be drunk to have the balls to kiss a girl, you need to work on your INNER game, not your bar game.

Keep at it man, you'll be a boss in no time
 

AlphaAchiever

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Genesis5 said:
If you need to be drunk to have the balls to kiss a girl, you need to work on your INNER game, not your bar game.

Keep at it man, you'll be a boss in no time
haha, well I live in Scandinavia, so over here its quite unusual to kiss AT ALL on the first date, but hey, I dont mind outshining my competition:box:
 

AlphaAchiever

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Genesis5 said:
As far as what I think about date timing. It's up to you man, play the game how YOU want to play it.

This is why we stress spin more plates. So if it doesn't work out, it doesn't work out.

I don't play that "oh im so busy on fridays and sat because I'm too cool for your ass" game.. If i have free time. I have free time. Last saturday I went on 4 dates, one in the AM, one for lunch, one for dinner, and one at night.
This fri/sat thing is bothering me. I mean if first date is wed, then you contact her on sunday, then you are lucky to strike a second date on thu, which is 8 days later. Whats your strategy, do you plan the second date at the end of the first date? Or, do you go like this:

Tues Date 1
Thur Call/text her
Sat Date 2
Mon Call/text her
Wed Date 3
Etc
 

Genesis5

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Stop with this strategy bs. there is no strategy. As long as you dont seem NEEDY and DESPERATE - you can literally hit a girl up the same night if you really wanted to.

You like this girl? don't fvcking play games, they can see right through you if you try to hold off a few days, if you made it THAT obvious on the date you liked her. (Again we go back to being a challenge)

Just own it. Own your feelings, don't be afraid of rejection.

I'll call a girl up the next day and tell her I had a dream I was fvcking her, get off the phone and she'll text me 5 hours later to come hang
 
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