Addressing The CWAF's Biggest Fear - Cheating

[Peaks&Valleys]

If it was so insecure that a man has problems with his woman hanging out with other men one on one, why does Peaks insist they will get rid of these men on their own? After all, according to you guys the only reason a guy would object is because he's insecure, right? Why would she instinctively do something on her own to appease some guy's insecurity?

Game...set...match. The entire house of cards comes crashing down.


You guys have literally adopted the female double standard re: opposite sex friends and repackaged it as "alpha".

*sigh*

Have you guys ever had a buddy who got a Gf then all of the sudden he drops off the face of the Earth?

I have a lot of friends that are coupled up, but they're long time friends. However, when I'm single, I find myself hanging out with my other single friends. When I have a gf, I find myself hanging out more with my coupled up friends.

Same principle you dinguses. Unless you're a beta b1tch provider, once you pull this woman into your world, for the most part, she won't need these orbiters....or want them. SMH.....She'll want to hang out with you!!!!

Have you guys not experienced this?

It doesn't matter if it's her single guy friends or her single girl friends. They will start to drop off.

If they don't drop off on their own, then you haven't pulled her into your world.

It's only when you force her to cut contact with them then she is appeasing your insecurities.

What happens if she runs into one of her former orbiters while grocery shopping? Is she supposed to duck her head and pretend she doesn't know him?

You guys are a$$ backwards.

This is why you only establish the boundary at the onset of her push for exclusivity. Her reaction will tell you most of what you need to know, whether her values lie in the arena where she is trustworthy. Women who value the attention of other men over you are NOT LTR material because quite honestly they are not trustworthy.

^case in point

You guys also make my brain hurt.

Yeah there are women that cheat. There's a $hit ton of them. And it's with other men....yeah, no $hit. Your solution is to limit contact with other men. But you guys aren't getting to the root of this issue. You're handling the problem on a surface level. I haven't seen any of you guys address the whole ashleymadison.com thing. Anyone?

"I wish women had the logical capacity men do, I wish they didn't thrive on drama, attention and constant stimulus" -- This is why they are built to be led and directed by men.

I agree. However, there are good leaders and bad leaders. I saw this quote on here before, it's a good one:

"Leadership is the art of getting someone else to do something you want done because they wants to do it."
-Dwight D. Eisenhower

I understand the whole premise that men can "set any boundary they want".....but that doesnt mean those boundaries arent "based in fear" or "bad boundaries". In the face of that charge, you guys cower up and say "well fvck you guys I can set whatever boundary I want".......this is the EXACT SAME as the beta AFC chump who proclaims "I want girls to like me for me....I dont want to change", whenever they first become unplugged.

The beta chump has been doing "unattractive things" and "insecure" things his ENTIRE life....thus he has limited success with women. By placing boundaries because you fear her cheating......you limit your personal growth. When you say things like "who cares if Im insecure and set a boundary, I want to".......you still prove you have a little of that beta blood inside of you. Instead of getting defensive and trying to defend your ego......you should seek to conquer ALL FEARS AND INSECURITIES instead of allowing them to manifest themselves.

Nice post. :yes:

For example.....lets say you KNOW 100% she will not cheat. Crazy I know, but its guaranteed shes 100% faithful. Would you still place this stupid boundary on her?

1. If you say no.....congratulations, you have just passed step 1 and now realize the true reason you place the boundary is because you FEAR HER CHEATING.

This, bottom line, it is an insercurity. You know it, and she knows it.

Again, I realize, that insecurity won't matter if her interest level is high enough, however, women are based off of emotion, so logical rules and boundaries aren't going to have the same effect as emotional boundaries.

The best part is.....the more alpha you are, the more she will seek orbiters to give her attention because you restrict the amount you actually give her.......

I've seen this. A woman that flirts, teases, however when the moment of truth comes, she leaves those orbiters with their toungues hanging out. I'm sure most of us have, at one time or another, been on the b1tch end of this scenario. The moment Alpha Dog comes a calling, she's goes running. Maybe not the healthiest of relationships, but she's most likely not going to risk losing her Alpha Man. She gets some of her attention from the orbiters, but she wants the attention from her Alpha.

I'm in the Danger camp on this, it doesn't matter if she is 100% invested, attracted, wrapped, however you want to say it. Almost all women are subject to situational impulsivity. With the better ones, it's high situational, takes a lot... but still impulsive if the right buttons are pushed. The application of game proves this in spades. I'm an average guy in many ways who learns fast, works hard, who has had -many- women drop all pretense and literally put their hands down my pants in crowded bars, pull their tops up over their bras in three star restaurants... these were professional women making 250 a year and still the bell works on them. Some of these women had a serious BF that they planned on marrying, some of them had a man who -thought- he had a GF, but who hadn't pressed the issue of behavior to find out if he really did or not.

A humble man concludes, "If I can -do- that, get that response quickly when I want it, it can be -done- to me." I'm not even playing their favorite song on a guitar, riding around in a Porsche or giving them an eball. Cut down opportunities for bad behavior, reinforce good behavior, greater probability of contentment or at least lack of drama... for the time being. If they can't handle that, then we don't need to be exclusive. Personally, I think this topic is relatively simple and being talked to death, not excluding myself from that assessment either.

That is why I don't give them permission to go play with matches and a gasoline can in the yard. They may do it anyway, but it won't be on my watch, and won't be while we are exclusive, at least the minute I find out about it. This may or may not prevent any cheating or bad behavior, but keeps the results as near binary and crystal clear as possible. Makes my life easier, and I can't emphasize enough the importance of doing everything in one's power to make your life with women easier.

Cats love people too, rub all over you, purr and meow... then the shiny bell with the feather on it rings and rolls across the floor... there goes the cat. I wish women had the logical capacity men do, I wish they didn't thrive on drama, attention and constant stimulus, and some of them don't. Those are very rare and stick out like a sore thumb, can be given more leeway. For the rest? Lay the groundrules when they ask for exclusivity and keep those reins on and tight. True insecurity is being afraid to do that because it might "chase them off."

Dasein, you make some good posts. And I think you're one of the few posters on here who can understand both sides of this argument and state your points and argument objectively,without twisting words or mis-quoting.

From the outside looking in, the bottom line, is it worth it to limit her activity with other men?

The pros and the cons. I see a lot more cons, and I've never had to do it. Would it be a pro-active solution to some women's cheating habits? Probably. However, like I've stated, I cannot see myself ever having to make that step, or wanting to make that step. If I ever felt I needed to, I would start looking for a new woman.

 

[Jaylan]

Have you guys ever had a buddy who got a Gf then all of the sudden he drops off the face of the Earth?

I have a lot of friends that are coupled up, but they're long time friends. However, when I'm single, I find myself hanging out with my other single friends. When I have a gf, I find myself hanging out more with my coupled up friends.

Same principle you dinguses. Unless you're a beta b1tch provider, once you pull this woman into your world, for the most part, she won't need these orbiters....or want them. SMH.....She'll want to hang out with you!!!!

I very much agree with this.

For the most part, I do see even my closest friends less when someone is in a relationship while the other isnt. Single people and couples simply have different interest and ideas of fun a lot of the time. Plus theres the whole 3rd and 5th wheel situations.

And I have seen my guy and girl friends limit contact with opposite sex friends once they get into relationships with someone they really like. They just instinctively do it.

 

[JoeMarron]

This sh!t is still going on, awesome

Mr. Marron, I know you have a wedding coming up, how are you planning on preemptively handling a situation like this from occuring?

I'm already married. She already knows what's up. That would result in an easy dump.

Danger summed it up pretty well what I meant by demanding what you want from a relationship. Demand is the wrong word, it's more like a statement. "Here's how I run my kingdom, if you don't like the rules leave now."

I understand the whole premise that men can "set any boundary they want".....but that doesnt mean those boundaries arent "based in fear" or "bad boundaries". In the face of that charge, you guys cower up and say "well fvck you guys I can set whatever boundary I want".......this is the EXACT SAME as the beta AFC chump who proclaims "I want girls to like me for me....I dont want to change", whenever they first become unplugged.

The beta chump has been doing "unattractive things" and "insecure" things his ENTIRE life....thus he has limited success with women. By placing boundaries because you fear her cheating......you limit your personal growth. When you say things like "who cares if Im insecure and set a boundary, I want to".......you still prove you have a little of that beta blood inside of you. Instead of getting defensive and trying to defend your ego......you should seek to conquer ALL FEARS AND INSECURITIES instead of allowing them to manifest themselves.

And we disagree on what constitutes a fear based boundary. Polyamory dudes would say we're being fearful and insecure by not allowing our women to fvck other men. As Danger has illustrated, a man of high value can state what he expects out of the relationship and the woman will comply.

For example.....lets say you KNOW 100% she will not cheat. Crazy I know, but its guaranteed shes 100% faithful. Would you still place this stupid boundary on her?

1. If you say no.....congratulations, you have just passed step 1 and now realize the true reason you place the boundary is because you FEAR HER CHEATING.

2. If you say yes(which I bet you will all say and scramble around now and look for a reason to actually say yes) then why? Dont be bland, be bold. Dont just say "its disrespectful".....tell me WHY its disrespectful. Its just her filling a need for male attention. The best part is.....the more alpha you are, the more she will seek orbiters to give her attention because you restrict the amount you actually give her.......you guys actually are proving to her how beta you are.

Yes because that's what a sensible man does when he begins a relationship, he sets the frame for how the relationship will be. As far as hanging out with male friends is concerned, even intelligent females know that that sh!t isn't a good idea. If you're in a monogamous relationship, you take steps to make sure you don't end up in dangerous situations that could lead to infidelity. My own mother could come here and tell you guys that it's a bad idea. We all can't be the most alpha dude on the planet. Therefore it's wise to choose a women who's smart enough not to put herself in "high risk cheating situations." It's not about preventing cheating. It's about choosing a woman who's smart enough to never put herself in the position to cheat in the first place.

Women are emotional creatures but they aren't stupid. When a man tells her what his boundaries are, she knows damn well that crossing them will have consequences. If she crosses it she made a conscious decision to disrespect him. He just made it incredibly easy to know how interested in him she is and how much she respects him. Children are illogical and emotional creatures too. However, no sensible parent would let their children roam free with no boundaries. As men we are to lead the relationship. Leaders don't rely on people implying that there's some things that can and can't be done without consequences. They make it clear what is expected.

 

[Peaks&Valleys]

Back to name-calling?

Do you realize that 90% of your posts have insults/shaming in them veiled as "advice"? Including this one.

you and Exception are terrified of setting the terms at the onset when she seeks exclusivity

You and Exception are so afraid of looking unattractive....

The problem is there are AFC enablers such as yourself who are too afraid to "upset them".

Your reasoning is still off by the way. From last thread:

The fact that you're still making statements like this after countless threads and 80K+ posts, is truly mind boggling to me. It has nothing to do with being a man, or having a spine, or fearing that she'll walk away. Nothing.

Would it be possible for you to try and understand this^?

Either you're full of $hit here, or you're telling the truth. Either way, our mind sets are on complete opposite spectrums, and I believe we have different ways of qualifying women that we bring into our lives. So your projections on my relationships are incorrect.

This is the heart of the matter right here. You don't believe me when I say the above regarding women who fvk me behind their bf's backs and then shower them with love.

Did I say you were lying here? No, I said it didn't matter if you were or you weren't. Reading comprehension 101


Let's revisit this statement where you point out Exception's "insult" all while you deliver two yourself. And you still don't understand the author's intent.

Exception himself tried to insult me by saying those using boundaries would have to wait until "they were 40 and still not married". Such is the mindset of someone who fears losing the sole source of pu$$y they have and sees marriage as the end goal. Classic blue-pill.

.



Anyways, you and a few others make statments like this:

No, the bottom line is that any girl who is serious about a relationship and wanting to be exclusive should already know that one-on-ones are not allowed.

As far as hanging out with male friends is concerned, even intelligent females know that that sh!t isn't a good idea. If you're in a monogamous relationship, you take steps to make sure you don't end up in dangerous situations that could lead to infidelity. My own mother could come here and tell you guys that it's a bad idea. We all can't be the most alpha dude on the planet. Therefore it's wise to choose a women who's smart enough not to put herself in "high risk cheating situations." It's not about preventing cheating. It's about choosing a woman who's smart enough to never put herself in the position to cheat in the first place.

Which, I could have said myself, in my argument and main points against setting boundaries. :crazy:

 

[Mr. Kalikoat]

Guys, not allowing your girl to see other men (in a platonic way, not talking about dating) is the dumbest thing you can do. Here's why;

Girls need male attention in 3 ways; sexual attention, praise (being pedestalized) and emotional tampons.

Unless you are willing and able to satisfy her needs on all 3 levels, she is gonna need other men in her life. Forbidding her to see them will actually DAMAGE your relationship and it will create a very toxic atmosphere where eventually she WILL cheat on you BECAUSE you forbade her to see other men.

Forbidding your girl to see other men WILL make you look like an insecure possessive control freak to her. It doesn't matter how often you repeat "no it's a position of power blablabla" that doesn't change the fact how SHE will see you (and not just her, me as well). You might believe you're bargaining from a position of power but really it's just your male-hamster spinning.

And besides; I don't know about you guys but I sure as hell don't wanna be her emotional tampon. Hence I will never forbid my girlfriend to see other men. She needs her emotional tampon and I don't want her to use me as one, so I'll allow her to use some Beta AFCs as her emotional tampons. It makes her happy and in turn it will make me happy because I don't have to deal with her fvcking drama and emotional bullcrap.

 

[Jaylan]

^Wtf?

Im pretty sure a good man can give his woman the sexual attention, encouragement, and emotional support she needs. Thats why I would have a girlfriend...because we could provide one another with these things. Why would her or I need to seek anyone else to provide those things?

Thats just asking for drama.

 

[Mr. Kalikoat]

^Wtf?

Im pretty sure a good man can give his woman the sexual attention, encouragement, and emotional support she needs. Thats why I would have a girlfriend...because we could provide one another with these things. Why would her or I need to seek anyone else to provide those things?

Thats just asking for drama.

Really? So you want to just sit there and listen to her girly problems and actually pretend you're interested? Well, good for you, but that's not what I want.

And what if her problem has something to do with you or her relationship with you and she would like to hear some male perspective advice? While I'd be the first person to say that open communication in a relationship is key, there are just moment where you want/need to hear an outsider's perspective on things. I have my female friends to sometimes ask them why my girlfriend behaves in a certain way, why shouldn't she be allowed to have male friends for the same purpose?


But all that is besides the point, and that is that making these ridiculous ultimatums will make you look like an insecure possessive control freak and it will only make her MORE LIKELY to cheat instead of less likely. It's really not realistic nor healthy to expect your girlfriend to cut any and all male contact from her life. Even "just" asking to cut 1-on-1 contact with her male friends is already too much. Some of her male friends might be childhood friends that she has known for years. Who the hell do you think you are to just demand her to cut that contact just because you are AFRAID (<- position of weakness, not power) that keeping this contact might make her cheat on you? Like come on, you're really gonna feel threatened by some beta childhood friends? Do you really think she would cheat with them? That's just complete irrational. Don't you realize how pathetically insecure that makes you? Your fear (weakness) for her potentially cheating with these male friends is irrational.

You know what might make her cheat on you? These kind of ridiculous "boundaries". That's the fastest way of getting a woman to just ditch yo a$$ either before or after cheating on you. I speak from experience.

And before you say "well if she doesn't want to accept my ridiculous boundaries she's not worth it, I'll just next her, plenty of woman in the sea", again, that's just your male rationalization hamster spinning. But by all means, keep thinking this nonsense, keep nexting these pretty girls who won't accept you ridiculous "boundaries". Means more pretty ladies for me, and less competition from you guys because you next these women over something that is in my opinion just plain ridiculous.

 

[Jaylan]

^Get real dude.

Actually being concerned and helpful with regards to your girlfriends feeling is what a good boyfriend does. And vice-versa as well. If Im going to commit to a girl, she has to be someone I could consider a best friend. So yes, I will listen to her "girly problems" the same way I expect her to like to my own problems.

Moving on, boundaries are about respect. While I expect myself and a girlfriend to keep opposite sex friends and still see those friends...what wont be happening is either of us spending 1 on 1 time with opposite sex friends. Mature adults who respect their partners dont have much issue with this.

 

[TheException]

Exception himself tried to insult me by saying those using boundaries would have to wait until "they were 40 and still not married". Such is the mindset of someone who fears losing the sole source of pu$$y they have and sees marriage as the end goal. Classic blue-pill.

You're absolutely right. I insulted you because you have no leg to stand on when it comes to LTR game. You sit here and try to preach to men younger than yourself how to have a good relationship and that a good relationship needs boundaries yada yada yada........yet there you sit......unmarrried. You have failed LTR game to this point. You have no family(atleast stable family unit), no kids(unless from broken home), yet you talk as if you know whats best for all of us.

You're damn right I see marriage as the end goal for LTRs. Thats the point.....I am seeking a high quality female to eventually have a family with. Doesnt have to be now, or in 2 years.......but waiting until my 40s or 50s I would consider a failure. I plan on being the "alpha dad" archetype and raising my kids with a strong masculine influence. I want to be able to run around the yard with them and coach them in sports. I dont want to be using a walker for their high school graduation...

And look at this......one one hand(quote above) you denounce marriage and call it a "fearful blue pill mindset"......yet below.....you claim committing to any woman without the intention to marry her is "scarcity beta game".

i feel sorry for you suckers who treat all women like a potential wife rather than just having fun with them flaws and all. you are the same guys that cry in a corner and shut down for months after a breakup........my statement still stands. if you arent planning to marry the chick, who really gives a sh*t if she cheats?

Midnight,

This only applies to committed relationships. Pay attention. Only betas commit to women in the HOPES that their behavior will change. Have some confidence in the value you provide to women, enough to set your expectations in the start instead of fearing you may "lose attraction".

And if you don't plan on "marrying her", why in the fvk would you commit to her in ANY fashion? To keep her longer? That in itself is beta game as well. Scarcity mindset.

Guess you are putting yourself in scarcity mode there pal.....since you dont plan on marrying YOUR GF.

I have a suggestion....since you love bragging so much about how many women you have gotten to cheat.....maybe stick to those topics. Maybe we could petition to have a new "subforum" opened up for you....we can call it "CWAF Game/Making Women Cheat"

 

[VikingKing]

This is a bit off the wall but, have you ever considered muslim women have to dress the way they do, and are not allowed to have the same freedom to go out for a reason? I mean, I'm just saying maybe their culture became the way it is in regards to their women based on thousands of years of experience.

I'm not saying everything they do is ok, but at some point they must have had some chronic issues that caused them to have the rules they do for women.

I mean keep an open mind.

 

[zekko]

Guys, not allowing your girl to see other men (in a platonic way, not talking about dating) is the dumbest thing you can do. Here's why;

Girls need male attention in 3 ways; sexual attention, praise (being pedestalized) and emotional tampons.

Unless you are willing and able to satisfy her needs on all 3 levels, she is gonna need other men in her life. Forbidding her to see them will actually DAMAGE your relationship and it will create a very toxic atmosphere where eventually she WILL cheat on you BECAUSE you forbade her to see other men.

Lol, I just love this. I absolutely love this. So now women are such wonderous and special creatures that not only is one man not enough for them, they have to have a TEAM of men to take care of all their highly specialized needs. Now if I am good enough, and lucky enough, and oh so very alpha enough, maybe I might get the opportunity to join the team of one of these marvelous creatures! Um..yeah, thanks but no thanks. Women join my life, I don't join their team.

They NEED pedestalized! L.O. frigging L. Hilarious. If there is one thing today's woman does not need it is to be pedestalized!

Forbidding your girl to see other men WILL make you look like an insecure possessive control freak to her. It doesn't matter how often you repeat "no it's a position of power blablabla" that doesn't change the fact how SHE will see you (and not just her, me as well). You might believe you're bargaining from a position of power but really it's just your male-hamster spinning.

OH NO! Not only will the woman think I am insecure if I'm not happy with her running around with her team of men, Mr. Kalikoat will think I am insecure, also! OH NO!

Of course, I did not "forbid" my girl anything. I was just qualifying her, to see if she could meet my definition of an exclusive relationship, which she was very eager to do.

And you talk about "male hamster rationalizing"? Wow, your feminist masters really taught you well, didn't they? They would be very proud of you.

keep thinking this nonsense, keep nexting these pretty girls who won't accept you ridiculous "boundaries". Means more pretty ladies for me, and less competition from you guys because you next these women over something that is in my opinion just plain ridiculous.

This right here alone shows you have no idea what you are talking about. This is not about collecting "more pretty ladies for me". This is specifically about exclusive relationships. How often do you think those types of situations come up? If you have a new exclusive relationship every two weeks you need to be more picky.

I'm sure since we are letting the girls have teams of men to meet their attention needs, we men get to have harems to meet our sexual needs, right? It's only fair, after all. Of course, then we're not talking about exclusive relationships, so it doesn't really apply, does it?

 

[VikingKing]

You must spread some Reputation around before giving it to zekko again.

 

[dasein]

From the outside looking in, the bottom line, is it worth it to limit her activity with other men?

IMO it is, especially if that and other boundaries are laid out when she starts pressing for exclusivity. Pre-exclusivity, few boundaries other than standard human courtesy apply, both do as they like, and other than that basic courtesy, everything else is nunya. That is my preferred "relationship status" today, I don't want exclusivity, we have fun, go out, stay in, whatever, and then she or I go away until next time.

Other men may feel differently and prefer exclusivity, be looking for a wife, kids, like to hang out with them forever, have three hour heart to heart's that's cool (lol no it's not really). Not me though, and if I am expected to be someone's exclusive BF, then they will have to ante up with reasonable restrictions on their behavior. I am no longer an "accessory" to some fabulous, stylish, in-demand woman's fabulous, stylish life... and then she does exactly as she pleases without accountability or consequence. No, we have fun together including sex, and if she wants a more secure thing such that I don't act on my options and do as I like, she will ante up with some minor, reasonable behavior modification... or go back to the 10 bozos lapping at her taint like puppies.

This is not insecure in the least because 1. I'm already sleeping with them regularly, may even be getting tired of that, 2. they are the ones who want exclusivity not me, 3. the boundaries are my way of ratcheting it and backing down from exclusivity without burning bridges, "well if you want to sleep on the couch at so and so's party and not call, that's fine, but as we discussed that's not part of how exclusivity works for me, so consider yourself free to do as you like once again, and I'll do the same." With no anger, angst or pouting at all. It is what it is. These are my rules or I get to go back to where I wanted to be anyway, nonexclusive.

They will pitch a tantrum, and may walk (for the moment, they WILL be back unless they landed a decamillionaire or pro athlete... in that rare case that has happened to me way too many times for vegas odds we were done anyway), but because the boundary was prediscussed, emphasized and repeated when there were no issues, I don't have to sit and have a 4 hour heart to heart or series of annoying phone calls/texts. I have 0plex (0 with 100 0s) time or tolerance for the infinite looping "are you mad? you seem mad? why did you take an hour to reply, are you mad? I think that's passive aggressive when you do that. Are you still mad? can we talk on the phone?" (for the third time that day). Each hour of such cancels out a previous good sex session or fun time in the past. Others may be more tolerant. Even the good ones have a penchant for drama that I just don't tolerate. If that's "insecure" so be it. I have "insecured" myself out of many annoying talks and maintained things the way I want them that way. It's just another way to keep binary and keep sane.

 

[dasein]

Really? So you want to just sit there and listen to her girly problems and actually pretend you're interested? Well, good for you, but that's not what I want.

The fallacy in your posts is that a woman must have those other things from men as opposed to from their GFs and their family. Women have plenty of support network generally without adding in exes, clingers and drinking buddy "male friends." Those latter are just attention supply, not any real need.

 

[JohnChops]

here we are, we see the wild SS DJ arguing again, and oh look not getting laid! magnificent creatures of hypocrisy they are indeed!

ill toss in my 0.02. if a girl is going to cheat with you, dont believe that she is going to cheat with YOU only, she wants to cheat and you were in the right place at the right time.

if she wants to cheat, she will do it anyway, might as well get a free lay out of it.

Addressing the boundaries, if your GF is gonna cheat LET HER, who gives a sh1t? dump her ass the second you find out, find a new girl. This has been my mentality in every relationship, I dont set boundaries, but she knows ill drop her on her a$$ if she cheats or does anything i dont like for that matter.

 

[bukowski_merit]

Rather than trying to reply to people, I'm just going to write up a few notes I gathered in my head (and from experience) as i read over the replies.
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Relationship advice is hard to prove.

If you have a guy (like me) who has had mostly flings, casual relations, with a few long term girlfriends – you can always say “well what do you know about being in a successful long-term relationship?”

If you have a guy who is in a successful relationship (at least in his eyes) – is his input really relevant? Does him saying “this is what works with my girlfriend” really matter?

I remember there was this guy back in the day (probably still puts out books) named CR James. And his books were more geared towards keeping your girlfriend/wife happy in the relationship. The advice in it seemed very good (although sometimes Dr. Philish stuff like "talk to her about issues" would pop up). But almost every story he told was how he handled a situation with his wife. The problem was – it was clear his wife was the perfect model for the type of women his stuff worked on.

Which is the case with almost all relationship advice. The model is almost always one girl, who the fvck cares about what works on one girl? That's not data.
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The reason the same doesn’t apply to pick-up is… well…. It’s something that can be repeated over and over with MANY DIFFERENT women over a short period of time. We can actually collect experience on what works and doesn’t. Relationships are so much longer, so much happens on the subconscious level; things we think are minor; that can influence the total lifespan of the relationship. And when it ends we won't even know the effect that thing that seemed minor had. So we have a very limited lifespan to collect the same data doing relationships.

Even if you’re doing mLTRs (multiple long term relationships) your experience will still be nowhere near that of a guy giving advice on pickup.
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There’s similar things and a lot of us can agree on some of the key points (such as: don’t be a push-over; don’t be passive aggressive, don’t be supplicant, etc.) But a lot of these outlining issues that men on here argue about all the time are really not things that are one way or the other.

To me - There’s merit to both sides of this argument. And both strategies work depending on their congruency of the guy behind the words.
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I can mainly give my experience only on one end.

I went through a 2-3 year period where I exclusively fvcked women who were taken. I thought I had found the secret to happiness! Why was I happy? Fvcking taken women is one of the least stressful things in the world. All it basically is is sex. The women don’t normally get clingy (sometimes they do). They don’t ask you to do things with them. It’s just sex.

During this period – I learned the #1 sign I was about to fvck the woman. It went like this:

“My boyfriend/fiancé told me I’m not allowed to hangout with you anymore.”

Up until this point – I was always just working the “flirty innocent ****y funny sexual” angle (yeah, that’s a real angle haha). Women will normally mention a guy to their boyfriends who’s impressing them. If she mentions him too much – most boyfriend will snap about it. It happened like clockwork!

“My boyfriend told me I’m not allowed to hangout with you anymore.”

Always resulted in sex soon after. That “always” is not an understatement. 100% of the time - when I heard those words – it was followed soon after by sex.
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So I do think that getting to a point where you attempt to ban her from seeing a “certain” guy is a terrible idea.

But the flaw with my data is, these guys were almost all AFCs. Some of them were good looking AFCs. Some of them were @sshole player AFCs. Some of them were Rich AFCs. But AFC is AFC and looks and money and even game cannot prevent you from being an AFC.

Another flaw is – I have no idea if boundaries were set going into their relationship. If they were – the woman wasn’t following them from the start.

So I can’t come to a concrete conclusion even though I slept with a good # of these women.
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I personally do set boundaries.

But the main 2 I set are that she’s “reliable” and “flexible to my schedule. “ (aka: easy to plan with)

A woman who’s reliable and flexible is going to by default be good in other areas of the relationship (for example: a woman sleeping with many different men is going to be incapable of being flexible and reliable). Even if it’s just casual - I still require she not get on my nerves by making it a hassle every time we try to hangout.

My most often reason for nexting a woman is one of the 2 things above. They are the easiest tip-off to future relationship problems.
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I don’t see anything wrong with telling a woman who is PUSHING YOU to be exclusive that that will include her not hanging out with other men.

If she’s at that point – she’s probably going to do anything you say to get the exclusiveness.

If she holds up her end of the bargain or not – will depend mostly on if she can successfully turn you into her b!tch or not.
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Just my thoughts on this.

 

[JoeMarron]

This is the goddamn twilight zone. We have experienced men here actively arguing for behavior that benefits the female. TheException, I have a question. Are you the most alpha man on the planet? If not then your girl is liable to run into a man more awesome than you. When that happens you want a woman who's wise enough and who respects you enough not to put herself into a bad situation. It's not about fear, it's not about constantly worrying about fidelity, it's not about mate guarding or preventing cheating, it's about stacking the deck in your favor and choosing the type of relationship that you want.

Like I said before a polyamorous dude could use the same argument you're using on us. You're insecure because you won't let your girl fvck other men. Like you keep saying about it being natural for a woman to monopolize male attention, women are also naturally hypergamous so why not let other alphas fvck her to ensure that she gets the best genes? As long as she comes home to you it's all good right? You would say hell no to this relationship simply because it's not the type of relationship you want, just like we don't want our women frolicking with other men.

I can mainly give my experience only on one end.

I went through a 2-3 year period where I exclusively fvcked women who were taken. I thought I had found the secret to happiness! Why was I happy? Fvcking taken women is one of the least stressful things in the world. All it basically is is sex. The women don’t normally get clingy (sometimes they do). They don’t ask you to do things with them. It’s just sex.

During this period – I learned the #1 sign I was about to fvck the woman. It went like this:

“My boyfriend/fiancé told me I’m not allowed to hangout with you anymore.”

Up until this point – I was always just working the “flirty innocent ****y funny sexual” angle (yeah, that’s a real angle haha). Women will normally mention a guy to their boyfriends who’s impressing them. If she mentions him too much – most boyfriend will snap about it. It happened like clockwork!

“My boyfriend told me I’m not allowed to hangout with you anymore.”

Always resulted in sex soon after. That “always” is not an understatement. 100% of the time - when I heard those words – it was followed soon after by sex.

Yeah these guys obviously didn't do it right. Ideally the boundary would've been in place from the beginning. As soon as he caught her hanging out with you he would know that she made a conscious decision to disrespect him. Easy dump.

 

[Mr. Kalikoat]

Actually being concerned and helpful with regards to your girlfriends feeling is what a good boyfriend does. And vice-versa as well. If Im going to commit to a girl, she has to be someone I could consider a best friend. So yes, I will listen to her "girly problems" the same way I expect her to like to my own problems.

Get real. A girlfriend can never be your best friend at the same time. Completely different dynamics. Girlfriends aren't even remotely like best friends. Friendship doesn't rely on the condition that she has to provide you with sex and affection, and in turn you have to provide her with stability and love. When one of the two can no longer provide what was agreed upon at the start of the relationship, it's over. Friendship, REAL friendship, is unconditional. Relationships are never unconditional.

Moving on, boundaries are about respect. While I expect myself and a girlfriend to keep opposite sex friends and still see those friends...what wont be happening is either of us spending 1 on 1 time with opposite sex friends. Mature adults who respect their partners dont have much issue with this.

Respect is about not cheating on each other and at the same time trusting that the other won't cheat without the need to set ridiculous boundaries such as these. Mature adults who respect their partners won't cheat and won't have much issues with the other seeing a friend of the opposite sex.

 

[VikingKing]

Isn't our attention our currency? Sex is a womans currency?

So if she gets to have orbiters, I should get to have fb's on the side, right?

I mean, women crave attention like we crave sex?

Equal rights...

 

[Mr. Kalikoat]

Isn't our attention our currency? Sex is a womans currency?

So if she gets to have orbiters, I should get to have fb's on the side, right?

I mean, women crave attention like we crave sex?

Equal rights...

I'm sure there are plenty women who agree with that and who have open relationships with their boyfriends/husbands, or are willing to have one.

Personally I don't think sex and attention have the same value/weight to them. When I'm in a monogamous relationship I don't necessarily need sex from others, as long as my girlfriend is capable of satisfying my sexual needs.

However, I'm a busy man and I can only see my girlfriend in the weekends (for quality time with the girl) and in the late evenings (for a quick bang). I'm not gonna expect her to just ditch all her male friends that she already had before she met me just because I'd otherwise be afraid she might cheat with them (I'm not afraid of that but some of you would be). It's not even realistic to believe she would fvck them. She didn't fvck them in the past when she was single and free to go, so why would I be afraid she would fvck them now? Being afraid she might cheat on me with them is completely irrational.

Why should I not allow her to spend time with her friends during the week (whether they're male or female, doesn't matter) as long as she spends time with me in the weekends and fvcks me exclusively on a regular basis? I see no good reason to act like such an insecure possessive control freak.