Accepting friendzone from select women

[PRW63]

I went through a stretch of limiting my personal interactions with women to romantic and sexual. Part of this was ditching Facebook a few years ago when it was getting ubertoxic. Recently I've been contemplating establishing female friends again, and they would be out of the pool of women I sexually pursued, as I almost always pursue women I like. Basically I'm looking at entering their friendzone orbiter cult for casual friendship.

I suppose the approach would be similar to a date but non sexual, like a lunch or public event. Has anyone had much success cultivating a decent circle of female friends on the side? Is it better to start from scratch?

You are confusing what "friend" means. It isn't about extremes (either Friend or Enemy). Friend is the "best buddy" that you hang out with one-on-one personally in a platonic way. An aquaintence is someone who is just part of the social circle that you run around with. So you can have woman as acquaintances all you want,...but having them as a friend only works if there is no way in the world that either one of the two of you will ever be attracted to the other (which is nearly impossible).

Also stop being fooled by what friendzone means. It does not mean you are a friend and that if you aren't in the friendzone then you are a stranger. Friendzone means,..."You ain't getting in my pants!...Go away!"

 

[PRW63]

Don't let your alarm clock be the only reason you wake up.

Just this morning,... Forgot to set the alarm,...usually goes off 6am or 6:30am,...I woke up at 9:30,...wondered if it was Saturday?,...nope it's Friday, made it to work by 10am (supposed to be there before 8am).

So the alarm clock is a requirement for me.

 

[PRW63]

Women are out living in the moment, not drawing up hard and fast rules about what they feel like doing.

Very true. That is why women are always the ones saying, "I don't know how that happened", or "I don't know why I did that", or "It just happend". Or like Rollo Tomassi always says, "I was drunk, he was hot,...and one thing led to another". Women ain't that hard to figure out if a guy stops expecting them to be more complicated than they really are. We are the ones who are complicated,...in-spite of the BS line you here in society that "Men are simple",...no we aren't, some are just kind of stupid. Even SIMPS go through all kinds of complexities in their minds to manage & justify the stupid things they do.

 

[Robert28]

That sucks. My experience is different, I've had girls toss hot friends my way. I'm not really into set-ups though, but I appreciate the thought.

I've also fukked "friends" and become friends with girls I've fukked. This is just another subject that I think men overthink to death. Women are out living in the moment, not drawing up hard and fast rules about what they feel like doing.

I would say your experience(s) is probably what 5% guys experience when it comes to women friends. It’s a outlier for sure. If more guys had experiences like yours, you’d see a much wider acceptance of men/women friends.

 

[fastlife]

There's no such thing as the friendzone. Women operate moment to moment, their attitudes are not static. This is another male mind trap - we like to classify things without exception and keep things in order.

Anyway, you can have a few select female friends as long as you approach it from the right mindset and place of high value - that you just want to hang, have her wing, or whatever.

Don't think of it as being in her orbit but of drawing her into yours.

Obviously this practice isn't for everyone - some guys just don't have time or interest in it and I respect that. But I've found a lot of value in female "friends" - quotes used because they're not the same as guy friends, of course. You still need to do all the usual high-value, masculine things you do with plates in terms of leading. This is why it's seen as too much trouble for some guys. But if you've internalized everything and are true to yourself, it's second nature. It all depends on your time/energy and whether it's worth it to you.

I'm glad the narrative around this is changing. IMO "don't be friends with women" is one of those misguided, overly-dogmatic "principles" that gets thrown around places like SS. Sure, that's great advice for guys who are needy, in scarcity, who lack boundaries, and who have low social value. Those guy are likely orbiting, likely lying to themselves (and their female "friends"), and likely being taken advantage of. It'll at least get them out of that and to the next steps of showing intent and being polarizing.

But it's a totally autistic idea for guys who have abundance and high social value. If you're already getting laid, then it's just not a big deal to enjoy the company of women. Whether there's sexual tension there or not, female friendships have been an awesome addition to my life. Those friendships don't tend to last the way male friendships do--usually the girl will fade away when her life (i.e. relationship) circumstances change--but they're great for what they are. While I prefer to travel light these days socially, in the past my female friendships have given me access to easy hookups, job opportunities, insight into the female mind ("never listen to a female" is another one of those stupid dogmas--girls are incredibly honest when they know you're not judging them), and have generally just been a fun addition to my life. Overall a total net positive.

I think a lot of the "rules" and "principles" here are really only useful for guys at the bottom. But, as always, be honest with yourself. If your female friendships are leaving you unfulfilled (because you're pining after her sexually lol) or are getting in the way of pursuing other opportunities, drop them. But other than that, live a little bit. Enjoy the full spectrum of what life has to offer.

 

[Robert28]

Okay, fair point. But I think it also has to do with attitude. Let's say a girl rejects a guy. If he's thin-skinned and low abundance (mentality or real) he'll think "I don't want to be friends!" and next her because his ego is hurt. If he's the opposite, i.e. doesn't give a fukk, carries on with a smile on his face, doesn't mind being her buddy or whatever, she'll toss cute girls his way, and also possibly reconsider her own choice (depending on many variables at play). So I think men are more in control of these possibilities than they realize.

IMO, if you wanna next a girl because you don't have time for that or just aren't into female friends, that's legit. Nexting because you couldn't handle rejection or don't want to be perceived by others as a guy who has chick friends, well that's kinda weak. (Exception: You had it bad for her and need to detox.)

Rejection I can handle, IF you directly do it and don’t play games and make me guess. But we all know women don’t do that. It’s not about being butt hurt because she rejected you, I want to move on with my life and go pursue someone else. My friendship is valuable, I just don’t give it out Willy nilly. If she’s got hot friends, great, there’s billions more women in the world I can meet and I won’t meet them if I’m wasting my time hanging around her.

 

[Mike32ct]

I think it’s only a potential problem when an inexperienced or AFC or ‘cel guy with ZERO women in his life listens to red pill advice: “Don’t give attention to any women you aren’t F-ing.”

So he has no women in his life, and he’s not getting laid. But NOW he’s preventing himself from even getting comfortable around women because he isn’t allowed to befriend them. He’s gonna stay trapped with his awkwardness now.

It’s fine if an experienced guy decides “no female friends for me” or “female friends are ok.” He can make up his own mind because he knows what he’s doing.

 

[Robert28]

I think it’s only a potential problem when an inexperienced or AFC or ‘cel guy with ZERO women in his life listens to red pill advice: “Don’t give attention to any women you aren’t F-ing.”

So he has no women in his life, and he’s not getting laid. But NOW he’s preventing himself from even getting comfortable around women because he isn’t allowed to befriend them. He’s gonna stay trapped with his awkwardness now.

It’s fine if an experienced guy decides “no female friends for me” or “female friends are ok.” He can make up his own mind because he knows what he’s doing.

I agree with that. That’s why I said they’re fine when you’re a teenager and in college. After that though? Cut that **** off when it’s presented.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

Has this been your experience?

Most of them really won't "help" you at least when it comes to women or social strength. They might do an odd favor here and there, but they ask for more.

 

[Robert28]

Most of them really won't "help" you at least when it comes to women or social strength. They might do an odd favor here and there, but they ask for more.

Ain’t that the truth. For every one favor they’ll do for you, you’ll do 12 for them. Some will be on a Saturday taking up all your weekend, some will be expensive, none will be small and convenient for you.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

Ain’t that the truth. For every one favor they’ll do for you, you’ll do 12 for them. Some will be on a Saturday taking up all your weekend, some will be expensive, none will be small and convenient for you.

Imagine that. You usually won't get "help" unless it regresses your position or advances her position in relation to you. Now a REAL female friend, whose being a friend will realize she's not fvcking you, but she has plenty of girlfriends that could and definately would if she put in a good word. Being a "good friend" she would put in that good word. How often does that happen? I"m sure it happens, just not often, maybe less than 10%. In most cases you will only get the "help" if it hurts you slightly or advances herself.

 

[Robert28]

Imagine that. You usually won't get "help" unless it regresses your position or advances her position in relation to her. Now a REAL female friend, whose being a friend will realize she's not fvcking you, but she has plenty of girlfriends that could and definately would if she put in a good word. Being a "good friend" she would put in that good word. How often does that happen? I"m sure it happens, just not often, maybe less than 10%. In most cases you will only get the "help" if it hurts you slightly or advances herself.

10% would be an improvement. I bet it’s under 1% to be honest. Being friends with women has never been more unpopular and there’s a reason for that.

 

[Robert28]

What's there to guess about? Either she's interested, or she's not. How are you being played, exactly?

When you know you aren’t that interested but you keep talking to me and going on dates I’m paying for. Don’t women claim to know whether they want to fvck a guy within the first few mins? So then why make me go out with you again and act like everything is progressing and make plans to see me again when you know you aren’t that into me? Then the audacity to give me the friend speech. Fvck that. Shove your friendship up your butt for all I care, just say we aren’t compatible and let it ride. Women that claim men string them along to use them for sex are the same women that’ll string along a guy to friendzone him after several dates. I know after 1 date if I want to see you again, it doesn’t take me 3,4,5 dates or a month or two if dating to come to that conclusion.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

10% would be an improvement. I bet it’s under 1% to be honest. Being friends with women has never been more unpopular and there’s a reason for that.

They use those guys as a "boost" and built in "azz kissers". They usually aren't really "helping" them because then he's no longer a "boost" for her. Or as a "brother", where she will always be trying to fvck his game up.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

When you know you aren’t that interested but you keep talking to me and going on dates I’m paying for. Don’t women claim to know whether they want to fvck a guy within the first few mins? So then why make me go out with you again and act like everything is progressing and make plans to see me again when you know you aren’t that into me? Then the audacity to give me the friend speech. Fvck that. Shove your friendship up your butt for all I care, just say we aren’t compatible and let it ride. Women that claim men string them along to use them for sex are the same women that’ll string along a guy to friendzone him after several dates. I know after 1 date if I want to see you again, it doesn’t take me 3,4,5 dates or a month or two if dating to come to that conclusion.

There are men who have a silvery slippery enough tongue that he can talk her into attraction over time where she may have not been able to "see" it up front.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

Has this been your experience?

No. It was just my experience most of them as "friends" only help you if it helps them more.

 

[Robert28]

No. It was just my experience most of them as "friends" only help you if it helps them more.

When you’re young I honestly believe they legit want to be your friend, less so in college, and after that you are most definitely only kept around for what you can provide.

 

[mrgoodstuff]

When you’re young I honestly believe they legit want to be your friend, less so in college, and after that you are most definitely only kept around for what you can provide.

It's usually quality time and attention.

 

[Barrister]

Being friendly with women has value. When you are trying to bang a woman and she sees that a lot of other women are friendly towards you it is beneficial for multiple reasons. Not only does it tell her you check out, but she also will likely believe they’re interested in you whether they are or aren’t. It increases her perceived value of you.

On the other hand, my experience of truly being “friends” with women is it’s usually more drama than it’s worth. In the rare instances where I’ve actually had them try to get me set up with one of their friends, sometimes even one who was very good looking, it generally seemed more complicated than it needed to be in a variety of ways. Just like everything else. Women are unnecessarily complicated.

And 9/10, it’s impossible to be her friend because she’ll start liking you anyway even if you don’t want that from her. I guess you could bang her then, but this can create problems in your social circle at that point.

 

[Guy69JackBlue]

Being friendly with women has value. When you are trying to bang a woman and she sees that a lot of other women are friendly towards you it is beneficial for multiple reasons. Not only does it tell her you check out, but she also will likely believe they’re interested in you whether they are or aren’t. It increases her perceived value of you.

On the other hand, my experience of truly being “friends” with women is it’s usually more drama than it’s worth. In the rare instances where I’ve actually had them try to get me set up with one of their friends, sometimes even one who was very good looking, it generally seemed more complicated than it needed to be in a variety of ways. Just like everything else. Women are unnecessarily complicated.

And 9/10, it’s impossible to be her friend because she’ll start liking you anyway even if you don’t want that from her. I guess you could bang her then, but this can create problems in your social circle at that point.

Great post on differing "being friendly" with "being friends"

Nobody is friends with people for no reason.