4 great dates + kissing + touching / rejected + LJBF?

[Partizan]

4 dates in one week? WTF? Can we say overkill?

 

[pyros]

idk man. gurus here telling you that u screwed up, killed her attraction (wtf, u had nice dates based on what you said, she has been responding nicely, showing interest and so on.)
I dont agree with them, it seems to me that you did everything fine. she just has her own problems, just be patient..

i have pretty much identical case, had like 7 dates, kissed her, hugged her and etc. Everything seemed to be nice, but then she left for vacation, contacted me first once she arrived, but then last weekend she flaked my dates, now she left for another vacation.. talked to her yesterday, she didnt reply for like 4 hours so i decided it's really over and deleted her number and so on, she apologized big time for a delay telling that she was packing her stuff, we had some chat and she agreed to go out on 23rd of august.. not sure if she will flake again, but w/e
what is actually similar in my case to your is that she didnt talk/ask me too much questions, she rather been talking about herself during our dates...

once again, i dont think you havent really screwed up, i do believe she likes you/has interest in you. She just has some stupid sh1t in her head and has to get over it. just be patient and dont overcomplicate stuff, that's my take, that's what i am currently doing... as my case is so similar to yours.

No, he did several things wrong. Its not 100 % his fault, but a big part.
Anyway, its funy how many guys here with little experience, and having a bad situation with a woman, go against what others with more experience recommend.

Nice...

P.S.
I would forget about that girl of yours wishyo.

 

[Rival]

Man everytime I been with a girl and she's went on a vacation, I make sure she knows I'm hanging around other women while she is gone. Works so well.

 

[xyz987]

thanks guys for your comments and critique.
Chill out, we will see what happen. I will give you an update.

 

[wishyo]

No, he did several things wrong. Its not 100 % his fault, but a big part.
Anyway, its funy how many guys here with little experience, and having a bad situation with a woman, go against what others with more experience recommend.

Nice...

P.S.
I would forget about that girl of yours wishyo.

I just shared my opinion. I dont have huge experience, but I had amazing LTR relationship, those days been among my most happy ones, we even ended up as amazing friends, we only had one drama during our 3 yr relationshio, we didnt even have those little "fights," at all. I had few one night stands/party nights during my college life with some hot girls too. This girl of "mine" is even hotter than those of bradd80's and by far the hottest I ever dated met, obviously not easy to stay emotionless and act rational.
Once again, I respect everybody's opinion here, I just shared my perception.

p.s. no fvcking way, she is mine. you will see the challenge is on bro

 

[xyz987]

4 dates in one week? WTF? Can we say overkill?

it was special situation. We had 2 dates and wasn't supposed to see each other for couple of days, and than somebody from her family suddenly died. She asked me if i can spend with a her a little time after work, because she don't wanna come back home to early due to baaad atmosphere.

My first thought was obviously "its not my business, hang out with your friends" but then I thought I shouldn't be so cold and gave in... and another date happen very spontaneously.

 

[Partizan]

it was special situation. We had 2 dates and wasn't supposed to see each other for couple of days, and than somebody from her family suddenly died. She asked me if i can spend with a her a little time after work, because she don't wanna come back home to early due to baaad atmosphere.

My first thought was obviously "its not my business, hang out with your friends" but then I thought I shouldn't be so cold and gave in... and another date happen very spontaneously.

Don't make yourself so available early in the dating cycle. Just because she asks to see you doesn't mean you have to agree. Remember you have other things going on in your life. Maybe hobbies, maybe work, maybe even other women. She doesn't need to know the details. Just that you are too busy to see her whenever she wants.

 

[Culture of ME]

To both the OP and Wishyo, you guys honestly need to listen. Stop thinking 'first person' about your situations and start looking at it as if you are hearing a story from someone you just met. Also, before I say anything about your situations, just know that I am no smarter than you or anyone else here. I, as almost everyone else here, has learned the HARD WAY. That is why we are sure about the advice we give and unwavering on the direction you should head. I made so many god damn mistakes with this one girl, that I could write 950 posts and it still wouldn't cover everything. So if you're going to take the time to post a question, then pay attention when people tell you what you did wrong. Here are my thoughts about both of your situations:

1) Stop blaming the girl for any of this. You are a man, take 100% responsibility. You f'd up and it's your fault. Even if it's not, it's still a proactive and powerful mindset. And who cares if it was her fault. Own your actions; you'll never change for the better if you don't. If you insist on blaming any girl, you are just a victim and no real man has ever been a victim.

2) For the time being, in both of your situations, you've lost the power in the relationship and now you must go ghost. She controls the game and you trying to create anything (interest, attraction, sexual tension) will not work. You had your initial chance and blew it. If you want ANY chance with either of your girls , then you need to accept that you may very well never get that chance and move on while trying to learn something and making yourself better. If you have any chance, she must be the one who drives it and you can then start the game over with her, but you're going to have to be 200% better than you would have had to be initially.

3) Wishyo, you in particular must stop the challenge accepted mindset. Unless the challenge you are accepting is to be a smarter and better man going forward, because that's all you control right now. You can't overpower a woman's emotions, especially one who you've already f'd up with by going too slow.

Guys, I wish you both nothing but luck and I hope you're both banging the f*** out of these two girls in a week. But, unless you take responsibility and start being men, it ain't gonna happen.

CoME

 

[The_411]

it was special situation. We had 2 dates and wasn't supposed to see each other for couple of days, and than somebody from her family suddenly died. She asked me if i can spend with a her a little time after work, because she don't wanna come back home to early due to baaad atmosphere.

My first thought was obviously "its not my business, hang out with your friends" but then I thought I shouldn't be so cold and gave in... and another date happen very spontaneously.

Huge red flag. If after two dates a girl wants to hang out with a guy she barely knows after a family death be thankful this didn't work out.

Think about it for a second. If someone in your family died the last thing you're probably going to do is want to hang you with a girl you've been with twice no matter how much of a distraction she might be and the girl should be a bit creeped out that you don't have some friends to hang out with instead.
way too much pressure and that's only something you should do when you're in a serious relationship.

 

[Fireballs]

idk man. gurus here telling you that u screwed up, killed her attraction (wtf, u had nice dates based on what you said, she has been responding nicely, showing interest and so on.)
I dont agree with them, it seems to me that you did everything fine. she just has her own problems, just be patient..

i have pretty much identical case, had like 7 dates, kissed her, hugged her and etc. Everything seemed to be nice, but then she left for vacation, contacted me first once she arrived, but then last weekend she flaked my dates, now she left for another vacation.. talked to her yesterday, she didnt reply for like 4 hours so i decided it's really over and deleted her number and so on, she apologized big time for a delay telling that she was packing her stuff, we had some chat and she agreed to go out on 23rd of august.. not sure if she will flake again, but w/e
what is actually similar in my case to your is that she didnt talk/ask me too much questions, she rather been talking about herself during our dates...

once again, i dont think you havent really screwed up, i do believe she likes you/has interest in you. She just has some stupid sh1t in her head and has to get over it. just be patient and dont overcomplicate stuff, that's my take, that's what i am currently doing... as my case is so similar to yours.

He was needy, way way way too available and didn't escalate. There is no ''stupid sh!t in her head'', she merely responded to OPs actions in a way that most girls would - LJBF.

 

[usernamedox11]

She had a lot of guy friends. I've met girls like this. They don't like or want relationships. They just want to fvck guys and are scared of true intimacy.

She told you I don't know if we could do this as a couple--DTF but didn't want a relationship with you. You should've said that's cool if you wanted to fvck her and told her a relationship is not what you are looking for.

Low interest on her part as far as something serious goes. She just wanted to fvck and you wanted a relationship. You didn't fvck up like other guys here are saying other than not realizing she didn't want you to be her BF and that she just wanted to fvck and hang out but she sensed you were falling for her and that you wanted more. If she had high interest in a relationship with you, wouldn't have mattered.

Chick is honestly a slut anyway so I don't see why you are tripping. Any time a girl says most her friends are guys, I don't take her seriously and know what her deal is.

These type of girls are not relationship material, FYI.

 

[Harry Wilmington]

So, I won't get into the numerous mistakes you made - obviously you've already done that as well as many of the other people on these boards - but I will say this: there's no reason for you to question her like for you. She did what very few women will do directly to your face when they've lost interest: she sat you down and told you she doesn't want to date you.

At this point, you're wondering: "But then, why would she get me a souvenir and want to come see me?" Simple: she feels like the bad guy in the situation, and wants to give you the consolation prize of being your friend. And friends get other friends gifts when they've come back from a trip. So, she's doing this with the idea that since she told you she doesn't want to date you, you're of the understanding that any contact she has with you is under the guise of friendship. Nothing more.

Now, I could be proven wrong on this fact. She may come over, give you the gift and talk about how she's changed her mind and wants to give you two a try. For one, I've rarely seen this happen; and two, if it DOES happen, the relationship will not last for long. The only reason she'd be getting with you is because, again, she feels bad for dumping you, and may feel like giving you another shot may prove her initial instincts wrong. It won't, and she'll dump you soon after agreeing to date you again.

I say all this to say: when a woman tells you directly to your face that she's no longer interested in dating you, you need to BELIEVE her and move on instead of trying to turn it around. That's your ego doing that because it doesn't want to believe a girl would dump someone as nice as you. But they will. Sometimes it's because of you doing the wrong things, but more often than not it's simply because she tried you out and realized you weren't a good fit for her for whatever reason, be it something you did or something about her life style that she doesn't want to get you involved in. In any case, you need to THANK these women for not wasting your time and move on to the next, which - in this case - is what I'd advise you to do.

Hope this helps!

 

[nismo-4]

You are guilty of Unauthorized use of a pedestal.

You had a chance for the pu$$y and you blew it. Now she just wants to be friends. Alas, your princess is in another castle. Move on. She did.

Case closed.

 

[sylvester the cat]

**** her in the park? If I had a accommodation, I would do, believe me. I didn't have one that night.

you don't need accommodation to bang a broad.

i once banged a very nice girl in a dirty alleyway. in the middle of the pouring rain!

but if rain isn't your thing then there are cars, public toilets, friend's places. no end of alternatives.

 

[marmel75]

So if I'm reading this right, it took til date 3 to kiss her and still haven't banged her after the 4th date?

If that's accurate that's on you brother...what are waiting on? The stars and moon to align?

 

[xyz987]

So if I'm reading this right, it took til date 3 to kiss her and still haven't banged her after the 4th date?

If that's accurate that's on you brother...what are waiting on? The stars and moon to align?

You didn't read it carefully - there was no room for banging (i find banging in public toilette or other strange places desperate and tasteless), and just after 4th date (which was OK) she made almost 10 days trip, almost no contact from both sides. When she returned it was over.

i once banged a very nice girl in a dirty alleyway.

congratulations, not my style.

when a woman tells you directly to your face that she's no longer interested in dating you, you need to BELIEVE her and move on instead of trying to turn it around

Yes, but on the other hand have you never heard about women changing their minds? Haven't you ever dismiss the girl once, and at some point in the future want to bang her badly? I know it's less probable, but don't make what she said so definite. She is young, cute, inexperienced girl, unsure of her feelings.

That's your ego doing that because it doesn't want to believe a girl would dump someone as nice as you.

I'm rather confused about how suddenly she made this decision. Everything was just OK (I would say it was escalating), then she went on a trip (we goodbye with a lovely kiss and "fire in eyes"), not seeing me, no actions from both sides, she was "thinking about it long and intensively" during these days, and then gave me that decision.
Was she attracted or not? Why she lost the interest during "silent days" and not earlier, what I was a bit needy, too available etc?
I mean - I've would never spent couple of days kissing/touching a girl which is not attractive to me, I wouldn't even start and wouldn't agree on her actions.

Meh, I think there is too much "logic" in my way of thinking about this...

She had a lot of guy friends. I've met girls like this. They don't like or want relationships. They just want to fvck guys and are scared of true intimacy.

Perhaps... but I don't think it's like that.
She is not a "wamp" or "wh0re" type of girl. Rather young, cheerful, not experienced (told me never has sex outside the 3.5year relationship), a little bit shy, dismissing guys seducing her kindly but firmly. Maybe it's all BS and she is different and I'm too naive, but I don't think so.
And she has also some girlfriends (I would say 50/50), so no exaggeration here.

Think about it for a second. If someone in your family died the last thing you're probably going to do is want to hang you with a girl you've been with twice no matter how much of a distraction she might be and the girl should be a bit creeped out that you don't have some friends to hang out with instead.
way too much pressure and that's only something you should do when you're in a serious relationship.

Yeap, I was surprised too.
I think "nice guy" part of my nature woke up then and I've just wanted hug her and tell "everything gonna be ok". Maybe mistake from DJ technique perspective, but we are humans after all, not robots.
What's interesting, that was the night when when I escalated from hugging to kissing and panties exploration.






UPDATE:
A little bit online talking between us:
- I've got the present for you, will make you happy bla bla
- Do i look like a sad guy..?
(after 2 days)- Hmm no you're not... anyyyway I'm so tired and busy, didn't even have time to respond you quickly. And tomorrow I'm going to my vacation!
- You're not the only one being busy and tired... Have fun on your vacation
- Yess... I will finally have time to sleep and rest!


Nothing else here.
But I don't care about women words, let's see some actions.
We will probably meet next week after her vacation (she wanna go tennis and swimming pool), will check her attitude...

 

[pyros]

You didn't read it carefully - there was no room for banging (i find banging in public toilette or other strange places desperate and tasteless), and just after 4th date (which was OK) she made almost 10 days trip, almost no contact from both sides. When she returned it was over.



congratulations, not my style.





Yes, but on the other hand have you never heard about women changing their minds? Haven't you ever dismiss the girl once, and at some point in the future want to bang her badly? I know it's less probable, but don't make what she said so definite. She is young, cute, inexperienced girl, unsure of her feelings.




I'm rather confused about how suddenly she made this decision. Everything was just OK (I would say it was escalating), then she went on a trip (we goodbye with a lovely kiss and "fire in eyes"), not seeing me, no actions from both sides, she was "thinking about it long and intensively" during these days, and then gave me that decision.
Was she attracted or not? Why she lost the interest during "silent days" and not earlier, what I was a bit needy, too available etc?
I mean - I've would never spent couple of days kissing/touching a girl which is not attractive to me, I wouldn't even start and wouldn't agree on her actions.

Meh, I think there is too much "logic" in my way of thinking about this...


Perhaps... but I don't think it's like that.
She is not a "wamp" or "wh0re" type of girl. Rather young, cheerful, not experienced (told me never has sex outside the 3.5year relationship), a little bit shy, dismissing guys seducing her kindly but firmly. Maybe it's all BS and she is different and I'm too naive, but I don't think so.
And she has also some girlfriends (I would say 50/50), so no exaggeration here.



Yeap, I was surprised too.
I think "nice guy" part of my nature woke up then and I've just wanted hug her and tell "everything gonna be ok". Maybe mistake from DJ technique perspective, but we are humans after all, not robots.
What's interesting, that was the night when when I escalated from hugging to kissing and panties exploration.


UPDATE:
A little bit online talking between us:
- I've got the present for you, will make you happy bla bla
- Do i look like a sad guy..?
(after 2 days)- Hmm no you're not... anyyyway I'm so tired and busy, didn't even have time to respond you quickly. And tomorrow I'm going to my vacation!
- You're not the only one being busy and tired... Have fun on your vacation
- Yess... I will finally have time to sleep and rest!


Nothing else here.
But I don't care about women words, let's see some actions.
We will probably meet next week after her vacation (she wanna go tennis and swimming pool), will check her attitude...

Your too damn stubborn, arent you? she is not that naive. Everytime that a guy has said: "oh no, see, she is inexperienced and naive" 90% of the time she was not. It is just something almost every girl says to look nice so you can put her on a pedestal. NOT THAT NAIVE.

Anyway, it seems you do not like to listen to the advice given. I told you that you should go ghost, and you should not meet with her to get that stupid souvenir she got for you, but hey, if you wanna explore the friendzone to its bounds, just do it man.

She wants to go to play tennis? so?? what are you? her male friend without penis? just go ghost. She is likely interested in another guy, and yes, she is su-cking this guy's ****, and going to play tennis with you. Cool.

 

[MattTheW]

Tennis and swimming

Great activities where you'll definitely be able to make moves on her.....

Oh wait......

You need to start listening to these guys fella, you've just been handed a one way ticket to the friendzone......

 

[wishyo]

xyz987, in any case please keep us updated.
patience pays, everywhere

 

[Skyline]

Hi,

me: 27,
her: 24, 8/10, being picked-up by males very often, has a lot of male-buddies, has been on 3-4 real dates in her life though (she dismissed many guys), had 3.5 year relationship (first and only) that finished year before (quit because of boredom)

So she has experience with AFC's.

Description of situation (short version):
- met online, couple of days of online great small talking/joking
- 1st date walking in the park, talking, glass of wine
- 2nd date great raquet playing in the park + biking + lunch
- 3rd date - wine drinking in the park, talking, kino, kissing a lot, intimacy touching (= i slowly massaged all her body with panties included, she agreed and felt great, we were not drunk)
- 4rd date - ice creams, talking, another park, kissing, holding hands, touching, laughing, just great.

- a lot of online chating between dates (80% initiated by her)
- 1st date on monday, 4th date on saturday (=1 week relationship)

You sure do love the park... Taking any girl to a place more than once within the same month is going to get old fast... Part of the meaning of going on dates is to show her a good time, this means going to different places and engaging in different activities. You took her to the same place 4 times... On top of that, date 1 and 2 sound like the same. And the 2nd date is something friends would do. Date 3 and 4 were basically the same as well. You didn't have 4 dates you had 2. You should have fvcked her in the park since you like it so much, seriously. You weren't really much of a surprise nor really did escalate to the next level.

- Then she went off for funeral (3 days, a lot of chating, calling, initiated by her, proposal of the next date, watching movies together etc.)
- Come back for 3 days before next travel (job related event) - little contact, no meeting, she met with friends instead, didn't tell she wanna meet, excuses (I'm tired, I can't make it).

Phones can destroy relationships or the possibility of one. It's okay to drop by a "hello" but it isn't okay to have a 7 hour conversation talking about what socks you washed. And I'm guessing those dates took place in the park huh? Along with escalation that never escalated to sex.

- Went for 4-day job related event - no contact from me, nor her.

- Her return and text message: we should meet and talk.
- Next day we met, she was nervous, no "hello cheek kiss", no touching at all, told me she was thinking about the whole situation all the time during being away, told me i'm great, make her laugh, make her fun, have enormous amount of common interests and activities, BUT she just does't feel "wow effect" somewhere inside and "we can do this thing all together but NOT AS A COUPLE".

Oh look, she just admitted that she isn't attracted to you. That's pretty rare most girls would simply disappear. I'm pretty sure the only reason why she's telling you this is because of what a great "friend" you have been. I mean, you massaged her whole body without even lifting some clothes up... What did you expect?

Also added "I don't know what I really want", "I know I gave you GREAT signs of interest, I had to kiss you to check if this is it, and it's not", "I have so small experience with males", "No one has ever chased after me so great as you", "your intelligence amaze me", "you didn't deserve to tell you THIS via online chat so we met". When talking, had tears in her eyes. When finished, had great relief, being relaxed again, smiling etc.

99% sure you just got friend zoned- also known as an area from which you're lacking game. She's only relieved because she doesn't want to stop hanging out with you, as friends of course. I mean you did show her a great time at the park, all the time.

- My reaction: I was smiling, tried to kiss her immediately (refused nervously, said NO), than when she was emotionally "open" I took her hand, listening and saying "it's OK, relax, I know what you mean bla bla bla", DIDN'T admit directly "OK LJBF", but didn't also said "No sex? Goodbye forever or change your mind".

When a woman tells you something like this... And you don't want to be just friends... You tell her flat out that you are interested in her romantically, nothing more nothing less, and if not, then tell her to contact you when she's ready. Then you walk away. This is what men with value do.

- Then the rain drops, we hide under the tree, it was cold, we were hugging very strong for 20 minutes, I did some kino with her hair etc., she also had (sniffing my perfumes, playing with hair), than we had some lunch, talk about future fun activities (she was very enthusiastic like: "take me to the theater!", "yes, i wanna do this!", "this is great idea, may i come with you?" etc).

Gay-male-girlfriend status. Come on man, this is clearly not what you want. Stand up for you what you want. And if you were to have simply escalated to sex with this girl this wouldn't be happening. I mean, the park would be pretty exhilarating in my opinion. You did have 4 chances, if not more.

- After that, there's almost 2 weeks - and almost no contact. I moved into shadow, she texted me once "how are you, are you ok?", I reply "I'm fine, thanks". That's it. Now she is on another "job event trip", no contact. I have a lot of activities (including with other girls, friends, family), posting about it on FB, having fun, not putting all the eggs in one basket, but still being crushed and thinking about her.

She's just checking up on her gay-male-girlfriend. And who are you fooling? You're clearly obsessed with this girl and are now posting stuff in hopes she will turn around. That's not how women work. You need to express your value, whether it be fake or not, through moving on and discovering other prospects. What's so special about this chick?

Is it over? What really happened?
Should I invite her on next activities/fun dates as we spoke?

You got friend zoned because you didn't escalate. Well you did escalate, but you stopped for some reason. Plus the 4 dates to the park thing.

And no, move on.

OK, now my analysis of the situation (please read it before you reply):
I'm quite experienced DJ, always had nice game, mainly thanks to creative negs, high IQ, sense of humor, sarcasm, being mysterious, having unusual complements and dates ideas, interesting life (nice job, sports, music, a lot of activities), and so on.

Oh yeah, 4 dates to the park is pretty unusual...

I don't believe any of what you just wrote bro.

When I was dating other girls it was "blah,OK" but when i met her, it was instant crush - such a chemistry I've never had before plus her physical attributes which fulfill my requirements, a lot of common things and interests, same view on things.

Seriously? So the second a girl that fits your criteria appears you act all weak and needy. That tells me that you don't believe that you deserve a girl like that.

We had great talking and I started the game perfectly, but then make this mistake - I trusted her to quickly, I've opened, sometimes being her adviser and therapist (the funeral stuff), TOO MUCH online chating (it was great, indeed). I never did that way with a women I dated (DJ rules!), but this one I've seen "special" and started being too nice, too open, too avaiable. I've also said things sth like "I like you", "will you be missing me?", "Do you like me?" etc (damn me, it's so lame!). I showed her a lot of signs of interest, a lot of physical compliments and sexual tension.

Kind of left that part out... Like I said, the only reason why men act weak and needy is because they don't believe in themselves. They don't have real purpose, direction, drive, which all relates to masculine energy. So they try and make up for it by finding this "perfect women" that they can't even maintain.

What do you think about that, bros?
How do you feel? Is there any chance to rebuild the attraction through "friends like" fun meetings, slowly incorporated kino, showing no neediness etc?

Should I speak her or not?

Read this:

http://www.mts.net/~bpony/djbible/

And no.