Dating late 30's and early 40's ?

[BaronOfHair]

Eventually I lost attraction and we split up. I could never get that spark back inside of myself

You. Lost. That. Loooooooooooovin' Feelin'....

 

[Sega Genesis]

What are your thoughts on starting an indefinite period of abstinence in a relationship in order to focus on other issues that need to be handled, both within the relationship but also in one’s self?

Good question and I wonder how much different it is from something I posted on a different thread about waiting a bit to have sex with a new partner with whom there is potential for LTR?

Sometimes (not always) powerful sex can blind you to incompatibilities or differences and/or prevent you from emotionally connecting or recognizing toxicity when it's present.

It becomes ALL about the sex! And only about the sex.

Great it your goal is to spin plates but not so great it your goal is a mutually rewarding long term relationship, imo and experience.

 

[BaronOfHair]

I never understood men who say 30s and 40s were the best time dating, as Duke said above

They aren't for everyone. Lots of men throw in the towel during the early part of their 3rd decade of life, after experiencing a thought which essentially goes something like: "I haven't become a billionaire celebrity by now, the way DiCaprio was after Titanic, or The Beatles were by '68... Therefore, life is over, and there's no point in making an effort"

They cling tenaciously to such thoughts, despite the fact that they run contrary to the evidence, even Insofar as most male celebrities go. Just a few examples:

-Glenn Powell is in his late 30s now, and finally seeing his star ascend

-Brad Pitt and George Clooney were both deep into their 30s(with the latter pushing 40), before anyone knew who the hell they were

-Jon Hamm was well into his 30s when Mad Men came along

-James Spader was in his 4th decade of life, before he really began to rake in the dough via prestige projects like The Practice and Boston Legal. He spent the first two decades subsisting on critically acclaimed yet seldom seen independent flicks and outright schlock

-Johnny Cash, Lou Reed, and David Bowie were all doing their most compelling work later on in life. Ditto with Patrice O'Neal, Carlin, and Rodney Dangerfield

-Nabokov and GRRM were in their 5th decades of life before penning Lolita and A Song Of Fire and Ice




The list could go on. We've allowed advertising to con us into believing that adolescence is the high water mark of human existence, despite the fact this was never a widely held belief*, prior to the advent of The Counterculture of the late 60s-early 70s. Ya know, when a 34 year old Abby Hoffman preached "Don't trust anyone under 30", and most of The Western Hemisphere just went along with this like automatons




*This was especially never considered the norm for men in decades past. Note the film stars of early Hollywood: Clark Gable, Bogart, Robert Mitchum... None of them were kids fresh out of high school

 

[Divorced w 3]

I've done something similar with two different women.

Case A
She lived with me and was most likely Borderline. I told her she needed to move out of my place and get her own and work on herself so she did. We would still see each other once a week but obstained from sex for several months. She made a ton of improvement, got some professional help but I was also her counselor. She eventually moved back in with me. During all of this, I ended up feeling more like her father/guidance counselor than I did her lover. Professionals always say you should never be a counselor to your lover. It changed how I saw the relationship. Eventually I lost attraction and we split up. I could never get that spark back inside of myself. I felt bad because she did what she needed and was really a solid chic. She went on to marry an older guy, but I still hear from her after all these years. She reaches out for relationship advice, and wishes her and I could be back together.

Case B
My most recent live in girl friend and I split and she moved into her own house. 7months after she moved out we started talking and seeing each other again every 2-3wks. The abstinence thing didn't last long. We agreed to talk out our differences, work on ourselves but were never successful. Just couldn't come to an agreement. I wanted a girl that could shut down her career/boss biatch mode and give me what I wanted so I could be more engaged in our relationship and be more attentive/affectionate to her. She definitely had it in her but wasn't willing to dial her career back for me.

To answer your question, yes I think its worth a shot. When you cut out the sex and live separately it really gets your attention. You have more time for self-reflection, discussing issues, and you are more vulnerable and have incentive to work towards the goal of getting back together. With each case, I felt there was a lot more respect for each other being shown and less anger being directed in negative ways at each other.

But I also am a believer that most of the time when these deals get bad, they never go back together like they were at one time. Usually too much damage happens. Once the relationship gets contaminated, its like a cancer.

In both instances, you had the women move out. Is it possible that the act of moving out is what did the relationship in? From my end it makes it a little tricky to determine if it was the abstinence or the physical and, likely emotional separation.

Also, how was the initial reaction to your decision to be abstinent, and how often, if at all, did it continue to be a point of discussion between you and your partners? Was it total abstinence on your end, or did you fulfill outside the relationship?

I do agree that sliding into the counselor role was a mistake. It creates an inherent superiority/inferiority factor.

I think when going this route, it’s a self-preservation thing. I think the initiator is starting to help themselves clear their thinking and protect their emotions to the truth in front of them. It feels a little bit like the first stage of acceptance that something is over, but just broaching it.

 

[Divorced w 3]

Good question and I wonder how much different it is from something I posted on a different thread about waiting a bit to have sex with a new partner with whom there is potential for LTR?

Sometimes (not always) powerful sex can blind you to incompatibilities or differences and/or prevent you from emotionally connecting or recognizing toxicity when it's present.

It becomes ALL about the sex! And only about the sex.

Great it your goal is to spin plates but not so great it your goal is a mutually rewarding long term relationship, imo and experience.

As long as its not punitive. It’s an interesting question in that it can use withholding sex in the opposite way, to attempt to induce conformity into a belief system; but the game the withholder is playing can be beaten, and often is, typically by high school and college boys that are willing to tow the line long enough to earn her trust. I don’t think it should be a punitive thing, relationships shouldn’t be punitive.

If it’s for self-development, then the outcome of the relationship may end up reflecting a bond beyond sexual attraction, I would think.

 

[Sega Genesis]

It’s an interesting question in that it uses withholding sex in the opposite way, to attempt to discern conformity into a belief system; but the game the withholder is playing can be beaten, and often is, typically by high school and college boys that are willing to tow the line long enough to earn her trust.

I'm not referring to one person "withholding" (typically the woman) and as a way to manipulate in many cases.

But rather it's a mutual decision in order to possibly alleviate the very things happening in the relationship later you posted about.

What's interesting is you use the word "withholding" in the beginning of a relationship and deem men who agree to it "towing the line."

But then use the word "abstinence" during the relationship.

Are they not the same thing with the same goal?

">>In order to focus on other issues that need to be handled, both within the relationship but also in one’s self?"<<

Before you decide to.enter into a long term relationship versus during it?

 

[Divorced w 3]

I'm not referring to one person "withholding" (typically the woman) and as a way to manipulate in.many cases.

But rather it's a mutual decision in order to possibly alleviate the very things happening in the relationship later you posted about.

What's interesting is you use the word "withholding" in the beginning of a relationship and deem men who agree to it "towing the line."

But then use the word "abstinence" during the relationship.

Are they not the same thing with the same goal?

If the heart is driving the bus and not the mind, it may have merit.

 

[Sega Genesis]

If the heart is driving the bus and not the mind, it may have merit.

Well yeah that's what I'm referring to - when the decision comes genuinely from the heart NOT a mind game or manipulation.

 

[Sega Genesis]

Also want to add that the person who initiates "abstinence" during the relationship might be viewed by their partner as a manipulation as well. Some sort of mind game.

I've seen that happen in some relationships.

It's about intention and it's important that be communicated imo..

 

[Divorced w 3]

Also want to add that the person who initiates "abstinence" during the relationship might be viewed by their partner as a manipulation as well. Some sort of mind game.

Or it exposes it

 

[The Duke]

In both instances, you had the women move out. Is it possible that the act of moving out is what did the relationship in? From my end it makes it a little tricky to determine if it was the abstinence or the physical and, likely emotional separation.

Also, how was the initial reaction to your decision to be abstinent, and how often, if at all, did it continue to be a point of discussion between you and your partners? Was it total abstinence on your end, or did you fulfill outside the relationship?

I do agree that sliding into the counselor role was a mistake. It creates an inherent superiority/inferiority factor.

I think when going this route, it’s a self-preservation thing. I think the initiator is starting to help themselves clear their thinking and protect their emotions to the truth in front of them. It feels a little bit like the first stage of acceptance that something is over, but just broaching it.

I don't think moving them out hurt the relationships at all, it helped provide some space to clear our heads and reflect.

In both cases the decision to be abstinent caused a little concern at first, but they understood why. It was my idea. I reassured them I wasn't banging other chics. We basically talked about it, and that was it, moved forward.

Me sliding into the counselor role was probably what helped her make so much progress. For us there was no issue with inferiority. I was able to take myself out of the situation and act as a 3rd party. I don't think most would be successful at it, I only coud with the right person. But, I'll never attempt it again because it changed my romantic desire for her.

Yes, I'd say some of it is self-preservation. I also think when you have been with someone for a long time that its a good thing even if it doesn't work out. It provides resolution and clarity.

 

[Sega Genesis]

If it’s for self-development, then the outcome of the relationship may end up reflecting a bond beyond sexual attraction, I would think.

I saw you edited your post to say this^.

I agree, it's exactly what I was referring to but with one caveat.

It may end up reflecting a bond beyond (but including) sexual attraction, I would think.

The sexual attraction doesn't disappear just because you waited a bit to have sex . You're still showing physical affection and expressing attraction.

It can actually build sexual tension which is never a bad thing imo!

If that's even what you were suggesting, I wasn't sure.

 

[BadBoy89]

The list could go on. We've allowed advertising to con us into believing that adolescence is the high water mark of human existence,

Adolescence is better for men in terms of romantic relationships.

When a man gets older, the relationship with a woman 100% transactional while the women’s value crashes to the floor. There is bitterness on both sides.

 

[Chow Mein]

I don't think moving them out hurt the relationships at all, it helped provide some space to clear our heads and reflect.

In both cases the decision to be abstinent caused a little concern at first, but they understood why. It was my idea. I reassured them I wasn't banging other chics. We basically talked about it, and that was it, moved forward.

Me sliding into the counselor role was probably what helped her make so much progress. For us there was no issue with inferiority. I was able to take myself out of the situation and act as a 3rd party. I don't think most would be successful at it, I only coud with the right person. But, I'll never attempt it again because it changed my romantic desire for her.

Yes, I'd say some of it is self-preservation. I also think when you have been with someone for a long time that its a good thing even if it doesn't work out. It provides resolution and clarity.

Did you take on the counselor role at the beginning of Case #1? If you took that on later in the relationship, I think that may create some friction because there some expectation.

 

[zekko]

Others have said this, but I'll add my agreement: There isn't really a lot of difference between late 20's through your 40's as far as dating opportunities go. As long as you have your sh!t together - stay in shape, have value, etc.

 

[jhonny9546]

Having a solid job/finances in order becomes more important as you age.

Curious about your occupation back then?

 

[BaronOfHair]

Adolescence is better for men in terms of romantic relationships

Yeah, fumbling around in the back seat of a Cheverolet is far superior to rolling around with your lady in a king-size bed at The Ritz

 

[The Duke]

Did you take on the counselor role at the beginning of Case #1? If you took that on later in the relationship, I think that may create some friction because there some expectation.

End of. She was very appreciative that I did.

 

[BadBoy89]

Yeah, fumbling around in the back seat of a Cheverolet is far superior to rolling around with your lady in a king-size bed at The Ritz

See now you are going to extremes.

And we are not talking about the location of making love, we are talking about the quantity and quality of the women. All things considered, a 27 year old male will get a lot more calls and interest from women than a 37 year old male. The 37 year old could get the woman alot quicker, but its transactional.

This site is delusional thinking if a man in his 30s has it together, the woman will flock to him. Even if they do, they are used up. The genetically blessed Alpha males have already destroyed them when they were young, or wifed up the hot ones in their 20s.

Yeah men, work your ass off and get rich in your 30s, because when you are 35, the 22 year old girl won't know what do because she will so attracted to a man 13 years her senior, instead of the 6'4 basketball player in college.

 

[Chow Mein]

See now you are going to extremes.

And we are not talking about the location of making love, we are talking about the quantity and quality of the women. All things considered, a 27 year old male will get a lot more calls and interest from women than a 37 year old male. The 37 year old could get the woman alot quicker, but its transactional.

This site is delusional thinking if a man in his 30s has it together, the woman will flock to him. Even if they do, they are used up. The genetically blessed Alpha males have already destroyed them when they were young, or wifed up the hot ones in their 20s.

Yeah men, work your ass off and get rich in your 30s, because when you are 35, the 22 year old girl won't know what do because she will so attracted to a man 13 years her senior, instead of the 6'4 basketball player in college.

You need to stop dwelling if you want to live life on your own terms