Harsh Truth: Women pursue the men that they want

[SW15]

if I were to ask out 100 22-32 year olds as well as 100 45-54 year olds, I wouldn't be shocked if I had a similar failure rate among both demographics. The only difference would be why they rejected me (The older ones would, in many cases at least, automatically reject me solely based on age...before they even gave any thought to my social awkwardness/baggage. The younger ones would reject me because of my social awkwardness/baggage)

There's a lot of truth in this statement and that's because you don't offer what the market of 22-32 year old women want in an extended relationships.

The "why" matters to an extent but you refuse to fix the problems associated with your mindset and behaviors that would make you more attractive to women near your own age.

45-54 year old women see you as an age inappropriate prospect. Almost none would take you seriously as a longer term prospect due to your age. Almost none would even want a first date with you. 45-54 year old women generally want to date men near their own age. Your neighbor in your building is a perfect example of this.

While there are likely some 45-54 year olds who could find you physically attractive, it wouldn't mean much in general.

If you were to ask out 45-54 year olds in person, they would also find it strange that you are asking them out. They too would not like your behavior, but mostly because they see your behavior as odd for pursuing an age inappropriate interaction.

interaction with my next door neighbor failed to go as planned

I've mentioned before on here that I lust after my next door neighbor who's nearly 20 years older than me (she's in her early 50s) A few months ago, we got a new female employee in our building (the new girl is in her mid 20s). Shortly after the new girl started, my next door neighbor was...

www.sosuave.net

Most 22-32 year old women aren't ruling you out on age alone. Some 22-25 year olds might, but not 26-32 year olds.

For the 22-32 year olds, you are mainly being ruled out on behaviors. Some would rule you out on a combination of age and behaviors.

22-32 year olds are often looking for someone with future husband and/or future father capabilities. Those goals might be a long way off for some, but they often would like to envision that as a reality. A strangely behaving guy isn't going to make a good husband for them and won't be able to get them hot & horny for you in the pre-husband stage.

45-54 year olds usually have a failed marriage in their pasts and are done having children. They don't care that much about you as father potential, though some of your awkward behaviors might turn them off. They might not want to have their teenage - 20 something children near you due to the awkwardness. It's possible that the few who wouldn't rule you out due to age might keep you as a short term fling if they really thought you were somewhat attractive and they realized that they couldn't get a Chad Thundercock. That's a very low probability effort.

If you were to fix your mindset and behaviors, you would be more marketable to a large percentage of women.

 

[Hamurabimbi]

Men resort to approaching strangers and using swipe apps when they have no social circle options.

Swipe apps are an easy adjunct. Takes little effort and the potential upside is great.
Approaching strangers (outside of bars/clubs) is a low reward strategy. As most women are already taken.
SC is iffy. Not every SC has a good supply of attractive, single women.

 

[Hamurabimbi]

I looked up Wheat Waffles. I selected the $15 option (where he gives a rating plus analysis)

It will be interesting to see what he says. Before getting the rating, I am skeptical though. When looking him up, I found a reddit comment that said Wheat Waffles is a failed pizza delivery boy who's learned to make a living by insulting other men. Either way, $15 is cheap enough I was willing to take the chance.

When I was in high school, I met/added a decent amount of girls from other schools on Facebook (through various Facebook games). Many of these girls indicated they found me attractive (without giving an exact 1-10 rating). My experience on these Facebook games in high school would suggest my looks weren't the problem; my freaky creep stigma at my own school was the problem (seeing as plenty of girls from other schools found me attractive)

As for where I currently stand, I'm aware most 33 year old men would prefer 22-32 year old gals. In my specific case, on the other hand, wouldn't it make more sense to get rated by older gals (as that's my preferred demographic)?

What good does a rating from a 22-32 year old woman do if I'm more interested in getting with their moms?

The only people that need to get Rated are average looking guys (4-6/10). If you are above or below average. You already know it.
If you need a rating. You are average.

 

[GoodMan32]

There's a lot of truth in this statement and that's because you don't offer what the market of 22-32 year old women want in an extended relationships.

The "why" matters to an extent but you refuse to fix the problems associated with your mindset and behaviors that would make you more attractive to women near your own age.

45-54 year old women see you as an age inappropriate prospect. Almost none would take you seriously as a longer term prospect due to your age. Almost none would even want a first date with you. 45-54 year old women generally want to date men near their own age. Your neighbor in your building is a perfect example of this.

While there are likely some 45-54 year olds who could find you physically attractive, it wouldn't mean much in general.

If you were to ask out 45-54 year olds in person, they would also find it strange that you are asking them out. They too would not like your behavior, but mostly because they see your behavior as odd for pursuing an age inappropriate interaction.

interaction with my next door neighbor failed to go as planned

I've mentioned before on here that I lust after my next door neighbor who's nearly 20 years older than me (she's in her early 50s) A few months ago, we got a new female employee in our building (the new girl is in her mid 20s). Shortly after the new girl started, my next door neighbor was...

www.sosuave.net

Most 22-32 year old women aren't ruling you out on age alone. Some 22-25 year olds might, but not 26-32 year olds.

For the 22-32 year olds, you are mainly being ruled out on behaviors. Some would rule you out on a combination of age and behaviors.

22-32 year olds are often looking for someone with future husband and/or future father capabilities. Those goals might be a long way off for some, but they often would like to envision that as a reality. A strangely behaving guy isn't going to make a good husband for them and won't be able to get them hot & horny for you in the pre-husband stage.

45-54 year olds usually have a failed marriage in their pasts and are done having children. They don't care that much about you as father potential, though some of your awkward behaviors might turn them off. They might not want to have their teenage - 20 something children near you due to the awkwardness. It's possible that the few who wouldn't rule you out due to age might keep you as a short term fling if they really thought you were somewhat attractive and they realized that they couldn't get a Chad Thundercock. That's a very low probability effort.

If you were to fix your mindset and behaviors, you would be more marketable to a large percentage of women.

The fact I'd be more attractive to gals close in age to me if I fixed my baggage is irrelevant if I don't want a gal close in age to me in the first place (Don't get me wrong; I'd accept a date with a gal close in age to me. But there's only so far we could progress, seeing as I'm not comfortable having sex with a woman who hasn't at least reached peri-menopause)

Some of my baggage is unable to be fixed anyway.

As for older gals, it's unfortunate but true that a lot would find it strange I was pursuing an age-inappropriate conquest. That's one reason I have a hard time working up the confidence to approach older gals more often. There are a few silver linings, however.

• I live in a place where the cougar thing is more popular than it is in most other places
• Even if I'm significantly younger than a 45-54 year old woman, I'm not exactly a spring chicken anymore. My fading youth, combined with the fact the outside world often guesses I'm slightly older than my actual age, makes me think the odds of getting rejected on age alone might not be terrible if I stuck to the very younger end of the 45-54 demographic (I'm talking about 45/46 year olds). The last woman I had non-escort sex with was born in 1978 (she's currently 46)
• Additionally: https://www.sosuave.net/forum/threa...vercome-fear-of-rejection.283253/post-3140241. On the linked post, I mentioned daygaming a woman at a mini mart. She was born in 1979 (making her currently 45). Even though she compared me to Jeffrey Dahmer when we met up a few days later, she didn't appear to be totally weirded out by the age gap thing alone (seeing as she was willing to give me her number and follow through with a meet-up)
• Lastly, since you mentioned my next door neighbor, it's worth pointing out that she told me I could maximize my chances of getting an older woman if I hide my age for as long as possible.

Through the years, I've had enough casual sex with gals born before 1980, I really don't think it's as low probability as you're making it sound.

 

[GoodMan32]

The only people that need to get Rated are average looking guys (4-6/10). If you are above or below average. You already know it.
If you need a rating. You are average.

Yet I've been told I'm an 8.5 and a 9 before. Interesting.

 

[SW15]

Approaching strangers (outside of bars/clubs) is a low reward strategy. As most women are already taken.

Approaching strangers in non-bar venues is a difficult path for most men.

On college campuses, almost everyone is unmarried. That isn't meaningful because a large percentage of college women have boyfriends at any given time.

For those in the working world, most women are in relationships at any given moment. Approaching in a grocery store, gym/fitness class, or at the mall isn't going to be fruitful. Most women in relationships won't tend to let men know about their relationship. They will be distant and non-responsive in an approach and let the interaction die out before they have to deliver that information.

Men can choose to do approaches in parts of their cities where unmarried people tend to be most common. Even in those parts of the city, most women will be in relationships at any given time.

This makes doing non-bar approaching much more difficult.

Night game has its own set of challenges. In theory, women who show up to nightlife venues are more likely to be unattached and in the market for meeting new men. That fact alone has value.

SC is iffy. Not every SC has a good supply of attractive, single women.

That is true about social circle. I have received few social circle introductions in my lifetime.

The fact I'd be more attractive to gals close in age to me if I fixed my baggage is irrelevant if I don't want a gal close in age to me in the first place (Don't get me wrong; I'd accept a date with a gal close in age to me. But there's only so far we could progress, seeing as I'm not comfortable having sex with a woman who hasn't at least reached peri-menopause)

That's because of your baggage. If you fixed your mindset, you would want women close to your own age.

Some of my baggage is unable to be fixed anyway.

This is in part because of your current attitude.

Drug addicts can be fixed in drug rehab. A lot of your problems are fixable. Almost every one of your problems identified in the first post of this thread is a fixable problem with the correct attitude, medication, and mental health professionals. The fixes are likely to be difficult though.

my struggles with the ladies go way beyond mere social awkwardness

I was having a DM discussion with another member where I mentioned how my struggles with the ladies go beyond mere social awkwardness/ASD. Come to think of it, I suppose the topic warrants its own thread. In addition to my ASD/social awkwardness, there are many other factors working against me...

www.sosuave.net

The least fixable problem you have right now is your work/financial history. You are 33, far from college graduation, and don't have a good work history.

 

[Hamurabimbi]

Yet I've been told I'm an 8.5 and a 9 before. Interesting.

Consider going on Tinder.
If you are a 8.5+. You will slay.

 

[CornbreadFed]

Cold approach sucks because it seems like every sane girl ranging from a 6-8 has a bf above their smv. Dating apps will at supposedly put you in front of “single” women though.

 

[H8CourtshipWithAPassion]

To answer your question of why autism hasn't been bred out of the gene pool, there are a few reasons.

1. Up until relatively recently (in the grand scheme of history), society was set up so that just about every man could get a woman.

That's certainly how it was when my grandparents (Silent Generation) were coming of age.

As for my parents (on the older end of Gen X), by the time my parents were coming of age, society was no longer set up so that getting a woman was guaranteed...but getting a woman was still a lot easier in the 80s compared to right now. Millennials (my generation) are the first generation where being an autist really holds a man back (in terms of getting a woman)

2. To build upon what I just said, autism isn't entirely genetic anyway. Neither parent of mine is an autist, yet here I am.

3. That being said, genetics at least partially play a role (if you have an autist for a parent, you're more likely to be an autist compared to a baby with 2 neurotypical parents). Since, as you illustrated, autism/social awkwardness doesn't hold a woman back from getting a man, there are plenty of female autists who pass their genes on.

for number 1, i think what you are referring to is that, for most of human civilization, there was arranged married dynamics, people were set up, introduced to each other, so my guess is, cold approach, or approach was not neccessary as much back then, or it wasn't so much of the man being the one to initiate, people were just set up with each other.

 

[GoodMan32]

Approaching strangers in non-bar venues is a difficult path for most men.

On college campuses, almost everyone is unmarried. That isn't meaningful because a large percentage of college women have boyfriends at any given time.

For those in the working world, most women are in relationships at any given moment. Approaching in a grocery store, gym/fitness class, or at the mall isn't going to be fruitful. Most women in relationships won't tend to let men know about their relationship. They will be distant and non-responsive in an approach and let the interaction die out before they have to deliver that information.

Men can choose to do approaches in parts of their cities where unmarried people tend to be most common. Even in those parts of the city, most women will be in relationships at any given time.

This makes doing non-bar approaching much more difficult.

Night game has its own set of challenges. In theory, women who show up to nightlife venues are more likely to be unattached and in the market for meeting new men. That fact alone has value.



That is true about social circle. I have received few social circle introductions in my lifetime.



That's because of your baggage. If you fixed your mindset, you would want women close to your own age.



This is in part because of your current attitude.

Drug addicts can be fixed in drug rehab. A lot of your problems are fixable. Almost every one of your problems identified in the first post of this thread is a fixable problem with the correct attitude, medication, and mental health professionals. The fixes are likely to be difficult though.

my struggles with the ladies go way beyond mere social awkwardness

I was having a DM discussion with another member where I mentioned how my struggles with the ladies go beyond mere social awkwardness/ASD. Come to think of it, I suppose the topic warrants its own thread. In addition to my ASD/social awkwardness, there are many other factors working against me...

www.sosuave.net

The least fixable problem you have right now is your work/financial history. You are 33, far from college graduation, and don't have a good work history.

All of the problems I listed on that post are rooted in my ASD in some way, shape, or form. There's no cure for ASD.

Then there's my phobia of pregnancy. Even though I didn't list my phobia of pregnancy on that post, my pregnancy phobia (which is why I don't want a woman close in age to me anyway) is also rooted in my ASD.

I just thought of another hurdle I face in getting a woman: As much as I'd like to think I'm wrong, I'd guess the majority of the female population would refuse to let me watch while they pee.

If a majority of the female population will always be off limits to me no matter what (because they won't indulge in my fetish), what's the point of fixing my problems?

 

[GoodMan32]

Consider going on Tinder.
If you are a 8.5+. You will slay.

Seeing as I got nowhere on Feeld this past summer, I obviously wouldn't slay on Tinder.

 

[GoodMan32]

for number 1, i think what you are referring to is that, for most of human civilization, there was arranged married dynamics, people were set up, introduced to each other, so my guess is, cold approach, or approach was not neccessary as much back then, or it wasn't so much of the man being the one to initiate, people were just set up with each other.

Which makes the idea that cold-approaching a woman (or approaching a woman at all) is "just something men have to do" and is "the natural order of life; a tradition stretching back eons" absurd.

 

[SW15]

Dating apps will at supposedly put you in front of “single” women though.

Yes, that is supposedly true. A woman on an app is supposed to be actively marketing herself for mating purposes as compared to the average female not on an app.

When a man daygames (even in a part of his city with mainly unmarried people), he's running into a lot of women who aren't actively seeking new penis. Most of the women don't inform him that they aren't seeking new penis, the conversations tend to naturally die out within 30-60 seconds, before a date can be offered unless someone goes very direct with a date offer.

Cold approach sucks because it seems like every sane girl ranging from a 6-8 has a bf above their smv.

Approaching strangers sucks because few women are receptive to being approached, especially in non-bar settings. Gyms, parks, and paths are being destroyed by earbuds/headphones. Many women have boyfriends already. Nightlife venues have been affected by the swipe apps and there's less of an approach culture.

All of the problems I listed on that post are rooted in my ASD in some way, shape, or form. There's no cure for ASD.

Then there's my phobia of pregnancy. Even though I didn't list my phobia of pregnancy on that post, my pregnancy phobia (which is why I don't want a woman close in age to me anyway) is also rooted in my ASD.

Your psychotherapists have done a piss poor job with you. They are a complete embarrassment to the profession.

Which makes the idea that cold-approaching a woman (or approaching a woman at all) is "just something men have to do" and is "the natural order of life; a tradition stretching back eons" absurd.

Approaching strangers for sex/dating purposes is something that grew a lot in the 20th Century. It was less common prior to the 20th Century. A lot of mating relationships were formed through social tribes in earlier centuries.

 

[Hamurabimbi]

Seeing as I got nowhere on Feeld this past summer, I obviously wouldn't slay on Tinder.

Yes, that is supposedly true. A woman on an app is supposed to be actively marketing herself for mating purposes as compared to the average female not on an app.

When a man daygames (even in a part of his city with mainly unmarried people), he's running into a lot of women who aren't actively seeking new penis. Most of the women don't inform him that they aren't seeking new penis, the conversations tend to naturally die out within 30-60 seconds, before a date can be offered unless someone goes very direct with a date offer.



Approaching strangers sucks because few women are receptive to being approached, especially in non-bar settings. Gyms, parks, and paths are being destroyed by earbuds/headphones. Many women have boyfriends already. Nightlife venues have been affected by the swipe apps and there's less of an approach culture.



Your psychotherapists have done a piss poor job with you. They are a complete embarrassment to the profession.



Approaching strangers for sex/dating purposes is something that grew a lot in the 20th Century. It was less common prior to the 20th Century. A lot of mating relationships were formed through social tribes in earlier centuries.

All of the problems I listed on that post are rooted in my ASD in some way, shape, or form. There's no cure for ASD.

Then there's my phobia of pregnancy. Even though I didn't list my phobia of pregnancy on that post, my pregnancy phobia (which is why I don't want a woman close in age to me anyway) is also rooted in my ASD.

I just thought of another hurdle I face in getting a woman: As much as I'd like to think I'm wrong, I'd guess the majority of the female population would refuse to let me watch while they pee.

If a majority of the female population will always be off limits to me no matter what (because they won't indulge in my fetish), what's the point of fixing my problems?

Your problems are beyond the scope of this forum.
Again. Seek professional help.
Nothing more we can do for you.

I’m out.
Goodbye.

 

[GoodMan32]

Your problems are beyond the scope of this forum.
Again. Seek professional help.
Nothing more we can do for you.

I’m out.
Goodbye.

A severely mentally ill man yelling at thin air as he walks down the street could be fixed with medication.

Since there's no cure for ASD, on the other hand, mental illnesses that are rooted in ASD are unable to be cured.

I guess I need to accept the fact most gals will never be into me (because of my problems rooted in ASD)

 

[H8CourtshipWithAPassion]

Yes, that is supposedly true. A woman on an app is supposed to be actively marketing herself for mating purposes as compared to the average female not on an app.

When a man daygames (even in a part of his city with mainly unmarried people), he's running into a lot of women who aren't actively seeking new penis. Most of the women don't inform him that they aren't seeking new penis, the conversations tend to naturally die out within 30-60 seconds, before a date can be offered unless someone goes very direct with a date offer.



Approaching strangers sucks because few women are receptive to being approached, especially in non-bar settings. Gyms, parks, and paths are being destroyed by earbuds/headphones. Many women have boyfriends already. Nightlife venues have been affected by the swipe apps and there's less of an approach culture.



Your psychotherapists have done a piss poor job with you. They are a complete embarrassment to the profession.



Approaching strangers for sex/dating purposes is something that grew a lot in the 20th Century. It was less common prior to the 20th Century. A lot of mating relationships were formed through social tribes in earlier centuries.

and people always argue or say that men approaching women has been the standard since the beginning of time, is there any proof or evidence to support that? people also argue and say, men court women, its been like that traditionally, history discussions can be interesting and cool

 

[H8CourtshipWithAPassion]

A severely mentally ill man yelling at thin air as he walks down the street could be fixed with medication.

Since there's no cure for ASD, on the other hand, mental illnesses that are rooted in ASD are unable to be cured.

I guess I need to accept the fact most gals will never be into me (because of my problems rooted in ASD)

yeah some people might argue, physically disabled men stand a better chance with women than autistic men do, because apparently a mans communication ability matters more than women's does when it comes to attraction

 

[GoodMan32]

and people always argue or say that men approaching women has been the standard since the beginning of time, is there any proof or evidence to support that? people also argue and say, men court women, its been like that traditionally, history discussions can be interesting and cool

No, as @SW15 indicated on his post, a man approaching a woman wasn't really a thing until some time in the 20th century.

Here's my takeaway: Since a man approaching a woman is a relatively new trend (in the grand scheme of history/evolution), it's unnatural. That's why the current culture of a man approaching a woman leads to a lot of bitterness on both sides (men are bitter we need to approach, the ladies are bitter about getting approached...because of course they only want to get approached by Chad or Tyrone)

Some of the ideas I've proposed (about striving for a societal shift where a man no longer has to approach a woman) on the forum sound far-fetched...but at least I have history on my side. For the vast majority of history, a man didn't really have to approach a woman.

 

[GoodMan32]

yeah some people might argue, physically disabled men stand a better chance with women than autistic men do, because apparently a mans communication ability matters more than women's does when it comes to attraction

Unfortunate but true. It's been pointed out on the forum before that a woman will "next" a man for the most trivial reasons.

 

[SW15]

It's been pointed out on the forum before that a woman will "next" a man for the most trivial reasons.

This was something that really took off with the Millennial generation when women started thinking they were special snowflakes from their participation trophies that started in the 1990s. This entitled attitude combined with abundance from tech methods led to a lot of this behavior.