Are women even still open to meeting men the old-fashioned way anymore?

[Bigpapa]

You probably approach a certain type of girl outside OLD that’s your niche vs OLD you are going against a broader scope. I get hotter girls on OLD than real life so could be that reason.

Dunno man, not my experience and neither the experience of anyone that I know

 

[CornbreadFed]

Dunno man, not my experience and neither the experience of anyone that I know

If you have a particular type of woman and they are more inclined to be attracted to you then this makes outside approach way easier. This is why a lot of men struggle because they refuse to target their target market or refuse to raise their value.

 

[BeExcellent]

To reply to @DonJuanjr please refer to @devilkingx2 for the why.

That’s a good summary of why. Trust me I’ve had dates in the past with very handsome men who had no personality. It’s strange. One was an accomplished lawyer….and I grew up with attorney parents so I understand that world rather well having grown up around it. I go to charity events and all sorts of social engagements. I’ve got to be with someone who can hold their end of a conversation or I am going to be like….NEXT!

 

[Bigpapa]

If you have a particular type of woman and they are more inclined to be attracted to you then this makes outside approach way easier. This is why a lot of men struggle because they refuse to target their target market or refuse to raise their value.

Dunno man, I would say that overall I am quite balanced in my tastes and women are too

It is true that I am more successful with Latinas or North African women, because mainly they think I am like them due to my olive skin. But in the same time I can not say that i am not successful with proper European women

So dunno if this answer is actually a strong reflection of what is actually
Going on

I am in quite a big city and guess what. I ran out of people after like 1 week of casually swiping. Over 90% of women that appeared from my calculations were big no no ( really bottom of the barrel )

 

[CornbreadFed]

It is true that I am more successful with Latinas or North African women, because mainly they think I am like them due to my olive skin. But in the same time I can not say that i am not successful with proper European women

The apps are mainly going to be full of careerist women predominately European depending on what city you live in. What is your city and did you use all three apps?

 

[Bigpapa]

The apps are mainly going to be full of careerist women predominately European depending on what city you live in. What is your city and did you use all three apps?

Sevilla, Spain

And used only tinder and bumble . But bumble is quite small
In Europe

It is kinda tinder or nothing here

 

[CornbreadFed]

Sevilla, Spain

And used only tinder and bumble . But bumble is quite small
In Europe

It is kinda tinder or nothing here

I have no idea how it is in Europe. I have never been to that part of Spain either. My city is literally 7 times your population lol, that would be considered a minor city in the US tbh. For OLD to work, you need a major city attracting young professionals.

 

[Bigpapa]

I have no idea how it is in Europe. I have never been to that part of Spain either. My city is literally 7 times your population lol, that would be considered a minor city in the US tbh. For OLD to work, you need a major city attracting young professionals.

Ywah, it is quite big for a city in Europe ( 1.5 mil when the metropolitan area is added ) though

But in Spain, most people do not spend that much time on apps as the culture is about going out + going to the beaches

Might be way different the tinder experience in Europe vs America

Lived in London for a while, and more or less I would not say that it is way different than the experience in Spain

The quality is quite bad on apps, in most Europe at least

Now… this does not mean that it does not work or is a complete waste of time, but for sure relying only on this is quite far away from the ideal. There are still some good looking women out there, but maybe you will match with 1-2 per month

Then when you start subtracting those that do not respond or just out there for validation, in an optimistic case you get a couple of dates per year . Not that great ROI if you ask me if the strategy is OLD

 

[Ricky]

It is quite funny how it flipped

I remember when online dating was thought of as weird! People were embarrassed to be using it or telling people they met a girl from plentyoffish etc. It was thought of as a way for semi-undateable people to meet up!

And now it's the other way around! It's the standard. Every hot young girl grew up with social media and online dating. I personally cold approach all the time and would never advise to not do it, but I must admit that you certainly do get a lot of reactions where you can tell she thinks just the fact you're talking to her makes her think you're a bit odd lol. I even have good looking friends who get fairly 'bad' reactions simply because the young girl is so surprised/anxious/shocked/thinks you must be weird for talking too a stranger

If you read the FR's on seddit from some of the Euro guys (Brits mainly) you see lots of FR's where he opens and the girl is like 'Errr...I don't talk to randoms. Bye' and this is in a social environment like a bar! But she doesn't think it's weird for a 'random' to swipe and message her on tinder haha

It'll probably 'flip back' one day. Almost certainly, in fact

I remember those days well too. I was using online dating to supplement the women i met in other ways. Was almost afraid to tell people how i met my wife which was online also. Years later i find out a friend was using plenty of fish and it was like shooting fish in a barrel for him.

One of the ways i look at cold approach.. is when i get a bad response or weird response from women it makes for a great story later. I Truly don't give a f what some women i don't know yet thinks about me, so it's more a method to screen out the odd women than anything.

 

[SW15]

Can we please stop pretending that somehow none of the women you would meet in person are on OLD? They are 95% of the same sets of women, yet people act as if they are mutually exclusive...like if you meet someone in person, it's because she wasn't on OLD.

It's nonsense...they are the same set of women for the most part. The only difference is she might not have given you the time of day online but you may have better luck in person.

Meet the right person online or in person and the result will be the same.

There isn't much data to either confirm or refute this statement. I've tried at times to figure this out. Maybe someone else can figure it out.

I believe there are some singles that a man can approach in public that wouldn't be app users.

Yes, there is overlap between app users and random singles men approach in public. The amount of overlap is unknown but I doubt the overlap is 95%.

 

[Bigpapa]

Yes, there is overlap between app users and random singles men approach in public. The amount of overlap is unknown but I doubt the overlap is 95%.

I do not think that it is even 30-40% for above average looking women

The lower you go the higher the overlap

 

[tksniper]

Women are still open to meeting men outside online apps. They still look at you in the gym, coffee shop, bar, park, etc. But their price is much higher nowadays. Don’t expect women to make the first move. Or even give you a blatant sign. It would be more like a subtle sign and you have to break the ice.

It’s harder for sure but for the men brave enough to break the ice with women giving out subtle signs, he will get the most pvssy.

Im not even saying this is fair, I’m just saying this is the state of dating in 2023. Men have to work a lot harder than 10 years ago.

Of course I am assuming you are a good looking and fit guy like myself. I can’t imagine how much harder it is for average looking guys. It’s harder for me now than it was 10 years ago but I still get subtle signs.

 

[SW15]

Women are still open to meeting men outside online apps. They still look at you in the gym, coffee shop, bar, park, etc. But their price is much higher nowadays. Don’t expect women to make the first move. Or even give you a blatant sign. It would be more like a subtle sign and you have to break the ice.

It’s harder for sure but for the men brave enough to break the ice with women giving out subtle signs, he will get the most pvssy.

this is the state of dating in 2023. Men have to work a lot harder than 10 years ago.

Of course I am assuming you are a good looking and fit guy like myself. I can’t imagine how much harder it is for average looking guys. It’s harder for me now than it was 10 years ago but I still get subtle signs.

I have noticed that women have gotten much poorer at signaling in the last 15-20 years. I was making that observation as early as the early 2010s. I noticed a difference between the mid-2000s and the early 2010s in terms of female body language signaling. Compared to the early 2010s, women have gotten even more immersed in their smartphones.

 

[HaleyBaron]

Women do suck at signaling, but the signs are there. It is not just about if they are looking at you, there are subtle cues with their behavior toward you vs others. If they are easy to touch you, they are grounds for gaming. If they are cold as a fish, do not even bother.

However gold diggers and hookers are still the king at showing interest. Not that I go out with either.

 

[tksniper]

I have noticed that women have gotten much poorer at signaling in the last 15-20 years. I was making that observation as early as the early 2010s. I noticed a difference between the mid-2000s and the early 2010s in terms of female body language signaling. Compared to the early 2010s, women have gotten even more immersed in their smartphones.

The other day I walked by a woman who I thought wasn’t attracted because she kept looking at me and looking away. When I finally decided to snub her, she turned her whole body towards me and looked disappointed I didn’t reciprocate. So I thought to myself, alright the next woman I will be more aggressive. So the next woman looks right at me with a confusing and weird look. I took it as an ioi and looked back and smiled. She then proceeded to act as if she was smelling sh1t. Turns out this woman was just annoyed by guys staring at her so much that she looked at me just to see if I was “eye raping” her so she could be offended.

This happens to me all day. And I’m a guy who grew up as a natural with well over 100 lays. When I play the “eye contact” game, I become completed frustrated. And this is something I never experienced before Covid.

So nowadays I no longer play the eye contact game. I found a loophole. The loophole is that you have to park yourself. Whether at a park, bar, or coffee shop. Park yourself and the women who are attracted to you will look at you more than once EVEN if you give them the poker face and ignore them.

This new method is completely fool proof and field tested. Park yourself, wait for her to check you out 3 times (the first time she looks at you may be because she’s tired of dudes eye raping her), and then on the third ioi, look at her and smile, wave, or approach if she’s next to you.

This is the new way to cold approach in 2023 lol. It’s even worked for me in the gym. I’ve made the mistake of smiling at girls upon first eye contact only for them to look like they are smelling sh1t. But when I just park myself and wait for them to check me out 3 times, my success rate of breaking the ice is close to 100%.

Women are so socially retarded nowadays that we have to to compensate for THEIR social awkwardness lol.

 

[Gamisch]

Hell yeah. Women are actually LONGING for real life encounters. That's what I keep hearing from most women I've dated in recent years. The fact I've somehow approached them made it all more worthy to them. And tbh, that always surprised me.

In our mind being a woman on old is like absolute paradise . You can swipe critically and be really reluctant to ever swipe right, and yet every swipe right is a match. But there's a catch..even though it seems this easy many women complain about the outcome of these dates . Why this is ? I dont know ,could be so many reasons. Maybe its the women and their choices, maybe the quality of men is also shyte .

Just the fact that men complain and that so many men DON'T date despite having the ability to present themselves to literally every woman in the world is telling. No ying without yang, so if men are unhappy that means there are equally as much women unhappy. There will always be a few exceptions. There will always be a dude married to his childhood love and having 5 kids with her. But he won't be on sosuave .

There isn't much data to either confirm or refute this statement. I've tried at times to figure this out. Maybe someone else can figure it out.

I believe there are some singles that a man can approach in public that wouldn't be app users.

Yes, there is overlap between app users and random singles men approach in public. The amount of overlap is unknown but I doubt the overlap is 95%.

This also depends on personal experience obviously. Like @Bigpapa stated, I've also managed to get much better results in real life than via OLD. I'm not using it now because recently the results where not too positive. Even if the woman was good looking, there were always huge redflags that immediately came up to the surface.

Look, lets admit we also have our preferences. And most of the times this is around hb8. Then she also has to behave and communicate on a certain level, and lastly she must be attracted to you fully so its easy to date her. Oh i forgot delete the app asap after she met me.I. o.w: a dimepiece.

If a man has lower expectations from women his experience might be better. I've ditched plenty of 6,s after one date, perhaps sex.

That being said, it does seem like there's a reward for the man who steps up to women vs the men who rather meets women through OLD. Somehow we rarely hear a man say that both work just as well.

Women are still open to meeting men outside online apps. They still look at you in the gym, coffee shop, bar, park, etc. But their price is much higher nowadays. Don’t expect women to make the first move. Or even give you a blatant sign. It would be more like a subtle sign and you have to break the ice.

It’s harder for sure but for the men brave enough to break the ice with women giving out subtle signs, he will get the most pvssy.

Im not even saying this is fair, I’m just saying this is the state of dating in 2023. Men have to work a lot harder than 10 years ago.

Of course I am assuming you are a good looking and fit guy like myself. I can’t imagine how much harder it is for average looking guys. It’s harder for me now than it was 10 years ago but I still get subtle signs.

I love this mentality.

 

[SW15]

Women are so socially retarded nowadays that we have to to compensate for THEIR social awkwardness lol.

I have noticed more socially inept behavior even from my friends' girlfriends/wives, all of whom are mid to late 30s right now. They were Millennials who reached adulthood as a lot of new technologies were emerging.

 

[Redwood]

I have noticed more socially inept behavior even from my friends' girlfriends/wives, all of whom are mid to late 30s right now. They were Millennials who reached adulthood as a lot of new technologies were emerging.

This is happening all across the board though.

 

[SW15]

What are some of these behaviors?

One of my friends' wives claimed she never got approached at a grocery store. This is false. Back when she was in her early to mid-20s, she was cute but not hot. Most men would have rated her somewhere between 6 to 7. I'm sure some guy approached her, but she was too socially inept to realize it.

 

[IKO69]

This is very true. Men don't know how to talk with women anymore. I rarely overhear any teases or flirts with women.

Most guys are SO EXCITED to SEE A GIRL in front of them. Wow, a woman! Wow, a wet hole! What will I do????

Then they proceed in this happy-go-lucky, super questioning mode, where every one of her answers is followed by a "wow, that's so cool!!".

Do not do this.

Everything is chill. You're just talking to a stranger, just as you would talk to some guy who spots you in the gym. You can comment on their shirt, or make some observation about them. Or, honestly, you can just straight ask their name and then say "I see you often here, so I have to say hi".

The opener really doesn't matter. What matters most is that you open your mouth.

You don't have to dedicate your life to cold approach. I'm going out with a girl tomorrow I "cold approached" in the gym because she was using a machine I had to use. I needed to use it so I asked to switch in with her. Then I got her talking and now we're going out.

You can do the same thing at any social event, or music event, or grocery store. Literally, ask about types of bread if you want. Or what the best flavor of peanuts is. It really doesn't matter. Anything to get her attention will do.

Start off chill, then start flirting with her. Bust her balls a bit (in a playful way).

When I close, I don't ask for her number. I just give her straight eye contact and say "We should go out sometime". Hold the eye contact and wait. If her response is positive, you get her number.

I like cold approach much more than OLD. To me, it's more human. Less swipes and more real conversation. You still fail, but afterwards you always feel proud that you overcame your fear.

Really good, that's how I would generally do it. I guess I have seen where a lot of guys mentioned the earbuds being a deterrence (and it sort of is), but what I have come to understand is the rules are largely enforced towards unattractive guys. You also have to take into consideration how a lot of the young, attractive women dress when they go to the gym - they wear some the tightest outfits: they practically put their entire body on display, especially the butt. They know what they are doing and want the attention --- of course they will welcome an approach from guys they happen to like.

I used to go to one of the Lifetime gyms here before the covid shut down, had lots of gorgeous women. I was probably the most popular guy there (at least during the time of day I went) with the women. That is not toot my own horn as I will be the first to tell you it doesn't mean **** as I only scored dates with a couple of them, but they liked talking to me. Would waive and say hi when they say me etc --- and that is largely because I wasn't afraid to start conversations with them as most of guys were. Some people are hardcore and it's all about the workout but let's be real that is a small %. A lot of the guys would gawk at the women but do little else.

You don't just hound a woman or come up to her mid set and ask a bunch of questions - it does require some tact. One of my moves was when I was at one of the cable/pulley machines and a babe would be next to me doing her thing. You know the type - the type that does one set and then admires herself in the mirror. I would wait until she turned back around and look her straight in the eye to get her attention and then motion to her earbuds. When she took them off I would say Hey lady you look good okay, but I want to know if you're using that attachment on the floor (one a person had left behind previously). You generally should not lead with a compliment on looks and I typically don't, but I considered this appropriate for the situation and it worked for me. You're letting them know you think they look good but their looks aren't more important than your workout (infact they are a bit obnoxious). Of course you want to deliver it a smile/joking tone of voice. The woman will likely be taken aback and nervously laugh at your boldness.

A lot of times I would workout next to them and ask if I could get the bench they were using after they were finished, etc. Short conversations at first, you want to treat it like a slow burn. The next time I saw them I would maybe wave at them or have another short conversation (the color of her shirt is nice or is that brand x? they have great quality clothing etc). You want to build familiarity at first - eventually they will be the one's that start saying hi to your first and what not - then you can progress things further. You might be on the treadmill for instance and she will take the one next to you and start a conversation since she knows you (these are things that happened to me so they will happen to you). These are the times when you can then turn on the charm.

---
Of course weight the risk. It can be embarrassing if you ask her out and get rejected because then you have to see her around. Try to get her dating status / wait for her to divulge it before you commit to pulling the trigger. Also don't be surprised when other guys give you the stink eye because they lack the courage to get off their lazy ****in asses and start conversations with the women of their own volition.