Hard Truth: There is no decent alternative to OLD

[Jake_Gyllenhaal69]

The only real alternative to OLD is School. Other than that, I cannot think of anything remotely close and this is why OLD isn’t going anywhere soon. The other options either have too much friction or too much investment with a high rate of failure. In our time, the sense of community has gone away, so there’s no more meeting your future wife at church, a city event, work, etc.

Work: The workplace has become too competitive to meet your spouse. Flirting with the wrong women can potentially cost you your job. It’s just not worth it todays age.

Bars: Too much investment for high risk. You don’t know if the bar is going to have a decent ratio or not. In addition, you score, but most bar girls are 304s anyways. Some guys like gaming at bars, but it’s not for most guys.

Gym: Combination of shvtting where you eat combined with an unfriendly approach vibe in general. Plus, I go to the gym to workout, not find a girl.

Social Events/Activities- You don’t know if this event is going to have single & attractive women. Plus, you are more than likely going to be doing something that you don’t care about anyway.

Grocery Store/Outside- If you can pull this off then that’s great, but this is extremely difficult for the vast majority of men. No, it’s not this just be a Chad and it’s easy. Cold approaching in these environments takes a special type of person and it’s not easy. This is coming from a guy that’s 6ft 2, in sales, and good looking lol.

In Summary, OLD provides the least friction and requires the lowest investment compared to the other methods except a school environment. Im
Sorry OLD haters, but it’s not going anywhere anytime soon!

 

[oc16]

I agree with most of what you said.

However, I am convinced most men that are with attractive women met them through their social circle (this is especially true when there is a looks mismatch) There are some attractive women on OLD, but a lot of undesirables too. I almost feel many attractive women don't need to go on OLD to meet men.

 

[sangheilios]

I agree with all of this.

Meeting women through work sounds like just a horrible idea overall. Sure, you could get in trouble for "harassing" the wrong woman. I'd be far more concerned about actually going out with one and then having to find a new job because of the likely scenario that the relationship doesn't work out. Just sounds like a recipe for a lot of drama and something that I would avoid.

Bar/nightlife game is definitely not for most guys, as you mentioned. The environment is also not conducive to being able to actually interact with women in a more normal way. It's also not a place where you are going to find quality, just not my cup of tea.

Gym environment seems like a great place to meet women but I actually believe that it's a terrible avenue for this. I've approached many times in the gym in the past and literally NOTHING has come from any of those interactions except a ton of drama and wasted time, and this is coming from a guy that is 6'4" and was/is one of the fittest guys there. A lot of women that are regular gym goers now are addicted to social media and are attention seeking *****s that will think nothing of leading men on. They'll flirt with you in the gym shamelessly but then resist doing anything with you outside of this environment. I've experienced this myself but I've other men go through stuff like this tons and tons of times over the years. Like with the work environment scneario, even if you were to date if the relationship eventually ends you may now have to go to a different gym to avoid running into your gym crush lol.

Cold approaching in public is possible but this is one of those things where everything needs to lineup perfectly and is more often than not a random chance encounter with a woman who is also single at that time and into you. Just not a good numbers game but totally possible.

It's just difficult for most men to land anything today, vast majority of relationships I know of often were from either school, especially university, or through a social circle.

 

[Zimbabwe]

Gym environment seems like a great place to meet women but I actually believe that it's a terrible avenue for this.

It's never a good idea to go for a woman in a male dominated environment, gym girls already get way too much attention.

Cold approaching in public is possible but this is one of those things where everything needs to lineup perfectly and is more often than not a random chance encounter with a woman who is also single at that time and into you. Just not a good numbers game but totally possible.

100% agree with this, but when you do actually get a girl from cold approach it is way more rewarding than some OLD date.

It's just difficult for most men to land anything today, vast majority of relationships I know of often were from either school, especially university, or through a social circle.

Yes without a good social circle from school/university you are pretty facing a very steep uphill battle.

 

[SW15]

Is your definition of online dating inclusive of both swipe apps and DMs on social media?

The only real alternative to OLD is School. Other than that, I cannot think of anything remotely close and this is why OLD isn’t going anywhere soon. The other options either have too much friction or too much investment with a high rate of failure. In our time, the sense of community has gone away, so there’s no more meeting your future wife at church, a city event, work, etc.

OLD provides the least friction and requires the lowest investment compared to the other methods except a school environment. Im
Sorry OLD haters, but it’s not going anywhere anytime soon!

You're right about the high rate of failure of other methods but swipe apps have a high rate of failure as well.

Additionally, a lot of men don't have an Instagram worthy of DMing women and getting a good response rate. Men who DM for dates/sex on LinkedIn are routinely mocked but the women usually mocking them are careerists age 30+. Twitter falls somewhere in between Instagram and LinkedIn.

School is a good alternative to swipe apps but a narrow window in life. It's over by 22-24 in most cases. Some men could go to graduate school and hit on undergrads while in grad school though. That takes more effort.

I don't see online dating going anywhere either. Younger Millennials and Gen Z are not socially adept enough in a lot of cases to handle them,

Bars: Too much investment for high risk. You don’t know if the bar is going to have a decent ratio or not. In addition, you score, but most bar girls are 304s anyways. Some guys like gaming at bars, but it’s not for most guys.

I agree that bars aren't for most men. If you even think back to the 1970s-1990s, many men struggled with bar game. It's difficult game, and the men of the 1970s-1990s in bars had better social skills than the men of 2010-present. Ratios have been lousy in bars going back to the 1970s-1980s.

Gym: Combination of shvtting where you eat combined with an unfriendly approach vibe in general. Plus, I go to the gym to workout, not find a girl.

Good point on unfriendly approach vibe. The earbud factor is the most difficult part of the general gym floor. Fitness classes at gyms eliminate the earbud problem AND have great ratios. Most fitness classes are the opposite of swipe apps on ratios. It's common to see 2 women for every man in a fitness class. However, despite good ratios at fitness class, there is a unfriendly approach vibe. Few women are sociable in the 5 minutes before and after the 45-60 minute class.

Social Events/Activities- You don’t know if this event is going to have single & attractive women. Plus, you are more than likely going to be doing something that you don’t care about anyway.

Social events/activities is a rather broad grouping of things. Your general assessment is accurate. We could go through certain types of events and activities on a one by one basis, but the general conclusion would be the same.

Grocery Store/Outside- If you can pull this off then that’s great, but this is extremely difficult for the vast majority of men. No, it’s not this just be a Chad and it’s easy. Cold approaching in these environments takes a special type of person and it’s not easy. This is coming from a guy that’s 6ft 2, in sales, and good looking lol.

Approaching strangers in non-bar venues is quite challenging. It's an alternative to the swipe apps, but not a terrific one.

While swipe apps stink, the other options stink too. It becomes a matter of subjectivity as to which option stinks less. I tend to think swipe apps stink the most and my Instagram doesn't warrant DMing as an effort, so approaching strangers in either nightlife venues or non-bar venues are my best option due to a lack of a social circle.

 

[Alvafe]

so going out is that hard, huh?

 

[corrector]

Just have to rot away since I cant meet anyone. Nice thread. At leaat it enourages me to continue doing nothing because you will be wasting your time and feeling bad when chad scoops your date at the last minute and you end up spending new years eve night alone after wasting time investing on that chick. Some things are worst than rotting.

 

[Pierce Manhammer]

Woe is you bro!

 

[SargeMaximus]

Agreed. Good to see y’all finally coming around. First to giving org@sms making you beta, and now OLd being the best. What’s next?

 

[SW15]

It's just difficult for most men to land anything today, vast majority of relationships I know of often were from either school, especially university, or through a social circle.

Social circle is great for getting a girlfriend. Pay close attention to the words "a girlfriend". That means one girlfriend. If you're looking for an extended relationship (2-5 years or more), your best bet for getting that with the least amount of grief and frustration is social circle. Many men who get social circle girlfriends tend to retain those girlfriends for a long time and often beyond the useful life of the relationship. A lot of the social circle girlfriend guys are beta males and beta males operate from a scarcity mindset. It's common to see a 10 year relationship (and counting) relationship from social circle which does lead to a marriage proposal.

A social circle introduction is a higher percentage play than a swipe app interaction or approaching a stranger (either in a bar or non-bar setting). It's a more difficult path and it's not a path I recommend highly. Social circle is better in the shorter to medium term. You can get a solid, medium term (1-4 years) girlfriend via social circles more easily than through approaches or swiping more easily.

The problem with social circles becomes sustainability over a longer period of time (5+ years). Social circles have a way of getting pissed off at men who continually exchange girlfriends without marriage or babies, even if the relationships are semi-long (1-4 years). After 2 or so instances of medium term relationships, the social circle will run dry. Social circle is not likely ideal for a serial monogamist who does have extended relationships but doesn't commit or the player type who tends to have relationships of less than 1 year.

The people who played the mating game best in college fell into 2-3 groups, all involving LTRs

• Greek Life people who found other Greek Life people for extended relationships
• Non-Greek Life people (mainly) who focused on activities and met someone for an extended relationship through some extracurricular activity or in one of their classes. This is more common way of forming LTRs in college.
• Greek or Non-Greek people who met someone in classes, activities, or some other method and had an LTR with them.

I didn't hear of one case of a random, outdoor on campus approach leading to multiple dates or a relationship. There might have been an approach or two in my university's student union that lead to something longer term, but I wasn't aware of it or simply don't recall it now.

LTRs seem to be the ticket for most men into regular sex at most phases of life. That's why a lot of people have them and stay in them, even beyond their useful life (think long term sexless marriages).

Even the groups that played the mating game best in college mostly broke up after college and had to date again. They can at least remember their mating experiences in college more fondly than some other people.

The people who focused on off campus parties with tons of beer/liquor as their source of mating interactions usually ended up sorely disappointed in the experience. They did one or both of the following things

• Read internet articles about approaching/game/pickup
• Starting de-emphasizing parties and emphasizing other campus activities and classes before graduation

Gym environment seems like a great place to meet women but I actually believe that it's a terrible avenue for this. I've approached many times in the gym in the past and literally NOTHING has come from any of those interactions except a ton of drama and wasted time, and this is coming from a guy that is 6'4" and was/is one of the fittest guys there. A lot of women that are regular gym goers now are addicted to social media and are attention seeking *****s that will think nothing of leading men on. They'll flirt with you in the gym shamelessly but then resist doing anything with you outside of this environment. I've experienced this myself but I've other men go through stuff like this tons and tons of times over the years. Like with the work environment scneario, even if you were to date if the relationship eventually ends you may now have to go to a different gym to avoid running into your gym crush lol.

You are the type of guy who would positioned to do well in a gym environment. You're 6'4" with big muscles. That's the "Chad" physique that women desire. It's peculiar that you haven't done well in gyms. If you haven't done well in gyms, imagine the experience for 5'9"-5'11" guy who are not among the fittest guys in their particular gym.

 

[bat soup]

The only real alternative to OLD is School. Other than that, I cannot think of anything remotely close and this is why OLD isn’t going anywhere soon. The other options either have too much friction or too much investment with a high rate of failure. In our time, the sense of community has gone away, so there’s no more meeting your future wife at church, a city event, work, etc.

Work: The workplace has become too competitive to meet your spouse. Flirting with the wrong women can potentially cost you your job. It’s just not worth it todays age.

Bars: Too much investment for high risk. You don’t know if the bar is going to have a decent ratio or not. In addition, you score, but most bar girls are 304s anyways. Some guys like gaming at bars, but it’s not for most guys.

Gym: Combination of shvtting where you eat combined with an unfriendly approach vibe in general. Plus, I go to the gym to workout, not find a girl.

Social Events/Activities- You don’t know if this event is going to have single & attractive women. Plus, you are more than likely going to be doing something that you don’t care about anyway.

Grocery Store/Outside- If you can pull this off then that’s great, but this is extremely difficult for the vast majority of men. No, it’s not this just be a Chad and it’s easy. Cold approaching in these environments takes a special type of person and it’s not easy. This is coming from a guy that’s 6ft 2, in sales, and good looking lol.

In Summary, OLD provides the least friction and requires the lowest investment compared to the other methods except a school environment. Im
Sorry OLD haters, but it’s not going anywhere anytime soon!

What about bus stops? You forgot to mention this goldmine.

 

[Jake_Gyllenhaal69]

What about bus stops? You forgot to mention this goldmine.

Not all of us live in areas where bus stops have people with a full set of teeth lol.

 

[BillyPilgrim]

What about bus stops? You forgot to mention this goldmine.

There is simply no better place for Mode One. Make your pitch, and then follow her home. She can't flake if she's a captive audience!

 

[eli77]

I always respect your post jake unfortunately I think in this situation you may be right dating is so 1990s is incredible

 

[BadWatermelon]

It's over for in-person-approach-cels!

 

[The Duke]

Heres what I read....It's either too hard or too risky. Boohoo, That's your problem and you guys ignore that fact. The same suspects I expected are all here crying the blues.

Men who improve themselves so it gets easier and accept risks get rewarded in every single aspect of life.

You do what others won't and you go where others haven't been. You put in more time than than the rest.

Not everybody gets a trophy just because they make an OLD profile.

If you don't have the confidence to approach in real life then you will struggle with women period.

The best thing I can recommend is you guys drop your standards so you can gain more experience and build your confidence. Work your way up to better women and more of them. Learn a few more things, understand women better. Put yourself out there. It's up to you.
Sit around and complain or swallow a little humble pie, and figure out how to make it happen.

 

[Stanley]

I get it, but i'd rather be irl.

I tried tinder about a month ago with old crap pictures and got matches. Ended up finding a fwb through it within 48 hours of downloading it. That said, it seems like a slippery slope, at least to me it did. The whole thing overwhelmed me and the attention and vanity of the whole thing feels off putting and disingenuous. I uninstalled for the time being. I'll come back to it again when i'm moved out and use my professional photos and maybe my opinion will change. I prefer talking to women irl since it feels so natural and easy now.

 

[Alvafe]

Agreed. Good to see y’all finally coming around. First to giving org@sms making you beta, and now OLd being the best. What’s next?

I bet it will be a cuck is alpha......

lately a lot of people are so looking attention and validation, so they start a lot of crap post trying to look like they know waht they are talking about, but they are just missing the point and ignoring the knowledge shared here because they are not willing to put the effort and because they don't feel like agreeing and worse they don't want to listen(or read) and just want a pat in back and get a "I feel you bro"

with is sad, very sad

 

[SargeMaximus]

I bet it will be a cuck is alpha......

lately a lot of people are so looking attention and validation, so they start a lot of crap post trying to look like they know waht they are talking about, but they are just missing the point and ignoring the knowledge shared here because they are not willing to put the effort and because they don't feel like agreeing and worse they don't want to listen(or read) and just want a pat in back and get a "I feel you bro"

with is sad, very sad

Lol is that aimed at me? I literally spent a few months fvcking a wife in an open marriage. I’m not a cuck bro

 

[Thebestthereeveris]

The only real alternative to OLD is School. Other than that, I cannot think of anything remotely close and this is why OLD isn’t going anywhere soon. The other options either have too much friction or too much investment with a high rate of failure. In our time, the sense of community has gone away, so there’s no more meeting your future wife at church, a city event, work, etc.

Work: The workplace has become too competitive to meet your spouse. Flirting with the wrong women can potentially cost you your job. It’s just not worth it todays age.

Bars: Too much investment for high risk. You don’t know if the bar is going to have a decent ratio or not. In addition, you score, but most bar girls are 304s anyways. Some guys like gaming at bars, but it’s not for most guys.

Gym: Combination of shvtting where you eat combined with an unfriendly approach vibe in general. Plus, I go to the gym to workout, not find a girl.

Social Events/Activities- You don’t know if this event is going to have single & attractive women. Plus, you are more than likely going to be doing something that you don’t care about anyway.

Grocery Store/Outside- If you can pull this off then that’s great, but this is extremely difficult for the vast majority of men. No, it’s not this just be a Chad and it’s easy. Cold approaching in these environments takes a special type of person and it’s not easy. This is coming from a guy that’s 6ft 2, in sales, and good looking lol.

In Summary, OLD provides the least friction and requires the lowest investment compared to the other methods except a school environment. Im
Sorry OLD haters, but it’s not going anywhere anytime soon!

i love old but it has its negatives of course. Looks is basically everything on old whereas vibe and confidence will get you the chick in person. I dont know how to explain it but girls know when your "on" and confident and will stare at you even if your not the best looking guy. However those who are jacked and good looking (me ) are usually confident but not always i have time when im feeling down and like a loser and girls dont give me the time of day even though i look just the same lol