How many happily married couples do you know (if any)?

[BeExcellent]

Like @RangerMIke I am a realist. But I’d say I’m an optimistic realist. To me personally I liked being married. I liked sex on tap, the stability that level of commitment brings, the having a lover/best friends/partner in crime/partner in life way of existing. Someone to love, be lovers & do life with. Most of the happy marriages I know have this light about them. My fiancé knows many long term happy marrieds too and has always desired the same dynamic I described above.

You both must be committed to being your best self and you need to have a great attitude about who you are personally, where you are going in life & you also must enjoy the moment, the here, right now. You must make some compromises to accommodate your spouse and you must take a long term ride or die view.

One of the couples I know is a lawyer & his wife who married at 20 years old. They are now pushing 90. They have been married almost 70 years. They are completely devoted to one another, she still affectionately calls him by his college nickname & he is ever the swashbuckling Texan, they have a wonderful adoration for one another and she just smiles and laughs and loves him for who he is, and as their children (who are older than me and successfully married themselves) have explained to me they just fell in love, got married and that was IT.

We were visiting their home a few years ago, having an evening cup of coffee. He’s telling a story and while he’s telling his story she is lining up his medicine & at one point she quietly interjected “Now Aggie, darling, it’s time to take your meds & think about bed…”

He stopped his story, looked at her, and said matter of factly “Goddammit woman. Can you see I’m telling a story over here?” And she smiled & nodded & he patted her hand & went right back to telling his story. It’s his way of both acknowledging and leading and being a man all in that moment. And he said this in a loving way.

Long term happily marrieds exhibit the kind of partnership you see on a twin engine plane. Yeah it can fly on one engine, but not very well and not very long.

It does exist.

 

[kavi]

Marriage also definitely benefits the wealthy and upper and upper-middle classes.

When you both have money, education and social status along with the lifestyle that goes with it most ppl dont want it to fail as there is too much to lose. Its like 2 winners wanna team up and be like we are better than others but 2 average ppl dont have the same benefits. Elite ppl benefit from monogamy and the marriage system as it allows them further leverage over poorer ppl, shared wealth, lifestyle etc.

In the Upper Classes you may see a greater respect for marriage but it is not really a moral position its more about marrying someone who is also above others in wealth and hence maintaining and increasing your position.

 

[Kotaix]

My parents, for one.

Most of my coworkers who haven't been divorced and have kids also appear to happily married.

Also some of my childhood friends have stayed happily married.

I dare say that a majority of the couples I know seem to be happy together.

 

[EyeBRollin]

Well I’m currently/recently married and there are pros and cons vs being single. I would rate my marriage as content.

The biggest cons are less freedom and no more thrill of the chase. If you truly like traveling or going out at any hour of the night don’t get married! The thrill of the chase is the one part I admittedly miss. New pvssy is better than the same pvssy.

The biggest pros are companionship, sex on demand, social prestige, and being catered to. People act more pleasant towards married men. I notice everyone smiles at me more. Also, my wife does a lot of house chores that I hated doing and she’s a great cook. I get home cooked meals, homemade juices, my lunch is always packed. It’s nice.

 

[Stanley]

Most marriages around my personal life have appeared positive, that said the ones that function well clearly have a man leading and being masculine. (and they are generally older)

The marriages I see that come across as toxic or just down right unhappy are rife with insecurities, incompatibilities and so on... I'm always mind blown when I see a couple that clearly would not function in a marriage pursue courtship only to either be unhappy for years to come or divorce. It seems those that are unhappy often settled and never quite understood their value... or lack thereof. Also, keeping in mind how many people expect their significant other to change for their betterment is just sad. After a certain age I'm hard pressed to see genuine substantial change in someone unless they are actively trying to undo years of habits and mental schema by their own volition.

I think a primary purpose of playing the field, dating, spinning plates or whatever... is to find someone you want to commit to. Weed out the low quality incompatibles and see who makes you happy. That said, I don't believe or subscribe to any soulmate or life long partnership bull****. That said, there are those that do find life long partners that complete them and I think that's amazing, but incredibly rare and INCREASINGLY so now a days. Agendas, media, feminism and every other modern contributor has made quality genuine relationships rare as unicorns and younger generations like mine will be ****ing lonely and bitter, especially the women as more men become clearly aware of the feminine imperative persisting in developed western nations...

I think under extremely specific circumstances and rationale marriage can be an positive thing for both the man and woman, but only if both have vetted each other heavily and understand the weight of marriage and the responsibility it carries. It seems very few people do this, especially the man who is often '*****whipped' and didn't capitalize and make use of his potential in realizing his smv. I think ultimately it comes down to a genuine shared love and comfort amongst one another and how well they synergize to create a happy marriage.

I like Rollo's take on marriage and think this quote summarizes modern marriage pretty well.

"Modern marriage is a menagerie of horrors for today’s men. People say, “Rollo you’re married, how come you’re so hard on marriage?” It’s either that or they presume my marriage is a **** show and I’m venting like a petulant boy. When I’m critical of marriage it’s in spite of my own (very happy for 21 years) marriage. But I cannot condone it for men today – not in its present state. Hardline MGTOWs and PUAs agree on one thing, if you ever consider marriage you’re Blue Pill. I’ve written in many prior posts that I don’t necessarily agree with that assessment, but I do understand it. The risks today far outweigh the rewards, but still there are men who, even with Red Pill awareness, will still take it on".

I think this is a more than valid stance and men get the short end of it nearly always nowadays. That said, those that are compatible and in tune with one another for a significant time in my experience have always outwardly portrayed a genuine happiness and ability to overcome obstacles as a couple. I just think it is incredibly rare in todays climate to have a longterm happy marriage, but i'm happy for those that find it.

That said, I'm young enough to be naïve and not yet quite Jaded, so with experience my perceptions of marriage will likely change.

 

[SW15]

"Modern marriage is a menagerie of horrors for today’s men. People say, “Rollo you’re married, how come you’re so hard on marriage?” It’s either that or they presume my marriage is a **** show and I’m venting like a petulant boy. When I’m critical of marriage it’s in spite of my own (very happy for 21 years) marriage. But I cannot condone it for men today – not in its present state. Hardline MGTOWs and PUAs agree on one thing, if you ever consider marriage you’re Blue Pill. I’ve written in many prior posts that I don’t necessarily agree with that assessment, but I do understand it. The risks today far outweigh the rewards, but still there are men who, even with Red Pill awareness, will still take it on".

The fact that Rollo Tomassi's marriage has lasted since 1996 can be interpreted as impressive.

I do believe that if you consider marriage in the present era, which I define as 1990-present, then you are blue pill. Rollo's marriage was closer to the beginning of this era. The risks of marriage have generally outweighed its rewards since the 1990s. I can understand why some pre-1990 formed couples are still together. I think there was a bit of a transitional era from the 1960s-1980s, where some elements of a more traditional time were still present, but other factors that signified modernization of the sexual marketplace became apparent. The first birth control pill hit the market in 1960s and female promiscuity increased throughout the 1960s-1970s. No fault divorce started around 1970 in California, and many more US states had it in place by 1975. Other Western areas followed suit.

Since the major wedding cycle in my social circle wasn't until 2016-2020, the divorce cycle has yet to start, but could be in full force by 2024-2030. There were a few weddings from people I knew that occurred between 2009-2011, those marriages all ended prior to 2020.

None of my romantic relationships have been close to marriage. Since I'm nearly 40 years old, it's getting seemingly less likely that I will ever marry. I avoid a lot of risk by avoiding marriage.

I had a terrible example of a marriage growing up. My parents' marriage was a joke. My home life was a joke. My father was a pathetic beta male. They also divorced too. They had no business marrying in the first place.

 

[Stanley]

The fact that Rollo Tomassi's marriage has lasted since 1996 can be interpreted as impressive.

I do believe that if you consider marriage in the present era, which I define as 1990-present, then you are blue pill. Rollo's marriage was closer to the beginning of this era. The risks of marriage have generally outweighed its rewards since the 1990s. I can understand why some pre-1990 formed couples are still together. I think there was a bit of a transitional era from the 1960s-1980s, where some elements of a more traditional time were still present, but other factors that signified modernization of the sexual marketplace became apparent. The first birth control pill hit the market in 1960s and female promiscuity increased throughout the 1960s-1970s. No fault divorce started around 1970 in California, and many more US states had it in place by 1975. Other Western areas followed suit.

Since the major wedding cycle in my social circle wasn't until 2016-2020, the divorce cycle has yet to start, but could be in full force by 2024-2030. There were a few weddings from people I knew that occurred between 2009-2011, those marriages all ended prior to 2020.

None of my romantic relationships have been close to marriage. Since I'm nearly 40 years old, it's getting seemingly less likely that I will ever marry. I avoid a lot of risk by avoiding marriage.

I had a terrible example of a marriage growing up. My parents' marriage was a joke. My home life was a joke. My father was a pathetic beta male. They also divorced too. They had no business marrying in the first place.

I agree with you on everything.

I was fortunate to have more 'old fashioned' parents who maintained and instilled morals in my siblings from a young age. My mother was a model and my Dad looked like a chad, but wasn't a player. He married my mother in 1989 when they were 30 and 31 years of age and had dated for years with both having successful careers. They waited to have children then decided to pop out four of em with me being the last with my mom having me at 38 which was incredibly rare for the 90s. My upbringing was odd compared to my peers since my immediate and extended family were much older than I and I had a rather 'unorthodox' young life. This led to some interesting perspectives and wisdom from the older men in my family from a young age. My parents struggled immensely trying support four kids and adopted the dual income strategy before it was hip. They were largely absent in my early years which shaped me as I am, but when they were together and spent time with my siblings and I, I was grateful. That said I still see the shortcomings and issues they faced and at one point thought they would've divorced when my siblings and I were teens. They overcame it and as they left the nest their relationship improved. But I realize how ****ing rare this is now a days and I hold out zero hope for a woman I want to marry. If it happens, it happens...

Many MANY of my friends and peers have broken homes and parents persisting in unhappy marriages. I think for all intents and purposes modern marriage in the western world has lost its meaning. In general I find people who are younger than say 50, tend to be less fufilled in relationships, I have no data to back that up, but that's just my personal anecdotal observation.

I just don't see the point in it today. Might as well just enjoy each others company without the title which ****s men over for the most part anyways. You can love and be happy with someone (or multiple) without tying yourself to an anachronistic title.

 

[SW15]

My parents struggled immensely trying support four kids and adopted the dual income strategy before it was hip.

Dual incomes became hip in the 1980s. Dual income was well established by the time your parents had children. The unique thing about your parents was having more than 2 kids in the 1990s.

Many MANY of my friends and peers have broken homes and parents persisting in unhappy marriages. I think for all intents and purposes modern marriage in the western world has lost its meaning. In general I find people who are younger than say 50, tend to be less fufilled in relationships, I have no data to back that up, but that's just my personal anecdotal observation.

In 2022, the oldest Millennials are 41. I'm an early Millennial at 39. Millennials are rapidly entering middle age.

A 50 year old today was born in 1972, and was part of the earlier wave of latchkey children, either from a 1970s no fault divorce or dual working parents.

I just don't see the point in it today. Might as well just enjoy each others company without the title which ****s men over for the most part anyways. You can love and be happy with someone (or multiple) without tying yourself to an anachronistic title.

Agree

 

[SW15]

I posted this as a response in another thread but it is also relevant here. This in part explains why a lot of marriages eventually go down the toilet. Women don't want to be monogamous for life. They like the shorter to medium term monogamy then eventually get bored of their husbands and want some new penis. Women who have more Alpha boyfriends/husbands will get bored less slowly but will eventually get bored. A lot of times, they want the marriage and the 1-2 babies, then will leave when the children reach elementary school/junior high years. Men are useful as sperm donors to get her the babies and useful for the money for child raising expenses.

Weddings Mean Nothing - Here's How To Prove It - Alpha Male 2.0

There’s a very interesting article right here about the percentages of newlyweds unsure about the wedding and whether this correlates to the four year divorce rate, which is the first big spike among divorces, statistically speaking. -By Caleb Jones The four year mark is about right, since as...

alphamale20.com

"women hate monogamy. The only time they like monogamy (a little) is when it's SERIAL monogamy, TEMPORARY monogamy. They also love getting married and having a wedding and a honeymoon. That's the fun part. But actually staying monogamous to one guy for 45 years? Uh, no. Not only do they hate that, in many ways they hate it more than men do."

Confessions of a Serial Monogamist - Alpha Male 2.0

-By Caleb Jones A while back, I wrote a post about how serial monogamy is, in most cases, abusive to men, since it’s usually women who initiate it and women who terminate it discordantly with the expectations of the men they’re dating. In that post,...

alphamale20.com

 

[logicallefty]

I've watched dozens of married couples I know deteriorate over the years. I keep saying this but I will say it again because it's applicable to this topic again. When the woman in the marriage hits her mid 30s, that's generally when sh|t breaks down. Examples I know personally:

Ages here are all HER age, NOT HIS. His age is irrelevant:
- My mom cheated on my dad at age 36.
- My sister cheated on her husband at age 38.
- My other sister left her husband at age 33.
- Buddy J caught his wife cheating at 36 .
- Buddy T caught his wife cheating at 33-34.
- Buddy M's wife left him at 39.
- Cousin S's wife left him at 32-33.
- My wife left her former husband at 38.

If I could go back in time to say age 18 I would know what it took to find a women and sustain her as a wife through her 30s. It can be done. Women go through some really crazy crap in their heads in their 30s and unless they man knows what he is up against before that and plans accordingly, she ISN'T GONNA BE HAPPY and he won't have a happy marriage.

I do know ONE couple who got married in their mid 20s and have survived the woman's 30s; my Buddy B and his wife E. I think she is like 44 now. I think they will be OK. I think his non-beta personality and her tight family structure have been contributing factors to the marriage staying solid. I don't think he knew any different he just stayed true to himself and didn't let her change him. This ONE couple is really the only one I would bet any money on at this point. Buddy B got lucky. He had a good alpha father who raised him right.

 

[member160761]

I have seen happy and joyful marriages but only when the couple was religious and/or were immigrants. There is something seriously ****ed up in the attitude towards marriage in the West, as is to some extent in Eastern Europe. Cheating, swinging and inverted sex roles are the norm. Those who sincerely believe in God have a strong and good marriage no exception, and those who come from a culture with strong family ties. Those happy marriages are few but I have seen them.

 

[Barrister]

I've watched dozens of married couples I know deteriorate over the years. I keep saying this but I will say it again because it's applicable to this topic again. When the woman in the marriage hits her mid 30s, that's generally when sh|t breaks down. Examples I know personally:

Ages here are all HER age, NOT HIS. His age is irrelevant:
- My mom cheated on my dad at age 36.
- My sister cheated on her husband at age 38.
- My other sister left her husband at age 33.
- Buddy J caught his wife cheating at 36 .
- Buddy T caught his wife cheating at 33-34.
- Buddy M's wife left him at 39.
- Cousin S's wife left him at 32-33.
- My wife left her former husband at 38.

If I could go back in time to say age 18 I would know what it took to find a women and sustain her as a wife through her 30s. It can be done. Women go through some really crazy crap in their heads in their 30s and unless they man knows what he is up against before that and plans accordingly, she ISN'T GONNA BE HAPPY and he won't have a happy marriage.

I do know ONE couple who got married in their mid 20s and have survived the woman's 30s; my Buddy B and his wife E. I think she is like 44 now. I think they will be OK. I think his non-beta personality and her tight family structure have been contributing factors to the marriage staying solid. I don't think he knew any different he just stayed true to himself and didn't let her change him. This ONE couple is really the only one I would bet any money on at this point. Buddy B got lucky. He had a good alpha father who raised him right.

Women want long-term security. If they feel their man isn't going to give it to them or they see what they think are cracks in that foundation, they start looking around. That usually happens in their 30s - which your own data backs up.

I will disagree with you somewhat though - I think older men are better equipped to deal with this than men who are the same age as the woman (or even younger God forbid). So I wouldn't go so far to say the man's age is irrelevant. I think this type of situation (from what I have personally observed anyway) happens much more often when the man is the same age as the woman.

 

[SW15]

I've watched dozens of married couples I know deteriorate over the years. I keep saying this but I will say it again because it's applicable to this topic again. When the woman in the marriage hits her mid 30s, that's generally when sh|t breaks down. Examples I know personally:

Ages here are all HER age, NOT HIS. His age is irrelevant:
- My mom cheated on my dad at age 36.
- My sister cheated on her husband at age 38.
- My other sister left her husband at age 33.
- Buddy J caught his wife cheating at 36 .
- Buddy T caught his wife cheating at 33-34.
- Buddy M's wife left him at 39.
- Cousin S's wife left him at 32-33.
- My wife left her former husband at 38.

Women want long-term security. If they feel their man isn't going to give it to them or they see what they think are cracks in that foundation, they start looking around. That usually happens in their 30s - which your own data backs up.

I will disagree with you somewhat though - I think older men are better equipped to deal with this than men who are the same age as the woman (or even younger God forbid). So I wouldn't go so far to say the man's age is irrelevant. I think this type of situation (from what I have personally observed anyway) happens much more often when the man is the same age as the woman.

When thinking about the relationships in my social sphere, if there are breakdowns in the woman's 30, it will be late 30s. These women who were getting married from 2016-2020 are now in their mid-30s and most had their first pregnancy between 32-34. The new baby NRE will help keep things together there from 38-40 or so.

I agree that 33-42 or so would be times where women who are married would start to look around if they see cracks in the foundation of long term security.

In thinking of personal examples of 2009-2011 marriages that failed to last past 2019, here were the ages of the women when they filed for divorce. 29, 37, and 36. The 29 year old filed not too long ahead of her 30th birthday and she filed as a childless woman. I think she perceived a less than ideal setting for herself, was feeling the onset of boredom, and wanted to exit where she still had her SMV intact and had no children. The 37 and 36 year old already had children by the time they exited. I think in all 3 of these situations, the relationships had a long and gradual decline.

 

[LTG71]

The happiness ebbs and flows. It feels good to have someone there to have your back and to share life with. Although, there needs to be a larger portion found from within and not expected from someone else. I wouldn’t say that my wife is the sole source of my happiness and sometimes she down right pisses me off. But in the overall scheme, things are good.

You can’t believe everything on social media. It’s basically everyone’s highlight reel. Nobody is going to boast about how they are fvcking up and failing. Women survive on validation and are going to project how their marriage/life is the best. I get annoyed as my wife has to get the “best photo” to flex on social media. This invention has created a huge social validation monster.

Back to marriage. When California was voting for gay marriage my buddy said it best…”Sure why not, let them be miserable too…”.
It’s not a guarantee for happiness.

 

[2Rocky]

But I realize lots of men never find it. And I agree it often has to do with a man failing to lead.

I do agree with you that the best chance a couple has to have a successful marriage is if BOTH partners bust their @sses to be the best versions of themselves possible. Mutual respect is also important. Finally, appreciate what you have... again BOTH have to do this.

I think Everyone has "complaints". I find that HAPPY people can complain, realize that's just how it is , and move on if they can't do anything about it. UNHAPPY PEOPLE dwell on the complaint and let it hold them back.

In every successful relationship, at some point you have to say about your partner: "Well that's just how they are, and I'm not going to worry about it anymore.". Whether it is socks on the floor, or the crazy relatives.

I'm trying to live simpler and I found this article which I think lays it out well: https://zenhabits.net/simple-living/

 

[The Duke]

Advice from the old lady:

I actually know at least a dozen married couples who really are happy. You can tell by the way they interact with one another and they truly remain cute over each other. In fact the more I think about it I may know more happy couples than that…couples that have been together for decades and still are INTO one another.

But my background lends itself to that. Men in my family were expected to lead and be masculine & ambitious; women were expected to be ladies (feminine, elegant and demure.). Similarly I grew up in an affluent area where achievements were expected & women want to be with high achievers. And the women appreciate both the masculinity and the ambition, and do NOT compete with it, but rather encourage & support it. I could cite example after example.

Even after leaving the area where I grew up those things were important to me so I naturally gravitated to social circles where the correct masculine/feminine polarity was important. So much so I’m fact that as my first marriage flipped on it’s head (me the breadwinner, him the house spouse), we found ourselves socially ostracized. So now it is lovely to be with someone who leads and is a decision maker, ambitious and decisive in addition to being masculine….I’m very happy. And because I appreciate him for these things he deeply appreciates me. He’s never had a girl like me. I think this dynamic is what is supposed to be….

But I realize lots of men never find it. And I agree it often has to do with a man failing to lead.

Out of these "dozen married couples", how many of the women work 40 plus hours a week outside the home? With most of the affluent "happily married couples" i know, there is a wife that stays at home. What age group are these couples?

As @kavi said earlier, marriage is a concept that benefits the upper middle class and higher. Women are highly attracted to men who provide resources, and status.

 

[BeExcellent]

Out of these "dozen married couples", how many of the women work 40 plus hours a week outside the home? With most of the affluent "happily married couples" i know, there is a wife that stays at home. What age group are these couples?

As @kavi said earlier, marriage is a concept that benefits the upper middle class and higher. Women are highly attracted to men who provide resources, and status.

I’d say 60% of the happy couples I see have an at home spouse. Depends on exactly which couples are in the sample size. Hell. I had an at home spouse myself for 10 years. He was lousy at being a home maker but he was a good father. That’s another matter.

I see dual income working couples that are really wonderful marriages. One couple I’m thinking of are from Winnipeg. They now live in the Bay Area in CA. They married at 18, never had children. He is in my field & a very successful colleague of mine & she is a corporate raider doing international mergers & acquisitions. They are both early 50s and travel the world enjoying an enviable life.

Another dual income couple is my sister. She teaches high school and he is a senior manager in the oil field. Second marriage for both, they have been married 26 years. I know another couple he is a doctor & she is a NP. They are early 60s, been together for decades (second marriage for both) and they have also owned a medical practice together….

I truly think what matters most is who you pick for a spouse. I fully expect my 20 year old son (who has been with his LTR already for 4 years) to propose to her based on what he said over Thanksgiving. He will commission in the Air Force when he graduates college, is pursuing his lifelong dream of being a fighter pilot & they have known each other since they were little kids in Catholic school, they go to church together, they both work, they function like a solid couple already in many ways but will not cohabitate before marriage. And she was not his first girlfriend. He has seen the party scene at university and has plenty of buddies who are players. He is very fit and very smart, socially adroit and is also very handsome. He’s got a very wise outlook for his age & while he loves his girl, he leads and is NOT whipped in any sense of the word. He knows exactly what he envisions for his life & he is on a trajectory to get there.

If any very young couple has the building blocks to be successful long term, they do.

I know another couple, late 20s now with small children. Grew up together in a small town. Both sets of parents (who themselves both work) are still together for 40+ years and the sets of parents were best friends and neighbors. Both sets of parents are prominent in the community both civically and at church. Both are financially successful and the young wife, who is college educated) stays home. The young dad works in banking and agricultural lending (his father is a prominent farmer in the area).

I agree marriage and particularly having an at home spouse have become a status symbol in affluent circles. It costs money to support a family and afford a non working spouse. But it confers many benefits.

My late father in law was himself an Air Force fighter pilot, an excellent one. His wife, my son’s grandmother, was an at home wife & mother. This is the life my son aspires to himself. And he is laser focused on that in all aspects.

It can be done even in today’s landscape.

 

[Dr.Suave]

Another dual income couple is my sister. She teaches high school

Interesting. What subject? I teach too.