Power dynamic when talking to girls in online dating

[Tilex]

i dont get why you older guys always suggest meeting girls through in person.

people do not cold approach in my generation. it is weird unless ur in a club.

If this is true, then holy sh!t!!!!!
The odds in cold approach are stacked in your favor.

You wanna know when online dating was stacked for guys?
20 years ago. The online dating market was at its infancy back then.
Now it's completely oversaturated.

 

[firstbornunicorn]

Get out of your head and go outside dude.

 

[firstbornunicorn]

people do not cold approach in my generation. it is weird unless ur in a club. instagram is the best and main way.

I cold approach people your age all the time with good results. Instagram? Dude, stop.

 

[SmoothSmooth]

I feel like the only way for a relationship to work and be happy is if they guy maintains masculine frame and the girl likes him more than he likes her. So shes always messaging, the guy still gives good replies etc but hes not like simping for her sending loads of messages, shes doing that.

And I feel like the only way to get that power dynamic is if the girl messages the guy First.

If I message a girl first, its like she feels entitled for me to continue making all the convo the rest of the time we are speaking. but me constantly making convo and trying to jestermaxx isnt holding masculine frame.

Is there a way to message a girl first and get them to start simping and sending loads of messages etc?


Also im from UK and girls are extremely entitled and have hundreds of messages per week off tinder and their instagrams with thousands of followers. girls barely want to reply to me, give me 1 word replies, or if they do speak normally, i will have to make all the convo or we just wont talk cos 100s of other simps are making that effort for her

But I downloaded an app for dating in south east asia - phillipines, vietnam etc. and within the last 2 weeks ive had like 120 girls message me and do this exact simping was talking about. they act like actual girls. i keep my masc frame and they write paragraphs for u in every message, calling u handsome all the time, sending nudes unprovoked etc

is there a way i can get girls in the UK to act like this or am I gonna have to move to a ****hole country just to get a girl who will speak to me like shes a traditional female and not like shes an alpha female

Most hot girls don’t take guys seriously online, that’s where you’re going wrong. Your competition isnt the guys in her DMs; she thinks they’re losers. Your competition is the guys she is chasing & being feminine around in real life.

If a hot girl ever resorts to her phone for meeting a dude, she def isn’t looking for a dynamic where the guy has the power, she’d be looking for a beta male after many years of heartbreak with alphas.

You need to gain some courage and stop thinking you can attract hot prime women from your phone. It’s a wishful fantasy that just doesn’t happen, didn’t happen 20 years ago and doesn’t happen now.

Girls do not join Instagram thinking about meeting men, they join it to stalk/impress other girls

 

[SmoothSmooth]

i dont even think theyre that uninterested in me. most of the girls i message from england give me OIO's like liking all my pics before i DM them and my insta pics make me look good looking. theyre just substanceless and overloaded with 100s of chads messaging them from tinder

look at this video, you can see how an average girl would get even more messages and be even more entitled for me to make all the convo

They like your pics and watch your stories but then ignore your messages because it’s a bait and switch tactic to get attention
.
That’s how women view men on Instagram/Tinder - they think you must be desperate/a loner for using the internet to find s3x and will toy you around for attention.

Those are not IOI’s, you are just an e-dude to her. Wake up!

 

[SmoothSmooth]

Also, from the way you are typing here, I can tell you aren’t in shape.
You need to hit the gym, cut, get a 6 pack and nice biceps, find the right haircut, and invest in some top tier clothing.
Then you won’t ‘feel’ like a genetic error and won’t need to resort to messaging strangers on the internet

 

[firstbornunicorn]

Your competition isnt the guys in her DMs; she thinks they’re losers. Your competition is the guys she is chasing & being feminine around in real life.

The girl I'm seeing rn shows me the randoms in her dms. Ngl, some are attractive dudes, but her question is always "why the fvck would you follow me/dm me dude? I don't know you. Should I block him @firstbornunicorn?"

 

[Genetic Error]

Also, from the way you are typing here, I can tell you aren’t in shape.
You need to hit the gym, cut, get a 6 pack and nice biceps, find the right haircut, and invest in some top tier clothing.
Then you won’t ‘feel’ like a genetic error and won’t need to resort to messaging strangers on the internet

no im in shape im just short thats why im a genetic error

 

[EyeOnThePrize]

no im in shape im just short thats why im a genetic error

Act like a king to be treated like one. Clearly you're putting too much effort into OLD.

You're over complicating things. OLD is all about having good pictures. Wear your best threads, sit in nice cars, get shots with celebrities and other girls, etc, and embellish everything. Never message first and ignore one word messages. I get a girl that fuucks my brains out maybe one every two to three months this way, and I do virtually nothing to get them. I really dgaf if I don't get a girl for years, and a lot of times I forget to open the app and swipe because I'm meeting plenty of girls IRL. Recently the only time I've opened OLD apps is when I get notifications that my account is being disabled from lack of use.

Online the real gold mines are apps that don't focus on dating and connect you with people for something more constructive. There are some with an insane amount of girls compared to guys, like 9 girls to every guy, and they're hot and smart. I won't give you the app names because I don't want your goofy a$s simping up the atmosphere. My point is think outside the box.

Your main source of women shouldn't be from OLD, it should either be from your IRL hobbies, or from those constructive hobby apps I mentioned.

And overall your life satisfaction and life fulfillment shouldn't come from women at all. Your life should be so full of abundance that women are an optional cherry on top. If it doesn't feel like that then you shouldn't even be concerning yourself with women yet.

There are five billion women on this planet and less than two billion seconds in 60 years; you couldn't meet them all if you tried, so relax, they're everywhere. Create an interesting life for yourself and you'll be beating them off with a stick.

 

[manfrombelow]

"Online dating" itself is already a losing game for men, nowadays.

 

[firstbornunicorn]

OLD is all about having good pictures. Wear your best threads, sit in nice cars, get shots with celebrities and other girls, etc, and embellish everything.

This is the opposite of the truth actually. Have ONE "posing/looking really good/model-type" photo, and on the others go for being yourself. Show more goofy sides, maybe one with a purposeful double chin. I guarantee more matches.

What you describe here falls into the "try hard" category and most chicks are turned off by it.

Of course, if it's really you, be you.

 

[SmoothSmooth]

Of course, no matter what strategy you use online, you will always end up with someone way below your SMV/what you could get meeting in real life (ie not hot girls aged 19-24) therefore online is pretty beta regardless of how successful you are.

 

[SmoothSmooth]

no im in shape im just short thats why im a genetic error

I know enough short guys with attractive girlfriends. You sound like a loser from your mentality, the fact you define yourself by what you lack on a physical level is very feminine. Women want confident bad boys, and you’re clearly not feeling like one, so work on that before you look for magic DM solutions

 

[EyeOnThePrize]

This is the opposite of the truth actually. Have ONE "posing/looking really good/model-type" photo, and on the others go for being yourself. Show more goofy sides, maybe one with a purposeful double chin. I guarantee more matches.

What you describe here falls into the "try hard" category and most chicks are turned off by it.

Of course, if it's really you, be you.

You're getting too deep in the weeds. Different photos attract different types. Imo if you want more insecure or fugly girls sure, post self deprecating stuff to showcase your own flaws. If you want women that disguise their insecurities with humor, post more goofy shiit. You're right, you may get more matches, but they'll be more insecure and fugly. If you drop all standards and fuuck any wet hole then you'll get plenty of lays if quantity is your only goal.

If you want dimes, you gotta have high res popping photos that showcase an interesting effortless life. Obviously dimes aren't the majority, so I am projecting my own goals a bit.

Having pics that aren't grainy potato isn't try hard. Neither is having pics that show your body type or your eyes; these are basic etiquette to save both parties time and energy.

 

[SmoothSmooth]

You're getting too deep in the weeds. Different photos attract different types. Imo if you want more insecure or fugly girls sure, post self deprecating stuff to showcase your own flaws. If you want women that disguise their insecurities with humor, post more goofy shiit. You're right, you may get more matches, but they'll be more insecure and fugly. If you drop all standards and fuuck any wet hole then you'll get plenty of lays if quantity is your only goal.

If you want dimes, you gotta have high res popping photos that showcase an interesting effortless life. Obviously dimes aren't the majority, so I am projecting my own goals a bit.

Having pics that aren't grainy potato isn't try hard. Neither is having pics that show your body type or your eyes; these are basic etiquette to save both parties time and energy.

Facts. But you aren’t banging dimes online no matter how good your pics are; dimes dont use the internet to find men, you’re just an orbiter on her phone giving a high-res ego boost.

However if you meet and charm the dimes in real life first then add them onto your IG with the high res pics, thats a good strategy. Especially if you’re meeting via cold approach and can display social proof

Don’t do too much though, using and posting on SM too much will start to have an inverse effect on your smv perception, no matter good your content is. You want to preserve the Mystery and mystique. Social Media is a female domain, and no high value guy is going to overly engage on an app where 90% of the content is food pics and teenagers

Social media will never build attraction, just solidify and confirm the attraction that was already present when you approached her. Her interest needs to already be at least 75% before you’ve added her on IG. So don’t be that guy that follows a bunch of girls he’s not dating

Also, as a High Value Male, you should be using Instagram to SCREEN girls. Not to sell yourself to them.
You add them after the approach and then find reasons to disqualify them/challenge them based on their content.

 

[EyeOnThePrize]

Facts. But you aren’t banging dimes online no matter how good your pics are; dimes dont use the internet to find men, you’re just an orbiter on her phone giving a high-res ego boost.

However if you meet and charm the dimes in real life then add them onto your IG with the high res pics, thats a good strategy

Don’t do too much though, using and posting on SM too much will start to have an inverse effect on your smv perception, no matter good your content is. You want to preserve the Mystery and mystique. Remember Social Media is a female domain, and no high value guy is going to engage on an app where 90% of the content is food pics

This is a self fulfilling prophecy, you're not an orbiter if you never overextend yourself. If a dime makes it very clear she wants to see me before I've even sent her a message, then I'll give her one shot to meet me out at whatever event I'm going to. "I'm going to x on friday, come through." or any flavor of that. That's it, there's nothing else I need to say, nothing else she needs to say. I'll be at that event having fun either way. If she comes by and makes herself known it's a bonus. This has worked and will continue to work for me.

Imo any endeavor that is 100% in the pursuit of girls should have next to zero attention, ideally zero. Like I said, I setup my OLD profile and now get hounded by the apps for not engaging enough, because I'm busy with things I actually find fulfilling, and have an ever growing network of friends where women are constantly showing interest and jealousy. Any intricate detail talk of some perfect strategy is a waste of your precious time and is completely backwards. If you create abundance in your life you'll naturally feel aversion towards women that don't make things easy (incompatibility), and naturally feel attraction to those that do (compatibility), whether online or IRL. Whether that comes across as mystery or not doesn't matter.

SM is the perfect place to showcase your life, and it just so happens to drive women crazy (which again should not be a primary goal). Be bold, post what plays to your strengths, what you enjoy.

It's like some of the threads we see here. A guy gets with a hot girl and posts a thread asking how he should respond to a text she sent the next day; the fact that he's even asking means he's not ready for her. He may get through a few texts/days/weeks with help from forum members, but the odds are against him because it's not his natural expression. Rather than doing the work to be content with losing her, he scours comments looking for some secret code. The secret code is no fear, and thus defeats the purpose of posting in the first place.

 

[SmoothSmooth]

This is a self fulfilling prophecy, you're not an orbiter if you never overextend yourself. If a dime makes it very clear she wants to see me before I've even sent her a message, then I'll give her one shot to meet me out at whatever event I'm going to. "I'm going to x on friday, come through." or any flavor of that. That's it, there's nothing else I need to say, nothing else she needs to say. I'll be at that event having fun either way. If she comes by and makes herself known it's a bonus. This has worked and will continue to work for me.

Imo any endeavor that is 100% in the pursuit of girls should have next to zero attention, ideally zero. Like I said, I setup my OLD profile and now get hounded by the apps for not engaging enough, because I'm busy with things I actually find fulfilling, and have an ever growing network of friends where women are constantly showing interest and jealousy. Any intricate detail talk of some perfect strategy is a waste of your precious time and is completely backwards. If you create abundance in your life you'll naturally feel aversion towards women that don't make things easy (incompatibility), and naturally feel attraction to those that do (compatibility), whether online or IRL. Whether that comes across as mystery or not doesn't matter.

SM is the perfect place to showcase your life, and it just so happens to drive women crazy (which again should not be a primary goal). Be bold, post what plays to your strengths, what you enjoy.

It's like some of the threads we see here. A guy gets with a hot girl and posts a thread asking how he should respond to a text she sent the next day; the fact that he's even asking means he's not ready for her. He may get through a few texts/days/weeks with help from forum members, but the odds are against him because it's not his natural expression. Rather than doing the work to be content with losing her, he scours comments looking for some secret code. The secret code is no fear, and thus defeats the purpose of posting in the first place.

I agree with what you’re saying man, and only guys with experience will understand where you’re coming from. My point was that you can’t draw DIMES from OLD. 7.5s sometimesss (after many many swipes). 7s yes. Attractive women aged 26 and above yes (but they’re hunting for a good beta not a lover). But 18-25 year old girls that are 8s and above; no. Those girls are not going to take OLD seriously and they can’t afford the risk of spending a Friday evening with a stranger they know nothing about - they’re not going to put in effort BEFORE THE FIRST DATE to vet 100s of men for cat fishing, lack of chemistry etc. Those girls create an account and get 100s of matches A DAY, and therefore subconsciously conclude that men on those apps are desperate/low value. Furthermore, the ‘match’ alone gives her too much validation. Hot girls are more interested in that one guy from real life that is a challenge. The thirsty men on the apps (80% of men) make you also look worse by association.

If you think a model tier woman is interested in a "I'm going to x on friday, come through’ text from a total stranger on an app you are delusional.

Source: have had thousands of matches online as have some of my friends. All reached the same conclusion

 

[Who Dares Win]

If an interaction, ANY INTERACTION leaves you annoyed, stressed, angered or pissed off it means something is wrong and your gut is trying its best to make it clear for you.

This works for approaching girls at the bar, chatting online or negotiating a business deal.

I really dont understand why the average man put that much work on a woman that 90% of the times doesnt even provide proper friction between her legs once you get there while you consume your time and mental health to get there to begin with.

 

[EyeOnThePrize]

I agree with what you’re saying man, and only guys with experience will understand where you’re coming from. My point was that you can’t draw DIMES from OLD. 7.5s sometimesss (after many many swipes). 7s yes. Attractive women aged 26 and above yes (but they’re hunting for a good beta not a lover). But 18-25 year old girls that are 8s and above; no. Those girls are not going to take OLD seriously and they can’t afford the risk of spending a Friday evening with a stranger they know nothing about - they’re not going to put in effort BEFORE THE FIRST DATE to vet 100s of men for cat fishing, lack of chemistry etc. Those girls create an account and get 100s of matches A DAY, and therefore subconsciously conclude that men on those apps are desperate. They are more interested in that one guy from real life that is a challenge.

You're speaking in absolutes, and projecting a bunch of narratives. There are 10s that do exactly what you describe, and there are 10s that express interest in OLD and show up exactly as I've described. Sure the probability of a 10 showing up is smaller, but so is the probability of becoming a millionaire, does that mean we shouldn't even try? Does that mean we shouldn't create the conditions for success? I agree that some things are easier to do in person, but OLD has it's advantages too, namely the breakdown of any social/financial/distance boundary you'd otherwise have.

If you think a model tier woman is interested in a "I'm going to x on friday, come through’ text from a total stranger on an app you are delusional.

This sounds like you keep attractive women on a pedestal, and is a strawman of the hypothetical I gave. These women are just as flawed as the rest of us. You would rather call me delusional and claim it's impossible than accept the fact it happens all the time. I'm not here to convince you, I'm here to point out that believing it's impossible is your biggest obstacle. I can bring you to water, but I can't make you drink. At this point I'm repeating myself, cheers.

 

[SmoothSmooth]

You're speaking in absolutes, and projecting a bunch of narratives. There are 10s that do exactly what you describe, and there are 10s that express interest in OLD and show up exactly as I've described. Sure the probability of a 10 showing up is smaller, but so is the probability of becoming a millionaire, does that mean we shouldn't even try? Does that mean we shouldn't create the conditions for success? I agree that some things are easier to do in person, but OLD has it's advantages too, namely the breakdown of any social/financial/distance boundary you'd otherwise have.


This sounds like you keep attractive women on a pedestal, and is a strawman of the hypothetical I gave. These women are just as flawed as the rest of us. You would rather call me delusional and claim it's impossible than accept the fact it happens all the time. I'm not here to convince you, I'm here to point out that believing it's impossible is your biggest obstacle. I can bring you to water, but I can't make you drink. At this point I'm repeating myself, cheers.

Not really…it’s like saying ‘is a millionaire handsome guy going to marry a girl he hooked up at a yatch party’…the answer is pretty much no in 99% of cases. It’s just a matter of understanding the social dynamics at play. There’s a right way of doing things, based on your goal. But hey; you can keep searching for that 1 in 1000 hot 21 year old girl that’s looking for a date online, and then hope to outcompete the 3000 guys she matches with for that date, and once you get the number, hope she doesn’t flake on you for the guy she’s crushing on at the gym/class/bar, and then hope she’s got a normal personality too. ‘Keep believing’ bro.

I’ll take the other route and let her compete for me whilst I’m out and about. I’ll qualify her and challenge her in person and easily standout from the 3000 men hiding behind their phones

OLD does not exist to help men get hotter girls than they normally would in real life. It exists to make a profit from desperate men who ‘keep believing’.

Regarding social media…Why do you guys think many IG models will have 30,000 followers but only follow back 400 people in total, most of which are women? Most girls aren’t using IG for men…they need to feel your aura, hear your voice, scope how you carry yourself to be attracted