I get farther with women when I'm nice

[AttackFormation]

I understood it and it makes sense.

Re the bolded, yes that is my style exactly, which I actually hope I never lose even as I get older.

Free-spirted, carefree, instinctive, intuitive.

The "older" women I know who, as you said, analyze patterns other than their own natural instincts are the women who struggle the most from what I have observed.

Yep that's exactly what would be expected, when theyre young and given the "peak validation" of their lives they have the "free spirited, carefree, instinctive, intuitive" orientation to dating. Then when they get older and can no longer deny that they are not in "peak validation" anymore, and they experience (what they consider to be) struggles they are not used to, a few of those women will have an "epiphany" and do things like trying to think of dating out of a male perspective or think about the consequences of their attitude and actions, which it would never occur to them to do before.

Your answers have been great.

 

[DonJuanjr]

But what makes them valuable or not valuable?

Would you pay full price for a car that has 100,000 miles on it?

 

[DonJuanjr]

Actually yeah if it was in tip top shape inside and out.

No you wouldn't. You would get a one with few miles on it for the same price.

 

[DonJuanjr]

lol, why did you bother asking if you were only going to disagree with my answer? lol

Who is talking classic cars? I'm talking, would you pay full price for a 2021 whatever that has 100,000 miles on it, when you could get a 2021 whatever with 50 miles on it?

Your selective cognitive dissonance is only hurting yourself if you fail to grasp what I'm saying.

 

[SargeMaximus]

Wanting leads to Attachment

Attachment leads to Confinement

Confinement leads to Suffering.

"To want is to suffer"

Not exactly. There is a conundrum where essentially people begin to “desire not to desire”. Wanting to be free of want is itself wanting.

Wanting is fine so long as you are unattached from the outcome ime

 

[DonJuanjr]

I answered the question, moving on.

I wasn't going to respond, but since you're making an effort on this site, I'm going to spell it out for you...

Think of the type of man that you would settle down with. This type of man is not going to be interested in you when you are in your late 30s. He will have younger women available to him that have those qualities you mentioned. Late 30s women are not the only women with those qualities. Why would he want you in your late 30s when he can have 22 year old you. Before you fvcked the amount of men you did since then. When your tjts, a$$, face and overall skin was tighter, and more lush.

 

[SargeMaximus]

That's higher level stuff.

I think for the average Jimmy "wanting and suffering" just needs to be applied to women.

Freedom from outcome (with women) puts you miles ahead.

Your "wanting to be free of wanting" - sure. I mean, if I eat lots of food I'm going to "want" to take a sh1t eventually. I can't avoid that.

I simply mean that if I desire not to have any desire and pursue that as my goal, it’s just as bad. It’s like the no fap movement where you are fighting against your nature.

It’s better to be in harmony but you can be free of outcome with women without having to eliminate your desire for them.

If you try to have no desire for women as a means to get women you are simply lying to yourself because it’s obvious you want women otherwise you wouldn’t be doing it

 

[SargeMaximus]

Totally. We all want pvssy and female energy, and pretending we don't is just inauthentic.

The key is to balance that Want and not let it rule your life. Like you say, outcome independence. But if you really think about it, outcome independence is faked too. If we were truly outcome independent then pursuing women wouldn't be very interesting.

Reality - we all hate getting rejected. And that's normal. If you didn't hate getting rejected then you wouldn't be human.

The key with outcome independence and managing rejection, I've learned, is to have lots and lots of irons in the fire. So if one iron falls out, then you focus on the other ones. Keep adding new ones. On and On it goes until you become a shriveled old man with lots of calluses on your c0ck.

Yes this is what I do in sales and I’ve been able to transfer it successfully to women.

I want women but I know there are lots of them so if one doesn’t work out there’s always another.

In sales it’s the same. I want the sale but if I don’t get it from the one person there are a hundred more. The odds are in my favor.

There are 3 billion + women on the planet. The odds are in our favor.

 

[SargeMaximus]

My career started in sales too. Everything I learned in sales applies to women. It's incredible. My success with women started shooting through the roof when I started selling insurance in my early 20's. Prior to that I was purely getting by on my looks, but I was clueless about how to manipulate women and get the outcomes I wanted. I was very passive and I just banged the women who came up to talk to me at house parties. I was behaving like a woman and I expected women to approach me. It did work, but I had no control over who I was banging.

That’s odd because my success in sales has not transferred to
Women as directly. As good as I am in sales I may be half that good with women, maybe less.

I don’t manipulate in sales, perhaps that is why. I just walk in with intention and don’t care if I get it or not.

 

[Barrister]

If you mean “nice” as in a man who never rocks the boat and is always agreeable with women in an effort to “get along” at all costs - no, you aren’t going to be successful with women. This isn’t male behavior by any stretch and women aren’t attracted to it. This will give you orbiter status with maybe an occasional pity fu*k. So some blue pill guy may think this is “success” if he doesn’t know any better.

You can still have human decency while being strong and always being bold. But a “nice” guy as it is traditionally defined is not one who is going to be successful. There’s a reason for the ubiquitous saying that “nice guys finish last.”

 

[SargeMaximus]

That could be it man. I was a dark triad salesman and I did and said anything to get dat commission and money stacks. Whatever needed to be said to close the deal, including all types of emotional manipulation, I had no limits. As long as it made me money, then I didn't care. This was prior to the 2009 Global financial crisis. You might remember that period. It was a free-for-all money grab and a huge party.

I was trained by some sales bulls in how to do the above. It was the start of my red-pilling. These dudes were incredible - like Michael Douglas players types mixed with Stifler from American Pie.

Damn. I just don’t know if I could do that. I also believe it’s weaker to win by manipulation.

To put in context ive had customers who other salesmen in the same company talked to first but when they talk with me they have said they wouldn’t buy from the first guy unless he split his commission with me. I remember the guy was stunned. I gladly took the money tho.

Being authentic and a person people can trust is ultimately more powerful imo just maybe not with women

 

[Fruitbat]

Women tend to not like men who are rude or unkind to them and try to dominate women.

the only women who do are damaged women.

however, women REALLY REALLY like men who are unkind to other men.

when I was a kid, like 22, and really dumb, there was a chick there about my age. Not that hot but big tits. (Workplace)

A dude about 50, ugly, and I didn’t get on.

one day he kind of ambushed me when this chick was present. I was too young to not be intimidated by this and the guy tore a strip off me, very aggressive and uncalled for. I was a bit lost and didn’t know what to say. It was unexpected, I ended up just walking out.

the chick slept with that dude that night. That really took some processing that I kind of got used as a punching bag to get that guy laid, and women really seem to appreciate that.

on the other side, I went out with a good girl. A good girl, apparently. One night I was drunk and me and this weaker dude were trying to get a taxi. I pulled the guy out the queue, threatened him and said “this is ours” and told him to F off, and he backed down, intimidated.

this good girl, man, she was sucking mu face off in the taxi and massively turned on.

so, it’s not about being a bad boy with women. It’s about being dominant over other men. Period.

 

[AbaGanov]

I think there is a difference between being genuine nice/kind (or whatever word you want to use) or acting nice in the hopes that behaviour will get you the girl. In guys acting nice you can see a quick shift to an angry incel once they realize they won't get what they want (see nice guys subreddit), they also try too hard and their niceness is unnatural and needy. They are giving from a place of wanting to achieve a certain goal - aka get the girl to like them and give them sexual favours.

Real man who achieved a certain level of maturity and manhood will sometime be the kindest man you will ever encounter, they realized that their mission in life to give to the world, to their women, to their family, to their friends, and they do it it genuinely, from a happy place that is not expecting to get anything in return, only the satisfaction that comes with the act of giving.

 

[Atom Smasher]

That’s odd because my success in sales has not transferred to
Women as directly. As good as I am in sales I may be half that good with women, maybe less.

I don’t manipulate in sales, perhaps that is why. I just walk in with intention and don’t care if I get it or not.

Do you sell a product or a service? Just asking out of curiosity.

 

[Atom Smasher]

Women tend to not like men who are rude or unkind to them and try to dominate women.

the only women who do are damaged women.

however, women REALLY REALLY like men who are unkind to other men.

when I was a kid, like 22, and really dumb, there was a chick there about my age. Not that hot but big tits. (Workplace)

A dude about 50, ugly, and I didn’t get on.

one day he kind of ambushed me when this chick was present. I was too young to not be intimidated by this and the guy tore a strip off me, very aggressive and uncalled for. I was a bit lost and didn’t know what to say. It was unexpected, I ended up just walking out.

the chick slept with that dude that night. That really took some processing that I kind of got used as a punching bag to get that guy laid, and women really seem to appreciate that.

on the other side, I went out with a good girl. A good girl, apparently. One night I was drunk and me and this weaker dude were trying to get a taxi. I pulled the guy out the queue, threatened him and said “this is ours” and told him to F off, and he backed down, intimidated.

this good girl, man, she was sucking mu face off in the taxi and massively turned on.

so, it’s not about being a bad boy with women. It’s about being dominant over other men. Period.

You really are onto something there. My woman loves the fact that I project a respectfull and polite demeanor that is tempered with a very definite “you really don’t want to f with me” vibe. I’ve got that Clint Eastwood “Speak softly but carry a big stick” thing going on. Not that I purposely modeled myself after him, but there is a natural similarity.

I used to be a total people-pleaser pu$$y with that sing-songy nice guy voice. You know, that voice tonality that tries to reassure everyone that you’re not a threat. I cringe just thinking about it, and am appalled if I catch myself slipping into it. Thankfully I recognize it right away and simply hit my internal reset switch.

My girl also loves the fact that I carry a firearm. Women love it when they consider you dangerous to everyone else but they feel safe with you. But being a loud mouth bully gets old fir them. I found that the sweet spot is that quiet dignity and polite attitude while still somehow projecting potential danger.

 

[Fruitbat]

You really are onto something there. My woman loves the fact that I project a respectfull and polite demeanor that is tempered with a very definite “you really don’t want to f with me” vibe. I’ve got that Clint Eastwood “Speak softly but carry a big stick” thing going on. Not that I purposely modeled myself after him, but there is a natural similarity.

I used to be a total people-pleaser pu$$y with that sing-songy nice guy voice. You know, that voice tonality that tries to reassure everyone that you’re not a threat. I cringe just thinking about it, and am appalled if I catch myself slipping into it. Thankfully I recognize it right away and simply hit my internal reset switch.

My girl also loves the fact that I carry a firearm. Women love it when they consider you dangerous to everyone else but they feel safe with you. But being a loud mouth bully gets old fir them. I found that the sweet spot is that quiet dignity and polite attitude while still somehow projecting potential danger.

sadly if you walked around with a firearm here a woman would think you’re a psycho or a gangster!

interestingly Clint in real life was a total DJ. He was getting air hostesses pregnant into his late 50s and 60s

 

[SargeMaximus]

Do you sell a product or a service? Just asking out of curiosity.

I actually don’t sell anymore. I do lead generation for a construction company. But I’ve sold everything from lawn care to furnaces. All door to door.

 

[zinc4]

I know this is hard for people to believe, but it's true. I also notice this with my friends as well. None of them are "bad boys" or act anything remotely resembling this forum, and get hot girls.

This seems to be an internet thing of trying to be a bad boy, calling a woman out on their behavior, putting them in their place. I have done this before and it doesn't work. Women think I'm an a$$hole and want nothing to do with me.

Same thing with my male co-workers. They are nice guys, and get girls. I've been around them plenty, and seen them interact with women who are very receptive to their advances, and end up in long-term relationships as a result.

What's interesting is I also know a few guys who are jerks, and I never see them with any girls.

A lot of this seems to be internet advice that never translates into real life.

If you look good and have decent social skills you can act as nice as you want. Even so, if you let a woman walk over you though she will lose respect for you and drop you fast. A lot of those guys end up getting cucked in their relationships i can promise you that. Just have boundaries and you are good.

Women do in fact like the "bad boys" though. You are clearly very inexperienced if you dont know this already. By bad boy i mean a person who makes their own rules only dares for his own gain and could care less about dropping them.

 

[zinc4]

Women tend to not like men who are rude or unkind to them and try to dominate women.

the only women who do are damaged women.

however, women REALLY REALLY like men who are unkind to other men.

when I was a kid, like 22, and really dumb, there was a chick there about my age. Not that hot but big tits. (Workplace)

A dude about 50, ugly, and I didn’t get on.

one day he kind of ambushed me when this chick was present. I was too young to not be intimidated by this and the guy tore a strip off me, very aggressive and uncalled for. I was a bit lost and didn’t know what to say. It was unexpected, I ended up just walking out.

the chick slept with that dude that night. That really took some processing that I kind of got used as a punching bag to get that guy laid, and women really seem to appreciate that.

on the other side, I went out with a good girl. A good girl, apparently. One night I was drunk and me and this weaker dude were trying to get a taxi. I pulled the guy out the queue, threatened him and said “this is ours” and told him to F off, and he backed down, intimidated.

this good girl, man, she was sucking mu face off in the taxi and massively turned on.

so, it’s not about being a bad boy with women. It’s about being dominant over other men. Period.

You shouldnt have done that to the guy in the taxi que. Especially if he was there first.

 

[Stuffnu]

There is absolutely nothing wrong with being nice.
If that’s your personality trait then stick with it. You want to attract your equal.

The one big misconception is people associate niceness with weakness or passiveness.
I’m a nice guy but that’s not an open invitation to walk all over me. Disrespect will immediate turn into a next-ing of a female.

Girls are attracted to strength not demeanor.