When did the red pill become basically black pill

[Lookatu]

I make over 100k, 6ft 1, 12% bf, and I’m not ugly and I’m called an Incel lol.

I think most people focus their improvements on the wrong areas. Social skills, conversational skills, and body language tweaks will likely get more results than going to the gym for the average guy.

 

[Lookatu]

while I agree that too much negativity is a bad thing. You cannot walk in to a relationship/marriage with your guard down especially in 2021.

There's what's called being a scared little boy being a pvssy and there's what's called being a smart man(calculated risks) and trying things in life and taking chances. Risk takers get the rewards.

Lately there's been a lot of pvssies on the internet and this forum.

Just going for it is the way of the man. Complaining and not doing anything out of fear is the way of the woman.

Do you think we would've landed a guy on the moon if pvssies ruled the world instead of men? Hell no.

This is mainly the reason why we can't have women in leadership positions. Biologically, they are not the type to pull the trigger on a lot of things that can advance us.

 

[Barrister]

That's all we are saying. The return on investment for the more superficial types of improvement that we used to focus on on this website is no longer worth the squeeze compared to how it was back then

Because guys are doing it for the wrong reasons. You shouldn’t be in the gym getting ripped and in great aerobic shape to get a hotter chick. You should do it for your own health. You shouldn’t be striving for that promotion or better job to get a hotter chick. You should do it because it’s your own accomplishment and reflects your own hard work through prestige and (usually) increased finances.

Guys on this site have a goal of hotter women. Self-improvement is not about that goal though. Women will come and go in life. They tend to have higher SMV if you have your sh1t together, but that shouldn’t be why you have your sh1t together.

 

[Guy69JackBlue]

Fact is, at least part of the benefit of those things is and always will be the woman aspect. Less people should bother now that the yield is tenuous at best.

And what's the replacement thing to focus on?

 

[Jake_Gyllenhaal69]

There's what's called being a scared little boy being a pvssy and there's what's called being a smart man(calculated risks) and trying things in life and taking chances. Risk takers get the rewards.

Lately there's been a lot of pvssies on the internet and this forum.

Just going for it is the way of the man. Complaining and not doing anything out of fear is the way of the woman.

Do you think we would've landed a guy on the moon if pvssies ruled the world instead of men? Hell no.

This is mainly the reason why we can't have women in leadership positions. Biologically, they are not the type to pull the trigger on a lot of things that can advance us.

I don’t believe in the moon landings for starts . I'd rather look at a person that left his life or death situation in Italy or somewhere to come to America. At the end of the day, there was a most likely guaranteed payout if the guy was willing to go through the years of hardship of immigrating to the USA and establishing himself. With marriage, there is no guaranteed payoff anymore because of increasing amount of unmarriageable women and toxic society causing seemingly steady marriages to un-stabilize over time. Not taking a risk on a bad payoff does not mean you are a pvssy, it means you are smart lol.

 

[Jake_Gyllenhaal69]

Because guys are doing it for the wrong reasons. You shouldn’t be in the gym getting ripped and in great aerobic shape to get a hotter chick. You should do it for your own health. You shouldn’t be striving for that promotion or better job to get a hotter chick. You should do it because it’s your own accomplishment and reflects your own hard work through prestige and (usually) increased finances.

Guys on this site have a goal of hotter women. Self-improvement is not about that goal though. Women will come and go in life. They tend to have higher SMV if you have your sh1t together, but that shouldn’t be why you have your sh1t together.

But this ignores reality though. What's wrong with just owning up to the fact that men desire to achieve great things to get women or a woman?

 

[AttackFormation]

But this ignores reality though. What's wrong with just owning up to the fact that men desire to achieve great things to get women or a woman?

The excessive approval seeking of "achieving great things" to "get her" turns her off. She knows she's no more than human, but you saying that dont seem to, which makes her feel like she cant connect with you. See master-slave dialectic. Women want to be treated like royalty by men who are Useful to them, but not by men who are Attractive to them.

 

[Guy69JackBlue]

But this ignores reality though. What's wrong with just owning up to the fact that men desire to achieve great things to get women or a woman?

It also ignores the reality that having large muscles has nothing to do with being in good health.

 

[Jake_Gyllenhaal69]

The excessive approval seeking of "achieving great things" to "get her" turns her off.

anything can turn a woman off if done in a pvssy submissive manner. It's okay to admit that you are bettering yourself physically & financially in order to attract hotter women or marry a higher quality woman down the line. TBH, I'm switching jobs because I don't want my GF to make more than me when she becomes a *****. Am I kissing her feet and ass....No

 

[Jake_Gyllenhaal69]

It also ignores the reality that having large muscles has nothing to do with being in good health.

Ugh large muscles is hopefully a phase. I used to be pretty bulky, but I prefer the leaner smaller look because it's more maintainable and I look better. Notice these body builders on youtube don't have any kids. I wonder why???

 

[AttackFormation]

anything can turn a woman off if done in a pvssy submissive manner. It's okay to admit that you are bettering yourself physically & financially in order to attract hotter women or marry a higher quality woman down the line. TBH, I'm switching jobs because I don't want my GF to make more than me when she becomes a *****. Am I kissing her feet and ass....No

Sure, that just wasnt how you formulated it first.

 

[Barrister]

Fact is, at least part of the benefit of those things is and always will be the woman aspect. Less people should bother now that the yield is tenuous at best.

I agree with your first sentence; disagree with your second. That was the point of what I was saying. Women should not be the impetus behind you achieving the best version of yourself.

 

[Guy69JackBlue]

anything can turn a woman off if done in a pvssy submissive manner. It's okay to admit that you are bettering yourself physically & financially in order to attract hotter women or marry a higher quality woman down the line. TBH, I'm switching jobs because I don't want my GF to make more than me when she becomes a *****. Am I kissing her feet and ass....No

Tell us. Just don't tell THEM

 

[Barrister]

But this ignores reality though. What's wrong with just owning up to the fact that men desire to achieve great things to get women or a woman?

Not at all. I have no doubt there are men out there who want to achieve "great" things to get women. You can look around on this site and see examples of just that. But to say what I said ignores reality couldn't be further from the truth. You will probably find your own take is going to dramatically shift pretty extensively in the next decade.

 

[Lookatu]

Not taking a risk on a bad payoff does not mean you are a pvssy, it means you are smart lol.

Not identifying when you should or shouldn't jump based on erroneous fears is not what's smart. Foolish at best...

Guys being on these forums with a wealth of info it offers has absolutely no excuse not to play it smart and make the jump if they see a good opportunity. They are far more equipped to do so than the clueless guy that hasn't opened his eyes and haven't been on these types of forums and that don't know anything about women.

I don't want to hear excuses from pvssified male's insecurities. That's a problem they have to work out first themselves.

 

[Hamurabimbi]

What happened?

What actually do you mean?

 

[taiyuu_otoko]

Social skills, conversational skills, and body language tweaks will likely get more results than going to the gym for the average guy.

Social skills work will get you much further than any kind of looksmax.

If dudes spent as much talk practicing small talk with any lady they could as they did in the gym, the improvements would be much better.

But going to the gym is not nearly as emotionally difficult as practicing game on strangers.

Any dude with a halfway decent body but strong social skills will blow away any jacked dude with mid to low level social skills.

 

[Kotaix]

the red pill has never become the black pill, they are different things

One a man takes the red pill, he can either accept that this is the way things are and choose to improve himself despite the challenges of modern life, or he can sit on his ass and b!tch all day long about how unfair life is.

The black pill is a vicious circle. Men who b!tch about life are repulsive to women, and they continue to be unsuccessful with them for as long as they continue to think that way. The black pill is for losers.

 

[Barrister]

Best is subjective. If people liked gym for gym and money for money, we wouldn't be giving advice here or a dating site to pursue that. They would already be pursuing it on their own initiative. We give that advice here because it is related to dating success. If it doesn't reap success, then the advice no longer makes sense. The advice then would be "excel at what you like to do" rather than specifically gym and money oriented career.

I don't mean to talk past you because I'm certain we ultimately agree. I agree that it was always stupid to chase money or gains just to impress women. Marginally, though, it's a factor. I just want to make this point about what we advise.

I understand that the advice to be best the version of yourself is given on this site as a vehicle for getting more women. I also appreciate the fact that the "best" version of oneself is completely subjective. However, going to the gym has tremendous benefits for you completely independent of women. Having money to spend has tremendous benefits to you independent of women - it allows you to live a much richer life than going paycheck to paycheck.

Now, we can agree that whether or not you consider that the "best" version of yourself is subjective. I know I certainly wouldn't consider a fatter, out of shape, broke version of myself better or the "best" version of myself vis-a-vis being in good shape and having money. Nor do I think most anyone would. But maybe there are some people out there that do think that. Probably some of the black pillers on this very site share that sentiment.

And I think ultimately we do agree on what we are talking about. I just enjoy a good discussion.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

Because guys are doing it for the wrong reasons. You shouldn’t be in the gym getting ripped and in great aerobic shape to get a hotter chick. You should do it for your own health. You shouldn’t be striving for that promotion or better job to get a hotter chick. You should do it because it’s your own accomplishment and reflects your own hard work through prestige and (usually) increased finances.

Guys on this site have a goal of hotter women. Self-improvement is not about that goal though. Women will come and go in life. They tend to have higher SMV if you have your sh1t together, but that shouldn’t be why you have your sh1t together.

The problem is the actions they take are not backed by the mindset of people who do it for the right reasons naturally because that is who they are. Until the mindset matches the actions they are simply incomplete in their transformation and will never fully become that which they think they are by their actions.