I built it, they didn't come

[allergictobs]

Hi guys,

I've just recently discovered this site, but many of the concepts have been familiar to me for years, decades even. I'm not really about learning game, but I read the "book of Pook", and many of the concepts in that series of posts have been second nature to me for my whole life.

I thought I'd collect my thoughts and write about my situation to clear my mind a bit. Any comments are of course welcome.

Here's a short version of the long story that follows:
- 36 years old, life in good order
- Physically fit, at peak fitness
- High status profession, financially well of
- Extreme lifestyle, very much a lone wolf type of guy
- Always been red-pilled, never put any woman on a pedestal
- Girls actually chased me in my early 20s, I was too busy chasing my own dreams
- Now, over a decade later - achieved most of my goals, but no sex life, zero women in social circle
- Have stopped trying to date women, puzzled by today's dating scene - looking for solutions



Long story (I'll break this up into smaller parts):


Let me start with the good things

My life is, in many ways, better than what I had expected it could be when growing up. I come from a lower middle class family from a poor country in Europe. At 36, I'm healthy, in the best shape of my life. I go to gym 4-5x a week and have the same, if not better, physique that I had in my early 20s (I have more muscle mass now than back then, body fat is consistently 10-15%).

I've climbed the corporate ladder to reach a comfortable position with a lot of freedom and great coworkers. It's a high status profession and the pay is very good, too. The only thing I don't like about it is commuting, but what can you do.

On top of my day job, a couple of years ago I started a side business. It has recently started paying quite well, and with three sources of income (career job, side business, and investments), I'm doing quite well financially.

I've achieved many of the things I've set as goals. I played competitive sports when I was younger. I traveled the world in my early 20s. I got the "dream career" in the corporate world. I don't have many items on my checklist anymore. These days, I'm mainly interested in health, and growing my side business and seeing if it can really take off in the coming years.

I'm single, and have been for years. Never married, only had one long-term relationship in my life. I've always been the type of guy who did his own thing, did not follow others' advice. And I really mean that. I have had to fight against the herd quite a few times regarding life choices. I have had to leave behind old friends several times in life and find new ones who are more like-minded.



Lifestyle, personality, and problems

My lifestyle has always been quite extreme. I rarely stop to "have fun" in the sense that most people talk about having fun. I don't party, I don't drink, I don't relax the same way that most people do. This is VERY important, something that cannot be changed: To me, having fun is progressing, competing and challenging oneself. Yes, I did go to parties and had the typical college experience when I was young, but I never liked it much, I just wanted to experience it to understand what it's all about.

The same goes with relationships. I really, really dislike hanging out in a pointless way. I just cannot do it - there has to be a purpose, such as playing a sport, having a meaningful conversation, or learning something new. But any type of "hey you wanna come over, have a few beers and watch the game" I've almost always responded with "no thanks". I cannot change this part in myself, I have tried hard when I was younger.

My days are mainly comprised of these activities:
- Workdays at the office (about 9 hours including commuting)
- Workouts and recovering (0-2 hours per day)
- Developing/running side business (0-4 hours per day)
- Other sports (golf, skiing, tennis, etc.) (mainly on weekends/vacations)
- Reading/learning new things (2-4 hours per day)
- Sleeping (8 hours per day)

I like all this about my life. I have plenty of stuff to do. I'm never bored. I've never really been bored.

But here's what I'm missing big time: sex, intimacy, even a relationship. No, I'm not looking for love or companionship (I don't mind those things, but I'm not actively seeking them), but a regular sex life.

My personality seems to require a traditional type of woman - one who is after a guy like myself. I have experienced it once, in my early 20s. I met a girl who was very feminine. She admired my dedication and just wanted to be in my boat. I was the captain, she was the passenger. She did not require any "entertainment" like going out or spending time doing pointless stuff. I just ****ed her silly, and the rest of the time I carried on with my own stuff. We had the funny conversations and stuff that couples do, even traveled together, but it was all on my terms. Maybe she secretly wanted something more, but she seemed very content with what she got. Eventually after a few years, I got too focused on my own things and broke up with her.

I need a relationship to be of the type where she is very feminine and submissive. I simply would not enter any other type of relationship. Sometimes I wonder if the ideal "relationship" for me would be with a hooker or an escort, since I'm mainly after sex. But I am interested in some kind of stability, so I want to be exclusive with just one person. I just need to be the dominant person in the relationship.

I'm quite rebellious by nature, and have a hard time playing a certain role or doing favors for other people. I'm very straightforward with everything and don't really care about other people's feelings. Basically, I'm the guy in the room who calls bull**** first. As for dating, I'm not able to jump through hoops to date a woman. I absolutely hate trying to impress other people, including women, because that puts you in an inferior position, like you need to prove something. In my view, she either likes you the way you are, and if not, it's her loss (blunt, I know).

My social circle consists of only men, most of whom have a somewhat similar personality to mine. Almost all of them are married with kids though, so I'm an odd person in that sense. I have zero female friends and acquaintances outside work. I've never had any female friends, in fact, no woman has ever wanted to be my friend and vice versa (I don't know if this is a good or a bad thing).

So as you can understand from the above, my situation is probably not very typical. I realize I'm a pretty extreme person, and I've tried changing and playing along when I was younger, but by this age, my personality is very much what it is.

 

[allergictobs]

Solutions? Any point in trying?

Being somewhat introverted, I turned to online dating in my late 20s and early 30s. The whole experience was, as you can probably guess, quite abysmal. I managed to get some dates, but almost all of them were disappointments (women with fake/old photos etc.). Even the best woman I met through online dating was far worse compared to girls I dated in my early 20s.

Don't get me wrong, I very much dislike our current dating culture, but I do think that there are some great women out there. The problem is that getting to know them is somehow harder than before. Everyone seems to be online these days, yet it is an extremely difficult market to navigate. The trash seems to float to the top, and the good ones are swimming deep (and most often find themselves a partner offline through friends).

This whole situation has got me very puzzled about life. I tend to think I'm a pretty good catch. Women used to approach me quite often when I was younger (early 2000s). I never thought dating life would become the biggest problem in my life. In my view, I built a successful life in many respects, yet "they didn't come". To be clear, I'm not looking for Ms. Perfect. I'm not looking for a wife or a soulmate, all I'm after at this point is regular sex with a woman who is reasonably attractive.

Here's something I don't understand:

I currently live in central Europe, where prostitution is legal. You can get a stunning woman to be with you for a couple of hours. The top ones are quite expensive, but you don't have to go out on dates, you don't need to entertain, and you know beforehand what you are going to get.

At the same time, it seems extremely difficult and tiresome to even get a date with average women these days. It doesn't make any sense - I have easy access to some gorgeous women via money, yet at the same time, the women using dating apps or the women at the workplace are so entitled that they would require a gigantic effort to entertain them before they would even go out with you. So why play their stupid game? The benefits don't outweigh the costs.

Why is there very little to no middle ground between the two extremes? Almost anyone can pay an escort in a country where it is legal. The average woman cannot compete with escorts in the looks department, so it would seem to follow that they need to offer something else that is better. Yet, it seems to be completely backwards.


What it boils down to

Over the past decade, I've put a lot of effort into developing myself. As you can probably gather from the first part of this post, I've achieved quite a lot. I really don't like bragging, but I'm easily in the top 5% of men in many aspects in life (physical fitness, financial situation, social status). Yet, when I made dating profiles online, 99% of women swipe left and didn't reply to messages. They never meet me or someone else like me, yet they complain all the time that they can't find quality men. It's absurdly funny.

To me, the essence of the problem seems to be this: Most women don't know what they want and their mating strategy is to just hang around until some guy picks them up. This used to work in the past, but online dating/social media messes this up because it puts women in a perpetual state of search due to the abundance of men. Crucially, it removes much of the traditional search for them, and many women don't want to be approached in the real world anymore. They don't even dress up in the real world, only for their social media pictures.

For example, for athletic men and women, the gym would in normal circumstances be an ideal place to meet. Yet, because of politics and online dating, all women are now actively avoiding contact in the gym, effectively stating that "if you want me, visit my instagram page and go to the end of the line with the other guys". It is like a drug for women, because it gives them an enormous amount of power to control men. Most women happily move their entire dating life online, not understanding that it will, for the most part, also stay online.

So yeah, I definitely do not want to play that game and in my opinion, no guy with self-respect should want to play that game. The problem is, it has become the only game in town with very few exceptions. So what do you do? Especially if you are a high value man? I can come up with two effective solutions: high-class escorts and some kind of exclusive match-making service. Is the situation really this bad? At my age, what other options are there?

--

With age, I've become increasingly straightforward with women. I call their bs all the time at workplace. I've now reached a point where if I were to go out with a nice girl, I might just say "Look, I'm not going to go through the traditional dating ritual. I like you and want to take you to my place and ****. Just say no if you don't want to do that, and we save a lot of time." Yeah...that's not going to go well, and since that's about the most effort I'm able to put into dating games at this age, I've figured I should just give up?

I'd like to know if you guys have been in a similar situation and would like to hear any advice that you may have. I'm also interested in hearing honest thoughts about my life in general. Since these are just my own thoughts, it is possible that I have overlooked some crucial aspects. However, more than anything, I believe my problems are a manifestation of our current times and culture. Let me know what you think.

 

[lostintime]

THe problem you're facing is you "built it" according to what society tells you SHOULD attract females.

Unfortunately, all that stuff you have (physique, good paying job, etc.) is irrelevant when it comes to arousal. The stuff you have attracts women, but unless your arousing to them, you'll continue to beat your head against a wall. What you need to do is start developing an organic dominance in your conversations w/ females. You need to learn how to use your body language to communicate to women non-verbally that you're high value and have your pick of the litter w/ females.

Why do you think there are extremely hot women who are caught up on dudes who by all external appearances don't have much to offer? It's because these guys are actual alphas. It's in how they speak to women, how they look at them, how they communicate, etc.

That's the stuff you need to focus on. There are a ton of rich, good looking dudes who have ZERO success with females. Other than of course being used for cash, gifts and emotional tampons.

 

[allergictobs]

Unfortunately, all that stuff you have (physique, good paying job, etc.) is irrelevant when it comes to arousal. The stuff you have attracts women, but unless your arousing to them, you'll continue to beat your head against a wall.

I think you are right about this in general, but it is not the source of my problems. Like I mentioned, my early 20s was actually a nice time regarding women and sex life. It all changed later in life, and I attribute it mostly to barely meeting any women these days.

That's the simple answer, but the more complex one is what to do about it. Hopefully I was able to make it clear, but with age, I've very much lost motivation to play the whole dating game. I don't know if there is a way to get the motivation back.

 

[lostintime]

but with age, I've very much lost motivation to play the whole dating game.

I feel you on that. I am experiencing the same thing.

 

[Mike32ct]

OP, how is your hair?

 

[allergictobs]

OP, how is your hair?

Been shaving it for years (started going bald in my late 20s). It doesn't bother me one bit though, I actually prefer being bald, makes me look more rugged/masculine.

 

[allergictobs]

1. You're boring.

Guilty. I cannot entertain women, and I don't really want to. I rely on physical appearance and dominant behavior.

 

[AttackFormation]

Been shaving it for years (started going bald in my late 20s). It doesn't bother me one bit though, I actually prefer being bald, makes me look more rugged/masculine.

How tall are you?

Looking at just your face, would you say that you could have been a male model?

 

[allergictobs]

How tall are you?

Looking at just your face, would you say that you could have been a male model?

I'm 5'9, which I recognize as a drawback, especially online. Same with the shaved/bald head. Again, neither bothers me one bit in real life. I've had women lust after me for my physical appearance, and that's all that counts for me.

I've gotten compliments from random women throughout my life ("you are really cute"), so I assume I'm not ugly. One ex said I could be a male model, but she was probably referring to my body/physique. Looking at just my face, I'm definitely not a 10, but probably not below 8-9 either.

 

[CAPSLOCK BANDIT]

I'm 5'9, which I recognize as a drawback, especially online. Same with the shaved/bald head. Again, neither bothers me one bit in real life. I've had women lust after me for my physical appearance, and that's all that counts for me.

I've gotten compliments from random women throughout my life ("you are really cute"), so I assume I'm not ugly. One ex said I could be a male model, but she was probably referring to my body/physique. Looking at just my face, I'm definitely not a 10, but probably not below 8-9 either.

You literally do this and you will be swimming in poon: Looking For A Travel Partner.

Thats it. Nothing else. Also, don't just be taking broads out traveling without bedding them first, that wall needs to be broken pre-travel or you back out.

 

[behimo]

most people are boring, women or men.
a man can be entertained easily i.e. half naked woman dancing around a pole.
a woman can not, at least from the opposite sex.
you have to evoke feeling in her, whatever it may be.
if you can't move her feelings, then there's no action.

 

[fastlife]

First, s/o @lostintime for hitting on something important. When it comes to sex, girls don't care what you do for a living, what kind of car you drive, how much money you make, what you've accomplished, they don't even care whether you're a good or bad person...they care about how you make them feel.

So you know you're high value, but other people aren't going to be able to magically know that when they meet you, and it's not like you can convince them logically (or else we'd all bring copies of our resume to the bar lol). People believe 1.) What they see and 2.) What they feel on an instinctual level. This is true for everybody socially, but especially women. So going up to a girl and being like, "I'm a very busy man. I just want to fvck you," is going to bomb ten times out of ten. She has no way of knowing your value!!! Instead you have to be able to efficiently demonstrate that value.

Game is a set of behaviors that can be practiced and learned, just like growing a business or playing a sport. It's not some magical, intrinsic formula that you either have or don't. It's just the ability to express yourself socially, demonstrate value, and create an emotional impact as efficiently as possible. It's probably a set of behaviors that you'd be able to learn and understand fairly quickly, since you seem to have a high sense of self-worth and a solid work ethic, but there will be a cost-benefit side to things, and you might decide it's more in your interests to just bang escorts--no judgement here, though there's something to be said for having girls that are actually into you because of who you are instead of what you offer them.

Here's where you're going to run into problems based on what you've told us about your personality:

1. Putting yourself in target rich environments. No, your office doesn't count lol. You don't have to go to bars and clubs (though these are where you're most likely to encounter groups of attractive women. But it might mean taking your laptop to a coffee shop or lounge to work on your side business and approaching girls there who catch your eye, or it might mean finding a trendier gym or doing your shopping in places where there's more likely to be attractive women. But you will have to be proactive.
2. Dealing with rejection from people who, logically, have less value than you. You're already experiencing some of this online (terrible medium for dating btw these days), but it'll be much more visceral when it's in your face and she's looking you in the eyes. Just remember that it's impossible for someone to reduce your value as a man and there's no way anyone can accurately assess your value in the first however long you've known her. She's not rejecting you, she's rejecting your approach...and your approaches will probably suck if this isn't something you've practiced a lot.
3. Being able to laugh. How often do you laugh, bro? How often do you take time to sit back and appreciate the world around you? Being successful and making a lot of money is great, but it's only a small fraction of the human experience. You also have to be able to let go, to celebrate victories, to take drives on back roads listening to songs you like. You won't be able to work forever and you can't take any of that stuff with you.
4. Being able to express yourself sexually. When's the last time you made a joke about sexual innuendo? How comfortable are you with talking about sex or telling girls what you like and don't like? The more comfortably you can talk about sex, the easier it is to make it happen.
5. Being nonjudgmental. Everyone is living their lives according to different value systems, and guess what? No one is 100% right. There are a million different ways to live fulfilling lives and you have to be able to drop all the external stuff to find commonalities. It's like guys here knocking on instamodels or bar stars, but it's like...you still would fvck them if you had the chance, so...
6. Disqualifying yourself as a boyfriend/provider. You don't have to spend hours entertaining girls before you sleep with them, but you'll have to jump through all sorts of hoops if she perceives you as a potential boyfriend or a provider. It's up to you to actively disqualify yourself, including downplaying your accomplishments, in order to make sleeping with you a no-lose scenario.

This won't be something that you can fix overnight and you might decide that the time investment isn't worth it for you. That's a personal judgement call. But the resources are out there, other people have done it before you, and you wouldn't have written this post if deep down this wasn't a problem you wanted to solve.

 

[allergictobs]

most people are boring, women or men.
a man can be entertained easily i.e. half naked woman dancing around a pole.
a woman can not, at least from the opposite sex.
you have to evoke feeling in her, whatever it may be.
if you can't move her feelings, then there's no action.

I completely agree. But I first need to get to actually meeting women. This has changed completely from my younger years. At 36, the only potential women I interact with are at work and at the gym. I view this as a problem of lifestyle, and certainly not unique to myself, but probably quite common in all men nearing their 40s.

Just to clarify, over the past few years, I can count with one hand's fingers the times when I've actually interacted with a woman who might have been at least a little bit interested in me (and online doesn't count). The opportunities are just abysmal.

 

[allergictobs]

Game is a set of behaviors that can be practiced and learned, just like growing a business or playing a sport. It's not some magical, intrinsic formula that you either have or don't. It's just the ability to express yourself socially, demonstrate value, and create an emotional impact as efficiently as possible. It's probably a set of behaviors that you'd be able to learn and understand fairly quickly, since you seem to have a high sense of self-worth and a solid work ethic, but there will be a cost-benefit side to things, and you might decide it's more in your interests to just bang escorts--no judgement here, though there's something to be said for having girls that are actually into you because of who you are instead of what you offer them.

Thanks for the thoughtful post (I only quoted a part of it to save space).

Your post contains something that I've been thinking about a lot, and I want to expand that thought here. It is not a finished process, and I don't know yet which path I'm going to take. But I feel like I'm at a junction.

You mentioned that I might just decide to bang escorts, but that having a girl actually want you, to adore you, is a different thing. Yes, I agree and having experienced both, I can tell that there is a clear difference.

However, like you said, it becomes a cost-benefit analysis at some level, and I don't know if it's worth it anymore. I really don't.

As you can maybe see from my first post, for years now, I've been getting tired of trying to meet women, most of whom are very average and I'm not even that into them. For example, I keep myself physically very fit, yet all the women I've managed to get dates with in recent years are flat out neglecting their own bodies (these were all through online dating, since I haven't had many other venues for meeting women in recent years). I cannot date a woman like that and be happy.

If one could say for certain that by improving my game I would meet and bed an attractive, high-quality woman, then yes, I would probably put more effort into it. But at this age, I'm increasingly evaluating the costs and benefits, the time and effort spent. I view all single women over 30 as somehow ****ed up in the head (and I've been proven right almost always in this matter). And yes, I would prefer to go for women in their 20s, but this is again a question of lifestyle and social circle - very little chance of me interacting with women in their early 20s in a favorable setting.

Reality has hit hard. Maybe, probably, I'm much better off focusing solely on my own life, hobbies and business, and accepting that at this point, the best I can do is exchange resources for sex. Many men, especially older, do it in one form or the other. It's not an unhappy life, and it certainly lets me focus all time and energy on things that I am motivated by.

 

[Who Dares Win]

You are in your late 30s, 5'9 and bald, did I get it correctly?

If thats the case, thats enough for most western women to avoid you especially if you aim at pre wall ones (which you should).

My best suggestion is to accept a casual dating life style or if you are interested in growing a family seek women abroad better yet if you move yourself according to how bad you want it.

If you wanted a decent looking girl being yours and being able and willing to bond to you, you should have done 10 years ago when you were in your late 20s, not trying to be a d1ck but the more d1cks a girl gets and the less she will be able and willing to bond with a man...even brad pitt and ewan mc gregor are divorcing, enough said.

Btw where exactly in central europe are you? is it germany or czech republic?

 

[lostintime]

This is kind of depressing lol

Reminds me of Saving private Ryan when the troops were trying to talk Tom Hanks out of opening fire on a machine gun nest. "Don[t have a good feeling about this one captain".

"Well, when's the last time you felt good about anything?"

 

[AttackFormation]

It isn't much solace but I do try to just reinforce to myself that the only thing that's really going to help my prospects is to move. if I'm not willing to move then I just kind of have to accept the consequences of that. This can make you feel kind of stuck but at least you take back control of the situation.

Where would you move that'd make a big difference?

 

[CAPSLOCK BANDIT]

Thanks for the thoughtful post (I only quoted a part of it to save space).

Your post contains something that I've been thinking about a lot, and I want to expand that thought here. It is not a finished process, and I don't know yet which path I'm going to take. But I feel like I'm at a junction.

You mentioned that I might just decide to bang escorts, but that having a girl actually want you, to adore you, is a different thing. Yes, I agree and having experienced both, I can tell that there is a clear difference.

However, like you said, it becomes a cost-benefit analysis at some level, and I don't know if it's worth it anymore. I really don't.

As you can maybe see from my first post, for years now, I've been getting tired of trying to meet women, most of whom are very average and I'm not even that into them. For example, I keep myself physically very fit, yet all the women I've managed to get dates with in recent years are flat out neglecting their own bodies (these were all through online dating, since I haven't had many other venues for meeting women in recent years). I cannot date a woman like that and be happy.

If one could say for certain that by improving my game I would meet and bed an attractive, high-quality woman, then yes, I would probably put more effort into it. But at this age, I'm increasingly evaluating the costs and benefits, the time and effort spent. I view all single women over 30 as somehow ****ed up in the head (and I've been proven right almost always in this matter). And yes, I would prefer to go for women in their 20s, but this is again a question of lifestyle and social circle - very little chance of me interacting with women in their early 20s in a favorable setting.

Reality has hit hard. Maybe, probably, I'm much better off focusing solely on my own life, hobbies and business, and accepting that at this point, the best I can do is exchange resources for sex. Many men, especially older, do it in one form or the other. It's not an unhappy life, and it certainly lets me focus all time and energy on things that I am motivated by.

Desperate times, call for desperate measures. Let Patrice breathe the spirit of life back into your broken soul, one episode at a time.. Forget all the hatred, let your frustrations fall into hilarity.

 

[fastlife]

And yes, I would prefer to go for women in their 20s, but this is again a question of lifestyle and social circle - very little chance of me interacting with women in their early 20s in a favorable setting.

What can you do to stack the odds in your favor? People tend to date within their immediate social environment--and actually meeting someone is a prerequisite for dating in general. Age isn't as big of a factor as proximity--plenty of girls like older guys, some don't, it's whatever--but if you're never meeting them then that doesn't really matter anyway. Very few social circles where a 36 y/o is going to meet girls in their early 20s, so you'll have to be proactive and you'll have to ditch your comfort zone.

When I was in my early 20s, I used to hangout with a group of guys in their mid-30s to late-40s who were regulars at a bar I worked at. Mostly normal divorced (or still married lol) guys, but they had enough social value in that environment where they were running through the 18-22 y/o girls who worked there and meeting their friends and doing pretty well for themselves. You could try taking yoga classes or acting courses or dance classes--anything that would give you proximity to girls in the age range you're looking for. Then it's just a matter of being social, getting to know people, and paying attention to the girls who show interest (if you're super jacked, it'll give you some easy openers).

Personally, I prefer cold approach, which, while not the most efficient way to meet girls, gives you the most flexibility of choice. But it is something that takes time and practice to get comfortable with, and it'll be easier to learn if you're somewhere with a lot of access to hot girls. If you live close to a good downtown district, that could be in coffee shops or even on the street. If there's a college close by, any of the stores, cafes, and restaurants by there will be good. And I know you're not a huge fan of the environment, but for most guys, bars and nightclubs will give you the best opportunity to practice. It's definitely a numbers game, especially starting out, but once you're comfortable talking to girls and leading those interactions., it's not something that takes a huge time investment to keep up. If you give yourself enough opportunities, you'll do fine for yourself. Remember, you're in EE where American guys literally pay to go to try to meet quality women lol.