A little perspective needed

[flowtheory]

That's for sh!t sure. Flow control, a bit disappointed in you. I would had thought you'd already be on her like bears sh!tting in the woods. You better jump on this b!tch, and like tomorrow.

I know. I’ve learned a wealth of knowledge here and this time I got a bit side tracked.
The thing is I have still being quite touchy and taking lead. I just haven’t made a move because of her letting me know that she’s fairly fresh out of a relationship. So I didn’t want to push it when she’s maybe not ready.

on point 100% = you friendzoned yourself
she literally begged you not to JBF, asked you 2x (at least) and you said "we are just friends"

I don’t know man. It seemed like she was making sure were weren’t dating and just wanted to be friends. I suppose next time I will simply just have to go in for it.

This is pretty lame. You dont waste valuable time playing tiddlywinks with women.

There are no mixed signals. Only uninterested women or guys who will not make a move to find out.

i would say there are mixed signals though. Because on one hand she’s saying ‘I don’t want a relationship because I’m still healing from my ex, etc” and on the other hand she’s always available to hangout and also making plans? Then asks straight up “we’re not dating right?” I forgot she had actually lead the conversation I recently wrote up with this.

 

[The Diver]

Her : “I have to put it out there, and this is just friendship right? Like you’re not expecting sex?”
Me: “haha what?! Expecting sex. What are you talking about?”

This was your cross road, and you should have go for the kill with:
Yes, I'm actually do, I'm a man you know, and can't do relationship without intimacy,.

This answer would have set the motion from here on, and you'll know where you are standing with her.

Man should never be apologetic for being a Man, with healthy sexual desire for woman.

(I actually had this kind of convo with one of my plate, and this was exactly my answer to her,,, the rest is history)

 

[flowtheory]

This was your cross road, and you should have go for the kill with:
Yes, I'm actually do, I'm a man you know, and can't do relationship without intimacy,.

This answer would have set the motion from here on, and you'll know where you are standing with her.

Man should never be apologetic for being a Man, with healthy sexual desire for woman.

(I actually had this kind of convo with one of my plate, and this was exactly my answer to her,,, the rest is history)

Right. It was more so the wording that made me not lean in to it. “You’re not expecting sex right?”
If she would have asked if I was interested or broached the topic on a more mindful level, like ‘do you like me more than a friend?’ I would have divulged, totally. But that word... expect made it feel cheap or that I was having major alterior motives and I wasn’t being real the whole time, when I have been; it’s just I slowly developed feelings while appreciating the connection.

But I can’t turn back the hands of time and do it different. So Maybe next time I see her I just correct my mistake verbally, then go in for the kiss. Because I feel like a fraud having told her I just wanted to be friends; it was almost a weird defence

 

[ohrein]

If she was wanting a bit more, wouldn’t she have not eluded to saying she was just after friendship during the talk, or steer it in that direction.
And her also telling me she’s fairly fresh out of a relationship and stuff.

One of the things that got me initially, was that after our first hangout when I dropped her off.. this was our conversation:
Her: “okay, so how does this work now?”
Me: “haha how does what work?”
Her: “ugh! Don’t laugh at me haha I’m new to this whole tinder thing! Do we like hangout again or I message you, whaat?”
Me: “well if you want to hangout again, we will do that. It’s simple! Hah”
Her “okay”
Me: “message me your number and we will get off tinder; we’re too good for it anyways”
Her “hahah! sure okay I will do that. But I’m not looking for a relationship, just friends to do things with”
Me: “sure.”

Then we hugged and she left my car. So from that point forward I was like “well I didn’t even really think this was a date, and I am just wanting to build my social circle, but we defiantly did have a connection”
And to which she actually forgot her phone in my car. So I got a quarter the way home only to hear it ringing, so I turned around and dropped it off again and she said she was embarrassed. But I was chill about it. And just about every time we’ve hung out she’s saying she has had wonderful times. New friends don’t do this do they?
I’m simply getting mixed signals with her telling me about her past and wanting to find friends but also receiving wink texts and kiss faces and huge thank you’s Via text

There's only one way for you to find out where you stand.

 

[R.U.G.]

Bro, she even set it up for you. Not sure if this is salvageable to be quite honest. When she said:
Her : “I have to put it out there, and this is just friendship right? Like you’re not expecting sex?”

and you came back with:

Me: “haha what?! Expecting sex. What are you talking about?”

Man.... You should had said, I just like to go with the flow and see where life takes us. Let's let fate decide what happens and where. It's mysterous and puzzling at the same time. Come on, she was basically saying, I'm DTF if you are. You said in lamens terms, nah, I just want to be besties with you...

MEN ARE NOT FRIENDS WITH WOMEN! ESPECIALLY ATTRACTIVE ONES.... Unless you are gaming for a class one orbiter.

Come on bro.. You had to of known she was giving you DIRECT HINTS.

 

[MrWood]

"no, im not expecting sex lol... what the hell, but you are cute as fvck.... whats your excuse?"
and go for the kiss

too late now I think... next time bro

 

[R.U.G.]

Can you imagine going back now.. Hey, about that sex offer??? Is it still on the table? Geez. Flow Control, not your best work. No worries, we all have hits and misses. You'll get the next one... Or, disappear from this one for a minute and see if that builds attraction. BUT. See her one more time, LOTS OF KENO. Light touches up her arms, neck, small of her back. Be suttle, but get it done. Then, silence for a few days to build up more tension. It might work, but it's a hail mary pass bro.

 

[The Diver]

“You’re not expecting sex right?”

Yes the word " Expecting sex " is kind of a tricky, but you easily could overcome it by saying something like " I'm not Expecting Sex" But I'm a man you know,,,,(and the rest), That way you express what you REALLY want ,,,

So Maybe next time I see her I just correct my mistake,,, Because I feel like a fraud having told her I just wanted to be friends;

Yea , you pritty much traped yourself with the " I just wanted to be friends".

 

[flowtheory]

Bro, she even set it up for you. Not sure if this is salvageable to be quite honest. When she said:
Her : “I have to put it out there, and this is just friendship right? Like you’re not expecting sex?”

and you came back with:

Me: “haha what?! Expecting sex. What are you talking about?”

Man.... You should had said, I just like to go with the flow and see where life takes us. Let's let fate decide what happens and where. It's mysterous and puzzling at the same time. Come on, she was basically saying, I'm DTF if you are. You said in lamens terms, nah, I just want to be besties with you...

MEN ARE NOT FRIENDS WITH WOMEN! ESPECIALLY ATTRACTIVE ONES.... Unless you are gaming for a class one orbiter.

Come on bro.. You had to of known she was giving you DIRECT HINTS.

Yea I should have said I just like to go with the flow. Lol I know not my best work at all and I’m definitely better than what I laid out there.

I don’t know if it’s totally off though.. I mean there was still touching and stuff after the movie when we were sitting in the dark talking, listening to the rain. And it’s not like those feelings instantly dissintegrate if she was feeling them before even or during the time she was over. A decent amount has been built..

Yes the word " Expecting sex " is kind of a tricky, but you easily could overcome it by saying something like " I'm not Expecting Sex" But I'm a man you know,,,,(and the rest), That way you express what you REALLY want ,,,



Yea , you pritty much traped yourself with the " I just wanted to be friends".

well like marmalade said, there’s only one way to find out where things stand. And that’s taking the necessary action I should have already took.

I just really don’t understand the mixed signals.

Like a woman wouldn’t let a guy touch them a whole bunch if they didn’t want to be sexual with that guy, correct?

 

[flowtheory]

So solution:
1) Text her tomorrow and set up plans for Friday?
Or
2) Should I call her, have a bit of small talk then present plan idea?

And when I see her in person should I:
1) Keno and escalate then go in for the kiss (risk startling her though and giving massive mixed signals because of our convo last time)
or
2) be honest and transparent, telling her I misspoke last time and don’t want to be just friends and that I have developed real feelings for her; then see how she responds and go in for the kiss if it’s a positive response?

 

[marmel75]

I know. I’ve learned a wealth of knowledge here and this time I got a bit side tracked.
The thing is I have still being quite touchy and taking lead. I just haven’t made a move because of her letting me know that she’s fairly fresh out of a relationship. So I didn’t want to push it when she’s maybe not ready.


I don’t know man. It seemed like she was making sure were weren’t dating and just wanted to be friends. I suppose next time I will simply just have to go in for it.

i would say there are mixed signals though. Because on one hand she’s saying ‘I don’t want a relationship because I’m still healing from my ex, etc” and on the other hand she’s always available to hangout and also making plans? Then asks straight up “we’re not dating right?” I forgot she had actually lead the conversation I recently wrote up with this.

You never pay attention to words, always to actions. This is the basis for all interactions with women. This is the foundation. If you don't understand this you are simply building a house of cards with your interactions with women.

What she says does not matter. What she does matters.

 

[sazc]

@flowtheory 2 things.... If you want to sex her that is....

1) start to gently neg her about things. Don't hurt her, but be playfully sarcastic. Push pull in those emotions.

2) Gently start to tease her sexually. For example, she bends over to pick up a dropped item, MAKE the comment "I know we're just friends but you have a nice a$$". She wears a low cut blouse, "you, my friend, have a beautiful pair of titties" find those organic moments that get you thinking about sexing her and try to shoot a comment. Always back immediately off and re focus on whatever you were doing - after all, it was "only a joke", right? You're just friends...

Dont over do the negs and innuendo. The trick/goal is to not only reframe the situation sexually, but to get her a bit titttilated.

If her over arching response is to continue to remind you that you and she are just friends, you need to evaluate if you really want to spend (waste) time with her, or make yourself available to meet other women.

Give it another week or two andand the "I'd love to hang out but I have a date that night' line and see what happens. In fact, startv looking for women to date.

Good luck

 

[Dingo]

REJECTION IS BETTER THAN REGRET...

Stop Analyzing... Call her up... Set up a date... Escalate.... **** her...

Report back.

 

[flowtheory]

You never pay attention to words, always to actions. This is the basis for all interactions with women. This is the foundation. If you don't understand this you are simply building a house of cards with your interactions with women.

What she says does not matter. What she does matters.

True. I really see that now.
It sure can be tricky. I think what got me about this, is that it was never a formal ‘date’ or anything then at the end she said ‘I’m not looking for a relationship’
If she was interested though, why would she say that?

And then also the most recent time say that ‘we’re not dating right?’

I’d think a woman with super high Interest wouldn’t be saying these specific things.. that’s what confused me and made me back down

 

[flowtheory]

@flowtheory 2 things.... If you want to sex her that is....

1) start to gently neg her about things. Don't hurt her, but be playfully sarcastic. Push pull in those emotions.

2) Gently start to tease her sexually. For example, she bends over to pick up a dropped item, MAKE the comment "I know we're just friends but you have a nice a$$". She wears a low cut blouse, "you, my friend, have a beautiful pair of titties" find those organic moments that get you thinking about sexing her and try to shoot a comment. Always back immediately off and re focus on whatever you were doing - after all, it was "only a joke", right? You're just friends...

Dont over do the negs and innuendo. The trick/goal is to not only reframe the situation sexually, but to get her a bit titttilated.

If her over arching response is to continue to remind you that you and she are just friends, you need to evaluate if you really want to spend (waste) time with her, or make yourself available to meet other women.

Give it another week or two andand the "I'd love to hang out but I have a date that night' line and see what happens. In fact, startv looking for women to date.

Good luck

Well this kind of seems way out of character for me to say those things. I think I’ll just cal her up and plan the outting then at one point go in for the kiss. Maybe lead with “you know those things I said last time weren’t true” then attempt the kiss or attempt the kiss then tell her what I was saying wasn’t true and explain the situation a bit for clarity.

 

[Mazer]

What if tomorrow you found out she was being railed from behind by four different dudes every single week. How would you react? Would you still be like “oh this chick is so cool, I love hanging out with her, so much fun” Eventually you will want more. Sounds like the road to onieties to me.

 

[BeExcellent]

You aren't certain you want to screw things up yet by escalating and seeming like you are not as advertised. So you need to build the tension (you already are without realizing it.)

I think the best way to handle things is to tease her a bit about being friends here & there - and then knock it off. Her excuse for the emoji's and so forth is that she is Italian. She doesn't pull away from you when you touch her. She wants you in her space.

Quit spending one on one time with her for so many hours at a time. Leave her wanting more. Go out somewhere social. You guys are friends right? Flirt with other women in front of her. See how she responds. You don't need to be over the top kissing other women in front of her or anything vulgar, but watch what she does. Does she simply socialize as though nothing is up or does she get into closer proximity to you, does she touch you to remind you she is there, does she know where you are and is she watching you. If she says anything or teases you or mentions the flirting...you get right in her personal space and you say...well dear, you are a lovely woman. We are friends. No? (Or something more akin to your personality) and you SMILE at her and look her in the eyes. Get very close as though you will kiss her...breathe on her neck gently...and remain there for a moment. See if she goes to kiss you. Tease her. Build the sexual tension. Women love sexual tension, and if you build it correctly (something you are doing already without realizing it) she will think about you more and more and eventually things will happen organically.

Right now you are playing a game of chicken (and so is she.) Both of you are saying words that friends say but both of you have body language that belies attraction. I have male friends and have had for many years. My male friends don't act like you are acting; and I won't let my male friends into my personal space or to get touchy. I don't think you have blown it at all. Too much overt escalation and you come off as expecting sex or that really sex was all you wanted etc., it is not congruent...and I think you realize that and this is why you haven't outright escalated yet. You know you'll run her off if you do this. She requires a more subtle hand, and allow the tension to build and give her opportunities to express her attraction to you by what she does.

You can be assuring each other you are friends all you like as you are kissing and touching (and clothes are coming off)...and you both know the friends thing is a sham because you are becoming lovers. But its a slower play than many other interactions and so you are out of your comfort zone.

Lovers is a nice place to be. It implies a caring as well as a passion. Keep building the tension, keep her in proximity, keep touching her and so forth. You do not need to be canned in your approach.

And if she doesn't show you sexual interest (she will be covert and subtle) then you focus on other women and keep her socially in your orbit as she'll up your value via social proof.

This is more advanced than kino & escalate without apology. This is a build sexual tension slow play. Enjoy the process, build the attraction. Eventually it will boil over all by itself. Just be patient and be congruent (but allow the sham of the "friends" thing to become more apparent.) This allows her a little cover even as she knows that lovers is really more what you both want.

 

[flowtheory]

You aren't certain you want to screw things up yet by escalating and seeming like you are not as advertised. So you need to build the tension (you already are without realizing it.)

I think the best way to handle things is to tease her a bit about being friends here & there - and then knock it off. Her excuse for the emoji's and so forth is that she is Italian. She doesn't pull away from you when you touch her. She wants you in her space.

Quit spending one on one time with her for so many hours at a time. Leave her wanting more. Go out somewhere social. You guys are friends right? Flirt with other women in front of her. See how she responds. You don't need to be over the top kissing other women in front of her or anything vulgar, but watch what she does. Does she simply socialize as though nothing is up or does she get into closer proximity to you, does she touch you to remind you she is there, does she know where you are and is she watching you. If she says anything or teases you or mentions the flirting...you get right in her personal space and you say...well dear, you are a lovely woman. We are friends. No? (Or something more akin to your personality) and you SMILE at her and look her in the eyes. Get very close as though you will kiss her...breathe on her neck gently...and remain there for a moment. See if she goes to kiss you. Tease her. Build the sexual tension. Women love sexual tension, and if you build it correctly (something you are doing already without realizing it) she will think about you more and more and eventually things will happen organically.

Right now you are playing a game of chicken (and so is she.) Both of you are saying words that friends say but both of you have body language that belies attraction. I have male friends and have had for many years. My male friends don't act like you are acting; and I won't let my male friends into my personal space or to get touchy. I don't think you have blown it at all. Too much overt escalation and you come off as expecting sex or that really sex was all you wanted etc., it is not congruent...and I think you realize that and this is why you haven't outright escalated yet. You know you'll run her off if you do this. She requires a more subtle hand, and allow the tension to build and give her opportunities to express her attraction to you by what she does.

You can be assuring each other you are friends all you like as you are kissing and touching (and clothes are coming off)...and you both know the friends thing is a sham because you are becoming lovers. But its a slower play than many other interactions and so you are out of your comfort zone.

Lovers is a nice place to be. It implies a caring as well as a passion. Keep building the tension, keep her in proximity, keep touching her and so forth. You do not need to be canned in your approach.

And if she doesn't show you sexual interest (she will be covert and subtle) then you focus on other women and keep her socially in your orbit as she'll up your value via social proof.

This is more advanced than kino & escalate without apology. This is a build sexual tension slow play. Enjoy the process, build the attraction. Eventually it will boil over all by itself. Just be patient and be congruent (but allow the sham of the "friends" thing to become more apparent.) This allows her a little cover even as she knows that lovers is really more what you both want.

Hmm.. So just keep doing what I’m doing? And let it naturally escalate? Shouldn’t I make a solid move?

I feel like I should tell her what I said last time isn’t entirely true and maybe kiss her?

 

[marmel75]

Hmm.. So just keep doing what I’m doing? And let it naturally escalate? Shouldn’t I make a solid move?

I feel like I should tell her what I said last time isn’t entirely true and maybe kiss her?

STOP TALKING and just DO. There is no need to tell her anything just grab her and pin her against the wall and kiss her passionately. If she has any interest in you she will be dripping all over the floor through her panties.

You are acting like the evil villain who tells everyone their plans in Geico commercial...stop.

Be like Nike...Just Do It.

 

[Igetit!]

Well....another case of the friendzone. It happens dude....it happens.

I'm in the minority here....cause I pretty much disagree with EVERYTHING EVERYONE has said. That is,at least in regards to how you should respond to this girl next time you see her.

See,you are in the friendzone. That's not something you can just waltz in and out of at will.

You can do whatever you want....you're more than welcome to try the suggestions other members have given. But to me,once you're friendzoned,that's IT. Game over,time to move on to the next girl. Not saying to never see her again,but stop trying to date/making things sexual with her.

I noticed how in a few posts,you mentioned something about her "mixed messages". Dude...that CRACKED ME UP.

Why? Cause YOU WERE THE ONE giving "mixed messages". One moment you're talking about what a "terrific friend" she'd be.....then two seconds later you're going on about how you want to "grab her and kiss her".

You were the one giving out mixed messages. That's why she ON MORE THAN ONE OCCASION kept trying to clarify. She was trying to get a STRAIGHT FORWARD answer,to make sure you two were both on the same page. That's why she kept going,"We're just friends....right?" "We're not dating.....right?" She kept saying that cause OF YOUR "mixed messages".

1: I mean,you "say" you only want to be friends,then all of the sudden,you're holding her hand,pretending to look at her ring.

2:You talk to her about the great friendship connection you two have,then 5 minutes later,when she spilt some wine on a blanket,you placed your hand on top of hers to "test the waters".

3:Her roommate claimed that all of your hangouts were dates and that you'd be expecting sex. She comes to you asking you if you were expecting sex from her,then you go,"Oh no.....no...of course not. Where'd you get a silly idea like that from? No...I'm not expecting sex out of you." Then you come back here...telling us you're thinking you should try to kiss her next time you see her,and tell her you didn't mean it when you said you just wanted to be friends.

You go back and try to kiss her,and/or tell her you didn't mean it when you said you just wanted to be friends,you'll 100% be making what her roommate said true. This girl will also feel STUPID cause she believed your "friends act",and will have to tell her roommate that she was right all along about you.


Yeah....a sticky situation,ain't it? And another thing.....

You've been told this over and over.........GO BY WHAT WOMEN DO.....not by what they say. Dude.....

STOP BELIEVEING THAT HORSESH1T LINE about her not wanting a relationship....or more importantly,that BS line about her "being hurt" from her last relationship and needing time to heal before dating again.

STOP BELIEVEING THAT SH1T. If that's true,then tell me something.......

What is Tinder? It's a DATING APP....right? If she's so hurt and needs all this time to recover before dating again,WHY is she on Tinder? She's MEETING GUYS AND GOING OUT WITH THEM.....ain't she? She met YOU there. If she's so hurt,why did she match you and agree to meet......shouldn't she have taken some time to recover and heal first,then once better,then start matching and meeting men?

Or does that make too much sense?

So solution:
1) Text her tomorrow and set up plans for Friday?
Or
2) Should I call her, have a bit of small talk then present plan idea?

And when I see her in person should I:
1) Keno and escalate then go in for the kiss (risk startling her though and giving massive mixed signals because of our convo last time)
or
2) be honest and transparent, telling her I misspoke last time and don’t want to be just friends and that I have developed real feelings for her; then see how she responds and go in for the kiss if it’s a positive response?

Dude....

DON'T DO THIS. Just let it go. All you're going to do is make things akward and uncomfortable. She kept asking if you two were just friends and trying to clarify because you wouldn't lead. You wouldn't make a CLEAR DECISION about wanting either friendship or a sexual relationship,so she kept asking to get clarification.....and when YOU TOLD HER you wanted to just be friends,she likely felt she got it. You trying to kiss or go sexual now is gonna seem out of nowhere,take her by surprise...and likely weird her out.

The chick told you that you reminded her of her FATHER. She doesn't want to make out with her dad.

It's over with. You screwed it up by not being upfront and hiding your true feelings behind a fake friendship.

And before you tell me your friendship with her isn't fake,that's likely what SHE is going to think. The second you try to kiss her,her roommate's words ABOUT YOU are going to come to her mind,and she'll likely think your whole "friendship" and all the time you've "hung out" together was all a ploy to get her into bed.........


and she'd BE RIGHT.