Pooks rule 14

[ImTheDoubleGreatest!]

So my girlfriends who have guy friends will likely cheat?

More likely than if they were all female friends.

 

[flowtheory]

More likely than if they were all female friends.

I could see this. My most recent ex and girl I saw before her, had only been in contact with guys on Facebook and other media. She didn’t get along with a lot of other women, or hangout with them often because she always wanted to be the center of attention when men were around. she ended up cheating. She was quite hot. However.. low self-esteem.

High self esteem women rarely have a bunch of guy friends, so I’ve noticed.

 

[ImTheDoubleGreatest!]

ITDG of course I read from a woman's perspective. But I see the man's view. I also see all the jadedness and distrust that many men here hold in their psyche. I understand that the playing field is biased and I know that a chick sharing a different view is not always welcome. Most of the men here are here as a direct result of bad experiences. It's important to remember that when reading the threads because you aren't getting the perspectives of men who ARE pleased in their marriages, almost none of those men are here...but they exist, even here.

MidnightCity isn’t jaded though. That’s why I said to view it from a man’s lens. He never said anything ‘feeling’-wise about t being good or bad, he stated the differences factually. Your interpretation of it being negative is your own view of that aspect of women. In order for men to be successful with women, we cannot have emotions at all regarding those topics that you view as negative. To us, it just IS. In the same way that grass grows and the wind blows, men and women have aspects that just are too. Any bitterness comes from the feeling of betrayal and feeling lied to by society about how women truly are.

Casanova (who married Penkitten), Colossus and others who have passed through here are married and pleased to have a partner for their life journey. Other men here aspire to have good relationships, possibly good marriages, and those guys are learning how to better themselves to become men who are discriminating, masculine leaders who can attract the women who are worth the risk of commitment. Grewd is engaged as he noted...and he's mentioned over the past couple of years that he has a good woman. Atom Smasher has found someone incredible (and he notes that his chick would NEVER have given him the time of day when he first came here), and there are others who are enjoying good LTR arrangements even if they never marry or remarry.

It’s important to note that Giovanni was here at the dawn of the century, he came here at the turning point of time. Women were different then than now. Even 5 year old me would notice that. And from when I was 5 till now, women have changed. And you also can’t forget the Grewd is also one of the ‘softer’ guys on here. In SS terms, he would be the most ‘blue pill’, or least ‘red pill’ as lame as that sounds. He’s also Northern European. Not US. Although, that would explain his difference in attitude. And Atom Smasher explicitly told me to never get married when you are younger because women aren’t worth it when they’re young except for banging really, and it’s nigh on impossible to find that gem in the rough. He said at least 40s before you get married if I recall correctly. You are cherry picking examples these examples and are ignoring the context of each of them.

Be very careful about drinking the bitter vinegar of someone else's sour grapes. Better to learn all you can and keep your own counsel because you could very well run into someone worthwhile. And worthwhile women have choices. So you make yourself her best option if you expect to be hers.

I always do. But people change out of a need. I am trying to be the best that I can for what’s within my reach and even then some. But when you do not have to better yourself or be a good person, then why would you? Women go with the flow of society. And if society is ****ed up, then so are they. They are sheep in the sense that they follow the herd. No, it isn’t not negative or positive to me, it is another one of those things that just is. It is a law of nature to me. I am just trying to tell you how the likelihood of there being a stray sheep is very little. I am ram in wolf’s clothing.

A man's perspective is fine, but if you want to have successful relationships with women you are going to have to consider a woman's perspective as well at some point. It's a two person journey. Both peoples perspectives have value even if only one (the man please...) leads.

Your words are like poisonous honey. I consider everyone’s perspective and speak many languages of people. But sometimes I don’t feel like playing the negotiator. I get sick of wasting time having to mediate hints between people or between me and another person when I know that if I explain things to them in a way that they can understand that they’ll side with me afterwards, or that if they refuse it’ll be only because of false pride. The outcomes are still the same. So why waste time on petty qualms? You do what needs to be done. I don’t want to waste any more time on pathetic people if they wouldn’t do the same. People don’t care about each other any more like how they used to, women don’t care about men like how we thought. And I think this is where our disconnect is. You already understand what is and what isn’t with women. Most women do lol. Verbalizing it is ALWAYS viewed as negative. I understand that, and so do you. But what you don’t understand (you may think you do, but you don’t, simply because you cannot) is how men emotionally want women to be like. I do. You understand sexual attraction, you understand most if not all forms of attraction in the social sense, but from men specifically to women in the emotional sense, you don’t. This is a deeper topic that is hard for me and most men to explain because it is natural within us and such things that just are are always hard to verbalize due to its inherent nature.

 

[AJ84]

ITDG of course I read from a woman's perspective. But I see the man's view. I also see all the jadedness and distrust that many men here hold in their psyche. I understand that the playing field is biased and I know that a chick sharing a different view is not always welcome. Most of the men here are here as a direct result of bad experiences. It's important to remember that when reading the threads because you aren't getting the perspectives of men who ARE pleased in their marriages, almost none of those men are here...but they exist, even here.

Casanova (who married Penkitten), Colossus and others who have passed through here are married and pleased to have a partner for their life journey. Other men here aspire to have good relationships, possibly good marriages, and those guys are learning how to better themselves to become men who are discriminating, masculine leaders who can attract the women who are worth the risk of commitment. Grewd is engaged as he noted...and he's mentioned over the past couple of years that he has a good woman. Atom Smasher has found someone incredible (and he notes that his chick would NEVER have given him the time of day when he first came here), and there are others who are enjoying good LTR arrangements even if they never marry or remarry.

Be very careful about drinking the bitter vinegar of someone else's sour grapes. Better to learn all you can and keep your own counsel because you could very well run into someone worthwhile. And worthwhile women have choices. So you make yourself her best option if you expect to be hers.

A man's perspective is fine, but if you want to have successful relationships with women you are going to have to consider a woman's perspective as well at some point. It's a two person journey. Both peoples perspectives have value even if only one (the man please...) leads.

It seems like the guys here who don't have an extreme pessimistic view of women and/or are currently in happy relationships or are happy with their dating options are ridiculed by others or labled as blue pill or beta. It's like being bitter is a requirement to be alpha or red pill. It isn't but it sometimes seems that way when I see how some guys respond to the guys here who seem happy with the woman/women in their lives.

It reminds me of when single girls covertly put digs at their girlfriends who are happy with a guy. Like if she talks about something nice he did her friend may say, " well he just did that to get a BJ you know what men are like."

Women do that a lot, and it seems so too do men here. Some things really are not that different I guess.

 

[ohrein]

Reading Pooks lessons again. I have a bit of confusion regarding lesson 14.
“Always have a back-up chick!”

I can understand this idea in the early stages of spinning plates and seeing what’s out there. Becoming abundant.
However, what happens when you find a woman who is worthy of your attention and time; someone YOU have chosen and who actually likes you, for you?
Is he saying even then “always have a back up chick” until you’re engaged or married?
Exclusivity is generally a conversation that happens around two-three months...
So, what then?

You keep your game up with social circle. I'm in an LTR and happy but I always have "options" if that ends. It's important to keep interacting with women in a flirty sexual way so that you know your value and ideally so that your LTR knows your value. I have old plates I don't really see anymore that would probably hook up if I was single again. Even just subtle flirting with women in retail can create competition anxiety. But I think it's more important just to keep up your understanding that you do have options and not to end up with oneitis because that can be death in an LTR, ironically. You have options, you just choose not to use them because the woman you're with has earned your exclusivity.

 

[BeExcellent]

It seems like the guys here who don't have an extreme pessimistic view of women and/or are currently in happy relationships or are happy with their dating options are ridiculed by others or labled as blue pill or beta. It's like being bitter is a requirement to be alpha or red pill. It isn't but it sometimes seems that way when I see how some guys respond to the guys here who seem happy with the woman/women in their lives.

It reminds me of when single girls covertly put digs at their girlfriends who are happy with a guy. Like if she talks about something nice he did her friend may say, " well he just did that to get a BJ you know what men are like."

Women do that a lot, and it seems so too do men here. Some things really are not that different I guess.

Its a human being thing to disdain things one does not have and/or things one is envious or covetous of. Some of that is to be expected because people in scarcity have trouble understanding those who experience authentic abundance.

The men here who are enjoying a relationship don't have the acrid attitude. Neither do the men in their 40s and 50s who have more life experience, even if they are choosing to play the field.

I never said Midnight City was himself jaded. That was the assumption that he and ITDG drew. I never said my comments were negative either. My comments are neutral.

No person worth being in a real relationship with, man or woman, is going to put up with "These are the rules that apply to you...and these (much more lenient rules) are going to apply just to me" Its quite laughable if you are talking about mature adult relationships. Now. If you are talking about transactional relationships? That's different. That's trading one thing in exchange for another. Resources for sex, as an example. There is an implied contract in that type of interaction. And at its core it is inherently flawed because it cannot create intimacy, it is merely an exchange: This for that. Jaded type men and women (let's be fair here) seek transaction based relationships because they are shallow and don't require intimacy or self-examination. In fact they block intimacy and self examination, which is both their initial appeal and their detriment if they continue. And then people who get into transaction based relationships (again both men and women) complain bitterly when they find their deeper emotional needs (which men have too) are not being met. Shocker that one.

And yet somehow these people, who are terribly self absorbed rather than self aware wonder how on Earth that happened. Gee. They are blinded by their own know-it-all-ness and can't figure it out for the life of them.

Urbanyst and Tenacity were recent examples of this. And I quite liked them both, never reported them for anything nor had ill will toward them, but they both became more and more shrill and extreme espousing views here that were the direct result of their own personal disappointments and refusal to see their role in their own situations. The result of that (in my view) was it significantly diminished their ability to contribute value here even though some of what they had to say was utterly true. They got so individually bitter and emotionally swept up in their belief systems that they could not tolerate debate or an alternative perspective.

I happen to agree with Pook, including his 14th rule, from the perspective ohrein put forth. I don't care who likes me and who doesn't. I'm simply a perspective among various perspectives. And I like what's going on in my life. I'm good. And I'm not dating anybody here or trying to impress any body here. I got no dog in anyone's personal hunt.

But if my son happened to be lurking about I'd warn him about adopting the bitter jaded views that proliferate here.

And I have no penis envy whatsoever of anyone. I find that assertion/suggestion quite funny actually and frankly rather sophomoric. I am delighted to be female, and happy with life and my experience of it so far. I am enjoying the company of a man who I am quite compatible with, that is becoming a LTR, I enjoy a great relationship with my ex husband, and I have a few long term male friends I have known for decades, and I have quite a few close girlfriends, most I've known for many years. I am blessed with wonderful friends. I do my level best to BE a good friend too. To all the people I care about.

But its a MALE forum. I know that. I get flamed and poked at and hotly debated sometimes specifically for that reason...and some ignore me for that reason too. But I respect the fact that it is a male forum, and I am not male. Duly noted - confirmatory anatomy check completed, lol.

 

[AJ84]

Its a human being thing to disdain things one does not have and/or things one is envious or covetous of. Some of that is to be expected because people in scarcity have trouble understanding those who experience authentic abundance.

The men here who are enjoying a relationship don't have the acrid attitude. Neither do the men in their 40s and 50s who have more life experience, even if they are choosing to play the field.

I never said Midnight City was himself jaded. That was the assumption that he and ITDG drew. I never said my comments were negative either. My comments are neutral.

No person worth being in a real relationship with, man or woman, is going to put up with "These are the rules that apply to you...and these (much more lenient rules) are going to apply just to me" Its quite laughable if you are talking about mature adult relationships. Now. If you are talking about transactional relationships? That's different. That's trading one thing in exchange for another. Resources for sex, as an example. There is an implied contract in that type of interaction. And at its core it is inherently flawed because it cannot create intimacy, it is merely an exchange: This for that. Jaded type men and women (let's be fair here) seek transaction based relationships because they are shallow and don't require intimacy or self-examination. In fact they block intimacy and self examination, which is both their initial appeal and their detriment if they continue. And then people who get into transaction based relationships (again both men and women) complain bitterly when they find their deeper emotional needs (which men have too) are not being met. Shocker that one.

And yet somehow these people, who are terribly self absorbed rather than self aware wonder how on Earth that happened. Gee. They are blinded by their own know-it-all-ness and can't figure it out for the life of them.

Urbanyst and Tenacity were recent examples of this. And I quite liked them both, never reported them for anything nor had ill will toward them, but they both became more and more shrill and extreme espousing views here that were the direct result of their own personal disappointments and refusal to see their role in their own situations. The result of that (in my view) was it significantly diminished their ability to contribute value here even though some of what they had to say was utterly true. They got so individually bitter and emotionally swept up in their belief systems that they could not tolerate debate or an alternative perspective.

I happen to agree with Pook, including his 14th rule, from the perspective ohrein put forth. I don't care who likes me and who doesn't. I'm simply a perspective among various perspectives. And I like what's going on in my life. I'm good. And I'm not dating anybody here or trying to impress any body here. I got no dog in anyone's personal hunt.

But if my son happened to be lurking about I'd warn him about adopting the bitter jaded views that proliferate here.

And I have no penis envy whatsoever of anyone. I find that assertion/suggestion quite funny actually and frankly rather sophomoric. I am delighted to be female, and happy with life and my experience of it so far. I am enjoying the company of a man who I am quite compatible with, that is becoming a LTR, I enjoy a great relationship with my ex husband, and I have a few long term male friends I have known for decades, and I have quite a few close girlfriends, most I've known for many years. I am blessed with wonderful friends. I do my level best to BE a good friend too. To all the people I care about.

But its a MALE forum. I know that. I get flamed and poked at and hotly debated sometimes specifically for that reason...and some ignore me for that reason too. But I respect the fact that it is a male forum, and I am not male. Duly noted - confirmatory anatomy check completed, lol.

Glad you were able to confirm that lol.
Yeah I get reminded from time to time that it's a male forum and I too respect that. Every now and again someone throws out the v card and asks what do we know about being a male. Well, we may not know what it means to be a male but we know what's it like to become attracted to and fall for one so .... when I see a post about how to attract or keep a woman that's so far off the mark as to be a head shaker I sometimes can't resist debating it.
However Several guys here have excellent points. A lot of the older guys and some young guys which for a young age is really impressive and refreshing.

 

[oldmanofthesea]

@ohrein summed it up really well.

You just never know what is going to happen. Things could be great and you wake up one day and she's gone, out of the blue with no warning. You will be in a much better place to bounce-back if you still have a good social circle intact and have plenty of women you can spend time with, platonic and sexual.

 

[AJ84]

again, because our biological imperatives are completely different. it doesnt make sense to you because it doesnt align with a females drive to seek commitment.

its the same if we were to see you guys talk to each other and say "only sleep with him when you want something, pick fights with him, he has to prove he cares about you if he gives in to what youre arguing about, he has to learn to choose you over his friends, go through his stuff, theres nothing wrong with wanting to know what hes up to" etc etc u get the picture. we'd all laugh at you but it would make perfect sense to you

Actually no. All of that is crappy thinking. You don't know me, but if you did you would know that I value my privacy even in a relationship and would be very ticked off if he went through my stuff snooping around. In turn I don't go through his stuff. I trust him, and if I felt I had to go through his stuff well then what would that say about the relationship.


But I'm not some relationship newbie. I'm 33, with past relationship experience, positive and negative. I made mistakes, learned from them and moved on. I'm past the bs of testing a guy's loyality with silly games. I got better things to do with my time and that's a total waste of it. If my husband wants to go out with his buddies I don't whine and pout like a 16 yr old and make him choose. I want him to have friends and a life outside of me, it's not healthy to be totally wrapped up in someone else to the exclusion of everyone else. I too, value a life outside of him. But he's the priority and I'll always have his back.
It took me a long time but I don't feel the need to win every argument or get defensive if I'm called on something I did that was wrong and I know I was in the wrong. I don't withhold sex or use it to get something I want, but I used to do that in the past I admit.

I learned from past mistakes I made in relationships, because I choose to check my ego at the door and really look inward.

And because of that, I choose a better man and become a better partner to that man.

Some women, yes, do that kind of annoying stuff, but it's based on immaturity, insecurity, and lack of personal awareness, not an innate female desire for commitment. Most women know men are the keepers of relationships. A smart woman knows she has to earn his commitment. A dumb woman plays silly games, thinking it's the other way around.

Not all women behave and think the same, and this where guys get it wrong when they think there's a one size fits all approach and then assume their behavior is based on some universal group think.

 

[old_skoolr]

blah blah blah im a special fvcking snowflake blah blah

we're not talking about YOU tho, we're speaking in general terms. this is very much the shlt that women pull and we all know this. you guys need to stop thinking "im not like these girls these guys talk about, where do they meet these people jeeze" well you may not fit all the generalizations down to a T but MANY women do and you probably fit a good amount of them at one point or another

Usually when chicks say that, they're EXACTLY like those girls guys talk about.

 

[AJ84]

blah blah blah im a special fvcking snowflake blah blah

we're not talking about YOU tho, we're speaking in general terms. this is very much the shlt that women pull and we all know this. you guys need to stop thinking "im not like these girls these guys talk about, where do they meet these people jeeze" well you may not fit all the generalizations down to a T but MANY women do and you probably fit a good amount of them at one point or another

I don't buy into this thing of many women fitting all generalizations down to a T nor all men fitting generalizations down to a T.

I'm giving an example based on my experiences, which, from what I read here, a lot of people do.

If that conflicts with what you believe most women to be, it is what it is.

 

[JohnChops]

I dropped all girls I was talking to , I.e. I didn’t talk to them, once I started dating my girlfriend. However, they always texted me, which led to her being jealous a few times.

Once I found good balance, which was in the past month or so,I was able to keep My game sharp and maintain at least friendships with a few girls.

All or nothing never works. The way I see it, as long as you aren’t making advances on these girls while in a relationship, it’s fair game.

 

[flowtheory]

@ohrein summed it up really well.

You just never know what is going to happen. Things could be great and you wake up one day and she's gone, out of the blue with no warning. You will be in a much better place to bounce-back if you still have a good social circle intact and have plenty of women you can spend time with, platonic and sexual.

This really resonated with me. I like your perspectives, old man.
Also is your name a nod to ‘the old man of the sea’ by Hemingway?

 

[The Duke]

One thing about getting older is I've seen this topic play out every which way possible. I've heard all of the varying opinions from men and women. At the end of the day, you have to do what is right for you, her, and the relationship if you are looking for a successful long term union. Everything in life always come down to having balance and functioning within a happy medium. All sides have to compromise for the benefit of the whole. Relationships that are too one-sided cause resentment in the other person over time.

However, one thing that concerns me these days is the majority of the females I know all have multiple male friends they converse with on a regular basis and texting/social media has made this very easy. These women are getting a portion of their need for attention/validation from these male friends and that's where the issue is. All of her needs should come from the man she is in a committed relationship with, not some other dude.

When her friends are beta males(those who provide females with attention and get no sex in return), they pose little to no threat and are already friend-zoned.

However, that high value male with alpha qualities in her social circle that she always keeps her eye on but doesn't always talk to.....he is a threat.
I've been that guy. I've got 3 examples of it in the past couple months. In every case, these girls started getting frustrated in their current relationship and began showing me interest like never before.

One of the girls I went out with a few times after she broke up with her boyfriend. 2months before the breakup she started showing me a lot of interest whenever we saw each other in person. After I had 2 dates with her, she got cold feet and ran back to her boyfriend. I hadn't heard anything from her for a few weeks since she rejected my request for a date and the other day I get a text wondering what I was up to. I'm guessing she is having "boyfriend" issues again and is feeling me out. This time around I'm going for the kill. She can put up or shut up.

The other girl is having major regrets with her boyfriend. They just bought an expensive house together and now she regrets it. She likes to go out, he likes to stay home. She gets along well with him, but he lets her run loose all the time. He won't lead the relationship like he needs to. He doesn't understand female attraction. He doesn't make the vagina tingle often enough. But he has big muscles and makes good money and likes spending it! So the other night when she went out dancing with me and the rest of the social circle and the boyfriend wasn't around, who does she come onto after a few drinks? Yours truly! The sexual "MAN" in me let it go further than it should have, but I didn't want to be any part of why her relationship fails so I shut her down before any clothes came off.

My female cousin is good friends with the two girls I mentioned above. And just this weekend I explained to her why having male friends can be an issue. She didn't see anything wrong with it. She references all of the males in our social circle which most are harmless beta's. They've flirted, asked out, spent money on these two girls I mentioned above and none of them got anywhere. I come around, invest little time, spend no money on them, and get further with these two women than any of those other guys. One of those "nice" guys that didn't get anywhere happens to be a little jealous now. After I pointed this out she understood.

The 3rd girl happens to be the girlfriend of one of my good friends. They are having issues now that he wants to move to a different city and she doesn't. She is testing the waters with me hoping she can branch swing. Not going to happen.

I really don't find that females make very good "friends" anyways. They aren't as fun to be around as males. They constantly pull shady things on their own female friends. They don't operate on a level of honesty, loyalty, and respect to meet my standards. They are most loyal to the guy that is meeting her needs.

If a female doesn't offer me physical and visual pleasure, then I have a hard time providing them any sort of attention or friendship.

 

[flowtheory]

I have a personal opinion about this:

Women want what they don't have. In my opinion, on a suppressed level, they WANT to know that women are chasing their man...and they want their man to "be a challenge" because women want society to think that their man is "a good catch."

Be a challenge... how does this work in the world of when you’re married or living with a woman, how do you ‘be a challenge’? Even if you’re getting interest from other women?

Does this mean always do your own thing alone often (hike, take a solo trip, go to movies, art gallery)? See friends often? Not always pursue her sexually?

 

[AJ84]

It’s cool, I’ve got nothing against you. You’re alright

But the nature and content of your posts are to be expected as I highlighted above that women’s advice for men still amounts to and leads back, in some way towards men making better committed partners for women, not necessarily advice that focuses on encouraging men to get what THEY want out of the women they’re dealing with regardless of whether that means that they might have to hurt those women in the process. Capiche?

I get it. Lord knows there is ooodles of advice out there for women on how to get what they want from men without giving anything up so guys who want to do the same have an nice pool of like
minded people to date.

I think that's fair game, when you know the woman is using you too.

 

[oldmanofthesea]

This really resonated with me. I like your perspectives, old man.
Also is your name a nod to ‘the old man of the sea’ by Hemingway?

No. I'm just old. And I like the sea. lol

 

[flowtheory]

I get it. Lord knows there is ooodles of advice out there for women on how to get what they want from men without giving anything up so guys who want to do the same have an nice pool of like
minded people to date.

I think that's fair game, when you know the woman is using you too.

Are there any forums like sosuave, but for women? I’d like to do some spying

 

[Red Legg]

My abundance level is so high that I don't need to spin plates.I am in an LTR now that is going great.I would recommend spinning plates for the "new" DJ though.... because they might not have a fully developed abundance mindset yet.

 

[zekko]

I said very early in our relationship that I have female friends and I'm not going to tolerate jealousy.

Do you think it makes any difference if these friends are "exes"?