K-Close on first dates but no second dates.

[Konada]

So up till now I still can't get second dates, good thing is I'm kiss closing these girls and still pushing for sex. The previous one gVe me a BJ but then proceeded to tell me 'She doesn't do hookups' while the most recent one went ghost after I made out with her (she said no when I tried escalating further).

Am I coming across too much off as a player? What can I do?

 

[Konada]

When are you escalating, mate?

I don't usually escalate towards sex on a first date. And I get the logistics worked out for when I do decide to take it to sex - which is typically the second date.

Pushing too much on a first date is often a case of wrecking the set. You are gaming girls online, remember.

If you want to fvck girls in one straight set, then you need to be doing night-game. That is best for the quick thrills.

Escalating on the third venue. My current game plan has been Coffee --> Bar --> Isolated area after talking a walk

 

[TheGambino]

Stay agressive, escalate, make her wet, kiss close, go for the kill on the first date. A high interested chick is not going to wipe you off for your testerone.

 

[Trump]

Escalating on the third venue. My current game plan has been Coffee --> Bar --> Isolated area after talking a walk

Sounds like you are pushing for sex rather than trying to connect with them and have it lead to sex.

That's too many venue's, they will get a headache or get too tired. Stick to one venue.

 

[devilkingx2]

getting laid on the first date is like winning the lottery, you should hope it happens but don't plan on it.

second and third dates are where it normally happens.

so pave the way to make it possible on the first date, but don't put all your eggs in that basket

 

[Tenacity]

So up till now I still can't get second dates, good thing is I'm kiss closing these girls and still pushing for sex. The previous one gVe me a BJ but then proceeded to tell me 'She doesn't do hookups' while the most recent one went ghost after I made out with her (she said no when I tried escalating further).

Am I coming across too much off as a player? What can I do?

I get called a player all the time lol. Which is funny because 10 years ago I was called everything BUT a "player", I was called: a lame, a nerd, a weirdo, etc., etc. So hell, I'll take being called "player" than the other names any day lol.

But no, in all seriousness, I think you are doing GOOD. Kiss closing and the like means the women are attracted to you. It just comes down sometimes to a numbers game man. Which means that:

- You approach or meet 25 women

- You get 15 numbers

- You go out/date 9 of them

- Of those 9, 3 you couldn't kiss close or do anything with. 4 you could only kiss close but couldn't get the chick to move beyond that. And 2 you kiss closed, fvcked, and could actually get them to move forward into some sort of "relationship".

So when you break down the percentages, about 8% of the women you approached turned into some sort of "relationship". That's usually the way it goes man (at least for me) and I've just learned to accept it. We can sit here and ask questions over this process all day, such as:

* I look good, why did I only get 15 numbers and not all 25? Why did the other 10 blow me off?
* I look good, why did I only get 9 to move forward with a date/meet up, and not all 15?
* I did well on all of the dates, why did I only kiss close 4 and didn't get anywhere with 3 of them?

We can ask these questions ALL DAY long and of course the keyboard warriors here will give you 1,000 theories on what you supposedly "did wrong", such as you wore the wrong shirt, or you breathe too hard, or you told her you like Jazz music instead of saying Rock music.....none of that shyt had really anything to do with anything.

MOST of this shyt is beyond our control. We are dealing with very complicated creatures (called the modern day woman) and their level of complication makes it so that even their BEST FRIENDS can't understand them sometimes (just talk to the average girl's best friend).

 

[l_e_g_e_n_d]

Tenacity, Konada stated he got zero second dates (out of dozens I assume?). Accordingly, it's not a number's game, but rather something OP is doing wrong.

Konada, if you are kissing closing and getting a bj--as well as getting the first dates--the issue is likely not in your relative SMV (to the girl), but rather your game.

Test other methods: Try five dates, where you attempt only a kiss-close, and see if the dynamic changes. Maybe you are pushing these girls out of their comfort zones as your escalation is unnatural. Notwithstanding, if you are still getting no second dates, the problem likely lies in the sub-communications and behavioral patterns you are projecting. There might be some deeper inner game issues that can only surface if you openly describe some of the deep-rooted insecurities that you are harboring. In the meantime, begin with the first date kiss-close only, and we'll take it from there.

 

[marmel75]

So up till now I still can't get second dates, good thing is I'm kiss closing these girls and still pushing for sex. The previous one gVe me a BJ but then proceeded to tell me 'She doesn't do hookups' while the most recent one went ghost after I made out with her (she said no when I tried escalating further).

Am I coming across too much off as a player? What can I do?

It happens, don't beat yourself up about it. You'll go through a period like this where you've advanced from not having anything happen on dates to now getting some action like kissing, makeouts, BJ's, etc, but still no second dates. You'll adjust a few things over the course of this happening to where you will start having women wanting to see you again, then fvcking them on dates 2 and 3 and then having multiple women you are fvcking.

It's a process and it just takes time to get things worked out until it becomes natural and you know what to do in various situations.

 

[Tenacity]

Tenacity, Konada stated he got zero second dates (out of dozens I assume?). Accordingly, it's not a number's game, but rather something OP is doing wrong.

Well, he didn't provide an exact number breakdown, but when you say he's doing something "wrong".....what is your definition of "wrong"? Wrong can be subjective.

Konada said he's not getting second dates, but he kisses the chicks and one (or some) of them are svcking his dyck. He said one of them svcked his dyck THEN told him that "she doesn't do hook-ups", that sounds like that "women are complicated" situation I described in the prior post.

Konada, if you are kissing closing and getting a bj--as well as getting the first dates--the issue is likely not in your relative SMV (to the girl), but rather your game.

There's no game dude, you guys kill me with this internet shyt. The bytches are svcking the man's dyck Legend, how is it that you are saying he's doing something "wrong"? No, what he's dealing with are FLAKEY, lukewarm, wishy washy a.ss chicks. These chicks dominate the market in large numbers. They will meet you Monday, fvck you by Thursday, fvck you again on Saturday, then by next Monday she disappears. YOU are going to tell me that this is happening because he's not following some "internet" gaming technique?

Maybe you are pushing these girls out of their comfort zones as your escalation is unnatural.

If this were the case they wouldn't be kissing him nor svcking his dyck. They would push away immediately.

Notwithstanding, if you are still getting no second dates, the problem likely lies in the sub-communications and behavioral patterns you are projecting.

What??

There might be some deeper inner game issues that can only surface if you openly describe some of the deep-rooted insecurities that you are harboring.

What in the living hell are you talking about lol?

In the meantime, begin with the first date kiss-close only, and we'll take it from there.

Isn't the man doing that already? I don't think the man is trying to strong-arm the bytch into bed lol, he's doing the kiss-close and seeing how far he can escalate it. That's what I do as well, I massage her neck, back, tongue kiss the hell out of her, and if I can get in her drawas NEXT then that's what I'm going to do. If she pushes it back a little bit, I'm not going to strong-arm my way in, I'll just finish kissing/massaging her.

 

[devilkingx2]

if you're noticing a consistent pattern then it has to do with you. so if this has happened with like 3 girls that doesn't necessarily mean anything, but if this has happened with OP's last dozen or so first dates, then it has to do with how he's doing things.

anything that isn't consistent is just women being women.

 

[Konada]

If I were to break down my dating history so far it is as follows:
Date #1: Low IL girl, out for a free meal
Date #2: Possible low IL, afraid to kiss close
Date #3: Went for k-close twice, rejected
Date #4: Failed to escalate, unable to confirm interest
Date #5: Girl looks different from pics, didn't bother
Date #6: Girl looks different from pics, didn't bother
Date #7: Kiss closed, high interest girl but terribly needy borderline stalkerish behavior, didn't follow up
Date #8: First date lay, banged again on 2nd day but driven away with my neediness
Date #9: Girl looks different from pics, didn't bother
Date #10: Went out with girl twice, no kiss-close
Date #11: Kiss closed, possible bootycall but she went ghost midway
Date #12: Low IL girl
Date #13: Kiss closed, escalated to sex. Gave me BJ but then says she is a virgin and is saving it for a committed relationship, blows me off the next day telling me she doesn't do hookups
Date #14: Kiss closed, escalated to sex. Pulls away when I tried escalating to sex and goes ghost.

You might note that there are some second dates but I'm more concerned about landing subsequent dates with women I'm highly interested in.

 

[Tenacity]

If I were to break down my dating history so far it is as follows:
Date #1: Low IL girl, out for a free meal
Date #2: Possible low IL, afraid to kiss close
Date #3: Went for k-close twice, rejected
Date #4: Failed to escalate, unable to confirm interest
Date #5: Girl looks different from pics, didn't bother
Date #6: Girl looks different from pics, didn't bother
Date #7: Kiss closed, high interest girl but terribly needy borderline stalkerish behavior, didn't follow up
Date #8: First date lay, banged again on 2nd day but driven away with my neediness
Date #9: Girl looks different from pics, didn't bother
Date #10: Went out with girl twice, no kiss-close
Date #11: Kiss closed, possible bootycall but she went ghost midway
Date #12: Low IL girl
Date #13: Kiss closed, escalated to sex. Gave me BJ but then says she is a virgin and is saving it for a committed relationship, blows me off the next day telling me she doesn't do hookups
Date #14: Kiss closed, escalated to sex. Pulls away when I tried escalating to sex and goes ghost.

You might note that there are some second dates but I'm more concerned about landing subsequent dates with women I'm highly interested in.

So we have 14 girls he has dated:

- 5 he did something sexual with or at least kiss closed

- 5 outright rejected him

- 3 he outright walked away from

- 1 he didn't make enough moves on, so not sure how that would have worked out

So out of the 14 girls, 36% he did something sexual with. He walked away from 3 and didn't try with 1, let's assume if he tried with the 3 he walked away from he would have kissed/did something sexual with them, and the one he didn't try on he would have at least kissed closed. That puts him at 64% which is around the same percentage of kiss close/did something sexual with that I outlined above.

Konada you aren't doing anything "wrong". It's a numbers game for one and then two, the LONGER you do this, the more "smooth" you will get with it. But you are doing very well. My recommendation is to continue doing what you are doing but INCREASE the quantity of women.

For the 1st Quarter of 2017 (January, February, and March) seek to do 30 dates (10 per month at least).

 

[Konada]

Quantity is no issue if I lower my standards to anything below a 5.5. I've been down that route and honestly it feels like a fvcking waste of time practicing game on girls I'm not even remotely attracted to.

That being said, I'm going to steer off OLD, simply because I'm not at the stage in my demographics where my looks alone can pull decent looking women off it. I'd say I'm about a 6-7 in looks. (Compare this to when I was in Shanghai a week ago, I was pulling 7-8s constantly on OLD, could've lined up 4-5 dates in the 5 days easily I was there if I really wanted to.) For now, I'm going to focus on day/night game because that's where my bottleneck in game is. Getting quantity and the quality I want.

 

[Tenacity]

Quantity is no issue if I lower my standards to anything below a 5.5. I've been down that route and honestly it feels like a fvcking waste of time practicing game on girls I'm not even remotely attracted to.

That being said, I'm going to steer off OLD, simply because I'm not at the stage in my demographics where my looks alone can pull decent looking women off it. I'd say I'm about a 6-7 in looks. (Compare this to when I was in Shanghai a week ago, I was pulling 7-8s constantly on OLD, could've lined up 4-5 dates in the 5 days easily I was there if I really wanted to.) For now, I'm going to focus on day/night game because that's where my bottleneck in game is. Getting quantity and the quality I want.

A 6 - 7 in looks is solid. Maybe I'm too hard on myself, but you've seen my pics and even with a 6 pack, I still say I'm a 6 - 7 in looks.

 

[devilkingx2]

If I were to break down my dating history so far it is as follows:
Date #1: Low IL girl, out for a free meal
Date #2: Possible low IL, afraid to kiss close
Date #3: Went for k-close twice, rejected
Date #4: Failed to escalate, unable to confirm interest
Date #5: Girl looks different from pics, didn't bother
Date #6: Girl looks different from pics, didn't bother
Date #7: Kiss closed, high interest girl but terribly needy borderline stalkerish behavior, didn't follow up
Date #8: First date lay, banged again on 2nd day but driven away with my neediness
Date #9: Girl looks different from pics, didn't bother
Date #10: Went out with girl twice, no kiss-close
Date #11: Kiss closed, possible bootycall but she went ghost midway
Date #12: Low IL girl
Date #13: Kiss closed, escalated to sex. Gave me BJ but then says she is a virgin and is saving it for a committed relationship, blows me off the next day telling me she doesn't do hookups
Date #14: Kiss closed, escalated to sex. Pulls away when I tried escalating to sex and goes ghost.

You might note that there are some second dates but I'm more concerned about landing subsequent dates with women I'm highly interested in.

you're not doing anything wrong, you just either have bad luck, bad taste, or bad locations for meeting girls

see if you can still smash #7 lmao

 

[TheGambino]

you're not doing anything wrong, you just either have bad luck, bad taste, or bad locations for meeting girls

see if you can still smash #7 lmao

You guys are horn3y af lmaaaooo

 

[TheFixer14]

Maybe the women that you meet are just basic beotches who don't know what they want?

I mean men everywhere after they don't get what they want out of a woman turn to themselves and say "what the hell is wrong with me?" On some level this is good. And guys do make mistakes. But a lot of women are just stupid and don't know what they want.

Just don't take em seriously and have at it.

 

[ubercat]

3rd date is normal kick to curb if no action. I think your doing fine OLD girls r flakier. R there any patterns yr noticing about interacting on the date?

 

[Konada]

3rd date is normal kick to curb if no action. I think your doing fine OLD girls r flakier. R there any patterns yr noticing about interacting on the date?

1. Most of the time I'm still initiating kino. They might bump into me or whatever but I'd have to start the escalating anyway. Little initiation on their part but reciprocation is there.

2. Always getting questions like 'How many girls have you been with on Tinder?' 'Do you always move this fast?'

3. The last 2 kiss closes I had were I would say were after token resistance. I try the first time, they turn away. I let it go by and continue talking, the next time I go in for the kiss, I just turn my head, sniff their neck, massage it and stuff. Usually they get the message and act coy about what's going to happen with a girly 'What?'. They try to break tension by blabbering about nonsense topics but I just keep my mouth shut and keep looking at them. Usually about 30s or so, they kiss me and start shoving their tongues into me, I'm never the one initiating the making out.

@Tenacity

I believe anyone with a ripped physique is automatically bumped into the 7.5-8 category easily. That being said, maybe I'm overestimating how good I look and would appreciate if you can give me an honest rating (we're here to improve, not give each other feel good butterflies). Pretty sure you've seen my pics so you can judge.

Anyone else who is willing to make the kind effort to rate my looks can PM me as well but please keep the pics confidential.

 

[ubercat]

Most young guys don't understand just how good they look. I wouldn't waste a single minute worrying about that.