Alton Sterling and Philando Castile, Your Thoughts

[englishman]

Once again, we go back to the problem. Whatever the demands are, whatever the problem is, whatever the inferiority complex is, it wouldn't exist IF one followed the instructions by the officer.

See how simple it is? Do as you are told and be on your way.

Really! You think it's that simple. One time I was in a club in northern England... was 1983 , the club had a reputation for being a bit of drug place.... the cops came in and busted it... filed us all one by one into a room and then outside.

Outside lots of cops... I started walking away and a cop told me to walk faster, I told him I'm walking and I'm leaving, so he kicked me up the azz.... I looked over and saw me friend getting jumped on by the cops. So I went to help him and got arrested.

When I saw my friend in the cells he had a big black eye, he told me that he was handcuffed in the van and a cop punched him in the face, another cop asked him what had happened, so the cop said this and punched him again just for effect.

When we the cops let us go they had zero drugs and it was a totally illegal arrest.

So this hot shot lawyer said he would represent us for free... but the day we were at court he sent this local solicitor and said the hot shot lawyer had called him and asked him to come and represent us as hot shot and changed his mind, and that we should all plead guilty and be bound over to keep the peace.... so we were young and we did that, and we had it on a criminal record.

I know lots of stories like that. Anyone who believes that if you follow what the cops are telling you to do, that it will all end correctly is naive... in my opinion.

 

[TheVirtualMind]

Really! You think it's that simple. One time I was in a club in northern England... was 1983 , the club had a reputation for being a bit of drug place.... the cops came in and busted it... filed us all one by one into a room and then outside.

Outside lots of cops... I started walking away and a cop told me to walk faster, I told him I'm walking and I'm leaving, so he kicked me up the azz.... I looked over and saw me friend getting jumped on by the cops. So I went to help him and got arrested.

When I saw my friend in the cells he had a big black eye, he told me that he was handcuffed in the van and a cop punched him in the face, another cop asked him what had happened, so the cop said this and punched him again just for effect.

When we the cops let us go they had zero drugs and it was a totally illegal arrest.

So this hot shot lawyer said he would represent us for free... but the day we were at court he sent this local solicitor and said the hot shot lawyer had called him and asked him to come and represent us as hot shot and changed his mind, and that we should all plead guilty and be bound over to keep the peace.... so we were young and we did that, and we had it on a criminal record.

I know lots of stories like that. Anyone who believes that if you follow what the cops are telling you to do, that it will all end correctly is naive... in my opinion.

So...

- Went to a club that was "a bit of a drug place"
- Cops raid the place looking for drugs in "a bit of a drug place"
- You get to walking and are told to keep walking
- You decide to take your time, then come back after being told to leave
- Have a high priced attorney who took your case, reviewed it, then decided that you should plead guilty, despite it "being an illegal arrest" after seeing the report

So...Am I missing anything?

 

[Ronaldo7]

Really! You think it's that simple. One time I was in a club in northern England... was 1983 , the club had a reputation for being a bit of drug place.... the cops came in and busted it... filed us all one by one into a room and then outside.

Outside lots of cops... I started walking away and a cop told me to walk faster, I told him I'm walking and I'm leaving, so he kicked me up the azz.... I looked over and saw me friend getting jumped on by the cops. So I went to help him and got arrested.

When I saw my friend in the cells he had a big black eye, he told me that he was handcuffed in the van and a cop punched him in the face, another cop asked him what had happened, so the cop said this and punched him again just for effect.

When we the cops let us go they had zero drugs and it was a totally illegal arrest.

So this hot shot lawyer said he would represent us for free... but the day we were at court he sent this local solicitor and said the hot shot lawyer had called him and asked him to come and represent us as hot shot and changed his mind, and that we should all plead guilty and be bound over to keep the peace.... so we were young and we did that, and we had it on a criminal record.

I know lots of stories like that. Anyone who believes that if you follow what the cops are telling you to do, that it will all end correctly is naive... in my opinion.

One time I was in a club in northern England... was 1983 , the club had a reputation for being a bit of drug place.... the cops came in and busted it... filed us all one by one into a room and then outside.

 

[speed dawg]

It's a shyt job all the way around which is why I said.....let the black inner city police themselves. Since cops are demonized as being all one particular way (racist and bad), then fvck it...stop calling 9-11. When Ray Ray and Pookie are breaking in your fvcking house, YOU get Ray Ray and Pookie out of your damn house then! When Ray Ray and Pookie are robbing you on the street, YOU police Ray Ray and Pookie's a.ss then!

Interesting concept for sure. I saw a black woman on the Kelly file saying she wanted to abolish the police. I think that'd be funny - the murder rate would go through the roof. She said she wanted "community solutions"....hahaha, like what? The churches aren't uniting anytime soon. The only solution would be gangs and then poof....murder rate explodes. This normally would be good but unfortunately some good people still live there.

Secondly.....I think that's what the elite WANT.....flood the inner city with crime, then push them out or let them kill each other....and gentrificate....and get rich. Or, they simply want the votes.

 

[Ronaldo7]

Interesting concept for sure. I saw a black woman on the Kelly file saying she wanted to abolish the police. I think that'd be funny - the murder rate would go through the roof. She said she wanted "community solutions"....hahaha, like what? The churches aren't uniting anytime soon. The only solution would be gangs and then poof....murder rate explodes. This normally would be good but unfortunately some good people still live there.

Secondly.....I think that's what the elite WANT.....flood the inner city with crime, then push them out or let them kill each other....and gentrificate....and get rich. Or, they simply want the votes.

I saw that too.

Absolute moron.

 

[Tenacity]

There should also be ZERO wrongful deaths during an operation by a doctor......There are major issues everywhere. Criminal Justice system, medical field, fast food service...

I completely agree but those other areas are discussions within themselves. Right now I wanted to center in on issues with the Criminal Justice system specifically.

Robbery occurs 3 blocks away and guy is wearing an orange shirt and blue hat, with a gun tucked in his waistband and he has a medium build and light complexion. Call came out and I was a few blocks away. As I'm coming up, there you are, in an orange shirt and blue hat, with the same build and complexion as the suspect. You literally just came out of your house to go up the street for some milk. You know that. I don't. Guess who is being told to get on the ground at gun point until I can verify you don't have a gun and aren't the suspect?

Do I have to hop out of my car and say "excuse me sir, I got a call of a guy with a gun who just robbed someone. Was that you?"

But Virtual, this example is an example of a cop being a DYCK. How about walking up to the man and saying that you just got a tip about a robbery, based on the description he fits the profile, and because of that that you need to detain him for a few moments to investigate the situation. Apologize for the inconvenience. If the man continues to ask questions, you then remind him of the situation and say that he must be detained, read him his rights, etc.

This is a FAR better approach then running up to the guy like the Wild Wild West, demanding he get the fvck on the ground....spread his legs....etc., without the guy having a damn CLUE WTF is going on.

Now, once I am able to verify you aren't the person, I will have no issue saying "hey man, sorry about that. Here's what happened up the street. You may want to buy some new clothes for the future..." If you think you got wronged, that's what the court system and a complaint to the supervisor is for.

Come on Virtual, you don't see how that makes you out to be a complete and utter DYCK? You run up on me, yell at me, make me get on the ground, spread my legs....completely embarrassing the fvck out of me and making me feel like a second class citizen...for NO reason. Then when you find out I had nothing to do with the shyt, then you finally "explain" to me why you did what you did, and tell me that if I feel someway about it to go make a complaint?

This is the reason why we have idiotic movements like BLACK LIVES MATTER, it's "dyck-like" behavior like this from the cops man.

 

[Tenacity]

Once again, we go back to the problem. Whatever the demands are, whatever the problem is, whatever the inferiority complex is, it wouldn't exist IF one followed the instructions by the officer.

See how simple it is? Do as you are told and be on your way.

No there's a reason we have something called a Constitution with our RIGHTS as citizens. I've yet to see you mention anything about that, instead, it's just what the fvck ever a cop says....GOES. Do you know how easy it is for an oppressive government to take us over using logic like that? What if the Cops say give me your money? Give me your property?

Think of the bigger picture, maybe this is why they want to take our guns away, it's so we would not be able to have any line of defense by this POLICE STATE that's out of control across the board, not just to black people...but whites and other races.

How you as an American can sit up here talking about "just follow police orders" without also demanding some sort of ORDER to the police along with acknowledging our RIGHTS as citizens in general (no matter the race), doesn't make any sense to me.

Interesting concept for sure. I saw a black woman on the Kelly file saying she wanted to abolish the police. I think that'd be funny - the murder rate would go through the roof. She said she wanted "community solutions"....hahaha, like what?

Yeah, she was a complete loud mouth. That's how a lot of black women argue (which is why it's VERY HARD to live with a black woman). Her mouth makes you want to give that bytch some Sweet Chin Music like you're Shawn Michaels or some shyt.

 

[TheVirtualMind]

But Virtual, this example is an example of a cop being a DYCK. How about walking up to the man and saying that you just got a tip about a robbery, based on the description he fits the profile, and because of that that you need to detain him for a few moments to investigate the situation. Apologize for the inconvenience. If the man continues to ask questions, you then remind him of the situation and say that he must be detained, read him his rights, etc.

This is a FAR better approach then running up to the guy like the Wild Wild West, demanding he get the fvck on the ground....spread his legs....etc., without the guy having a damn CLUE WTF is going on.



Come on Virtual, you don't see how that makes you out to be a complete and utter DYCK? You run up on me, yell at me, make me get on the ground, spread my legs....completely embarrassing the fvck out of me and making me feel like a second class citizen...for NO reason. Then when you find out I had nothing to do with the shyt, then you finally "explain" to me why you did what you did, and tell me that if I feel someway about it to go make a complaint?

This is the reason why we have idiotic movements like BLACK LIVES MATTER, it's "dyck-like" behavior like this from the cops man.

So, let me get this straight. A potential robbery suspect, with a gun...You want me to just walk up and be all buddy buddy with them? You're joking, right?

Policing in the real world isn't flowers and sunshine.

 

[Skyline]

But Virtual, this example is an example of a cop being a DYCK. How about walking up to the man and saying that you just got a tip about a robbery, based on the description he fits the profile, and because of that that you need to detain him for a few moments to investigate the situation. Apologize for the inconvenience. If the man continues to ask questions, you then remind him of the situation and say that he must be detained, read him his rights, etc.

This is a FAR better approach then running up to the guy like the Wild Wild West, demanding he get the fvck on the ground....spread his legs....etc., without the guy having a damn CLUE WTF is going on.

Come on Virtual, you don't see how that makes you out to be a complete and utter DYCK? You run up on me, yell at me, make me get on the ground, spread my legs....completely embarrassing the fvck out of me and making me feel like a second class citizen...for NO reason. Then when you find out I had nothing to do with the shyt, then you finally "explain" to me why you did what you did, and tell me that if I feel someway about it to go make a complaint?

This is the reason why we have idiotic movements like BLACK LIVES MATTER, it's "dyck-like" behavior like this from the cops man.

It's unlikely that the same person will fit a description but in case it does, there is really no logic in asking a suspect of robbing someplace with a gun nicely.

Criminals don't care. In one of my classes we did an exercise where one person acts as an armed criminal and the other arrests. The instructor didn't tell us, the criminal, to pull our guns out so I was the only one who actively did in situations where I felt I could. Let's just say I would have killed more than have of the class and everyone got scolded for not being aware.

And even before they got yelled at for being stupid, some of them even said "our instructor didn't tell you to do that," as if criminals need to ask permission to use violence...

I think going over the top in that scenario would be tazing or using some form of deadly force.

I can't say if the situation where Alton's situation was over the top because the camera doesn't cover the part where his gun was at so he very well could have had it in his hands at one point.

 

[Ronaldo7]

No there's a reason we have something called a Constitution with our RIGHTS as citizens. I've yet to see you mention anything about that, instead, it's just what the fvck ever a cop says....GOES. Do you know how easy it is for an oppressive government to take us over using logic like that? What if the Cops say give me your money? Give me your property?

Think of the bigger picture, maybe this is why they want to take our guns away, it's so we would not be able to have any line of defense by this POLICE STATE that's out of control across the board, not just to black people...but whites and other races.

How you as an American can sit up here talking about "just follow police orders" without also demanding some sort of ORDER to the police along with acknowledging our RIGHTS as citizens in general (no matter the race), doesn't make any sense to me.

The police is there to maintain order and to keep the community safe. An officer is not going to say "give me your money" or "give me your property". Find some relevant examples.

Gun control has no connection here. The only issue here is individuals not following instructions.

Officers aren't going to go out their way to hassle you without a good reason. It's laughable. They must have seen something to proceed.

All i see is a group of clowns giving excuse after excuse to justify their inability to follow instructions given to them by law enforcement.

 

[BlueAlpha1]

Tenacity is right here. The very real militarization of police in this country is evidenced in the insane amount of police incidents per 100,000 compared to other countries like Iceland and Norway. I know these are SJW utopias overrun by feminists, but on the specific issue of police brutality, if lower crime and less people killed by police is the goal, they are light-years ahead of us because their police are trained to deescalate. We have a BILL OF RIGHTS and we are not presumed guilty until proven innocent - it's the other way around. Do I think you should FIGHT the police in instances where they bully you? Not of you want to live, but THEY need to be retrained so we are not put in a position to choose between death or nonlethal abuse.

But there is no race angle. The police are like this with EVERYONE except those who live in the Financial District, Martha's Vineyard and Beverley Hills, because it is the HAVES vs the HAVE NOTS. Black Lives Matter is a hate group and terrorist organization, because their premise is of black victimhood is intrinsically false and separatist, and their tactics are extreme.

There are no good guys in this war between aggressive police and thugs.

 

[Fatal Jay]

You guys screaming out Black Lives Matter, you do know that is government funded right?

 

[TheVirtualMind]

Tenacity is right here. The very real militarization of police in this country is evidenced in the insane amount of police incidents per 100,000 compared to other countries like Iceland and Norway. I know these are SJW utopias overrun by feminists, but on the specific issue of police brutality, if lower crime and less people killed by police is the goal, they are light-years ahead of us because their police are trained to deescalate. We have a BILL OF RIGHTS and we are not presumed guilty until proven innocent - it's the other way around. Do I think you should FIGHT the police in instances where they bully you? Not of you want to live, but THEY need to be retrained so we are not put in a position to choose between death or nonlethal abuse.

But there is no race angle. The police are like this with EVERYONE except those who live in the Financial District, Martha's Vineyard and Beverley Hills, because it is the HAVES vs the HAVE NOTS. Black Lives Matter is a hate group and terrorist organization, because their premise is of black victimhood is intrinsically false and separatist, and their tactics are extreme.

There are no good guys in this war between aggressive police and thugs.

The challenges faced in America vs. other countries is paramount. You can not compare the US vs. other countries, especially with policies. Why?

- You point out that there are more incidents per 100,000 compared to Iceland and Norway. Great.
- The US has lower police incidents per 100,000 compared to Somalia, Kenya, Mexico, and Haiti, just to name a few (those were also named some of the most corrupt police countries in the world)

Speaking of being presumed guilty until proven innocent, what happens with all the police incidents on the news? Police are accused (especially by our glorious President...) of being found guilty, harsh handed, and over bearing. Darren Wilson was deemed "guilty" by the public and the President within 2 days of the situation. By the end, once all the evidence was presented and even a GRAND JURY said "yeah, he was justified because the dude was trying to take his gun," there was no "whoops," no apology, NOTHING! A mans life was ruined because people wanted to jump on him so quick. 6 cops in Baltimore were trying to get railroaded for some crack head pos taking his "let me injure myself in here so I can get some money" stunt too far. Everyone jumped on the police for that one too. Now that the evidence is coming out...Guess who isn't being found guilty because they didn't kill the dude? The two cases mentioned in the title of this thread...People are finding the officers guilty before anything is out. During the live stream for Castile, people were calling for the death of cops WHILE THE DUDE WAS BLEEDING OUT AND HIS CHICK WAS SITTING THERE PLAYING ALL INNOCENT!

I do agree with your statement on BLM. 9 year old shot by gang members in Chicago? Nothing. 5 people shot during a vigil for another shooting victim? Oh well. Girl killed by illegal dirt bike rider, leaving a child behind? "I ain't see sh*t." Officer trying to arrest suspect and the whole neighborhood tries to jump the officer? "Run Pookie! Run! I ain't see where he went, Officer! Get the f*ck outta here before I kill you!"

"Black Lives Matter when it's convenient for us to protest"

 

[BlueAlpha1]

The challenges faced in America vs. other countries is paramount. You can not compare the US vs. other countries, especially with policies. Why?

- You point out that there are more incidents per 100,000 compared to Iceland and Norway. Great.

Why can't I compare them? These are first world, secular countries, far more like the United States than the other countries you mention below.

And it's not a matter of "more incidents", in some of these countries it's 10,000 to 1. For every one police killing of a civilian in Iceland (1 in the nation's history), there are about 1,000 a year here. There is nothing that can explain a disparity this steep but for training manuals.

The kind of people we recruit for the police in the country is ASTONISHING (especially in the NYPD.) There seems to be a crazy amount of veterans with some level of PTSD or morbidly obese guido-types with thick accents who never got laid and now want to compensate for something by establishing "authority". The stereotype of a mall cop are now the real cops in NYC.

- The US has lower police incidents per 100,000 compared to Somalia, Kenya, Mexico, and Haiti, just to name a few (those were also named some of the most corrupt police countries in the world)

With all due respect moderator, this is a pretty low bar to set.

Speaking of being presumed guilty until proven innocent, what happens with all the police incidents on the news? Police are accused (especially by our glorious President...) of being found guilty, harsh handed, and over bearing. Darren Wilson was deemed "guilty" by the public and the President within 2 days of the situation. By the end, once all the evidence was presented and even a GRAND JURY said "yeah, he was justified because the dude was trying to take his gun," there was no "whoops," no apology, NOTHING! A mans life was ruined because people wanted to jump on him so quick. 6 cops in Baltimore were trying to get railroaded for some crack head pos taking his "let me injure myself in here so I can get some money" stunt too far. Everyone jumped on the police for that one too. Now that the evidence is coming out...Guess who isn't being found guilty because they didn't kill the dude? The two cases mentioned in the title of this thread...People are finding the officers guilty before anything is out. During the live stream for Castile, people were calling for the death of cops WHILE THE DUDE WAS BLEEDING OUT AND HIS CHICK WAS SITTING THERE PLAYING ALL INNOCENT!

I agree on these cases. Unlike BLM, I go on an individual basis and not down the party line. They are tribal and ONLY see race. I sided with the police in Michael Brown and Freddie Gray. Hands up don't shoot never happened. But the Walter Scott incident was a man running away getting shot in the back, and the Eric Garner choke-out met the bar for manslaughter. I'm sorry. When the dude says "I can't breathe" 9 times and 5 guys are already on him, you loosen the damn hold.

I do agree with your statement on BLM. 9 year old shot by gang members in Chicago? Nothing. 5 people shot during a vigil for another shooting victim? Oh well. Girl killed by illegal dirt bike rider, leaving a child behind? "I ain't see sh*t." Officer trying to arrest suspect and the whole neighborhood tries to jump the officer? "Run Pookie! Run! I ain't see where he went, Officer! Get the f*ck outta here before I kill you!"

Yep. They started out as a hate group, but have since advanced to the level of a terrorist organization. People are outraged that they are being compared to the KKK. In 2016, they're far MORE dangerous than the Klan, who haven't had a documented murder since 1981. BLM had five murders this week. And YES THEY DO take the blame for this sniper. Your inspiration was a convicted cop killer from New Jersey and you've called for it at your rallies. Afterwards your followers praised him on Twitter. Don't try to act innocent now. There is too much blood on your hands.

But in a defiant act of solidarity with black racists Barry the racial arsonist will probably have Sharpton and DeRay
over for dinner this weekend.

 

[TheVirtualMind]

Why can't I compare them? These are first world, secular countries, far more like the United States than the other countries you mention below.

There is a different type of citizen in every country. What works in Iceland won't work in America.

And it's not a matter of "more incidents", in some of these countries it's 10,000 to 1. For every one police killing of a civilian in Iceland (1 in the nation's history), there are about 1,000 a year here. There is nothing that can explain a disparity this steep but for training manuals.

It's not quite that simple. You train for what you face. Are police in Iceland, England, or Japan going to train the way US cops do? No. Are US cops going to train the way Iceland, England, and Japan based police do? No. Nothing is the same. Even certain training in the US isn't the same. Officer Inner City won't train the same way as Officer Closest Back Up Is A Deer, nor will either of them train the same way as Officer The Mayor Is My Cousin.

The kind of people we recruit for the police in the country is ASTONISHING (especially in the NYPD.) There seems to be a crazy amount of veterans with some level of PTSD or morbidly obese guido-types with thick accents who never got laid and now want to compensate for something by establishing "authority". The stereotype of a mall cop are now the real cops in NYC.

For NYPD, there is a 3-5 year hiring process. A lot of the reason for veterans being hired is due to the fact that they are used to certain things (taking orders, staying in shape, maintaining equipment, surviving situations.) While PTSD does occur, it can and does occur in police, EMTs, fire fighters, doctors, ect.

As for the "morbidly obese guido types," either they know someone (which happens in every job...and isn't fun to have partner with you at times anyway), or they WERE in shape when hired and got super lazy (again...Not good to have with you.) But it's the same as any job.

With all due respect moderator, this is a pretty low bar to set.

So are a lot of things I can't/won't comment on when it comes to the US. ;-)

I agree on these cases. Unlike BLM, I go on an individual basis and not down the party line. They are tribal and ONLY see race. I sided with the police in Michael Brown and Freddie Gray. Hands up don't shoot never happened. But the Walter Scott incident was a man running away getting shot in the back, and the Eric Garner choke-out met the bar for manslaughter. I'm sorry. When the dude says "I can't breathe" 9 times and 5 guys are already on him, you loosen the damn hold.

The Walter Scott incident was one of the very, very few shootings that you just look at as a cop, after the evidence was presented, and go "dude...really? What the f*ck!?"

As far as Eric Garner...You say "I can't breathe," you can breathe. I've been in situations where the person I was trying to handcuff would say "I can't breathe," with a bunch of us there (not wanting to go to jail is a hell of a motivator) and as soon as we let up a little, the fight got worse. Eric Garner was a VERY unfortunate situation that actually occurs a lot in retail security and police all over the US (you never really hear stuff from other countries when you are in America, so I can't comment on the frequency). The issue is, someone has a bad heart, or is on some type of substance (usually PCP) and gets "hyper excited" and causes their heart rate to reach a level that it can not maintain naturally and it gives out. There is also incidents called "positional asphyxiation." Someone is face down and have a heavy amount of weight on thier back, rendering them unable to breathe. Those are the ones that CAN'T yell out. That is the result of too much "high energy."

Yep. They started out as a hate group, but have since advanced to the level of a terrorist organization. People are outraged that they are being compared to the KKK. In 2016, they're far MORE dangerous than the Klan, who haven't had a documented murder since 1981. BLM had five murders this week. And YES THEY DO take the blame for this sniper. Your inspiration was a convicted cop killer and you've called for it at your rallies. But in a defiant act of solidarity with black racists Barry the racial arsonist will probably have Sharpton and DeRay
over for dinner this weekend.

They also had a member recently fire rounds at a police officers house in Indianapolis (luckily, he missed with his 17 shots), while wearing a "BLM" shirt. They are more akin to the Black Panthers. While not EVERY member is violent, the tendencies are there. Remember, you hear stories of how Hell's Angels buy Christmas gifts for under privileged kids every year. The KKK did the same thing and was like a "good old boys' club...Yet much worse. BLM is only going to get worse before things get better. People are comparing this to the 70's all over again.

 

[BlueAlpha1]

There is a different type of citizen in every country. What works in Iceland won't work in America.

It's not quite that simple. You train for what you face. Are police in Iceland, England, or Japan going to train the way US cops do? No. Are US cops going to train the way Iceland, England, and Japan based police do? No. Nothing is the same. Even certain training in the US isn't the same. Officer Inner City won't train the same way as Officer Closest Back Up Is A Deer, nor will either of them train the same way as Officer The Mayor Is My Cousin.

I am not saying they need to train the exact same ways cops are trained in Iceland. The point is to reduce the number of deaths and arrests of innocent people as low as possible because ONE is too many. I don't like when I see nonchalance from people like Rudy Giuliani which implies "eh, mistakes will happen." I am not saying police are an equal opposite to BLM. Every member of BLM is an extremist, but there certainly a troubling number of extremists on on the blue side in one civilian's opinion.

Personally, twice I have been pulled over on a Saturday night and interrogated as though I was on a witness stand, for driving while well-dressed with gelled hair around bar close time. I had not been drinking either time, but I was breathalyzed, threatened, and belittled. One instance was by a female cop who probably lost her entire family for being such a harridan. The presumption of guilt from jump street was very troubling.

For NYPD, there is a 3-5 year hiring process. A lot of the reason for veterans being hired is due to the fact that they are used to certain things (taking orders, staying in shape, maintaining equipment, surviving situations.) While PTSD does occur, it can and does occur in police, EMTs, fire fighters, doctors, ect.

But firefighters and doctors job descriptions do not entail de-escalation techniques with problematic people. Expecting someone with PTSD to talk a lunatic off a ledge seems so counter-intuitive it's like a bad horror movie.

As far as Eric Garner...You say "I can't breathe," you can breathe. I've been in situations where the person I was trying to handcuff would say "I can't breathe," with a bunch of us there (not wanting to go to jail is a hell of a motivator) and as soon as we let up a little, the fight got worse. Eric Garner was a VERY unfortunate situation that actually occurs a lot in retail security and police all over the US (you never really hear stuff from other countries when you are in America, so I can't comment on the frequency). The issue is, someone has a bad heart, or is on some type of substance (usually PCP) and gets "hyper excited" and causes their heart rate to reach a level that it can not maintain naturally and it gives out. There is also incidents called "positional asphyxiation." Someone is face down and have a heavy amount of weight on thier back, rendering them unable to breathe. Those are the ones that CAN'T yell out. That is the result of too much "high energy."

You are I are going to fundamentally and 100% disagree on this case. I do believe that a police officer is the only person who can look at that case the way you do. Even the most conservative commentator in the country Michael Savage, who is no friend to BLM, debated a cop on his radio show on this case. Savage was with me.

I believe Daniel Pantaleo showed gross negligence by not releasing the choke. Presuming you don't have a bone caught in your throat and are instead having a heart attack, you can still speak when you're STRUGGLING to get air. He's using his LAST BREATHS to tell you he can't breathe. Turns out he was telling the truth because he died seconds later. Police are accountable to the law just as much as any civilian. There should have been an indictment and a trial at the very least.

BLM is only going to get worse before things get better. People are comparing this to the 70's all over again.

Yes it is. And I agreed with Barry on 70% of his platform when he first got elected. I was a liberal in college. But he has since gone full retard and the obliteration of race relations is now his legacy, and we know what side he was on. He's a race agitator who doesn't like whites very much.

 

[Skyline]

Tenacity is right here. The very real militarization of police in this country is evidenced in the insane amount of police incidents per 100,000 compared to other countries like Iceland and Norway. I know these are SJW utopias overrun by feminists, but on the specific issue of police brutality, if lower crime and less people killed by police is the goal, they are light-years ahead of us because their police are trained to deescalate. We have a BILL OF RIGHTS and we are not presumed guilty until proven innocent - it's the other way around. Do I think you should FIGHT the police in instances where they bully you? Not of you want to live, but THEY need to be retrained so we are not put in a position to choose between death or nonlethal abuse.

But there is no race angle. The police are like this with EVERYONE except those who live in the Financial District, Martha's Vineyard and Beverley Hills, because it is the HAVES vs the HAVE NOTS. Black Lives Matter is a hate group and terrorist organization, because their premise is of black victimhood is intrinsically false and separatist, and their tactics are extreme.

There are no good guys in this war between aggressive police and thugs.

What do you mean with the 'police in the U.S. Are militarized?' Any enforcement agency is considered a paramilitary from private security, cops, to feds, and even to CIA.

 

[Tenacity]

So, let me get this straight. A potential robbery suspect, with a gun...You want me to just walk up and be all buddy buddy with them? You're joking, right?

No, I'm not joking. The keyword is "suspect", you have no idea whether or not I did the robbery. All you have is some blanket description that quite honestly, a lot of guys most likely probably could fit. Have some respect for me as an American citizen, and approach me with some common courtesy UNTIL you get more information leading to the actual perpetrator.

The policing tactics you described Virtual, is why you have stupid movements like Black Lives Matter (BTW, what a stupid name to name a movement). You have these ratchet, loud mouth, more than likely single black mothers who probably have 5 kids from 5 different convicted thugs, who are running around here talking about ALL cops are killing us!

Obviously, ALL cops aren't killing us, I posted the stats earlier on cop killings in 2015...but when you take isolated cases like a Castile or Amadou Diallo, or the shooting of Levar Jones, all due to STUPID policing, you are giving LIFE to STUPID movements like Black Lives Matter.

You said you are a cop that works in these inner cities Virtual, as you know from my posts I'm not some far left, socialist, communist, idiot. I'm very moderate in my views and I actually lean "right". And I'm informing you that the policing example you described is giving BIRTH to these stupid protests. There are BETTER ways of policing and they NEED to be implemented across the board.

The police is there to maintain order and to keep the community safe. An officer is not going to say "give me your money" or "give me your property". Find some relevant examples.

Big Government is getting bigger, more oppressive, and out of control. We are dealing with the growth of a Police State, where Police think they can just run around, being a DYCK, and doing it all in the "name of the law". If a citizen wants to complain, they can "file a report about it".....instead of the cop (whose salary I pay with MY tax dollars) treating every citizen like a law-abiding American citizen until given DUE REASON not to.

You are giving way too much power to the Police. We have laws, we have rights, we have a Constitution. A police officer is not a damn Dictator. There are codes of conduct, ethics, and other procedures that NEED to be followed and you have a sub-section of Police that believe that they don't have to follow a damn thing.

Giving too much power to the Police to where they don't have to follow any code of conduct, opens up a Police State and an Oppressive Government to where we could eventually be looking at Cops showing up at the front door demanding property. They are already trying to take guns off the street....I wonder why? Is it so the citizens won't have a means to defend themselves against the Oppressive Government?

Officers aren't going to go out their way to hassle you without a good reason. It's laughable. They must have seen something to proceed.

It's laughable to YOU because you are closed minded. Virtual (who works in the inner cities) just GAVE you an example of bad policing, where a cop goes out of their way to HASSLE someone without having any damn information, proof, or anything in relation to that person being a robber. All they have is a generic, blanket, description, without any real concrete evidence on the person.....and instead of coming in calm to investigate, Virtual said it's GOOD for them to come in a blazing telling the guy to hit the fvcking ground. That's bad policing. Bad....bad....bad!

All i see is a group of clowns giving excuse after excuse to justify their inability to follow instructions given to them by law enforcement.

The reason that's "all you see" is because that's all you CHOOSE to see. I look at all sides of the problem. We have an out of control inner city with violence through the damn roof, and we have some improperly trained cops using bad police tactics to police the area.

 

[YawataNoKami]

You cannot ever have personal accomplishment if you are raised as a perpetual victim of the evil white devil. That cultural racism is the reason we have so many young racist blacks out there being uninformed racist fools. Fighting with the cops puts them into a situation of their life or yours. That is the issue. When it comes down to it, we all want to go home at night. The contemptuous behavior of black people in everyday situations has more to do with their formative years than what they have experienced to that point. An 18 year old has yet to see the magnitude of the racism he believes exists. How about being angry with the people who started you out with too few choices, i.e. poor, uneducated people having children? How selfish. This exists in the white community as well. And while the choice to have a child in circumstances of poverty may be the decision/non-decision of the two parents, it is a society of "haves" that has enabled this to continue by paying for it. When the black community sees that they have been duped by welfare, that this system is contributing to their plight, perhaps they will make better choices. Stop having children that you can't afford, work towards the educational betterment of the ones that you have and stop looking at white people to save you.

So let"s have an honest conversation about how this thing started in the first place. With more than twice as many whites being killed by cops than blacks, why are there no blacks speaking out against violence against whites, or people as a whole? Yet, every protest that is held for the black community, whites show up to share their support in droves. Even though that statistic combined with the numbers from the black and latino community would definately strengthen the case for excessive force by police, blacks focus only on cop on black violence and forget everyone else.

It is time to call out black racism for what it is. It is no better than the uncle tom era and shouldn"t in any way be supported by those looking to create actual change in this country. How the black community can get behind a movement so incredibly racist blows my mind. They are going to isolate themselves to the point where no one listens and racial tensions bring us to the breaking point.

 

[TheVirtualMind]

Tenacity...

Your concept of how police should handle a potentially armed suspect is what gets cops killed. Yes, I do work in the inner city.

That's a video of an incident that occurred well before Freddie Gray, in an area I work in. The officers were trying to be nice, polite, and be the perfect officers you describe. How well did that turn out?

Also, as far your whole "have some respect for me." That's all well and good, and I do show respect. But when I do not know if you are the suspect or not and whether you have a gun that you may or may not want to kill me with, you better believe that until I know otherwise, you WILL be getting stopped in the manner I said. Now, the example I gave had a pretty detailed description as far as what is usually put out. Now, if I had just said "tall, skinny male," then yeah, that fits a lot of people. But once you narrow it down with clothes...

Like I said, policing isn't sunshine and flowers. There is "nice" was to arrest someone who is resisting. There is no "nice" way to deal with a potentially armed person. There is no "nice" way to deal with a crowd of 20 people surrounding you whIle you investigate (you know...The thing police are paid to do) a crime and have a potential suspect detained until you can verify it.

Please enlighten me on your "better" tatics.

The best "tactics" that can help reduce violent crime and help reduce the amount of violent criminals (the same ones that fight with police) would be:

- petition the courts to ENFORCE VIOLENT FELONIES and the jail time for them

- have neighborhoods help clean up their area. "I ain't see nothing" isn't going to get that guy that just shot your homeboy off the streets before he comes for you...

- have parents either raise their kids, or, for the ones that do, stop telling them "if you are bad, that cops going to lock you up." If you're a little kid and your parents tell you a cop is bad, are you going to respect them or go to them for help?