How to Recover from Job Loss

[LiveFreeX]

Who said I'm broke? I just self-produced my own app.

When I said YOU, I wasn't talking about you specifically Neil... I was making the comment that it seems that a lot of people when they lose their jobs, also tend to lose their shirt. Most people live basically hand to mouth, without any savings or any specific skills to fall back on and absolutely no back up plans. One of the things that is necessary for job loss is financial management. Also, I know it rarely occurs to people, but while employed I'm always on indeed hunting my next job or checking up on the skills required to make the next big leap. Having a plan like this makes losing your job actually quite exciting.

 

[marmel75]

What language are you programming in?

 

[bigneil]

Software patents are such a pain it makes you wish you went open source. In the end, nobody looks at it except your mom anyway. The only people smart enough to understand have egos too big to allow them to appreciate something they didn't make.

"And I don't want to live in a world where somebody else makes the world a better place... better than we do." - President of Hoolie on Silicon Valley Season 2.

 

[bigneil]

When I said YOU, I wasn't talking about you specifically Neil... I was making the comment that it seems that a lot of people when they lose their jobs, also tend to lose their shirt. Most people live basically hand to mouth, without any savings or any specific skills to fall back on and absolutely no back up plans. One of the things that is necessary for job loss is financial management. Also, I know it rarely occurs to people, but while employed I'm always on indeed hunting my next job or checking up on the skills required to make the next big leap. Having a plan like this makes losing your job actually quite exciting.

Huge keys are:

1) Have a roommate - as much as it sucks, your rent is $650 instead of $1300, etc. During the good times, put the extra $650 a month you save toward a $1300 vacation with your girl every 2 months.
2) Have a storable food supply. Clean your pantry for 60 days of mac and cheese with veggies.
3) Have cash, gold, and silver. You don't miss it. It's just money in the bank that's harder to access.
4) Have stuff to sell. During the good times, shop wisely so you can then sell back your juicer, popcorn machine, 50" TV and laptop for nearly what you paid. Buying and selling and tax deducting allows you to save on shipping and storage, and upgrade for minimal cost, if not a slight profit (unless you over do it and cross the tax threshold on Amazon of $15K or so).
5) Have something to work on. Or you'll go crazy. In the meantime, it's your chance to be your own boss and produce something during the 60 days you'll typically have off between jobs.

 

[bigneil]

What language are you programming in?

C++, DirectX, OpenGL and now WebGL which I think is the latest holy grail. Write code that runs on iPhone, Android and desktops (if not Window Phone) all at once. I have a graphics niche. You can also have a GUI niche, C# .NET niche, shader language niche, networking niche, multithreading niche, parallel programming niche like AMP or GPGPU, Java or Javascript niche, C++ 11 niche (probably the most profitable overall for next 5 years) or optimization niche, among others. But have one.

 

[dustmuffin]

I lost my job and was unemployed for two years. I finally found a government job that I will retire from. It pays well and is easy. If you are unemployed all I can say is just keep trying. you will eventually find a job.

I am earning 25% less than before. I have adjusted my lifestyle. My life is still good. Happiness comes from the inside.

 

[Asmodeus]

Worked in construction for years in a few different areas... Not highly educated, but I have a few certifications. I found that the best way to recover from and prevent job loss is to diversity yourself and gain as many skills as possible. In your spare time work to get certified or learn other things, that way you will be able to apply youself at a wide range of things. I was able to get a HVAC job during the recession, got it a few months before my former employer had to lay off everyone because of how bad it got (I saw the writing on the wall and jumped ship before it sunk).
Also be aware of trends...Some jobs may be secure one year, and the next year it may not be secure. You always have to pay attention to these things, such as how when the recession and housing bubble busted construction jobs became difficult to get, the few years before that construction was booming. You have to keep aware of the job security and oppritunity and if it becomes stagnant work to find a better oppritunity.

 

[marmel75]

C++, DirectX, OpenGL and now WebGL which I think is the latest holy grail. Write code that runs on iPhone, Android and desktops (if not Window Phone) all at once. I have a graphics niche. You can also have a GUI niche, C# .NET niche, shader language niche, networking niche, multithreading niche, parallel programming niche like AMP or GPGPU, Java or Javascript niche, C++ 11 niche (probably the most profitable overall for next 5 years) or optimization niche, among others. But have one.

My Niche is WPF/XAML/VB.net, but I'm working on learning C#, which is basically a 100% equivalent language, but used much more since its related to C++ and very similar to Java as well. Learned Python also, which is very similar to VB.net with some minor differences...the sh!t just looks like heiroglyphics to me with all the
{
public void i++
}
stuff going on, but I guess programming in VB.net which a normal person could actually understand is not cool, lmao!

 

[LiveFreeX]

Not highly educated, but I have a few certifications. I found that the best way to recover from and prevent job loss is to diversity yourself and gain as many skills as possible

Agree, Agree, Agree. Local Certs are quick and easy.

Forklift $150 (2 days)
Gas Tech 3,2,1 $6000 to $10,000 depending on level (4 months to 4 years)
CDL $5000 (4 months)
Security License $100 (2 days)
Private Investigator License $350 (2 weeks)
TESOL $1500 (2 weeks)


To name a few that have paid off for me.

60 days

Never been out of a job for more than a week.

The next one I'm looking at is NDT tech, that looks fun, anyone here do that?

 

[CMNILS87]

Always work more than one job.

 

[bigneil]

Never been out of a job for more than a week.

I was about to take a job in NYC for $67.50 an hour, W2, work at home. Which is only $1800 a week after taxes, with 30 day delay, biweekly invoice.

Just in the nick of time, another job came in and (because I told them I had an official offer) they moved within 48 hours and offered $80 an hour Corp to Corp ($3200 a week, work at home, with 3 day delay, weekly invoice).

Consider:

Job 1: Start June 13.
Job 1: Invoice June 24.
Job 1: Invoice July 8.
Job 1: Invoice July 22.
Job 1: Get first paycheck July 25. $1,800 paid ($17,820 earned but only 10% collected).

Job 2: Start June 13.
Job 2: Invoice June 20.
Job 2: Get paid June 23. $3200.
Job 2: Invoice June 27.
Job 2: Get paid June 30. $6400 total
Job 2: Invoice July 4.
Job 2: Get paid July 7. $9600 total
Job 2: Invoice July 11.
Job 2: Get paid July 14. $12,800 total
Job 2: Invoice July 18.
Job 2: Get paid July 21. $16,000 total
Job 2: Invoice July 25.
Job 2: Get paid July 28. $19,200 paid ($21,120 earned, 91% collected)

So in one job, by August 1 you have nearly 11 times as much money.

Thus, we see the power of Corp to corp, 3 day delayed payment versus W2, 30 day delay, and why jumping on the first job isn't a good idea.

 

[guru1000]

I was about to take a job in NYC for $67.50 an hour, W2, work at home. Which is only $1800 a week after taxes, with 30 day delay.

Just in the nick of time, another job came in and (because I told them I had an official offer) they moved within 48 hours and offered $80 an hour Corp to Corp ($3200 a week, work at home, with 3 day delay).

Consider:

Job 1: Start June 13:
Job 1: Invoice June 24.
Job 1: Invoice July 8.
Job 1: Invoice July 22.
Job 1: Get first paycheck July 25. $1,800 paid ($17,820 earned but only 10% collected).

Job 2: Start June 13.
Job 2: Invoice June 20.
Job 2: Get paid June 23. $3200.
Job 2: Invoice June 27.
Job 2: Get paid June 30. $6400 total
Job 2: Invoice July 4.
Job 2: Get paid July 7. $9600 total
Job 2: Invoice July 11.
Job 2: Get paid July 14. $12,800 total
Job 2: Invoice July 18.
Job 2: Get paid July 21. $16,000 total
Job 2: Invoice July 25.
Job 2: Get paid July 28. $19,200 paid ($21,120 earned, 91% collected)

So in one job, by August 1 you have nearly 11 times as much money.

Thus, we see the power of Corp to corp, 3 day delayed payment versus W2, 30 day delay, and why jumping on the first job isn't a good idea.

Don't forget with W2 income, you get killed with the lack of tax write-offs.

Every dollar I spend is written off. Real estate holdings (mortgage, tax, insurance, maintenance, repair), rents; utilities; auto (lease, gas, garages); "business" lunches, dinners, and outings; "business" attire are all held/paid in corporate name and other structures--all written off. W2 employees pay for the bulk of these expenses (outside of mortgage interest) with after-tax money.

Nice to be taxed only on your net savings. Part of amassing true wealth is in mitigating your tax liability.

 

[bigneil]

Don't forget with W2 income, you get killed with the lack of tax write-offs.

Exactly. If you try, you can live within the rules of the IRS and deduct most of what you need including:

1) Airfare
2) Hotels
3) Rent (if less than 6 months) or Home Office (prorated on square footage)
4) Meals (actual or per diem)
5) Electronics (in the Computer field)
6) Movies (in the Graphics field)
7) Auto
8) Parking tickets or registration fees related to travel.

That's why last year I only had to pay 9% tax. My operating cost given frequent travel has averaged about $100K per year, but I enjoy a good portion of that spending.

If you are W2, they take 25-45% off the top and you can't deduct anything.

 

[bigneil]

PS - To get paid Corp to Corp you need to get:

1) A Tax ID (pay Delaware $350 per year). Silicon Valley Season 1 episode 4 has a classic scene on this.
2) Pay state franchise tax (at least in Texas), $250 per year.
3) An accountant ($1100 per year or so) - even for "zero returns" (years with no income).
4) For most jobs $1M in Workers Compensation and Liability Insurance ($550 per year).
5) Cost of compliance. You'll need to spend 40 hours producing a Dictionary-sized pile of receipts every January, but credit card annual statements make it much easier. I wish Amazon would provide an annual summary.
6) You need to file a corporate return and personal return. In general, profit is treated as income for the individual.

Total overhead: $2250 per year (about $200 per month).

As you can see, you practically get enough to cover these in the first paycheck. But you need to pay all this even if you make no money.

 

[LiveFreeX]

Big Neil do you have a CS degree?

 

[bigneil]

Big Neil do you have a CS degree?

Yes. I don't think they are that important. You are better off making your own app than taking a college course in C++, IMO.

 

[LiveFreeX]

In my country you would need a degree to even get looked at for a job

 

[guru1000]

PS - To get paid Corp to Corp you need to get:

1) A Tax ID (pay Delaware $350 per year). Silicon Valley Season 1 episode 4 has a classic scene on this.
2) Pay state franchise tax (at least in Texas), $250 per year.
3) An accountant ($1100 per year or so) - even for "zero returns" (years with no income).
4) For most jobs $1M in Workers Compensation and Liability Insurance ($550 per year).
5) Cost of compliance. You'll need to spend 40 hours producing a Dictionary-sized pile of receipts every January, but credit card annual statements make it much easier. I wish Amazon would provide an annual summary.
6) You need to file a corporate return and personal return. In general, profit is treated as income for the individual.

Total overhead: $2250 per year (about $200 per month).

As you can see, you practically get enough to cover these in the first paycheck. But you need to pay all this even if you make no money.

1) You can get a Tax ID for free online. Don't pay accountants, lawyers, or agents for this service.
2) Delaware corporations are fine, but require annual taxes and registered agent fees. You can incorporate within your own state to avoid DE's superfluous fees.
3) Incorporate using an LLC, not a C-Corp., and file your LLC operating income in your personal return, Schedule C (if multi-member, Schedule E). Here you save $600-$800 annually by not having to file a separate corporate return.
4) If your contract requires it, maximize deductibles to decrease insurance premium.
5) Keep one corporate card, and expense all corporate expenses through the card to streamline annual summaries. No work required here. Keep receipts in case of audit.
6) See No. 3.

In my country you would need a degree to even get looked at for a job

You don't need a degree to be self-employed.

1) Research local, state, and federal subject business, licensing, and solicitation laws to ensure compliance.
2) Learn the skill set.
3) Incorporate.
4) Secure a virtual phone number, address, and e-mail.
5) Create business cards and letterhead.
6) Create subject contracts.
7) Find, solicit, and close prospects.
8) Do phenomenal work and go beyond to keep clients happy.
9) Solicit clients for other jobs.
10) Ask clients for referrals.
11) Go to No. 7.

 

[thatfeel]

It's really curious that about 50% of the guys on SoSuave are multimillionaires who made 120k per quarter and have banged 250 women. The 0.01% all hang out here. Who knew?

Gotta agree with this.

 

[thatfeel]

Part of amassing true wealth is in mitigating your tax liability.

Yes...it's also a one way road to the retarded "end the fed, taxation is theft" mindset... Whatever, it's fine that tax write offs are 'legal'(because they benefit those who stand to profit the most from them)but don't try to wear the defect of our social system as a badge of honor.