You are the prize.......? .........Value......?

[Reykhel]

You hear "you are the prize" being thrown about in so many threads, but is it coming from a place of.....

1. Wishfull thinking

2. Coming from a place of authenticity

If you google "I am the prize" you'll see that it's written in both men's and women's "dating advice" blogs. Blogs that are there to make money. There's even a photo in google images from some mangina who states "women, take the pressure of yourself when dating. He has to impress you while dating, not the other way around (then in big capitals) YOU ARE THE PRIZE"........so you can imagine the women being told that will feel all pumped up and feel better about themselves.....from this external validation....that's based on nothing.

This is similar to the effect that women receive from their thirsty orbitors on social media.....every photo they put up is "liked" and even the fat ones will have a bull pen of thirsty men lined up ready and willing......thus the sense of her own value is erroneously pumped up......the feel good factor..........not to mention the fact that she's been told that she's a princess from Daddy....

The result is that you have hb5's thinking they are at least hb7's and hb6's believing they are hb8's...........

Their view of their own value is erroneous and based on external lies and feelings....

"Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken" Fight Club

The context is to observe that so much of "game" and "game tactics" come from women (see the Art of Seduction) and from Self Help........

"You are the prize" started as an affirmation........say it to yourself so many times in front of the mirror and it will come true. right? Yes granted I can understand those of you who will try to change the mentality of a "newcomer" who is putting women on a pedestal by saying "she is not the prize! you are the prize!" But is he being deluded.......

What if we were to go up to a Tramp in the street and say "hey mate, fvck all these haters. You are the fvcking man. You are living life on your terms not by society's. You are a a free bird. This makes you the prize!"

....So we convince the Tramp and he has this "feel good factor" and he walks around repeating to himself "I am the prize, I am the prize".......what will happen? He may now walk around with a swagger and start to delusionally think to himself "fvck all these losers, I am the prize...I'm giving value by my very presence..." .....He's now walking around with his new paradigm and it feels so fvcking good, right? .....he's changed his perception of himself but has the perception of the rest of the world changed when they look at him?

......they may say "he seems a very confident tramp. But he's still a tramp. He's got nothing to offer me".........and the tramp thinks to himself...."these idiots are not accepting my value. Well I'm going to just ghost them so!!!!"

Yes he "feels" better about himself because of his affirmation, nonetheless, he's now delusional with regards to his own "value"....

When a stranger approaches us (woman or man), we'll usually think:
1. Who is this person?
2. What do they want?
3. What's in it for me?

Everyone wants to know: What's in it for me??? What can this person bring to the table that will enhance my life???

I am the prize mentality is only authentic when it is authentic and not just an affirmation. If one's life is truly amazing and you would truly add value and enhance someone else's life by inviting them into your reality then sure, you can authentically think you are a prize (a genuine catch as they say)...............otherwise it's just chest thumping feel good factor which is delusional....

What is value?
Value is like currency. So often men are told here "you are the value".......or a poster will erroneously feel "wow I am adding value yet these ignorants cannot see it"......

Yet so often what we consider value maybe worthless to someone else. All currencies are not valuable in every country. A person may believe that his dollars are valuable.....and they are....in certain contexts and to certain people......however, when he tries to pay his restaurant bill on a trip to Scotland.......he may find that the restaurant does not value his dollars......

........the Scottish restaurant is looking for a different currency (a different value)....so what's to be done? do we say "fvck these fools for not accepting my value"? or do we give the currency that the restaurant is looking for......if we wish to dine there....

 

[zekko]

"I am the prize" is a little like the advice "Be confident". It's fairly worthless on the face of it, if it isn't based on something. You should have some reason to be confident, or else it's just like Mystery saying "We're all 10s".

"I am the prize" is useful for some guys who are used to putting the female on the pedestal. A man should not be looking UP at the woman, that's a terrible frame to be in. So it's good to remind the guy that he has value also.

Steady, relentless, self improvement should get you where you want to be - setting goals and setting out to attain them. When relationships succeed, women WILL have the attitude that you are the prize. If a woman has high interest in you, she knows you have value that she wants. I'm a firm believer in the idea that you should go for women who are high interest.

 

[9Volt]

These SS daily affirmation "life coaches" shouting they are the "prize" have less value than the one that comes in a Cracker Jack box.

 

[froznie]

I think you are thinking too much

If you see a girl you like. What the **** do you want?

Do you want to sleep with her? Do you want to have tea with her and discuss philosophy? Do you want her to help you with your math homework?

YOU WANT HER ***** DAMMIT

That's what your mindset should be! Not a ****ing book on philosophy and psychology

Approach her with only one thing in your mind: what you want.

Ya maybe if you don't have much practice you might look awkward or whatever, who knows, it doesn't matter. Don't try to manipulate her or control her. You want one thing. You can either get it from her or not. If not, then fine. If so, then nice. If she tells you to **** off and looks at you weird, just don't take it personally.

**** technique. **** game. Don't even think about it. All that stuff is just icing on the cake that comes with practice. Sure the more you do it the better you get at it. But don't force it.

If you are too intelligent, then that's a problem. Try to be stupid. Seriously, try it. It's fun. Be stupid for a bit. When you are stupid you don't think too much. Everything is just more clear when you're stupid. Just don't let yourself get manipulated. Some girls have it in their minds that ***** comes at a price. **** that.

 

[guru1000]

Reykhel, great thread as usual. Let’s delve into this “value” concept:

We should begin with a distinction between extrinsic and intrinsic value.

A man who had failed consistently with most women may hold no extrinsic value. That is, he provides nothing to the sexual marketplace of value and thus is met with repeated failure. So this man comes to SoSuave and is taught he is the prize to be won! So this man goes back out to the trenches with his new awareness, but, even though some women might admire his confidence, he, again, is met with repeated rejection.

This particular man is different than other men though. Because when he is apprised that he is the prize, something awakes in him. His consciousness expands. He thinks to himself, “I am better than what reality has taught me. I am indeed great. The world just has not recognized this yet, but they will.”

First, cognitive dissonance between “the prize” and the “repeated rejections” ensues. Following, a deep yearning and calling to get extrinsically better awakens. Now the man vehemently begins his journey toward self-improvement.

I was lucky to understand my intrinsic value at a very young age. Most men never will. Some men need this type of consciousness awoken before they can act. Some men despite their being apprised they are the prize, will never incite this type of consciousness/mental paradigm to act and improve.

IF we could reach out to just some men and awaken this hibernating giant whom resides within them, we have done well.

 

[BeExcellent]

Reykhel, great thread as usual. Let’s delve into this “value” concept:

We should begin with a distinction between extrinsic and intrinsic value.

A man who had failed consistently with most women may hold no extrinsic value. That is, he provides nothing to the sexual marketplace of value and thus is met with repeated failure. So this man comes to SoSuave and is taught he is the prize to be won! So this man goes back out to the trenches with his new awareness, but, even though some women might admire his confidence, he, again, is met with repeated rejection.

This particular man is different than other men though. Because when he is apprised that he is the prize, something awakes in him. His consciousness expands. He thinks to himself, “I am better than what reality has taught me. I am indeed great. The world just has not recognized this yet, but they will.”

First, cognitive dissonance between “the prize” and the “repeated rejections” ensues. Following, a deep yearning and calling to get extrinsically better awakens. Now the man vehemently begins his journey toward self-improvement.

I was lucky to understand my intrinsic value at a very young age. Most men never will. Some men need this type of consciousness awoken before they can act. Some men despite their being apprised they are the prize, will never incite this type of consciousness/mental paradigm to act and improve.

IF we could reach out to just some men and awaken this hibernating giant whom resides within them, we have done well.

To expand on the extrinsic versus intrinsic issue, which is spot on, we must all expand our self awareness to recognize how we are perceived by others in the marketplace.

I didn't know I was pretty as a teen and therefore didn't understand the value society attaches to "pretty". I learned this in my 20s. But I already had a strong sense of self that came from inside me even without the pretty part.

When you have a strong intrinsic sense of self and sense of what you bring to the table it doesn't hurt when someone doesn't choose you and it also allows you to make choices and move forward through life with personal power.

If someone doesn't choose you, it isn't a reflection on you so much as you aren't the right person for them for whatever reason. The same is true when you are doing the choosing. You pick based on how well you like someone and based upon how well that other person brings what you want to the table.

When you know who you are and when you know you have something to offer you also know that you are not all things to all people. You understand that as two individuals sort things in relation to one another that a true match is rare. You become patient in the process because you understand and honor your own value.

You are internally validated. That is not to say life never disappoints you...rather the disappointments can no longer define you. YOU define you.

Some people never reach self awareness and never become self actualized. Those who are typically can see this trait in another person. Because of their own journey they recognize it in others.

 

[ImTheDoubleGreatest!]

You have a good take on this Reykhel. 'You are the prize' is a quote that is thrown around here a lot.

But there is another quote on here people have seem to have forgotten about that is distinct only to SoSuave:

'As you think, you shall become!'

 

[9Volt]

If a person must consistently remind themselves and attempt to have others just "believe" what a "valuable prize" they are, they aren't a valuable prize at all.

 

[bigneil]

When girls in the backroom are all talking about how hot you are, you are the prize.

When you are clearly the biggest and strongest man in the room, you are the prize.

When you earned more in the past year/month/day than anyone else in the room, you are the prize.

When you live with your mommy and hope to be pretty enough to get that girl to call back and love you for you, you are 17.

 

[Serenity]

Internal value: "What is of value to me?"
External value: "What is of value to others?"

We can believe ourselves to be as valuable as we want, but it means nothing if others do not agree. Telling ourselves we are the prize means nothing if most others disagree, which is why real change is often needed to gain actual value. Often a guy doesn't do anything that is of value to others, thinking he does will not change that fact. To be viewed as valuable he must provide something that others value, the last thing he should do is think his worthless actions holds value and not change them.

Telling someone that they're really valuable when they provide nothing of value does not change them, if anything it sabotages their motivation to make real improvements.

 

[Young OG]

You can't just think your the prize. You have to make yourself the prize through self improvement. Many guys can tell themselves there the prize, but it's only putting a band aid over it. You need to rip that band aid off and fix what's underneath it to actually become the real prize.

 

[Killakittie]

You are the prize effectively translates to having self respect, self love, and healthy enforced boundaries.

It is communicated via action, and body language. Those around you, including women pick up on it overtly, and make subconscious evaluations on your worth and value. Anyone who has no boundaries or self respect can't be the prize. People don't value people who don't value themselves.

It's not a single mindset. It must be through and through a way of life.

 

[ChristopherColumbus]

You hear "you are the prize" being thrown about in so many threads, but is it coming from a place of.....

1. Wishfull thinking

2. Coming from a place of authenticity

If you google "I am the prize" you'll see that it's written in both men's and women's "dating advice" blogs. Blogs that are there to make money. There's even a photo in google images from some mangina who states "women, take the pressure of yourself when dating. He has to impress you while dating, not the other way around (then in big capitals) YOU ARE THE PRIZE"........so you can imagine the women being told that will feel all pumped up and feel better about themselves.....from this external validation....that's based on nothing.

This is similar to the effect that women receive from their thirsty orbitors on social media.....every photo they put up is "liked" and even the fat ones will have a bull pen of thirsty men lined up ready and willing......thus the sense of her own value is erroneously pumped up......the feel good factor..........not to mention the fact that she's been told that she's a princess from Daddy....

The result is that you have hb5's thinking they are at least hb7's and hb6's believing they are hb8's...........

Their view of their own value is erroneous and based on external lies and feelings....

"Sticking feathers up your butt does not make you a chicken" Fight Club

The context is to observe that so much of "game" and "game tactics" come from women (see the Art of Seduction) and from Self Help........

"You are the prize" started as an affirmation........say it to yourself so many times in front of the mirror and it will come true. right? Yes granted I can understand those of you who will try to change the mentality of a "newcomer" who is putting women on a pedestal by saying "she is not the prize! you are the prize!" But is he being deluded.......

What if we were to go up to a Tramp in the street and say "hey mate, fvck all these haters. You are the fvcking man. You are living life on your terms not by society's. You are a a free bird. This makes you the prize!"

....So we convince the Tramp and he has this "feel good factor" and he walks around repeating to himself "I am the prize, I am the prize".......what will happen? He may now walk around with a swagger and start to delusionally think to himself "fvck all these losers, I am the prize...I'm giving value by my very presence..." .....He's now walking around with his new paradigm and it feels so fvcking good, right? .....he's changed his perception of himself but has the perception of the rest of the world changed when they look at him?

......they may say "he seems a very confident tramp. But he's still a tramp. He's got nothing to offer me".........and the tramp thinks to himself...."these idiots are not accepting my value. Well I'm going to just ghost them so!!!!"

Yes he "feels" better about himself because of his affirmation, nonetheless, he's now delusional with regards to his own "value"....

When a stranger approaches us (woman or man), we'll usually think:
1. Who is this person?
2. What do they want?
3. What's in it for me?

Everyone wants to know: What's in it for me??? What can this person bring to the table that will enhance my life???

I am the prize mentality is only authentic when it is authentic and not just an affirmation. If one's life is truly amazing and you would truly add value and enhance someone else's life by inviting them into your reality then sure, you can authentically think you are a prize (a genuine catch as they say)...............otherwise it's just chest thumping feel good factor which is delusional....

What is value?
Value is like currency. So often men are told here "you are the value".......or a poster will erroneously feel "wow I am adding value yet these ignorants cannot see it"......

Yet so often what we consider value maybe worthless to someone else. All currencies are not valuable in every country. A person may believe that his dollars are valuable.....and they are....in certain contexts and to certain people......however, when he tries to pay his restaurant bill on a trip to Scotland.......he may find that the restaurant does not value his dollars......

........the Scottish restaurant is looking for a different currency (a different value)....so what's to be done? do we say "fvck these fools for not accepting my value"? or do we give the currency that the restaurant is looking for......if we wish to dine there....

Yes, good point. There is no point in being delusional. Nor, for that matter, is there any point in being realistic. The aspiring DJ needs to find the.. 'goldilocks zone', where he recognizes his reality, yet is also striving for the ideal, which is unfolding from within himself. In this zone, he will not be deluded, nor will he be depressed... he will just be the best he can be at any given moment. As for currency, it should be gold.

 

[Reykhel]

If you truly are "the prize" (i.e. a great catch), then surely any women that you would want to invite into your
world, surely must see herself (and be) authentically "the prize" (i.e a great catch) too.....

Surely anyone who is dumpster diving does not authentically feel they are "the prize". Unless we are to contextualize where and
with whom one is the prize.

A Prince will not dine in a pig trough.

Necessitous men with delusions of their own value, are only the prize in their own minds.

It's like the worker who's called in to have a chat with the boss about their performance. They are in shock. The bottom lip starts to tremble. They believed they were doing such a great job. But they lacked the critical analyzing skills that one needs in order to truly assess one's strengths and weaknesses. They never really had a true understanding of how their performance related to expectations.

So many business fail because the entrepreneur knows nothing about value. They know nothing about their clients needs. There was an article asking people the reasons why they started a business/wanted to start a business and most of the reasons given where superficial and about the person himself (not about passion or wanting to actually give value/enhance people's live's). Most businesses fail because of a failure to know the market and the clients needs.

"If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battle."

 

[devilkingx2]

the point of thinking you are the prize is that you're supposed to not focus so much on impressing whatever girl you think is a princess this week and that you should also keep in mind what you want and if she's making a good impression on you.

like if a girl is a total b!tch you may wonder what you could've done to get her but sometimes the question you should be asking is "why would I even want a girl like that?"

 

[fastlife]

The problem with the premise of this thread is the idea that 1.) Women are capable of accurately discerning real value from displays of value and 2.) Women recognize value in the same way a man would (emotionally vs. logically/feeling vs. cost-benefit). This simply isn't the case. I go more in depth on that discrepancy here:

• We can pretty accurately state that women will only sleep with men whose value she perceives to be higher than her own. Therefore game is the ability to convince a girl, through behavior, verbals, or passive indicators (looks, social proof, body language, etc.) that your value is higher than hers.

Arousal happens on a preconscious level; the prefrontal cortex--the part of the brain responsible for planning, long term decision making, memory consolidation, judgement, social self-monitoring--evolved 200,000 years ago. Our humanoid ancestors were having sex for millennia prior to that.

It's totally arrogant to think that our lymbic system is capable of distinguishing honest signals (i.e. you actually are alpha) from mimicry (i.e. a PUA pretending to be alpha)--at least given the short period of time necessary from meeting a girl to bedding her. Like you said, your 'innergame' can be totally fvcked up, but if you hit the right buttons--i.e. the girl perceives your value as higher than her own--then she'll still sleep with you.

In a perfect world, your lifestyle would be at all times witnessed by a tribe of >80 people, so that girls would have the most possible information on which to base their perception of your genetic value. We simply don't have that luxury in modern life, at least after high school or college, for girls to make an accurate evaluation. Therefore, if, say, you move cities (no more social circle), your friends all get married or wifed up and all of your boy's gf's friends she could introduce you to are older than peak fertility (no more social circle), you work in an environment isolated from females you find attractive (no more social circle), you have a very narrow window in which to demonstrate your genetic value to any females you come across in your day to day. So let's pretend we're not going for 4-6's on POF--and say we want 8-9's in the 18-21 y/o age group where there is 0 overlap in our social cirlces. Well, you might have a bar where you have tons of social proof--everyone loves you and girls there vouch for you--well, within that specific context you could just go up to girls and say, "Are you married?" and be balls deep within a couple hours. You didn't need active game, since your passive game (indicators of your genetic fitness) filled up enough of the picture for the girl to feel like she could form an accurate perception of your value.

But let's say that bar closes. Let's say your buddies are in relationships and won't hit the town with you anymore. Let's say you see a solid 9--but she's surrounded by her tribe and you're the outsider. Let's say you only have 10 minutes to strike her interest--and until she can form an accurate picture of your value YOU ARE A LIABILITY--since she already has super high value and if you're not actually cool (even if you look cool & have six pack abs) then she is jeopardizing her value in the tribe. No matter how solid your frame is or how good you look, if you stand on the wall looking like James Bond, she will not risk social ostracization to come up and game you. It won't happen--maybe a drunk 6 whose batting out of her league--or girls with super low internal value (if a smokeshow approaches you then there's a very good chance she has BPD Field-tested).

But when you approach that 9, and she's surrounded by all her friends and orbiters and you're by yourself and might be a murderer or rapist--and you approach her--then it's her onus to have you display your genetic fitness as rapidly as possible. Sh1t test. Sh1t test. Sh1t test. Well, if you're not an 'overcompensating dweeb' you reject yourself. She's just a b1tch and won't immediately bow to your superior value (or the value your ego convinces itself of). But what if you could pass sh1t tests (proof of your genetic fitness), what if that same girl had just seen you making out with another girl (proof of your genetic fitness), what if you told that girl a cool story about what you did last night (proof of your genetic fitness)? Well, then there's a good chance she'll be the sweetest, most submissive girl ever & might ditch her friends and risk seeming like a slvt because you DEMONSTRATED enough value--actively--using active game--and risked seeming like a TRY-HARD, LOSER, PUA to give her an accurate, full picture of your genetic fitness.

Then you can sit back and let her chase

So there's Societal Value (generally based on your logical utility) and there's Mating Value (generally based on your demonstration of genetic fitness, which often runs counterpart to Societal Value). Then you throw in an imperfect observer (women), who are only ever able to form an incomplete working model of your value (be that societal or genetic) from an incomplete set of facts. Of course, we as men, would love for women to value us according to the things we value about ourselves and to validate those qualities--but even if every woman loves you, then there's still some problematical elements to letting that determine your value.

Take Fifty Shade of Grey. It's outsold The Great Gatsby, Catch-22, Moby ****, basically every great work of literature ever written; the vast majority of its consumer base was female. Does that make it the penultimate achievement of English literature? Isaac Newton probably couldn't get laid at Arizona State--does that diminish his value to humanity?

And then take your tramp analogy--the delusionally overconfident tramp has a better chance to lay hotter girls than the kind, upstanding, humble, slightly shy IT whiz kid who works out 5 nights a week, drives a nice car, and volunteers on the weekend. One of my good friends is the definition of a tramp--even as his entire life is falling apart and he hasn't showered in a week, he, for the 5 or so years I know him, has always had a roster of women lol. A HUGE key women use to form their perception of your value--second only to other the perception of other women--is your self-perception of your own value. Delusional or not.

 

[zekko]

And then take your tramp analogy--the delusionally overconfident tramp has a better chance to lay hotter girls than the kind, upstanding, humble, slightly shy IT whiz kid who works out 5 nights a week, drives a nice car, and volunteers on the weekend. One of my good friends is the definition of a tramp--even as his entire life is falling apart and he hasn't showered in a week, he, for the 5 or so years I know him, has always had a roster of women lol. A HUGE key women use to form their perception of your value--second only to other the perception of other women--is your self-perception of your own value. Delusional or not.

If your tramp friend has always had a roster of women for the entire five years you've known him, I would say perhaps his self confidence isn't really that delusional? I mean, it isn't bragging if you can back it up, right?

I think when it comes to delusional overconfidence, there are a lot of variation by the individual. How does his overconfidence manifest itself in his personality? Does it come across as charming, or is he just a d!ckhead?Does he have anything to actually be confident of? Do women find him physically appealing? Does his confidence lead to bold action? Generally speaking, positive thinking will get you further than negative thinking.

Humility is a good trait, but when you combine it with being shy, you run the risk of timidity. "He who hesitates is lost", as they say. If a woman likes a certain guy who is quiet, she will often him out, make it easier for him. But fortune favors the bold.

 

[fastlife]

If your tramp friend has always had a roster of women for the entire five years you've known him, I would say perhaps his self confidence isn't really that delusional? I mean, it isn't bragging if you can back it up, right?

I think when it comes to delusional overconfidence, there are a lot of variation by the individual. How does his overconfidence manifest itself in his personality? Does it come across as charming, or is he just a d!ckhead?Does he have anything to actually be confident of? Do women find him physically appealing? Does his confidence lead to bold action? Generally speaking, positive thinking will get you further than negative thinking.

Humility is a good trait, but when you combine it with being shy, you run the risk of timidity. "He who hesitates is lost", as they say. If a woman likes a certain guy who is quiet, she will often him out, make it easier for him. But fortune favors the bold.

His confidence, at least in the time I've known him, is simply rooted in and of itself--kind of an irreducible fact, based in ignorance to any alternative mode of being. I mean, on an interpersonal level, he's a great friend & conversationalist, but you'd be hard pressed to pinpoint any external area of his life that would be the basis for that kind of confidence. For him, even the fact that he has women is more just a simple fact and not anything remarkable or noteworthy.

At a certain level, confidence and self-acceptance = value, in & of itself. You can argue over whether it's delusional according to whatever metrics you use to measure worth.