Women only training hours at my school's gym

thunder_god

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thunder_god

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Danger said:
On the .pdf.....Page 4....number 6. This is a clear violation of the human rights code as it is discrimination based upon gender.
Ya I saw that too, only problem is its from 1994, so I'm not sure if they have an updated version.
 

thunder_god

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I'm also thinking about creating a petition but not sure how to write one up.
 

zekko

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Danger said:
On the .pdf.....Page 4....number 6. This is a clear violation of the human rights code as it is discrimination based upon gender.
Seems pretty cut and dried.
 

thunder_god

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Espi said:
Thunder god another thought:

If you haven't already done this:

Take out your cell phone and make a photo and a video of the women's only sign. Feel free to post on youtube.com.

In the video, feel free to provide a brief narration: "This is thunder god, UT student, standing in front of______. The date is_____ and this sign has been present for ______ weeks. This sign clearly discriminates the school's written policy on gender discrimination and I have lodged a formal complaint against______, requesting that the sign and the discriminatory policy be terminated immediately. I have also requested via a certified letter/email that_____formally acknowledge my complaint, but I have yet to receive a response from him/her."

Point is to DOCUMENT everything. The photo and vid would be effective when attaching to an email, or meeting with the decisionmaker.

I found this http://physical.utoronto.ca/FitnessAndRecreation/Drop_In_Programs/Women_only_hours.aspx

http://physical.utoronto.ca/docs/dr...-fees-forms/scc-women-only-hours.pdf?sfvrsn=0

I'm going to head to the gym in a little bit and take a photo while I'm there.

I could definitely use some help guys with writing up the next complaint letter. The person who's contact info I got has the title of assistant manager at the strength and conditioning centre. I got her email address from one of her employees. I told the employee I was looking for the contact info of the person responsible for creating the gym policies here and they gave me her contact info. She also has her office right in front of the gym as well. Should I try and ask for her superior at the main office? Only problem I can see is if I do that, they will try and get me to meet with them right at that moment and I wouldn't have any documentation to leave a trail nor would I be prepared to discuss the matter with them on the spot.
 

zekko

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Espi said:
Why are the windows and doors completely covered? Lemme guess: to keep the pervo men from looking in and oogling the women while they swim, right??? Cause the boys at the University of Toronto are pigs who will harass women swimmers???

As a man I am angered and offended. I consider this policy to be highly offensive toward men. This goes beyond discriminatory language.

:cuss: :cuss: :cuss:
No kidding, this is beyond discrimination. This is actually insulting.

And why aren't men offered all these special benefits? Because if men are embarrassed about their physique, then they are just told to svck it up - women don't want to look at your ugly @ss anyway, lol.
 

Jaylan

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Do what you want kid, but based on the area your college is located in, I could see this blowing up in your face in terms of attracting women during your college career.

Reps are valuable depending on your school (especially if the campus isnt very large). You can easily end with having chicks think you are a whiner, a perv, or someone who rocks the boat to take digs at women.

Do you OP. But I still think you have better uses of your time at school. If women only gyms are able to exist, and have beaten these cases in the past, I dont see your case standing much of a chance even on a school campus.

In any meeting, theyll simply show the fact that you and other men have plentiful hours to use the gym, and that will be the end of it.
 

speed dawg

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Jaylan said:
Do what you want kid, but based on the area your college is located in, I could see this blowing up in your face in terms of attracting women during your college career.
LULZ at you attempting to be superior.
 

Maximus Rex

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Jaylan said:
Reps are valuable depending on your school (especially if the campus isnt very large). You can easily end with having chicks think you are a whiner, a perv, or someone who rocks the boat to take digs at women.
Who wants to be with a chick who only wants to be with you on her terms? This is all about the equality they so called wanted. If the roles were reversed, the women on campus would be all up in arms. This is credence to the notion that women aren't interested in equality, but supremacy and special privileges.

Here's what I'm not understanding, how can this gym charge thunder_god at a full time rate, but only grant him part-time access? It would be one thing is the guys were charged cheaper membership fee due to the restricted hours, but they're not. It seems that this school not only wants to encourage women to work out buy not only cutting into men's workout time, but it seems that the school is more than willing to take the male students money, in other to make up for short falls in the budget. The sh*t is really ****ed up.
 

Jaylan

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speed dawg said:
LULZ at you attempting to be superior.
How am I trying to sound superior by calling a college kid, a kid? Most people in college are 18 to 23. I consider teens and early 20s folks to be kids.

Troll elsewhere.
Maximus Rex said:
Who wants to be with a chick who only wants to be with you on her terms? This is all about the equality they so called wanted. If the roles were reversed, the women on campus would be all up in arms. This is credence to the notion that women aren't interested in equality, but supremacy and special privileges.

Here's what I'm not understanding, how can this gym charge thunder_god at a full time rate, but only grant him part-time access? It would be one thing is the guys were charged cheaper membership fee due to the restricted hours, but they're not. It seems that this school not only wants to encourage women to work out buy not only cutting into men's workout time, but it seems that the school is more than willing to take the male students money, in other to make up for short falls in the budget. The sh*t is really ****ed up.
When it comes to women, college is about getting puzzy. That was my point. Its not about worrying about dumb gym hours.

The gym ish isnt worth stressing over if the likely outcome is that OP changes nothing and gets brushed aside.
 

donking

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I agree. I would spend more time in college pounding chicks than trying to fight the system.

I understand it's very frustrating but unless you convince 20+ more people (male or female) to join your side and get it into the local paper, you probably gonna fail. Strength in numbers bro.

Focus your time and energy on building yourself up first. Once you are strong, then try to change the system. As a college student, you are by definition weak, since you rely on this institution. They know they own you.

Keep your eye on the long game.
 

thunder_god

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Espi said:
If it were me:

I would email her directly and be sure to include a read-receipt. Give her 3 days to respond. If no response, email her again. Wait 3 days.

If no response to the second email, I would print the email and mail it to her via certified letter. I would then send a 3rd email indicating that since you have emailed her twice with no response, you have sent a certified letter. I would end that 3rd email with a three-day deadline date for her to respond; indicate that if she doesn't respond in 3 days, you will lodge your complaint to her superior.

I would also be sure to attach the photo/video and Internet link in ALL emails and correspondence.

NO typos or grammar errors. A professional, business letter.

Since she is the person who is responsible for all decisions at the gym, I would not ask to speak to her boss, unless of course she fails to respond.

I would view this as the first step of a process. Keep in mind that this person that I'm recommending you email was likely responsible for enacting the women's-only policy to begin with.

She will likely either ignore you or defer you to someone beneath her or above her.

I agree 100% about NOT meeting her face to face. Don't do that, in my opinion. Keep everything in WRITING so that you can keep everything DOCUMENTED.

If you end up meeting face to face, let her know (don't ask) that you're going to be recording the meeting via your cell phone, strictly for documentation. Then take out your cell phone, put it on the table in clear view, press play, and proceed. If she refuses to allow you to record the meeting, smile, stand up, say, "Not a problem. I'll just convey my complaint to you via email. Thank you for your time." Then leave. Be polite and respectful about it.

I'll again emphasize the importance of documenting. It's a very effective way of getting people to take you seriously. If you do choose to meet face to face--or if she requests to meet face to face, it is VERY important that you document every word of that meeting, and that you immediately follow up that face-to-face meeting with a read-receipt email, recapping what was discussed and the outcome of that meeting.

Here's one way that I would word a follow-up email from a face-to-face meeting:

"Dear______:

Thank you for meeting with me today and for agreeing to record our discussion regarding my formal discrimination complaint regarding the women's-only gym hours at the University of Toronto.

To recap the record of our meeting, I explained that_(you could quote from page 4, sections 6 and 8 here)____________________ and you responded by saying_________________. It's clear to me that we disagree about the women's-only gym hours, and I can respect that.

Please feel free to respond to this email by ___ a.m./p.m. on ___________ if you have any additional comments or clarifications on this matter, as I am taking the next step to resolve this issue by lodging the same complaint, along with the comments you made during our aforementioned meeting, to __________________ on the date of ___________.

Thank you for your time."


I'm going to take awhile before I help you draft up another variation of a complaint letter. I'm a bit perturbed now and want to wait before I think of how I can help draft a formal complaint. I don't write well I'm angry! :mad:

Maybe some of the other guys will chip in some ideas, too.
But I already emailed her. That email response was from the assistant manager who I was told by an employee is responsible for the weight room policy. I wonder if she was also responsible for creating the women only swim hours. Should I just go ahead and file a complaint letter with the university then.

Also these were taken earlier today when I went to the gym.

 

TarantulaHawk

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thunder_god said:
But I already emailed her. That email response was from the assistant manager who I was told by an employee is responsible for the weight room policy. I wonder if she was also responsible for creating the women only swim hours. Should I just go ahead and file a complaint letter with the university then.

Also these were taken earlier today when I went to the gym.

If your school has Muslim girls who attend it as a "minority" group the school may be trying to cater to them and their religion. Most likely why the pool windows were covered. The school probably can't say Muslim women only hours but judging by the pic the girl looks Muslim. They probably don't care if it's just women of all races and religions at the time but it might be something due to some law or even a lawsuit in regards to Muslim students who are female. Especially since tensions are strained with the Muslims of the world and with the countries current administration etc. The school may have to have women's only hours.

I'm only guessing by the pics you showed but in all honesty I don't understand what the big deal is. You should be more concerned with your education and meeting chicks rather than worrying about women only gym hours.

It may come back to bite you especially if everyone finds out it was you or no one else cares etc. I personally wouldn't give a crap and not bother with it. There's much more important things to worry about than an hour or so of women only in the gym.
 

zekko

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Jaylan said:
Do what you want kid, but based on the area your college is located in, I could see this blowing up in your face in terms of attracting women during your college career.
You're telling this guy not to protest what he sees as unfair because it might cost him some chick being attracted to him. That's pretty much standard stereotypical "nice guy" behavior - in other words, appeasement. Can we put the pvssy on the pedestal any higher here?

Anyway Jaylan, you're always saying that it does no good to discuss men's rights issues on these forums because it's all just talk. Well, now someone has stepped forward to actually do something about these double standard policies - he lodges a complaint, and you still have a problem with it. What gives?

donking said:
I understand it's very frustrating but unless you convince 20+ more people (male or female) to join your side and get it into the local paper, you probably gonna fail. Strength in numbers bro.
I agree that thunder god should be talking to some other male students and see if there is anyone else that shares his point of view, or that might be convinced to join him. As you say, strength in numbers.
 

thunder_god

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Espi said:
Much more forthcoming from Espi on this.

For now, Thunder god click the link below. It's very similar to the complaint flow chart you linked earlier in the thread but I personally consider the link below easier for me to read and work with you.

Let me know which step you're on. I'm thinking you're on Step 3?

I'm working on a letter now.

http://www.viceprovoststudents.utor...es/rights-and-responsibilities/stepbystep.htm
I'm on step 2 right now. So far I've only contacted the assistant manager who is responsible for creating that policy. So I guess my next step would be to contact the faculty of kinesiology and physical education then? How should I write my letter to the department head now?
 

amoka

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Kudos to Espi for such a devotional work. I really like your input on this matter. Great job.
 

zekko

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I really think the school could get further with a "we want to let Muslim women use the gym" excuse than the "we want to promote gender balanced use" bit.
 

TarantulaHawk

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zekko said:
I really think the school could get further with a "we want to let Muslim women use the gym" excuse than the "we want to promote gender balanced use" bit.
From the picture the op posted it looks like they're trying to not discriminate against Muslim women but don't want to come out and say it to cause a possible shtstorm due to already high tensions in the world. The picture could just be explained away as a woman rather than specifically saying Muslim women which would explain why the pool windows were covered as the op mentioned.

It's not a battle the op gains much from even if he succeeds he could stand to lose more in the end but it's his decision.
 

Create Reality

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Honestly, the whole concept is preposterous!

I almost can't fathom the ego flopping. What kind of kiss-ass chastity is going on here!?
 
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