Women are a Catch 22

[Aristippus]

Remember this. If you're in a live-in situation or married, your woman might start whining that you don't do the things you used to when you were dating. Although I definitely recommend keeping things fresh and not letting things stagnate, sometimes the extra financial demands and burdens heaped on a man's shoulders who is in a live-in relationship with a woman simply put him in a financial bind where he CAN'T afford it, even if he'd LOVE to.

You see, on the one hand, women want you to support them financially, and on the other, women want to be able to do the things you did together while dating. Their lack of insight and understanding and just plain common sense doesn't allow them to see that the reason you were able to go out more and do more together to begin with was because you had extra income you could devote to that because YOU WEREN'T SPENDING ANY OF YOUR MONEY SUPPORTING HER.

Even if she's contributing, women incur extra expenses and you still wind up spending more money on day to day expenses than if you were single. So in a lot of cases what happens is the woman is receiving the financial benefits of a long-term relationship minus the excitement she used to have from dating. In cases where women cheat, the man she's cheating with is reaping all of the benefits of the dating phase (the extra income to go out and do things, without the burdens of being financially involved with the woman, which is what allowed him to have the extra income to begin with).

So you either have a couple of scenarios that play out often. If she's a loyal woman, she simply is less enthusiastic about the relationship and might whine occasionally about not going out like you used to. On the other, if she's not the loyal kind, she cheats, and basically, the guy she's cheating with is reaping the benefits on YOUR DIME because you laid the financial groundwork by supporting the live-in girlfriend or wife. All of your resources are going into supporting her, with nothing left for recreation, while he swoops in and gets to reap all of the benefits of your hard work with minimal investment.

This is NOT condoning going after married women or women in relationships. This is for men either in a live-in relationship or considering being in one. There are things you can do even if you're on a tight budget to keep things fresh and new and exciting. That's for another topic. The main thing here is, keep these other things in mind if you're considering the live-in relationship. This is a warning for men to either exercise caution before entering into a live-in situation or for men who are already in live-in relationships, to take measures to address this issue.

Just remember, women aren't the most reasonable/logical creatures. While you might expect, and rightly so, to get appreciation for all of your hard work and sacrifices, you might wind up instead, getting either resentment or a bored girlfriend/wife. This is simply a warning. I'll start another topic soon about how to keep things fresh in a relationship.

 

[PlayHer Man]

You should not be supporting a woman financially in the first place.. even in a live-in situation.

Your personal goals should always come before anything a woman wants. If you're supporting a woman financially you are p*ssy-whipped and have little power in your relationship.

 

[ecko280]

Great Post Aristippus. I never thought of it like that.

 

[rearea]

I have never seen a woman complain of the things you mention. I hear countless women complain that their husbands become detached and mean however.

Men are inherently selfish. It doesnt matter his upbringing or his personality. I dont date other than casual dating because guys do what they can to "win you over" and then give up afterwards. They become mean, degrading and selfish and expect us women to roll over and deal with it because they think we are inferior beings. I would never expect a man to do every single thing for me in a relationship that he did while we were dating. However, once the honeymoon stage is over men expect to be catered to and they expect the relationship to shift to 80/20 with women putting in 80% of the work/men doing 20%. Then, they feel entitled to only giving 20%. **** men and their inherently selfish ways.

 

[EastWind]

I'd like to chip in something at this point that has always bothered me, this whole "doing things to keep the relationship fresh". It's just one of the many still-alive remnants of the "PUA" phase the whole scene went through.

You should be with a woman who considers you, as you are, without doing special extra out-of-your-daily-way things, "fresh" at all times. That's not to say that coming up with new ideas once in a while is a bad thing, but it should be done for you.

If you start out with the mindset "I should do something fresh every 12.29 days to keep her on her toes", that is a very slippery slope my friend.

If you can't find a woman willing to stay with you while just doing what you always do, that is another matter.

The whole "don't spend more because you're in a relationship" thing is just a subset of this basic thought.

 

[Aristippus]

I'd like to chip in something at this point that has always bothered me, this whole "doing things to keep the relationship fresh".

You should be with a woman who considers you, as you are, without doing special extra out-of-your-daily-way things, "fresh" at all times. That's not to say that coming up with new ideas once in a while is a bad thing, but it should be done for you.

If you start out with the mindset "I should do something fresh every 12.29 days to keep her on her toes", that is a very slippery slope my friend.

If you can't find a woman willing to stay with you while just doing what you always do, that is another matter.

You're assuming that I'm saying to do things to keep the marriage fun and enjoyable to win her approval. I'm saying that the average person's idea of what a relationship is, is bland at most and miserable at best. If you don't have extra money to do certain things to make the relationship more enjoyable, then there are things you can do for free and other things you can do for little money. It's not about impressing anyone. It's more about improving the quality of your relationships by spending quality time together.

I could care less about "keeping a woman on her toes". Some men are in relationships that started out very good but over time things eroded, mainly because of changes in circumstances and also because of lack of imagination. Throw in some female brainwashing on top of that and you can have some problems.

This is more or less explaining what can happen and why things can start going south in a situation that started off good. We're all familiar with the idea of moving on or out of a bad situation or not getting involved with a woman who isn't worth your time. There's definitely a time to walk away. No need to try to salvage a bad situation. In other cases, there are times where something that was good for a while can start becoming boring or can take a negative turn.

Men can most definitely experience this boredom. And I think men experience it more often than women. Women just vocalize it more than men do. In a situation where you love someone and she loves you it's worth making the effort to get things back to the way they were. The other option is to simply end every relationship at the first sign of things being less than ideal and either being a man who is dating/sleeping with several women at once, and doing this for life, or being someone who keeps getting into and out of monogamous relationships, with no intention of ever marrying, and doing this for life.

Nothing wrong with either one. I'm simply saying there's a third way. Not necessarily a better way. Just a different way from the first two. Some men love their wives/live-in girlfriends and also see that it's worth giving it a shot to make things better. Definitely no harm there. If it's unsalvageable and either he, or she, isn't happy, or they both are unhappy, then it's time to move on. I would say that it's probably even more common for the man to be unhappy in a relationship. If that's the case, he should leave. If there's a few minor things that he would like to see change that could make the relationship better for both him and her, then I think it's worth doing, whether it's making things more like the way they were or improving on things.

 

[Aristippus]

p.s. I still stand by the idea that women, because of brainwashing and the rampant entitlement mentality can be unjustified in their demands or complaints. That's where you have to put your foot down. If she has a large amount of good qualities and the good outweighs the bad, then you can train her. Sometimes, the man has fallen into the same old routine. The idea is if you've fallen into a rut, there's things you can do. Never think of a woman as faultless and also, never think that things are hopeless and that there's nothing you can do in a situation where the relationship starts to deteriorate but you both care about each other.

 

[Aristippus]

Great post. I literally just got out of my marriage at the end of last week. I think my marriage was one of the finest examples of "The Institution" if you'll forgive the parlance. We did keep things fresh and kept costs down. My wife cut her own hair - she hasn't visited a salon in years. That's just an example. But there are always costs. For instance we lived in a cramped 1 bedroom apartment that would have been fine for a single person. We were saving money but it was a tight space. She talked me into moving into a bigger place. We could afford it, sure. And eventually I agreed to it for myriad reasons. But it was as usual about a woman's comfort vs. what we really needed.

Ironically I'm the one who got bored and restless, but that wasn't really her fault. One woman just wasn't enough for me.

Spade,

Yeah, there have been times where I've gotten restless too. Even though I have a good woman. And not because I wanted other women! Simply because going from being as free as a bird, doing what you want to the moment you think it, to still having freedom, but having to consult with another person or compromise, was in some ways "cramping my style", for lack of a better way to put it.

In relationships, you have to get the other person's input sometimes because if you don't, it becomes a very one-sided deal and is unfair to her. To be fair to both, you both have to give in a little for each other. She has to consult with you too. In the end, you make the final decision, but it isn't like the days where you didn't need to discuss anything with anyone, other than calling up some friends and inviting them with you.

It's not like you have to discuss everything 100% of the time. But if your decision to do this or that affects your finances in some way or if it affects how time is spent and you're talking about plans for 2 people, all of a sudden it isn't like the old days where 100% of the time you do what you want, when, with no discussion. Even if you're doing what you want most of the time and you're discussing the details 20% of the time, it still holds you back a bit. Anyway, enough of my rant. I definitely can put myself in your shoes.

 

[EastWind]

Spade,

Yeah, there have been times where I've gotten restless too. Even though I have a good woman. And not because I wanted other women! Simply because going from being as free as a bird, doing what you want to the moment you think it, to still having freedom, but having to consult with another person or compromise, was in some ways "cramping my style", for lack of a better way to put it.

In relationships, you have to get the other person's input sometimes because if you don't, it becomes a very one-sided deal and is unfair to her. To be fair to both, you both have to give in a little for each other. She has to consult with you too. In the end, you make the final decision, but it isn't like the days where you didn't need to discuss anything with anyone, other than calling up some friends and inviting them with you.

It's not like you have to discuss everything 100% of the time. But if your decision to do this or that affects your finances in some way or if it affects how time is spent and you're talking about plans for 2 people, all of a sudden it isn't like the old days where 100% of the time you do what you want, when, with no discussion. Even if you're doing what you want most of the time and you're discussing the details 20% of the time, it still holds you back a bit. Anyway, enough of my rant. I definitely can put myself in your shoes.

I can get behind that, but my ever-growing impression is that there are no women left that you should give one inch of leeway to, lest she decide there are more "alpha" guys than you out there.

 

[Aristippus]

I have never seen a woman complain of the things you mention. I hear countless women complain that their husbands become detached and mean however.

Men are inherently selfish. It doesnt matter his upbringing or his personality. I dont date other than casual dating because guys do what they can to "win you over" and then give up afterwards. They become mean, degrading and selfish and expect us women to roll over and deal with it because they think we are inferior beings. I would never expect a man to do every single thing for me in a relationship that he did while we were dating. However, once the honeymoon stage is over men expect to be catered to and they expect the relationship to shift to 80/20 with women putting in 80% of the work/men doing 20%. Then, they feel entitled to only giving 20%. **** men and their inherently selfish ways.

This isn't a direct reply to rearea. I refuse to respond directly to her and will ignore any future responses she has to this topic. This is just quoted to prove a point. There are plenty of places where she can have her voice and complain about men. We're on a men's forum so this isn't one of them. And I'd suggest not letting her derail a perfectly good topic by replying to her.

This statement might be true for maybe 5% of the women out there. I highly doubt she's part of that 5%. These are the 5% that always wind up with loser men. Again, bad choices on their part, so you can't feel totally sorry for them either. Here's the thing. She's probably part of the 80% of women that simply have unreasonable demands and then complain about men when they get tired of her sh*t and dump her.

They don't see it because they're blind to their own faults. They don't see their demands as unreasonable. OF COURSE he's supposed to pay my bills and take me everywhere with me contributing little or nothing, and I can simply sit there and look nice (even the ugly ones think they look nice). He has to put up with my disrespect and unreasonable behavior with a smile and be my little doormat. After all, I DESERVE IT!

Then she either meets a doormat and marries him and makes his life a living he!! or she has sex with a few men who she's extremely attracted to, but eventually they tire of her garbage and dump her. These could be genuine good guys who simply won't take her garbage, or they could be the types with low character. It doesn't matter. Maybe she's been with one type exclusively or both types. These types of women label both men of high character and low character together ,if they refuse to take her b.s., as jerks, scoundrels, etc etc.

Eventually she can even drive the doormat away with her nagging and demands, or she leaves him, sighing, "Where are all the real men?". Running from YOU! When these women complain about having to do "all of the work" it's usually about the same as a slave owner from the 1800's complaining about having to do "all of the work" because all of his slaves escaped. YEAH! Now the slave owner has to do the work on his own or PAY someone to do it! Oh, the horrors!

Most women are a victim of their own making. Either by making false claims of being a victim, simply because men refuse to meet their unrealistic, selfish demands, or in some cases even when they do, but enough is simply never enough. In other cases, they choose unwisely. In a small percentage of the cases, OK, yeah, maybe you did all of the right things and still wound up with a loser.

p.s. To the men reading this, please do me a favor and don't respond to any posts on this topic from angry women. If enough men would do this, they would shut up. Thank you.

 

[Burroughs]

The entitlement, capriciousness, and arrogance of modern women proves without a doubt that women are fit to be only the property of men to be ruled and guided by that man in law for all the days of her life....and she shall have no identity outside of that man ever.

 

[evan12]

I dont date other than casual dating

she is just like other women who come here occasionally , she is offering hits of easy sex so men in this forum may bomb her inbox with messages .