Why I think most relationships fail

[Slowhandluke]

Threat of death will keep things humming along.

Yes... yes it does... Also, the threat of going to jail for stealing also keeps a lot of people from stealing at their local CVS/walgreens/walmart.. and you see less stores closing. Society either through laws, ethnics, slvt shaming, etc.. etc.. have a profound effect on human behavior. We tell men to "do better".. "to workout"... "to be more successful", etc.. etc.. but yet we don't blame stores that close because of stealing, that they "need to do better".

 

[The Duke]

I see alot of threads where most advice is that she should respect you etc etc.

But I feel like most of this advice can be summed up in to just “LOVE YOURSELF”.

So what does this mean? When looking for a partner you need to know who you are, what you look for in a partner and obviously also have some sort of connection with that person. I would like to also listen to what my gut says about a woman im seeing.

I believe that relationships are as simple as setting certain boundaries, knowing who you are and being honest towards and about yourself. If you do not communicate this early on the possible future relationship wont last.

Most women also just want to feel heard from her emotional perspective, so my advice would be to just listen, rephrase what she is saying so she feels heard and dont give any logical advice. After that just make her feel held. By doing this you are already 1-0 ahead than most men, because most men just argue their logical perspective which causes alot of fights and her being unhappy and not understood in a relationship, which will make her leave you.

After making her emotional perspective feel understood you can tell your logical perspective which will make you also feel heard and happier in the relationship.

This is just the beginning, its important to have had bad times in a relationship and see how she will act according to her feelings at that moment. Does she cheat, will she cross boundaries you have set in the beginning? If so, then its up to you if you accept the crossing of boundaries or not. A good woman wont cross any boundaries as she respects them, mainly because you respect and love yourself. You are content being alone.

And yes, there are many good women out there. You just have to stop thinking with your **** and stop approaching women who know what the **** they are doing when they wear extremely tight clothes “just for herself”. These type of women are usually the women we as men notice and are attracted to.

What you have stated is valid, but it goes a lot deeper than that. It comes across as too simplistic and a little naive as posters afterwards expanded upon. Keeping things healthy in a long term relationship is the hardest thing you will ever do.

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

This is on a par with guys trying to figure out what a woman wants, when she herself often has no idea what she really wants.

But if you can figure out what she needs, you can bind her more tightly to you than most men would imagine.

 

[Vanderdonck]

Yes... yes it does... Also, the threat of going to jail for stealing also keeps a lot of people from stealing at their local CVS/walgreens/walmart.. and you see less stores closing. Society either through laws, ethnics, slvt shaming, etc.. etc.. have a profound effect on human behavior. We tell men to "do better".. "to workout"... "to be more successful", etc.. etc.. but yet we don't blame stores that close because of stealing, that they "need to do better".

Yes. Also the threat of death for people who steal works even better. Same as death penalty for misbehavior, political speech, organizing, religious practice, etc. Amazing what it will do.

 

[Clockwerk50]

This is on a par with guys trying to figure out what a woman wants, when she herself often has no idea what she really wants.

But if you can figure out what she needs, you can bind her more tightly to you than most men would imagine.

I agree with your information. However, I think people would get more out of your post if you could elaborate how they can find these needs or what these needs are so they cast a wider net during the courtship process.

It might be out of the scope of this thread though.

 

[Clockwerk50]

Yes... yes it does... Also, the threat of going to jail for stealing also keeps a lot of people from stealing at their local CVS/walgreens/walmart.. and you see less stores closing. Society either through laws, ethnics, slvt shaming, etc.. etc.. have a profound effect on human behavior. We tell men to "do better".. "to workout"... "to be more successful", etc.. etc.. but yet we don't blame stores that close because of stealing, that they "need to do better".

Stores do get better. They get CCTV equipment, security systems, and time-locked safes.

Again, insinuating that only males need to improve to increase their SMV and find a better sexual partner is laughable since women also do. Just because we are males doesn’t mean that we have the right to reproduce, and suggesting to beat women up into submission for it to happen is on par with colonialism.

 

[AmsterdamAssassin]

I agree with your information. However, I think people would get more out of your post if you could elaborate how they can find these needs or what these needs are so they cast a wider net during the courtship process.

It might be out of the scope of this thread though.

Yes, that would fall outside the scope, but the main thing is that if you can figure out what someone needs (preferably before they even realise they need it), they give you control over their lives. In more ways than just the romantic aspect.
The main problem is that it's especially prone to abuse by the unethical.

 

[Slowhandluke]

Same as death penalty for misbehavior, political speech, organizing, religious practice, etc. Amazing what it will do.

yes, if you want to limit political speech, then imposing the death penalty for political speech would do it. same with religion. what's your point? do you hate religion or something?

society has a profound effect on the average person. From the way people act, talk, marry, divorce, etc... at the end of the day, society shapes most people lives. in society where marriage is taken more seriously, people don't divorce and people on average are happier. Men in these societies rarely tell other men to "get better" (basically, implying most men suck). And there are less women crying that they can't find a man . funny how that works, right?

 

[Divorced w 3]

You guys ever have a woman blow up on you, threaten to throw it all away if you didn’t attend a family trip, then get you black out drunk and slide the news at you at 3am that she showed her apartment and took an application, which you obviously didn’t remember, and then two weeks later tell you she’s moving out while subsequently signing said tenant lease and cashing the check?

 

[jhonny9546]

So I was just studying the topic of LTR during the last year.
I took examples from my friends IRL LTR's, and also by studying online knowledge (big thanks to sosuave). I came to a small conclusion. I wrote an essay in my Word document, and I’ll copy and paste it here. it’s English translated from Italian!
Please let me know if my current understanding of this is correct. I don't consider myself a knowledgeable person, but this is my two cents.

Women dont' love us (the way we believe).​

Women dont' love us (the way we believe).
It's all a lie, perpetuated by the media and society to keep men in check. It's all nonsense. Don't ever believe it. Ever. The truth is, women only "desire" what they cannot have, like cats: they hate getting "unwanted" attention, and when they don't get it, they crave it so much more.

Women will always tease you, use you, and pretend to love you just so they can get what they want from you. It is the woman's job in a relationship to provide emotional support, not the man's. Don't say "I love you," don't say "you mean everything to me"; never give any indication that this girl has you under her control (emotionally), because when you do, unfortunately, that's when she starts to "lose attraction" and begins manipulating and playing games. But wait for her to come to you, and validate her "I love you", with your "I love you too". The so-called "in love" feelings that women have for us are nothing more than a strong sexual attraction—what they refer to as "love."

For centuries, men have been the hunters/providers of the family, while women have been the gatherers/breeders. This means that men took all the risks, had sexual relations with women, and it was the woman's job to "keep the man interested in her" so as to "provide for her" and "protect her."
This means that it was her job to provide emotional support—to, to say "I love you," because if she didn't, she and her child were often at risk from danger or left alone without providers or food.
She knew that in order for the man to want to protect her child, she had to nurture him as this was the master switch that signaled to the man that this was the only way to preserve the "family" or the "human race", thus, she would continue to protect her child from danger and also continue to reproduce to produce more offspring.

Sexual attraction between men and women is still primal, as it always has been; women are attracted to male qualities like strength, courage, and dominance (that's why big and tall guys are attractive by default), not emotional "neediness." When we become emotionally needy it signals to their primal brain that we are 'weak males' who can no longer protect or provide for their offspring.


And So i came up with the "Key Rules" of Power Management: Sexual, Emotional, Validation.
It's all about power!

Here are the ways you express your love for a woman while keeping her attracted to you:

1. Sexual Power
a) Never ask her for sex, ever. (it makes you more desireable and she would ask if you're getting sex elsewhere)
b) Don't always accept her sexual advances (it will drive her crazy).
c) If you want sex, take her without permission.

Make sure you make her orgasm and don't neglect any part of her body, treath her like porn stars in the bedroom, and make primitive sex.

2. Emotional Power
a) Be emotionally distant and she will come running back to you.*
b) The only emotional support you should provide her is in response to hers: hug her when she comes to you—do not go to her. Only tell her "I love you" when she has said it first.
c) As soon as you start opening up to her emotionally, she will start to lose attraction to you, and the longer you continue this way, the less attracted she will be to you until she is no longer "in love." (That's what friends are for; use them.)

3. Validation Power: Compliments and Gifts
a) Only give compliments and gifts when she deserves them—when she gives you emotional support or when she initiates intimacy. When she does something good for you, acknowledge it.
Otherwise, you punish her! (the right ways - not misoginist).

This is not what we were taught, but it is what will make her feel loved, even if it contradicts what she, and you, sees in the media.
It is what she doesn't even know she wants!
Never talk to her about it.
But you do it because you are a real man now.

----------------------------------------------------
Plus, I still don't know how a man should act in terms of his general behavior in society. What is the "real" way to behave? As this little essay states, we are shaped by society, and we often don’t know the correct way to act. Should we act like the man described in option:
a) Kind and friendly with everyone, including her—a general "gentleman" but with a spine and knowledge? (Like this man describe in his videos)
or
b) Dominant, manipulative, narcissistic, and arrogant toward others, while possessing that same knowledge
?

*Being emotionally distant can be challenging. When you have alone time with your wife that isn’t sex, deep conversations about your relationship, or about her or you, or worldviews often arise. This can lead to vulnerability, where personal information might be used against you. As a result, many couples prefer discussing gossip or current society events rather than their own relationship dynamics. They may fear that delving into deeper topics could kill the attraction or reveal too much about themselves, losing the mystery that can be appealing. Can you relate? So how do you actually deal when she ask you about "deep" themes?

 

[Vanderdonck]

yes, if you want to limit political speech, then imposing the death penalty for political speech would do it. same with religion. what's your point? do you hate religion or something?

society has a profound effect on the average person. From the way people act, talk, marry, divorce, etc... at the end of the day, society shapes most people lives. in society where marriage is taken more seriously, people don't divorce and people on average are happier. Men in these societies rarely tell other men to "get better" (basically, implying most men suck). And there are less women crying that they can't find a man . funny how that works, right?

My point is that people will comply under threat of death.

I've never needed government intervention for my personal happiness, and I've never cared what "society" thinks of me. Some people, I guess, make their decisions based on what others think is right for them.

Men who need government or social shame to enforce marriage are, to me, hopeless simps. But I think marriage goes against nature anyway. Most relationships fail because the man can't lead, and/or because humans are not monogamous.

 

[Slowhandluke]

My point is that people will comply under threat of death.

Yes...

I've never needed government intervention for my personal happiness, and I've never cared what "society" thinks of me.

Governments that provide clean air; good jobs; abundant food; a safe environment low in crime; AND a framework for women and men to work together and that promotes marriage, have more men AND women happy. In north Korea, there are very few happy people (men or women). Also, governments that promote endless hookups or free and abundant abortions have lower rates of happiness (e.g.., current USA liberal cities as compared to ones that don't).

Good for you for not caring about your government or what society thinks of you... I guess. When the world burns, you just say "F them all.. I'm going to live in my hole in the ground. Just try an get me!!!" hahahahaha

Some people, I guess, make their decisions based on what others think is right for them.

Also, true. I would venture to say, most people, not just "some people"...

Men who need government or social shame to enforce marriage are, to me, hopeless simps. But I think marriage goes against nature anyway. Most relationships fail because the man can't lead, and/or because humans are not monogamous.

Uhhh.. Ok... Muslim men, Hindu men... some men in countries in Asian and some eastern Europe men would disagree (so would their wives).. but.. yeah, "western men are simps... they just suck"... you believe what you want I guess. Because you are "alpha"... and most men in the USA are simps.. or beta... or whatever.. You go on believing that, I guess..

 

[Slowhandluke]

Stores do get better. They get CCTV equipment, security systems, and time-locked safes.

But yet the stores still close.. and people still steal. Why is that?

Again, insinuating that only males need to improve to increase their SMV and find a better sexual partner is laughable since women also do. Just because we are males doesn’t mean that we have the right to reproduce, and suggesting to beat women up into submission for it to happen is on par with colonialism.

Beat up women? Women were not given as much rights as they do now; does that mean in the past men on a regular basis beat up women? Does that also mean, since women have more rights.. Women no longer get beat up? If this is all true, why are women in general so unhappy NOW? Do they like "getting beat up"?

In societies where there are arranged marriages.. where women cannot vote; do women there get beat up more? If so, why do they report more happiness? Even when these women come to western nations to live, why do the majority continue to wear burqas? Or pursue men who have the same mentality like their homeland?

Something tells me these women don't get "beat up" as much as you think they do...

 

[Giovanni SouthSide]

Just came back from blasting a 5 mile run at the dirt trail. I just fed my Rottweiler boy and I’m just vibing with the midst of the quiet night. This post got me thinking to push pencil like a stone.

Women are a blank slate. They take life one day at a time with little regard for future planning. If you have forged yourself into a worthy stud (in the traditional sense of the word) then they're going to start misplacing their birth control while never really understanding why. A month later they're pregnant and desperate to get married. 9 months later they're (hopefully) married and they have their first child.

And each day they're going to wake up a prisoner of their cumulative circumstances, never really drawing a line from where they've been to where they are now and by deduction where they are heading. You will notice that they only care about future planning when they don't have a figure of authority to tell them what to do and when to do it, and in any case they hate that responsibility. It makes them miserable.

What makes a marriage work or even an LTR is that she must be able to see you as a master, not only over her but over your own destiny (and that of your family by extension).

Money is only relevant if you possess it as a vehicle to drive your dominance in the world. A big house is meaningless if your maid scalds you to keep your feet off the couch and you meekly comply.

I would say that searching for a submissive woman is everything, if you are a man to be submitted to.

Submission is far more prevalent in youth (for women) which presents another example of why younger is better.
You're better off with an 18 year old 6 than a 32 year old 8.

Women inherently are not that bad if you have game. Game is just convincing her that she made the right choice. The problem is we make too many judgments without game and sometimes we can get poisoned by frustration and cynicism to the point that we blame external forces like culture rather than focus on ourselves. Ourselves as in our “inner game”.

At a certain age as a man , if you've done right you should have accumulated a lot of values and wisdom, so simply by existing and presenting yourself correctly to women you should have no trouble. If you still aren't of high value, tough luck, no magic bullet except putting in the work. My opinion is that men would be better served putting in the effort to build an awesome life, look their best and have a lot going for them socially to where less effort is required to get laid. The best time to get a girlfriend is when you don’t need one.

Certain philosophies and especially religions and/or religious people have long taught this concept of meaning, higher purpose, and goals. Christianity, logo-therapy, Islam, to name a few. Accepting chaos and chance can be scary thing for men who have a need to feel in control.

To me it's sort of like being on a donkey with a stick over it's face a carrot hanging on a thread. Doesn't matter how hard the donkey tries, how fast he walks, how much he really wants that carrot, he's never going to get there. I see life much like a dance, there's no destination to go, you're just dancing around in circles, along with everyone else, and then you realize the whole purpose is not to go anywhere, it's just to enjoy the dance.

I'm not saying to become a rock star, vacuum rails of peruvian blow, and drink yourself to death because goals and meaning are for the blinded, I'm just saying that maybe the meaning of life is just to be alive and enjoy the ride and feel laughter, love, and friendship without having to be with shot up anxiety stuck in a maze to find some objective all the time. Maybe instead of looking for something to hold onto, you should just let go of everything.

 

[Vanderdonck]

Yes...



Governments that provide clean air; good jobs; abundant food; a safe environment low in crime; AND a framework for women and men to work together and that promotes marriage, have more men AND women happy. In north Korea, there are very few happy people (men or women). Also, governments that promote endless hookups or free and abundant abortions have lower rates of happiness (e.g.., current USA liberal cities as compared to ones that don't).

Good for you for not caring about your government or what society thinks of you... I guess. When the world burns, you just say "F them all.. I'm going to live in my hole in the ground. Just try an get me!!!" hahahahaha



Also, true. I would venture to say, most people, not just "some people"...



Uhhh.. Ok... Muslim men, Hindu men... some men in countries in Asian and some eastern Europe men would disagree (so would their wives).. but.. yeah, "western men are simps... they just suck"... you believe what you want I guess. Because you are "alpha"... and most men in the USA are simps.. or beta... or whatever.. You go on believing that, I guess..

All right, I'll get back to my original point. My woman is a Muslim and the country she's from is not a healthy environment for women or men. It is not rare for women to be abused physically, and if they cheat or leave they can be killed with impunity. Many are taken as brides as teenagers. The men are raised to be mofos who buy into this and expect to go straight from mommy to wifey with no growth as a man whatsoever. So my point is that having the state or religious institution back up a man's threats of violence or death will certainly keep a woman in line. We all make the best choices for ourselves in any situation. If someone points a gun to my head I'll probably do what he says.

I'm all for having a respectful woman who wants to serve me, but I have that because of my frame and her free desire. Not just now but most of my relationships were like that and I moved on from those who were disrespectful. I don't need the backing of the state, religion, or the mafia. And no I don't think I'm "alpha," I just take ownership of my life and what I want - not the government which can f--- right off.

Also, you keep claiming that these types of societies are happier. But happiness indices regularly rank Scandinavian countries at the tops of their lists which are among the most liberal when it comes to sexual freedom and "equality." I don't necessarily believe any of those polls but I'm wondering where you get your data. A lot of Sosuavers say they want a more traditional culture but I never hear of any moving to a Muslim country (many of which will gladly grant a visa to an American no questions asked). The truth is a lot of such places have failed relationships within marriages that stay intact.

And anyway, in our world/reality - why worry about it? Men take sex and women way too seriously.

 

[zekko]

Most relationships fail because western society does not promote long-term relationships . For example, most relationships in Muslim countries that promotes families/relationships do not fail. Even in countries that are not Muslim, but support long-term relationships, they are doing better than the West with respect to marriage, etc.

It's definitely a cultural thing, at least partly. For example, Asians have the lowest divorce rate in the US, because culturally they value the family. This is something we used to value in the US as a whole, but the rot crept in and robbed us of our traditional values.

 

[jhonny9546]

This is on a par with guys trying to figure out what a woman wants, when she herself often has no idea what she really wants.

But if you can figure out what she needs, you can bind her more tightly to you than most men would imagine.

Yes, this is very common, yet it can be complicated to understand with some women.

She might say things like, "I want a 6-foot tall guy with blue eyes, who is fit and has a dog," but what does she really need instead? She doesn't know.

Also, as you mentioned, this understanding would be very useful when interacting with other people, including men in general.

This skill could be integrated into your behavior, but it may not be easy for the average person. How do you find this out or do it?
@AmsterdamAssassin

 

[Lean Baby Face]

Most relationships fail because western society does not promote long-term relationships . For example, most relationships in Muslim countries that promotes families/relationships do not fail. Even in countries that are not Muslim, but support long-term relationships, they are doing better than the West with respect to marriage, etc.

Just an aside, but most females are happier in Muslim countries when compared to western nations. Also, people in India where arranged married are common, females there are happier also.

When a society promotes, no fault divorce, "you go queen", if "your man doesn't full fill all your desires, dump that looser, there are more fish in the sea..' etc.. etc.. etc.. No to mention, women are focusing more on careers during their prime fertility years, instead of families/relationships... Well, why would anyone expect relationships NOT TO FAIL in the west? Men are not disposable. But western society tells women that.

It's almost as if the west was run by childless cat ladies promoting their own ideas of what women should be doing instead of promoting families/relationships, etc.

Muslim marriages might look good on the outside but in reality behind the doors it's often yelling, hitting, and crying children, not to mention the claustrophobia of a large family being stuffed inside a tiny apartment or house with nowhere to get away from all the noise.

I do respect the idealism of these couples but to be honest a lot of these women do look quite miserable in my opinion. Where I live the Muslim women never smile and no wonder if the man at home is a fat, hairy, bearded angry bear, while stuck in a toxic marriage that you refuse to end because of "my family's honor" or out of fear of the husband.

 

[Slowhandluke]

Muslim marriages might look good on the outside but in reality behind the doors it's often yelling, hitting, and crying children, not to mention the claustrophobia of a large family being stuffed inside a tiny apartment or house with nowhere to get away from all the noise.

I do respect the idealism of these couples but to be honest a lot of these women do look quite miserable in my opinion. Where I live the Muslim women never smile and no wonder if the man at home is a fat, hairy, bearded angry bear, while stuck in a toxic marriage that you refuse to end because of "my family's honor" or out of fear of the husband.

But yet most Muslim women do not convert into something else when given a chance in western nations. In Britain, there is NOT a lot of young women who grow up in Muslim households that want to convert to other religions or become agnostic or atheist. Even after their western schooling, they continue wanting to be Muslims wearing traditional garb.

Relationships are hard IN ALL CULTURES. There's yelling, hitting, and crying children in western relationships. To be honest, I wonder how many women have been killed by their boyfriends/husbands in western society as compared to Muslim countries? I'm sure being Muslim in a western culture will cause some strife.

The west likes to make other countries seem as being bad or backwards; but that's usually not the case. I remember a documentary where researchers surveyed Afghani wives. Most were happy with their lives. However, if you look at western literature, you will find a bias towards the western idea. For example, a lot of research into happiness will focus on "career" women... Or women who aren't married or don't want to be married and use them as a symbol of how bad a region is. However, if the researcher focused on the average women, they will found out, a lot like the status quo as in the case of the documentary I saw.

Remember in Muslim countries, at the end of the day, Fathers are still giving away their daughters. They are allowing heir daughters to be married to other Muslims. If beatings, and heart aches are things their daughters can only expect, why would their Fathers allow it? Do Muslim fathers just hate their daughters?

If you look at western society 100-150 years ago. you will find that with respect to woman/men relationships, Muslim society and western society wasn't that different. Women weren't expect to work outside the home. Some would even say the wife was the man's property that he need to take care of. She couldn't vote. She really wasn't considered and equal of men with respect to voting, etc...