Why Getting Good with Women is so Important

[self_is_an_illusion]

The hell are you talking about? The candy bar analogy was to emphasize that most men will not know a good woman from a bad woman if they have such little experience.

I’m not missing your point. Calling women “candy bars” still turns them into products. Even if you wanted to show that experience helps you spot good matches, you’re still treating people like interchangeable items. Real growth isn’t about sampling options, it’s about listening, caring, and seeing someone as a full person with their own thoughts and feelings. If you really want to tell a good partner from a bad one, stop thinking in terms of taste tests and start treating each person as a human being. Until you drop that product mindset you will keep missing what real connection feels like.

 

[BPH]

I’m not missing your point. Calling women “candy bars” still turns them into products. Even if you wanted to show that experience helps you spot good matches, you’re still treating people like interchangeable items. Real growth isn’t about sampling options, it’s about listening, caring, and seeing someone as a full person with their own thoughts and feelings. If you really want to tell a good partner from a bad one, stop thinking in terms of taste tests and start treating each person as a human being. Until you drop that product mindset you will keep missing what real connection feels like.

Dude/ma'am go away.

Every one of your replies reads like a jaded woman/frustrated incel. If you have no value to contribute and are just here to spew negativity you don't have to be here.

 

[self_is_an_illusion]

Hell if I know, bro came online after a 7-month absence and has been flaming posts for a solid hour now. @Dr.Suave @Serenity @BackInTheGame78 can we get a banhammer on the troll?

You want to ban someone for pointing out how you treat women like objects and dismissing consent and respect? That tells me more about your insecurity than any “troll.” You cannot handle real critique so you call for censorship. This is not trolling. It is accountability. If you really cared about improving your game you would engage with the arguments instead of silencing them. Until you can sit with discomfort and challenge your own mindset you will keep repeating the same toxic patterns. Stop hiding behind a banhammer and start owning your behavior.

 

[self_is_an_illusion]

Dude/ma'am go away.

Every one of your replies reads like a jaded woman/frustrated incel. If you have no value to contribute and are just here to spew negativity you don't have to be here.

If calling out objectification and shallow thinking sounds like “negativity” to you, maybe that says more about what you’re used to than it does about me. It’s not jaded to ask for basic respect. It’s not frustrated to question a system built on dehumanizing people. If you only see value in posts that stroke your ego or fit your worldview, then you’re not here to grow, you’re here to be coddled. You don’t need everyone to agree with you, you need to ask why disagreement feels so threatening. I’m not here to flatter you. I’m here to hold up a mirror.

 

[BPH]

You want to ban someone for pointing out how you treat women like objects and dismissing consent and respect? That tells me more about your insecurity than any “troll.” You cannot handle real critique so you call for censorship. This is not trolling. It is accountability. If you really cared about improving your game you would engage with the arguments instead of silencing them. Until you can sit with discomfort and challenge your own mindset you will keep repeating the same toxic patterns. Stop hiding behind a banhammer and start owning your behavior.

Brother/sister...this is a pickup forum for seducing women.

Enjoying and wanting to be with lots of women generally means you like them...

If you think I'm bad, you'd probably cry your mascara off hearing how some of my "any hole's the goal" type friends view women. Some people want to make a lot of money. Some people want to build a lot of muscle. Some people want to bang a lot of women. Just because THEIR goals and interests don't align with YOURS doesn't make you right and them wrong, or you good and them bad.

Not every friend you make needs to be your best friend.

Not every woman you meet needs to be a potential wife.

Calm the f*** down and offer some value between your sperg sessions, or just leave. It's clear you don't like it here, and so far I'd wager most of the members you've replied to aren't happy you're here either.

 

[self_is_an_illusion]

Brother/sister...this is a pickup forum for seducing women.

Enjoying and wanting to be with lots of women generally means you like them...

If you think I'm bad, you'd probably cry your mascara off hearing how some of my "any hole's the goal" type friends view women. Some people want to make a lot of money. Some people want to build a lot of muscle. Some people want to bang a lot of women. Just because THEIR goals and interests don't align with YOURS doesn't make you right and them wrong, or you good and them bad.

Not every friend you make needs to be your best friend.

Not every woman you meet needs to be a potential wife.

Calm the f*** down and offer some value between your sperg sessions, or just leave. It's clear you don't like it here, and so far I'd wager most of the members you've replied to aren't happy you're here either.

Liking women doesn’t mean respecting them. You can want to be around women and still treat them like objects. That’s exactly the problem. You think desire excuses dehumanization. It doesn’t. And no, having worse friends doesn’t make you better by comparison, it just proves how low your bar is. This isn’t about having different goals, it’s about how your goals erase other people’s humanity. If your pursuit of women involves ignoring consent, reducing them to body parts, and lashing out at critique, it’s not just a different lifestyle. It’s a broken one. Discomfort isn’t censorship. It’s accountability. Deal with it.

 

[BPH]

Liking women doesn’t mean respecting them. You can want to be around women and still treat them like objects. That’s exactly the problem. You think desire excuses dehumanization. It doesn’t. And no, having worse friends doesn’t make you better by comparison, it just proves how low your bar is. This isn’t about having different goals, it’s about how your goals erase other people’s humanity. If your pursuit of women involves ignoring consent, reducing them to body parts, and lashing out at critique, it’s not just a different lifestyle. It’s a broken one. Discomfort isn’t censorship. It’s accountability. Deal with it.

Ok, I'll humor your stupid a**.

Explain to me specifically how I'm dehumanizing women and objectifying them.

How am I ignoring consent? Where am I lashing out at critique?

If you're gonna say a bunch of dumb sh** and throw out buzzwords like they're candy - kinda like my analogy you couldn't comprehend - then let's have you back them up.

 

[Dr_jitsu]

There's a lot I want to reply to here, but in the interest of not making this a giant text wall (which it may still end up being), I'll just tag @BeExcellent @Dr_jitsu and @Sega Genesis

.....'t want to type up something rushed.

Hi BPH. First, I want to say that you are many steps ahead of most men, so please don't think that I am lecturing you or being condescending in any way. You are like a talented athlete who just needs more coaching.

I have been a serious student of seduction for a long, long time. I started by studying academic literature (most of which is worthless except evolutionary biology). I have a book out and also a youtube channel. In fact I just did a video about your situation. I am not posting a link except for the one in my signature because I don't want to violate forum rules. But if you click on it it is my most recent video, just released today. I was a very successful member of the seduction community more than 20 years ago and have been very happily married to a beautiful women for almost 19 years. She is 15 years younger than me. I am old, 62.

I can't address everything in your post, but I can address 2 things: The age issue, and the quality of woman issue. In terms of age you always must obfuscate the issue until the woman has high interest in you. I was 43 when I met my wife and she did not know my true age until after around 6 dates. I only saw her once a week (I was running a 3 woman rotation...I only saw my wife during the week, not the weekends and it drove her interest through the roof). By that time she was falling in love with me.

Now with this woman who texts you at 2 AM. When she asked you "why do you go here?" Telle her "because I knew you would be here." But she still liked you. However, you made a huge mistake texting her for 2 hours back and forth. You should have sent a couple of texts...3 max. The last one should have been "hey I love texting you but I have to go now. If you want to talk to me we need to meet up in person" or something to that effect. Absolutely nothing good comes from 2 hours of texting back and forth. Even if you are in an established relationship that is too much. Massive texting is what women do. Men meet up in person. You simply can only drive a woman's interest level so much by texting...but you can drive it down, a lot.

When a woman asks your age you must deflect the question. "I am old enough" I wasn't born yesterday" "I'm old enough to be your brother". I am married and I like to go dancing. I don't cheat but I dance with lots of women. Since I am not really hitting on them they often become curious. These women are usually in their 40's, sometime younger. I was dancing with a 23 year old last month. I talk with them and they often ask my age. I say "I was born right after the dinosaurs died". If a woman keeps pushing and pushing it means she is inflexible and probably not relationship material. Also....I go by the half plus 7 rule. You are 30 so 22 is as young as you can go.

In terms of quality of women out there. I am generous in saying that only 1 in 4 women are relationship material. As they age that ratio worsens. For example, I used to teach college. Women come in sweet, wanting to get married and start a family. They graduate hating men, because this is what academia teaches. Social media also ruins women. So EVERYTHING I do is a checking and screening system. Is she pleasant and does she have a nice conversation with you? Check. Does she give you her number? Check. Is she happy when you call? Check. Does she accept your date idea without trying to negotiate? Check. Does she cancel any early dates? Is she kind, flexible, and loving? If no to any of these, get rid of her.

That is why we must approach and open hundreds and hundreds of women. Open one every day. Open many when out clubbing. You are already successfully opening plenty of women...I know tons of men who can't even do that so you are succeeding at the hardest part of this game. You just need to start date closing, getting that first and second date. I don't coach men to get laid on the first date I coach to drive up interest level and get a gal in your dating rotation. Most relationships end after 2-3 months anyways...but the sex is incredible.

 

[Dr_jitsu]

This thread is actually a really great discussion.

So here is my question. Did the gorgeous blonde's friend acknowledge you? Yes or no? If she did & was cool then things are good. If not, things are a bit off.

As to the other girl who busted your chops about age? Ok first of all WHY are you responding to women at 2am????? Let the girl wonder where you are/what you are doing/who you are with for God's sake. Why are you having a conversation at 2:30am that is going nowhere? You are annihilating any interest, mystery or intrigue because you are as available and eager as a 3 month old puppy. She wondered where you are. She texted. Do NOT respond. Isn't your time valuable? Aren't you a man doing man stuff or sleeping like normal person?

When you answer you are WAY too available and it removes any questions....nah you are sitting home waiting to respond to 2am texts. Seriously? Ok. Not what high value people do.

Have some self respect man.

The age thing is silly in my book. But people are asking you the age question because they are at a "college bar." Do you have to show your college ID to be admitted? No? Then its not a college bar. Its a bar. Its open to the public.

But had you ignored the girl's text at 2am, none of this exchange happens. You are blowing yourself out by being too eager.

The gorgeous blonde you tried to escalate too fast; last night's girl you were too available. Soon enough you WILL have a reputation at this bar among the cute girls, but it will not be a good one.

Be mysterious. Be aloof. Be difficult to obtain. You have some looks going for you, but you act desperate which is a turn off.

Quit thinking you gotta get the kiss, the date, etc. before you leave.

An anectdotal analogy: A young bull and an old bull were looking over the herd of cows they saw down the hill. The young bull felt the testosterone surging through him and said to the old bull, "Man! Let's run down there and fvck a cow!!!" The old bull did not react. Just chewed his curd, flipped his tail and said "No son. Let's walk down there and fvck them all."

Right now @BPH you are the young bull.

Great post!

 

[Dr_jitsu]

Ok, I'll humor your stupid a**.

Explain to me specifically how I'm dehumanizing women and objectifying them.

How am I ignoring consent? Where am I lashing out at critique?

If you're gonna say a bunch of dumb sh** and throw out buzzwords like they're candy - kinda like my analogy you couldn't comprehend - then let's have you back them up.

Ignore this person. Your candy bar analogy is not that far off.

 

[BeExcellent]

Good take. He is winning the initial skirmish but ultimately losing the war.

Patience is key. Patience & drive up desire through creating intrigue.

It is a scarcity mindset that grabs on too tight initially and thinks.....

"I gotta get a date/kiss/sex RIGHT NOW"

No. Be patient. Leave her wanting more, rather than trying to escape.

 

[BPH]

@Dr_jitsu I appreciate the thought-out post. I'll watch your video here in a minute but I just had a few questions in response to this.

Now with this woman who texts you at 2 AM. When she asked you "why do you go here?" Telle her "because I knew you would be here." But she still liked you. However, you made a huge mistake texting her for 2 hours back and forth. You should have sent a couple of texts...3 max. The last one should have been "hey I love texting you but I have to go now. If you want to talk to me we need to meet up in person" or something to that effect. Absolutely nothing good comes from 2 hours of texting back and forth. Even if you are in an established relationship that is too much. Massive texting is what women do. Men meet up in person. You simply can only drive a woman's interest level so much by texting...but you can drive it down, a lot.

Ok yes, it was clearly wrong to do this. I thought it might lead to a booty call and I had just gotten home and was still drunk as well, but you and everybody else who suggested I shouldn't have responded until the next day are correct.

However, the age is clearly an issue for her to bring it up so many times, so even if I didn't respond that night, I feel like it wouldn't have made much difference she would just ask and be bothered by it another time - ultimately arriving at this same realization that you describe as her being "inflexible", no?

I'm not saying this is behavior I should repeat, but as a silver lining isn't it better than I found this out and removed her sooner rather than later - like partway through a date I set aside time and money for?

When a woman asks your age you must deflect the question. "I am old enough" I wasn't born yesterday" "I'm old enough to be your brother". I am married and I like to go dancing. I don't cheat but I dance with lots of women. Since I am not really hitting on them they often become curious. These women are usually in their 40's, sometime younger. I was dancing with a 23 year old last month. I talk with them and they often ask my age. I say "I was born right after the dinosaurs died". If a woman keeps pushing and pushing it means she is inflexible and probably not relationship material. Also....I go by the half plus 7 rule. You are 30 so 22 is as young as you can go.

To be fair, I'm not necessarily looking for relationship material. I'm aware of my financial and living situation and need to spend time bettering those aspects of my life before I should be heavily investing my time in somebody else, along with their needs.

As for my question, wouldn't deflecting the question cause the woman to worry? What is he hiding? Why can't he answer? Isn't it a simple question?

I used to have a similar problem when it came to body count. I didn't get asked it often, but all my serious girlfriends did eventually ask, and I wondered how I should answer.

I considered lying; too low and I sound inexperienced, too high and I sound like I take anything that comes my way.

I considered refusing to answer, but that just sows more doubt about what the actual number is that it's important enough for me to hide.

Thing is I hate lying. I'm too lazy to keep of what lies I've told, so I just don't - if she has a problem with my answer that's her problem, not mine. So I've always told the truth, and it's never been a dealbreaker or even a problem/fight.

Also, I'm curious what the basis is when it comes to your half plus 7 rule - what observations have you made to arrive at that number.

If you have time, I'd like to know what your opinion is on the situation I'm facing in this other thread: https://www.sosuave.net/forum/threa...d-behavior-im-considering-engaging-in.283886/

The first and last responses of mine are probably the only ones you'd need to read to understand the context.

Good take. He is winning the initial skirmish but ultimately losing the war.

Patience is key. Patience & drive up desire through creating intrigue.

It is a scarcity mindset that grabs on too tight initially and thinks.....

"I gotta get a date/kiss/sex RIGHT NOW"

No. Be patient. Leave her wanting more, rather than trying to escape.

You're right, and I'm aware of this.

All my FWBs fell off around the same time - suddenly instead of having sex at least a few times a week with at least 1 girl I go about a month and a half before breaking my dry spell with a girl who blocks me soon after for not giving her enough attention.

It's been another 2 weeks since her, and I think this desperation is coming from the fact that I'm working with very limited time; I do not see women during my day-to-day so I generally have to wait until the weekend. I live in a pretty dull place so I have to spend a decent chunk of my time and money to make it out to places where I'm hoping to see enough attractive girls for me to want to approach - notably Philly and West Chester.

On any given night, realistically I'll see 1-5 girls I'd want to talk to, and I do. Rejections happen, boyfriends exist, and sometimes I fail after the fact as described in this thread. Couple this with the fact that the dating apps in Delaware are understandably dry, and that once summer comes around everybody will graduate and leave/spend their summer down in Dewey Beach and I feel the clock ticking.

Since I have no regularity right now, and I anticipate it getting worse soon, I think that's why I'm rushing things with the women who have shown me interest lately.

 

[Dr_jitsu]

Good take. He is winning the initial skirmish but ultimately losing the war.

Patience is key. Patience & drive up desire through creating intrigue.

It is a scarcity mindset that grabs on too tight initially and thinks.....

"I gotta get a date/kiss/sex RIGHT NOW"

No. Be patient. Leave her wanting more, rather than trying to escape.

Exactly....but he is so far ahead of where many guys are today. Many cannot simply even start a conversation with a woman. That is really the core skill you need, once you have that everything else is a matter of simply making the correct choices/mindset.

I had a guy I was coaching who could not even talk with women. He was 6 foot and good looking and had a decent teaching job. His mental outlook was so bad he had resigned himself to only going after single moms...at the age of 28!!! I tried everything with him including proven canned openers. He had terrible oneitis when he met someone because he had no options.

Once you get good at opening (the first 25 or so are the hardest) you can discipline yourself to open one woman a day....get 7-8 phone numbers a month, 3 dates or so a month. From those 3 one will click with and boom, soon you will have a solid 3 woman rotation and many phone numbers. Abundance.

BPH seems to have his opening down. Every time he goes out he successfully opens hot women. He just needs to be more strategic from that point.

 

[Dr_jitsu]

@Dr_jitsu I appreciate the thought-out post. I'll watch your video here in a minute but I just had a few questions in response to this.



Ok yes, it was clearly wrong to do this. I thought it might lead to a booty call and I had just gotten home and was still drunk as well, but you and everybody else who suggested I shouldn't have responded until the next day are correct.

However, the age is clearly an issue for her to bring it up so many times, so even if I didn't respond that night, I feel like it wouldn't have made much difference she would just ask and be bothered by it another time - ultimately arriving at this same realization that you describe as her being "inflexible", no?

I'm not saying this is behavior I should repeat, but as a silver lining isn't it better than I found this out and removed her sooner rather than later - like partway through a date I set aside time and money for?



To be fair, I'm not necessarily looking for relationship material. I'm aware of my financial and living situation and need to spend time bettering those aspects of my life before I should be heavily investing my time in somebody else, along with their needs.

As for my question, wouldn't deflecting the question cause the woman to worry? What is he hiding? Why can't he answer? Isn't it a simple question?

I used to have a similar problem when it came to body count. I didn't get asked it often, but all my serious girlfriends did eventually ask, and I wondered how I should answer.

I considered lying; too low and I sound inexperienced, too high and I sound like I take anything that comes my way.

I considered refusing to answer, but that just sows more doubt about what the actual number is that it's important enough for me to hide.

Thing is I hate lying. I'm too lazy to keep of what lies I've told, so I just don't - if she has a problem with my answer that's her problem, not mine. So I've always told the truth, and it's never been a dealbreaker or even a problem/fight.

Also, I'm curious what the basis is when it comes to your half plus 7 rule - what observations have you made to arrive at that number.

If you have time, I'd like to know what your opinion is on the situation I'm facing in this other thread: https://www.sosuave.net/forum/threa...d-behavior-im-considering-engaging-in.283886/

The first and last responses of mine are probably the only ones you'd need to read to understand the context.



You're right, and I'm aware of this.

All my FWBs fell off around the same time - suddenly instead of having sex at least a few times a week with at least 1 girl I go about a month and a half before breaking my dry spell with a girl who blocks me soon after for not giving her enough attention.

It's been another 2 weeks since her, and I think this desperation is coming from the fact that I'm working with very limited time; I do not see women during my day-to-day so I generally have to wait until the weekend. I live in a pretty dull place so I have to spend a decent chunk of my time and money to make it out to places where I'm hoping to see enough attractive girls for me to want to approach - notably Philly and West Chester.

On any given night, realistically I'll see 1-5 girls I'd want to talk to, and I do. Rejections happen, boyfriends exist, and sometimes I fail after the fact as described in this thread. Couple this with the fact that the dating apps in Delaware are understandably dry, and that once summer comes around everybody will graduate and leave/spend their summer down in Dewey Beach and I feel the clock ticking.

Since I have no regularity right now, and I anticipate it getting worse soon, I think that's why I'm rushing things with the women who have shown me interest lately.

I'm off to the gym, brother. I will give your posts a look tomorrow. Remember the analogy I gave...you are like a natural athlete who has talent, you just need some coaching. You are opening when left and right, that is the most important core skill to have. Ultimately you will have enough women that you won't worry so much about what any one girl thinks.

 

[Clockwerk50]

I don’t have much to add when it comes to the topic of gaining experience with women and how it might help in life, but I do want to chime in on the age and dating part. It seems like the best response to the question about what age range you’re willing to date might’ve been something like, “I’m not sure—I haven’t really thought about that.” Sometimes it’s better to stay a little ambiguous. I’m not talking about straightforward questions like “How old are you?” or “Do you have kids?” but more about things like “Do you see yourself getting married or settling down anytime soon?” or “How many people have you been in love with?”

 

[Dr_jitsu]

I don’t have much to add when it comes to the topic of gaining experience with women and how it might help in life, but I do want to chime in on the age and dating part. It seems like the best response to the question about what age range you’re willing to date might’ve been something like, “I’m not sure—I haven’t really thought about that.” Sometimes it’s better to stay a little ambiguous. I’m not talking about straightforward questions like “How old are you?” or “Do you have kids?” but more about things like “Do you see yourself getting married or settling down anytime soon?” or “How many people have you been in love with?”




View attachment 14153

Always, always deal with these questions using humor. I went through a nasty divorce at age 35. That is also when I got clean and sober (I was a bad alcoholic....drank 15 beers a day everyday). Have not had a drink in over 30 years. Smoked some pot at age 55 and dabbled but have been otherwise sober since

So I was 36 and on the dating market. In a PhD program, but dirt poor. Back then I applied AA principles to my dating....and what a MASSIVE mistake that was. I was "rigorously honest", great for getting sober but TERRIBLE for dating. I would tell women I was a recovering alcoholic and divorced on my first date and then wonder why I would not get a second date. I was constantly available for women...this one doctor would call me at 6 in the morning every day and like a simp I answered then phone and talked for 30-40 minutes every day....then she dumped me.

I had to start over and learn how to get good with women. I studied evolutionary biology (good) and what other PhD psychologists/relationship experts had to say (absolute garbage). I eventually got into the seduction community and ended up a PUG (Pick Up Guru) on the old MASF forum. I also studied POOK and Anti Dump from this forum (great stuff). I worked my tail off and became extremely disciplined. By age 43 I had mastered my system. I was running a 3 woman rotation of beautiful high quality women and eventually married the best one. In fact she just cooked me dinner. Lets call her Susan.

By that time I became an expert at answering silly questions. If a woman asked "have you ever been married?" My response was yeah, only 6 times, but I am sure the next one will work!" Ha ha ha!

My now wife after 5-6 weeks of dating became my best prospect...and my other 2 gals were incredible. But since my wife was my #1 prospect I only saw her during the week, and at that time only once a week. Soon she was asking "why don't you take me out Saturday are you seeing other people?" Sat I was seeing this incredible Indonesian gal who was pushing for marriage...and I considered it.

I replied "I am only seeing 13 other women....but you are my favorite, ha ha ha..."Then I gave her a big smile. On 2 occasions she left loooong break up letters posted on my bathroom mirror. Both times she was back in my arms in 3 days. She then started stalking me on MASF. She printed out 17 pages of field reports (man I miss that forum) of me banging her and my other gals. She stayed with me because at this point her interest level was sky high.

One Sunday...I had been seeing her for about 8 weeks, I was banging one of my other girls. 5 minutes after the girl left there was a pounding on my door. It was Susan.

I answered and she blurted out "I left my jacket here, I need it." It was 84 degrees out. She stormed into my bedroom, came out with her jacket and said "I don't care if you are seeing other women....I am going to fight for you!"

Our relationship had been perfect up to that point. And she is beautiful. Still is today, and I am an ugly old f$ck. At that moment I committed to her, and stopped seeing all other women. A year later she was pregnant and we were engaged to be married.

18 years later we are still solid and our son, the captain of his team just wrestled in the 190 lb state wrestling championship. He is a master with women (body count higher than his age....not sure if I am happy about that).

Please guys, if there is anything I can do, please ask.

The dating world is more f'ed up today than in human history. In case you have not noticed, there is a War on Men....especially good men who want to start families. As men we must band together and help each other navigate an incredibly hostile dating world.

 

[Dr_jitsu]

@Dr_jitsu I appreciate the thought-out post. I'll watch your video here in a minute but I just had a few questions in response to this.



Ok yes, it was clearly wrong to do this. I thought it might lead to a booty call and I had just gotten home and was still drunk as well, but you and everybody else who suggested I shouldn't have responded until the next day are correct.

However, the age is clearly an issue for her to bring it up so many times, so even if I didn't respond that night, I feel like it wouldn't have made much difference she would just ask and be bothered by it another time - ultimately arriving at this same realization that you describe as her being "inflexible", no?

I'm not saying this is behavior I should repeat, but as a silver lining isn't it better than I found this out and removed her sooner rather than later - like partway through a date I set aside time and money for?



To be fair, I'm not necessarily looking for relationship material. I'm aware of my financial and living situation and need to spend time bettering those aspects of my life before I should be heavily investing my time in somebody else, along with their needs.

As for my question, wouldn't deflecting the question cause the woman to worry? What is he hiding? Why can't he answer? Isn't it a simple question?

I used to have a similar problem when it came to body count. I didn't get asked it often, but all my serious girlfriends did eventually ask, and I wondered how I should answer.

I considered lying; too low and I sound inexperienced, too high and I sound like I take anything that comes my way.

I considered refusing to answer, but that just sows more doubt about what the actual number is that it's important enough for me to hide.

Thing is I hate lying. I'm too lazy to keep of what lies I've told, so I just don't - if she has a problem with my answer that's her problem, not mine. So I've always told the truth, and it's never been a dealbreaker or even a problem/fight.

Also, I'm curious what the basis is when it comes to your half plus 7 rule - what observations have you made to arrive at that number.

If you have time, I'd like to know what your opinion is on the situation I'm facing in this other thread: https://www.sosuave.net/forum/threa...d-behavior-im-considering-engaging-in.283886/

The first and last responses of mine are probably the only ones you'd need to read to understand the context.



You're right, and I'm aware of this.

All my FWBs fell off around the same time - suddenly instead of having sex at least a few times a week with at least 1 girl I go about a month and a half before breaking my dry spell with a girl who blocks me soon after for not giving her enough attention.

It's been another 2 weeks since her, and I think this desperation is coming from the fact that I'm working with very limited time; I do not see women during my day-to-day so I generally have to wait until the weekend. I live in a pretty dull place so I have to spend a decent chunk of my time and money to make it out to places where I'm hoping to see enough attractive girls for me to want to approach - notably Philly and West Chester.

On any given night, realistically I'll see 1-5 girls I'd want to talk to, and I do. Rejections happen, boyfriends exist, and sometimes I fail after the fact as described in this thread. Couple this with the fact that the dating apps in Delaware are understandably dry, and that once summer comes around everybody will graduate and leave/spend their summer down in Dewey Beach and I feel the clock ticking.

Since I have no regularity right now, and I anticipate it getting worse soon, I think that's why I'm rushing things with the women who have shown me interest lately.

I can't answer everything in one post. Also, read my personal story in the post right above this one. What happened to me is I COMPLETELY changed my mindset. I basically snapped and decided I was going to do whatever it takes to become successful with women. It took a LOT of work and discipline. Study everything good from this forum. There are some smart guys here. Also read all the classic material, the Hall of Fame stuff, and POOK and Anti Dump.

The male brain is problem solution oriented, the female brain is completely different, it is PROCESS oriented. One brain is predominantly driven by white matter, the other by grey matter. For men, truths tends to be an absolute object, not affected by the way we feel. The female brain is completely different. Truth is contingent upon FEELINGS. For example, a 22 year old woman may objectively state that her upper age limit is 27. BUT once she falls in love, that truth is no longer fixed. 27 was attached to how she felt previously. If her interest level in you is 90% than she is going to create a totally different truth...say 30.

Your problem is you are not gauging and calculating your behaviors. Before you do or say anything ask "will this increase her interest level in me, or decrease it?" That is all that matters. In terms of ethics...the current Western world is so MASSIVELY biased against men, especially good men, that you need to create a different moral universe. Do not listen to an idiot like self is an illusion, please. That advice will only bring you sorrow and failure. You must play to win. Creating super structures like your chocolate analogy is perfectly fine if it can help you navigate this world, with is terribly misandryst.

Remember...the goal is healthy and strong relationships between men and women. That is my purpose. I want to help men get women to fall in love, and stay in love. It just so happens that a woman in love will give you the best sex of your life. But that is a by product of my system, not he primary goal.

Finally...you claim you are not in a place financially and thus not ready for a relationship is nonsense. Are you saying you don't want beautiful women who are head over heels in love with you in your life? Women who give you great sex, women who don't play games, women who make your world better, not worse? You are 30. I was 36. It took 7 years to master my program. So you will be 37. You need this time to really get good, just as an athlete does. My son was a good wrestler his freshman year....but it took 4 more years of intensive training to cross the elite barrier. In 4 years you will no longer be making mistakes. If you work hard you will have a 3 woman rotation of high quality women. You still have to find and settle down with the best one. Do you not think your career will be solid in 5 years? Start developing excellence TODAY.

Like I said....you must change your mindset 100%...NOW! Today is the day that you start getting that beautiful blond to give you her phone number. Today is the day that you stop making mistakes. Today is the day you develop a mindset of abundance.

In my video I go over 5 key principles that will turn your club game around. Patience, getting her interested, getting her curious, get her number, and don't overstay your welcome. Apply these and next weekend you will walk away with numbers, and most likely at least one solid date.

 

[BackInTheGame78]

I don’t have much to add when it comes to the topic of gaining experience with women and how it might help in life, but I do want to chime in on the age and dating part. It seems like the best response to the question about what age range you’re willing to date might’ve been something like, “I’m not sure—I haven’t really thought about that.” Sometimes it’s better to stay a little ambiguous. I’m not talking about straightforward questions like “How old are you?” or “Do you have kids?” but more about things like “Do you see yourself getting married or settling down anytime soon?” or “How many people have you been in love with?”




View attachment 14153

Or as Aaron Burr said in Hamilton

Burr: "Talk less...smiiiiiillllleeee more! Don't let them know what you're against or what you're for. You want to get ahead?"

Hamilton: "Yes"

Burr: "Fools who run their mouths oft wind up dead...."

 

[BPH]

@Dr_jitsu, I watched your video and wanted to reply to that, along with your above message, here all at once.

WARNING: This is a long post. I tried to condsense multiple responses to different points into 1 response, so hopefully you can power through this when you get around to it.

I actually laughed out loud when I started watching the video. I thought you were going to analyze a similar situation - not MY situation, so I knew I was going to sound like an idiot the longer it went on.

Regarding the situation you described above with "Susan", personally I'm not sure I would've lasted. The long breakup messages, the stalking - printing out multiple pages of records she had secretly compiled...this reminds me of my ex. She was bipolar, and she could be the sweetest, most loving girl in the world - but then she would make wild accusations without proof or allow me to defend myself, and we got into frequent, massive fights. I would often leave her house, drive home, and ghost her. She would leave long voicemails of her crying, begging for me to come back. Apologizing for her behavior, saying that she loves me but is scared of getting hurt. And I would always come back because I thought there was a light at the end of the tunnel - but there never was. We got over things, but there was never resolution. She always made me feel like I was wrong and that I had to accept that; otherwise, it would start another fight because, in defending myself, she would get mad that I was "lying". Reading above reminds me of that.

Anyway, I think there are some fundamental differences in our approaches to this. Not to say one is right/wrong or better/worse, but you describe playing the long game, not pushing for sex until the 3rd date. I am primarily playing the short game, assuming there is a very low chance I'll see a girl beyond the interaction I have with her here and now tonight - and sex usually happens by our second interaction (not necessarily date), if not by the end of the first. I cannot remember the last time I saw a woman I was sexually interested in where sex didn't happen before the 3rd date. At that point, it's either already happened, or I figure probably will not happen.

Patrice O'Neal had a great analogy for this, and I suggest a lot of people listen to the advice he gave on the Black Phillip Show; he said that each time you go out on a date and don't f*** her, that SHE'S f***ing YOU, but YOU aren't f***ing HER. To some extent, I agree with this approach - a woman knows well before date 3 whether she wants to f*** me; she's probably already decided before date 1. Classy women wanting to be courted is one thing, and I understand that - but requiring ME to jump through hoops for something we BOTH want because of a self-imposed time delay seems unnecessarily wasteful.

I would love to have regular sex with women who love me and give me the best sex of my life, but I do not think I am equipped for a serious relationship, let alone juggling 3, as you've done above. I live at home with my parents and make less than $40k/year - THAT needs to be where I'm focusing the majority of my time and effort. Not remembering birthdays, anniversaries, doing enough for Valentine's Day (my ex killed that holiday for me btw), Christmas, etc. I feel like I need to fix my problems in these other areas. Even if my income and living situation weren't dealbreakers, logistically, if we're both living at home (which is more likely than not these days), we wouldn't have privacy to have sex anyway. Bringing it back to my question about my situation above, I really am curious about what you think about what's going on with the girl in this other thread. You might've dealt with this before since you're more experienced with the long game than I am: https://www.sosuave.net/forum/threa...d-behavior-im-considering-engaging-in.283886/

Finally, I did enjoy your video and found the information valuable, and I just wanted to elaborate on some of my mistakes. They were definitely bad, but I want to provide some context since they (in my opinion) weren't quite as bad as they sounded:

• I didn't immediately try to kiss her. After she was introduced to me and told me she was interested, we talked a bit, flirted a bit, and I got her number. It wasn't until she told me she was leaving soon that I offered what I THOUGHT she wanted and had that advance rejected.
• I didn't ask to go with her and her friends, she invited me. I probably should've declined and left her wondering, but I thought some isolation would help. Her friend and her boyfriend went and did their own thing, so it wasn't a group date dynamic.
• I didn't ask how she felt about older guys on the ride over. That wasn't until we were walking out of the casino to leave and have me dropped off. This was after she rejected my 2nd attempt, so I was fishing for what might be her hold-up. Still not a good move, obviously.
• I only tried kissing her twice, not three times. That was at the bar, and then while we were alone playing casino games.

Otherwise, yeah, a lot of the mistakes I made were from operating with the mindset that I'm looking to make things happen TONIGHT, because some other night might not happen. And I think I just have a fundamentally different goal; a deeper connection is nice but not a requirement..

Thanks for the video. I know this is a long reply, but when/if you get the time, I'd love to hear your opinion on the girl in that other post I referenced, since I had a deeper connection with her that has seemingly dissolved.

 

[Dr_jitsu]

@Dr_jitsu, I watched your video and wanted to reply to that, along with your above message, here all at once.

WARNING: This is a long post. I tried to condsense multiple responses to different points into 1 response, so hopefully you can power through this when you get around to it.

I actually laughed out loud when I started watching the video. I thought you were going to analyze a similar situation - not MY situation, so I knew I was going to sound like an idiot the longer it went on.

Regarding the situation you described above with "Susan", personally I'm not sure I would've lasted. The long breakup messages, the stalking - printing out multiple pages of records she had secretly compiled...this reminds me of my ex. She was bipolar, and she could be the sweetest, most loving girl in the world - but then she would make wild accusations without proof or allow me to defend myself, and we got into frequent, massive fights. I would often leave her house, drive home, and ghost her. She would leave long voicemails of her crying, begging for me to come back. Apologizing for her behavior, saying that she loves me but is scared of getting hurt. And I would always come back because I thought there was a light at the end of the tunnel - but there never was. We got over things, but there was never resolution. She always made me feel like I was wrong and that I had to accept that; otherwise, it would start another fight because, in defending myself, she would get mad that I was "lying". Reading above reminds me of that.

Anyway, I think there are some fundamental differences in our approaches to this. Not to say one is right/wrong or better/worse, but you describe playing the long game, not pushing for sex until the 3rd date. I am primarily playing the short game, assuming there is a very low chance I'll see a girl beyond the interaction I have with her here and now tonight - and sex usually happens by our second interaction (not necessarily date), if not by the end of the first. I cannot remember the last time I saw a woman I was sexually interested in where sex didn't happen before the 3rd date. At that point, it's either already happened, or I figure probably will not happen.

Patrice O'Neal had a great analogy for this, and I suggest a lot of people listen to the advice he gave on the Black Phillip Show; he said that each time you go out on a date and don't f*** her, that SHE'S f***ing YOU, but YOU aren't f***ing HER. To some extent, I agree with this approach - a woman knows well before date 3 whether she wants to f*** me; she's probably already decided before date 1. Classy women wanting to be courted is one thing, and I understand that - but requiring ME to jump through hoops for something we BOTH want because of a self-imposed time delay seems unnecessarily wasteful.

I would love to have regular sex with women who love me and give me the best sex of my life, but I do not think I am equipped for a serious relationship, let alone juggling 3, as you've done above. I live at home with my parents and make less than $40k/year - THAT needs to be where I'm focusing the majority of my time and effort. Not remembering birthdays, anniversaries, doing enough for Valentine's Day (my ex killed that holiday for me btw), Christmas, etc. I feel like I need to fix my problems in these other areas. Even if my income and living situation weren't dealbreakers, logistically, if we're both living at home (which is more likely than not these days), we wouldn't have privacy to have sex anyway. Bringing it back to my question about my situation above, I really am curious about what you think about what's going on with the girl in this other thread. You might've dealt with this before since you're more experienced with the long game than I am: https://www.sosuave.net/forum/threa...d-behavior-im-considering-engaging-in.283886/

Finally, I did enjoy your video and found the information valuable, and I just wanted to elaborate on some of my mistakes. They were definitely bad, but I want to provide some context since they (in my opinion) weren't quite as bad as they sounded:

• I didn't immediately try to kiss her. After she was introduced to me and told me she was interested, we talked a bit, flirted a bit, and I got her number. It wasn't until she told me she was leaving soon that I offered what I THOUGHT she wanted and had that advance rejected.
• I didn't ask to go with her and her friends, she invited me. I probably should've declined and left her wondering, but I thought some isolation would help. Her friend and her boyfriend went and did their own thing, so it wasn't a group date dynamic.
• I didn't ask how she felt about older guys on the ride over. That wasn't until we were walking out of the casino to leave and have me dropped off. This was after she rejected my 2nd attempt, so I was fishing for what might be her hold-up. Still not a good move, obviously.
• I only tried kissing her twice, not three times. That was at the bar, and then while we were alone playing casino games.

Otherwise, yeah, a lot of the mistakes I made were from operating with the mindset that I'm looking to make things happen TONIGHT, because some other night might not happen. And I think I just have a fundamentally different goal; a deeper connection is nice but not a requirement..

Thanks for the video. I know this is a long reply, but when/if you get the time, I'd love to hear your opinion on the girl in that other post I referenced, since I had a deeper connection with her that has seemingly dissolved.

All good my friend. And let us be absolutely clear: I am in no way judging you, In fact you are waaaay ahead of most men. I do not think you are an idiot whatsoever, in fact the opposite. You just need to make that transition from player to master. I think you have tremendous potential. You are just making easily correctable errors.

Also, don't confuse love with mental illness. Everything I do during the first 3 months is a screening process. Any hints of any problems whatsoever and the girl is out. But when women love you they will do some amazing things. Committing to a gal at the 8-10 week mark means something....but from there I have to get "The Golden Year". That is one full year of perfect dating. No red flags, no major arguments, no problems of any sort. Mind blowing sex is a given. She must be wiling to rob banks for you. Prior to meeting my wife I was engaged to a doctor, but she started dragging her feet on the wedding and I immediately dumped her. Over the next year I seduced and had sex with more than a dozen women, all 8's and above. And I was a still dirt poor graduate student. I apologize for the bragging but pictures tell a thousand words. This was me and my wife a week ago.

So it does not matter that you are living with your parents. You are "in transition" while developing your goals. If a woman really likes you and believes in your potential she will have you at her place banging every last drop from you. Many of the gals I dated were extremely well off financially and often I went to her place. Usually sex and dinner were waiting. I would have sex 3-4 times with each one. This was Tuesday, Thursday, and Saturday, so I was having sex more than 10 times a week. You have seen how old and ugly I am, I will DM you a week old picture of my wife. EDIT: DM didn't go through...that is why I posted here. I have nothing to hide.

You could easily be banging that blonde by next week. Are you really telling me that that is not something you would like? You can't wait one extra date...a date that could take an hour and should not cost more than 20 bucks. Really?

I will take a look at your post tomorrow. I am sure that you know that what you are posting is something called a "field report." Field reports are absolutely phenomenal ways to sharpen our game. It is time to start fighting back against the War Against Men.

If you do not want my advice, that is perfectly OK. I just think you could easily be having sex with most of these women you are meeting.