Why am I afraid of girls?

electro shock

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Whenever I see a girl on the street, whether she's in her 20s or in her 80s, whether she's healthy or weights 400 pounds, wether she's a HB10 or looks like a pig... I always have to look the other way.

I have a tremendous fear that if I don't turn my eyes away from a girl, she might thing that I'm interested in her even though I'm not.

I know it's stupid, but I can't freaking help it! Whenever a girl comes near me, even if she's really, really, really ugly, my eyes automatically start to look away from fear of making eye-contact, which would make her think that I'm interested in her.

Unless a girl talks to me first, or unless she's someone I know, I just can't freaking look at her! If I see a girl I know, like if she's in my class or something, I can talk to her no problem. But if there's a girl I've never met anywhere I can't help but try to avoid her. If she's waiting in line at the cash in a supermarket, I have to go to another cash to avoid the possibility that she might think that I was interested in her by approaching her.

It's not a question of how hot the girl is... it doesn't matter, the same thing is true with old ladies. Whenever there's an old lady or a fat woman or whatever who comes near me, I just have to look away. My reactions is the same if it's a hot 20 year old girl. It doesn't matter who it is as long as it's a she.

Wtf is wrong with me? I mean, there are girls that I'm really not interested in at all and even those girls I just have to avoid them! It's like if I can't control my muscles when I see them and I just have to look away or stay as far as possible from them, unless I have seen them before or know them in which case I have no trouble looking at them and talking to them.

Oh and btw my psychiatrist told me that I have obsessive-compulsive disorder. I don't know if it's relevant.

Another thing is that I'm not capable of accepting when people know that there was something I wanted which I was not able to get. For some reason, it shows a weakness and it makes me feel like I'm dying. Obviously, being rejected by a girl is probably the ultimate killer in this situation, but many other situations can be just as bad if not worse.

Recently I wanted to go eat in a restaurant but as I tried to open the door, I realized that it was closed because it was too early and the restaurant didn't open before 11 AM. The problem is that there were people around. In my head, I couldn't help but see the situation as people realizing that I wanted to eat at that restaurant, thus had a need to be filled with (the need was hunger or the will to eat at the restaurant).
In my mind, a need is a weakness so whenever someone wants something it is a weakness because he is not satisfied with what he has. So just the fact of walking in the restaurant for me is terrible because people realize that I have that weakness, ie the desire to eat at that particular restaurant. But when people see that I find the door locked, it shows them two things:

1) I probably don't live in that area of town because otherwise I would have known that the restaurant is closed.
2) By failing to obtain what I wanted, I am dissapointed because I have a need and wasn't able to fill it to achieve satisfaction.

Both 1 and 2 shows a weakness. 1 shows a lack of experience, which is particularly painful for me in other situations such as taking the train and waiting for the doors to open on the wrong side of the train (ie, the doors open on the right side when we get to the station but I'm waiting near the doors on the left side of the train because I haven't been to that station before and thus I didn't know that the doors would open that way, which shows that I'm a "newbie" and "inexperienced." This leads me to avoid taking the train altogether from fear of showing that I don't know which side the doors would open.)
Number 2 would lead people to conclude that I am sad. Personally, I don't care about not being able to eat in the restaurant. Okay, I would have prefered to go, but in the end it doesn't matter because by not going I save some money so it doesn't really bothers me that much. However, there is the possibility that people who see the scene conclude that I truly wanted to eat in that restaurant, which is why I tried to open the front door, and thus by failing to fulfill my wish I was sad. Even if I am not sad, the possibility that people might think that I am feeling sad or dissapointed is extremely painful for me and when it happens I have to walk away as fast as possible looking away from people and pretend that they are not there while I manage to escape to some "safe" place - a place where everyone who is around me has not seen me trying to walk in the restaurant and thus does not think that I am sad and have failed to fulfill my goals.

When it comes to girls, it's the same thing. If a girl thinks that I want her, it makes her think that I have a weakness in the form of a hole to fill - that hole to fill being loneliness or simply not being satisfied with my current situation. If a girl thinks I want her, at the same time she thinks that I am not "full," in the sense that being "full" is a state in which a person reaches a state in which he has been able to accept the emptiness and ephemeral state of existence which disconnects him from the empirically observable world - such a state would eliminate sadness because inner well-being would no longer depend on external factors.
Yet, by thinking that I want her, a girl will have no choice but to conclude that I cannot find satisfaction with myself or with my interpretation of the world surrounding me and that I need her to help me strengthen my weakness. I do not have that problem with men because there is normally a presumption that people are straight and not attracted to the opposite sex, which of course can be refuted, but in principle when I talk to another man or make eye contact it is natural for him to assume that I do not need him for emotional contact and affection, which would show the most painful kind of weakness. Yet, the presumption works the other way, a man is presumed to be interested in girls and thus if I make eye contact with a girl and approach her, it is presumed that I either desire her or wouldn't mind having her company, which displays a need for affection. This is the reason why, in any situation I am in, unless I have a justifiable reason to talk to or approach a girl (if the girl talks to me, I answer because I am polite and if I see a girl I know I approach her for the simple reason that I see someone I know and thus am justified in starting a conversation).

Yes, I am aware that I am not normal and that's why I am asking for whatever help I can get from people who can understand my problem. My way of thinking is rooted deep in my mind and I have spent years trying to eliminate it yet I have never been able to. Psychiatrists were unable to make a final diagnosis on me yet but they have concluded to obsessive-compulsive disorder and believe that there is a chance I have anxiety problems as well. In any case, I have started reading stuff in the DJ Bible to get myself through it, but the more I read I'm afraid the more I seem to have the impression that my efforts to improve are vain.

So... what do you guys suggest I do at this point?
 
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Jariel

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It sounds like psychological conditioning. It happens to a lot of guys either as a result of parents, church, friends or whatever, and leaves them afraid of their sexuality (or afraid of showing interest in your case). Some guys are afraid of touching a woman, saying anything sexually suggestive, general intimacy or being put on the spot, and your case sounds extreme.

To be honest, I can relate to what you are saying as I used to feel the same way myself many years ago.

Overcoming it is a case of reconditioning yourself and breaking these old habits and restraints. You're going to have to force yourself out of this comfort zone. Do it gradually if it helps and start by making brief eye contact with non-threatening old ladies, and work upto the younger women.
 

milkman

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Originally posted by Jariel
It sounds like psychological conditioning. It happens to a lot of guys either as a result of parents, church, friends or whatever, and leaves them afraid of their sexuality (or afraid of showing interest in your case). Some guys are afraid of touching a woman, saying anything sexually suggestive, general intimacy or being put on the spot, and your case sounds extreme.

To be honest, I can relate to what you are saying as I used to feel the same way myself many years ago.

Overcoming it is a case of reconditioning yourself and breaking these old habits and restraints. You're going to have to force yourself out of this comfort zone. Do it gradually if it helps and start by making brief eye contact with non-threatening old ladies, and work upto the younger women.
Jariel is right. :cool:

But if possible, skip the part with the old women unless you are into old women. ;)

Go as soon as possible for the women you like. Yeah, I am talking about the women you personally like most (no matter how other people find them).

Accept the way you are feeling. There is no problem with being nervous, being unhappy etc. Try to approach women no matter how you feel and in what mood you are.

You see a woman you like, you are nervous, you wear ****ty clothes you don´t know what to say?

Great, so go and approach her.

Dude, you can only win. ;)
 

milkman

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Originally posted by electro shock
but the more I read I'm afraid the more I seem to have the impression that my efforts to improve are vain.

So... what do you guys suggest I do at this point?
Don´t read that much. I am serious: stop reading right now. Instead go out and do at least "something". I don´t give you advise her what to do.

Do what comes in your mind.

Then come back and report and we can discuss further. But I will talk to a guy then who has been started to get active.

So dude go, I am with you. ;)
 

MackJr

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I'm not sure what to say about your OCD. It looks like it has the effect of taking mild phobias for most guys and making them more extreme for you.

I'm going to give you the same advice I'd give a guy without OCD, with the understanding that you might need to practice more, and that's okay.

You have a very strong fear of humiliation and rejection. You're even averting eye contact becuase you're thinking too far ahead--ie that a woman will reject you because she thinks that you're interested in her. So you see it's not the fear of women. It's the fear of rejection.

What you have to do is reframe what it means to win in a social encounter. Start with the smile program. Go out into town and smile at 3 women while walking. Do this for 3 days. Then move up to 5, and finally 10. Practice just being able to smile in a relaxed way when you see a woman. You have "succeeded" in the interaction if you smile. If she smiles back, that's nice, but if she doesn't notice you, or if she even frowns, it doesn't matter, because you got your smile in.

Do this for 2-3 weeks until it's automatic. Then when you're comfortable doing smiles, move up to saying "Hi". Later, when you're comfortable saying hi to strangers, chit chat about non-sexual subjects. For example, if you're buying groceries, you can say, "man, I really like this kind of potato", etc.

If you follow this program, and do the exercises, you'll be able to come back here and talk about the more intricate aspects of dating, but first we want to build a solid foundation of being able to interact socially.

Good luck, we'll be waiting to hear from you to see how it goes.
 

white cloud 8

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...because....girls are the devil...momma said ;).
 

Pfeile

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Originally posted by MackJr
You have a very strong fear of humiliation and rejection... It's the fear of rejection.
I think you have Avoidant Personality Disorder (APD):
"Avoidant personality disorder is characterized by extreme social anxiety. People with this disorder often feel inadequate, avoid social situations, and seek out jobs with little contact with others. Avoidants are fearful of being rejected and worry about embarassing themselves in front of others. They exaggerate the potential difficulties of new situations to rationalize avoiding them. Often, they will create fantasy worlds to substitute for the real one. Unlike schizoid personality disorder, avoidants yearn for social relations yet feel they are unable to obtain them. They are frequently depressed and have low self-confidence."

From: http://www.4degreez.com/disorder/avoidant.html
(Just Google search it for more info)

I have it as well (albeit not as severe as in your case), and I totally understand what you're talking about. I diagnosed myself about a year ago and since then I've been trying to improve. One thing I did was get a job where I am forced to constantly speak to customers, just random strangers who I've never met before. I still find it a bit challenging, but it's getting better.

Here's another thread from someone who has it.

I used to think that having APD was just a born-with personality trait that I would have to live with. But then I realised that it is an abnormal condition. It is a disorder. It is not who you are. It is not your personality. Therefore, it can be changed.

There is a lot you can do to overcome it. I'm sure you can answer your own question. Just remember like everything, it takes time. Practice makes perfect. I am by no means over it yet, but I've definitely made improvements. Have courage.

"Fears are conquered by repeated acts of courage."
 

Downrock27

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I was diagnosed with OCD at age 14 and still deal with it on a moderate level even to this day. One thing about it is often becoming obsessed with extremely irrational thoughts. It sounds like this feeling of not wanting other people to think you're not satisfied because you couldnt eat at a restaurant because it was closed may be OCD.

Having the disorder myself I can completely understand where you are coming from with these bizarre thoughts. OCD can manifest itself in many ways, but it always involves obsessive behaviour over something that would seem mundane or illogical to anyone without the disorder. It's also possible that you have Avoidant personality disorder like another poster suggested, but the abnormality of the whole thinking behind social situations definitely makes me think it is tied in with OCD. It really is a ***** of a disorder. If you wanna talk more about it give me a PM and hopefully I can help you out, also I can let you know what sort of thoughts and ideas ive struggled with. With OCD its always good to be able to talk to someone who understands how it feels. Good luck.
 
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