Which is most importan Rapport or Attraction

[SELF-MASTERY]

Which do you find to be the most important? There are plenty of fat ugly converstionist who can get a girl laughing and talking, but never seem to date any of the women that they work so hard to amuse.

I'm not trying to devalue conversation, but should we waste our time on women who are not responsive to our mere presence? Do any of you know that feeling, where you can just tell that a women is into you? If I dont have that feeling should I go foreward and chat her up?

What are your thoughts?

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Attraction without a doubt.

 

[SELF-MASTERY]

What are the tale tale signs that women are attractive to you. Women are not as obvious with men.

 

[Alpine]

Too much rapport and not enough attraction = chump LJBF

 

[KnightRyder]

Originally posted by SELF-MASTERY
Which do you find to be the most important? There are plenty of fat ugly converstionist who can get a girl laughing and talking, but never seem to date any of the women that they work so hard to amuse.

I'm not trying to devalue conversation, but should we waste our time on women who are not responsive to our mere presence? Do any of you know that feeling, where you can just tell that a women is into you? If I dont have that feeling should I go foreward and chat her up?

What are your thoughts?

I have to say two things.

First off, Good thread Self-mastery .

Secondly, I agree with all the comments made on it so far.

lastly, attraction can sometimes cause rapport, but because you talk well with someone doesn't mean you are attracted to them.

Part of rapport, is your willingness to talk to them and that has to come from you being somewhat attracted to them. So while everything is not clear cut , I would have to agree that attraction stems rapport and attraction is the basic bread and butter, if you are ever going to have a relationship.

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Originally posted by SELF-MASTERY
What are the tale tale signs that women are attractive to you. Women are not as obvious with men.

Attraction is pretty straight forward. Any type of repetitive kino(especially long lasting) is a good sign. However, understand that a woman may not go beyond just being attracted to you for various reasons. For example, there's tons of guys out there in the LJBF zone where the woman is definitely attracted to them but won't become romantic with them because they are afraid of loosing the friendship.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

Apples & oranges.

Attraction leads to rapport. Rapport never leads to attraction. The best rapport ever experienced by a woman will never be enough to get you laid.

 

[Donald Kaufman]

Attraction leads to rapport. Rapport never leads to attraction

I think there is truth to this statement but it's not quite so simple.

I think it is more about the goal. If you go into a convo believing by developing rapport it will turn into attraction you will fail. If you go into the same situation believing rapport will be part of what allows you the time to get close enough to increase the IL it can can be a good part of creating attraction. In this sense rapport can be seen as a tool.

How and when you use rapport can decide the nature of the relationship. If you work mostly on attraction and little on rapport it will more likely be a physically based, short term, hopefully no one gets too invested into it thing. If you add rapport into the mix it will tend towards something with more expectation and more potential. Ultimately more dangerous but it also can be more fulfilling. More ventured, more possible gain.

The screwed up part is, if you use rapport you increase the chance of an LTR and also the chance that if something goes wrong or you decide to treat it lightly it will blow up in your face.

Even worse, if you don't use rapport early you can choose to use it later and it can still become something deeper. (i think david deangelo goes into more detail in this in his lover/provider stuff)

The very worst part is I find the rapport the most intriguing part.

So, attraction does not have to lead to rapport, but it can be brought in any time with a similar chance of success.

Rapport seldom in and of itself leads to attraction and will often be one of the things that will stand in the way of attraction.

On a selfish note I will lose any attraction I have for a girl if I cannot develop rapport leaving her available for most guys who are happy to just have some eye candy.

It's a little AFC but I don't think I would change that if I could.

 

[TooColdUlrick]

you can have rapport without attraction. but it's very difficult to have attraction without rapport.

with attraction comes rapport, because you're actually genuinely interested in each other.

therefore, to get laid, attraction is most important.

true, part of attraction is rapport. but the bottom line is that if a chick is attracted to you, she's yours to lose.

i have great rapport with almost every woman i meet because i'm such a charming and engaging specimin doesn't mean i can fvck 'em though.

 

[Magnus Pym]

ATTRACTION = RAPPORT

Pym

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Originally posted by Magnus Pym
ATTRACTION = RAPPORT

Pym

Really? Explain...

 

[TooColdUlrick]

Originally posted by Francisco d'Anconia
Really? Explain...

if a woman (or man) is attracted to you, they are much more inclined, in fact they would go out of their way subconsciously, to engage with you--THEY CRAVE MORE OF YOU. therefore, attraction leads to [more or better] rapport, even if you're not a particularly engaging person in the first place.

again, if a woman is attracted to you, you would really have to fvck things up to lose her.

but yet again, rapport is important in building attraction. the two are interdependent and of course there are exceptions.

we're talking about getting laid here aren't we? if u put a gun to my head, i would say:

60/40, 70/30, attraction/report ratio is probably about right.

for one night stands, more like:

90/10 ratio. because ONS's dont care about talking, they care about fvcking!

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Originally posted by TooColdUlrick
if a woman (or man) is attracted to you, they are much more inclined, in fact they would go out of their way subconsciously, to engage with you--THEY CRAVE MORE OF YOU. therefore, attraction leads to [more or better] rapport, even if you're not a particularly engaging person in the first place.

again, if a woman is attracted to you, you would really have to fvck things up to lose her.

but yet again, rapport is important in building attraction. the two are interdependent and of course there are exceptions.

we're talking about getting laid here aren't we? if u put a gun to my head, i would say:

60/40, 70/30, attraction/report ratio is probably about right.

for one night stands, more like:

90/10 ratio. because ONS's dont care about talking, they care about fvcking!

So by default, if a person finds you attractive, you can have the personality of a rock and the person will still find you attractive.

And since attraction is equal to rapport, a woman will automatically think you are attractive if she enjoys your personality, right?

 

[TooColdUlrick]

Originally posted by Francisco d'Anconia
So by default, if a person finds you attractive, you can have the personality of a rock and the person will still find you attractive.

i wouldn't go that far. for a ONS, yes. for seducing, no. a dude with a personality of a rock cannot seduce anything but his own hand.

And since attraction is equal to rapport, a woman will automatically think you are attractive if she enjoys your personality, right?

attraction leads to rapport. someone else said attraction=rapport. i don't think attraction=rapport at all.

no, i don't think so. she won't automatically find u attractive (e.g. want to fvck you) if she simply enjoys your personality. if that was the case, there wouldn't be so many LJBF threads here.

sure, in some cases if she enjoys your personality, rapport, that will lead to attraction. but you'd be wasting your time.

=========

like i said, the two are interdependent, with attraction the most important. if she isn't attracted to you, and never will be, you ain't getting pvssy!

1. what is the probability of tagging a chick if she's only attracted to you?

2. what is the probability of tagging a chick if you only have good rapport?

3. what is the probability of tagging a chick if you have both?

***

1. high: for a ONS

2. low: you'd have to spend a lot of time and HOPE she will BECOME attracted to you. Yikes! emotional tampon territory?

3. very high: if you don't fvck it up, and a relationship can develop (a great one!).

bottom line: dont waste time on chicks that aren't attracted to you. don't next them, but don't waste a lot of time with them because you're approaching "get lucky" territory. DJ's dont get lucky.

do chicks waste their time, trying to bag guys that they aren't attracted to? rarely for HB7's and higher. when a chick goes out to get fvcked, who does she end up with? a guy she's physically attracted to. she'll probably never see him again.

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

Originally posted by TooColdUlrick
i don't think attraction=rapport at all.

That's all that I was attempting to point out. Either one feeds into the other and can possibility enhance the other.

 

[john]

get attraction first, then wait for her to seek rapport.

never try to seek rapport with a girl who doesnt seek it first.

you need to attract, qualify her, THEN let her try for rapport.

rapport is a lot easier to learn than attraction.

 

[SELF-MASTERY]

rapport is a lot easier to learn than attraction.

Attraction can't be learned. It is either there or not there.

 

[Francisco d'Anconia]

How does one actually 'get' attraction? And what do you mean by waiting for her to seek rapport???

 

[mcs]

i wouldn't go that far. for a ONS, yes. for seducing, no. a dude with a personality of a rock cannot seduce anything but his own hand.

i dunno. i had no big interest in this one girl and i was way too ****y for her. yet we had best sex ever... and now i'm thinking about creating the rapport. she's a bit whiny and that's great because that's a good challenge to be a man's man.

 

[BadsnakeUK]

You need both to some degree. Even if you have the best looks, dress sense and build in the world, 'wanna f/ck?' is not going to cut it with most women. You need to have at least a small amount of rapport or they will feel like they're being used for sex.

Even is she knows deep down its a purely physical thing her conditioning will require that she has some token rapport so she can justify her actions to herself.

It also depends on the girl. Some need more rapport before they open their legs, others don't. You need to be able to gauge this and play it accordingly. This is what calibration is all about.

Why be one or the other? Be the full package.