Which coaches are the real deal?

[eli77]

All you need is Doc Love, self-improvement, and practice.

Nothing wrong with Cory Wayne, but his book is boring a fvck... and really it's just Doc Love with sex and Tony Robbins BS.... but it's okay. I guess if I had to recommend anyone, since Tom Hodges (AKA Doc Love) is dead, it would be Wayne. You can get most of his content for free but I don't think I would waste any money with one-on-one coaching with anyone.

What do you got against tony lol

 

[eli77]

Between here and the library you should be good

 

[SmoothSmooth]

Direct game/fast game can actually work wonders, but that’s the thing you need to be good at it and establish a solid frame. Got laid by that far often then with indirect game and they were most often the more respectfully ones, because they respect men who embrace their sexuality

ok so explain your direct game? 'hey wanna come over for a drink sometime?' - no comfort; no establishing a connection, no flirting....that doesnt work. why would she respect you for that more than the guy who is displaying personality and being less thirsty....
i have 6 ft 4 friends that have male model looks and they also need to go indirect with women...
u need rapport and vibe, sex occurs mentally before physically for many women
how desperate does a woman have to be to hop into bed with the guys that go 'fast' versus the ones that are more paced. whats in it for her other than the risk of std, bad sex and regret

 

[SmoothSmooth]

I’m naturally good at it. it’s all part of the game you either have to be good at it or learn to be good at it. I was surrounded by girls since my childhood so I can instinctively tell what to say and what to avoid in that moment, it happens natural

yeah i was surrounded by girls too, and nothing turns them off/creeps them more than guys that act thirsty or upfront about sex. it might work in a nightclub or holiday resort but not everyday society.
are you suggesting men just message girls for casual sex with no build up? can you imagine females you know or relatives responding to that behaviour? the first thing she'll think is 'how many other girls has he tried this with'

contrary to what most 'coaches' teach, the vast majority of women use sex as a means to pursue relationships. ONS is alot rarer than people make it seem, and gets rarer among the more attractive and socially competitive women

 

[SmoothSmooth]

That’s not what I’m saying and suggesting here. The difference is you are doing things fast. Rapport, comfort, escalation they happen fast and smoothly when you are good at it. You give off desperate and creepy vibes when you subcommunicate it, subcommunication happens over 90% through your nonverbal

yeah i agree to escalate fast on the date, but its also a push/pull thing. however usually you come across as more attractive if you have restraint rather than too fast.

 

[SmoothSmooth]

Narcissist for example pull fast game very good. That’s because they already subcommunicate that they are the king of this world and that they are supposed to be worshipped. Woman can sense their strong ^high value^ subcommunication. That’s why narcissist are extremely good in short term things but very very bad in long term prospects

yeah that works in bars and holiday resorts. doesnt work in general society where women have their guards up

 

[SmoothSmooth]

also i read somewhere that narcissists always underperform in the dating market. theyre more likely to have indiscriminate sex with people way below their level than with people on or above their smv. its the good looking guy that bangs 100 5/10s but never an actual hottie. female narcissists also tend to partner with men way below their expected level, due to the desire for control...other issues include hyper-sensitivity, domineering (in a non sexy way), lovebombing, intensity, lack of patience etc which scares most people away

 

[SmoothSmooth]

I don’t know about this but there are some plausible but contradicting points. A grandiose narcissist would only want the best thing, a covert one more likely what she/he can get

most narcissists are completely deluded in my experience and underperform/lie about dating results.

 

[SmoothSmooth]

You have to remember narcissist are the game. It comes from them, attraction is based solely on narcissism. If someone has her guard up a narcissist will know what to do, most of the time playing the victim or relating to one of their past bad experience which leads to sex. But this won’t work long term

not true. narcissists tend to be more attractive because they acquire resources and put themselves first - are very image and status driven. but narcissistic behaviours do not help with women. a narcissist would do better in dating by learning to hide their narcissistic behaviours and act 'more normal', whilst retaining the charm and status their narcissism has given them.

90% of the 'game' with women is just appearing agenda-less, normal and relaxed..

 

[SmoothHendrixPS2]

BS. telling a woman upfront that you want sex is the worst strategy. if it was that simple, these forums wouldnt exist and everyone would be getting laid. it will only work on the worst of the worst type women and make you look like a thirsty/desperate lunatic.
ive never in my life met a man with an enviable dating life that just tells women upfront that he wants sex. play it cool, seduce her smoothly etc is the conventional approach which has been proven to work for millions of men

@SmoothSmooth Unfortunately you are in fact wrong. Let me start off by saying Mode one (direct approach) isn't for everyone. It's for men who are in the top 20 percent of self assurance, backbone, erotic dominance, and confidence.

You obviously haven't read the books and are just assuming you know what mode one is. Mode one wasn't designed to get you laid. It was designed to weed out and decipher the type of women you are approaching and her level of interest, while saving your money and time. Getting rejected after a 5 minute conversation by stating your true intentions is way better than being indirectly vague and ambiguous for two weeks and paying for her food and drinks. I walk away from a mode one rejection confident and happy because I showed alpha qualities. I don't lose my balls after a rejection. Mode one allows you to NEVER GET PLAYED!

I've been indirectly smooth and conventional and have had my fair share of success in my lifetime. I speak with sub communication (********) with women online and texting, But the breakthrough I've witnessed being mode one direct has changed my whole approach game. The reason a lot of you guys get played is because you are manipulative yourselves.

I'd be willing to bet that almost 80% of the guys on here or even in society (including you) don't have the balls or backbone to approach a women in an explicitly sexual manner. It takes an extremely self assured man to do so in an erotic and smooth seductive way. The guys who throw shade at Mode One are usually guys who struggle with abrupt rejection. Mode one frees men from the failure of rejection. You don't just say "I want to ****k you". You have to be verballly smooth and seductive, confident bordering on ****y. Anytime you say something alpha to a woman, she will test you by looking into your eyes and seeing if you truly mean what you say. THAT's THE KEY TO MODE ONE! The biggest factor of mode one that you boys don't understand is how you hold your frame when women give you **** tests for being so bold. If you are unapologetic and hold the frame, 9 times out of ten the women will get wet for you. But ya'll still caught up in getting her damn number or taking her out on dates.

Being "thirsty" would be me asking for *****. I tell them "I know you want to share my company", "I can't wait for you to *** on my hard ****", I can't wait to stretch your ***** out". See the difference? I'm sure of myself, not "Thirsty". And if they reject me, I move on and leave them alone. That's not desperate silly goose...If you understand the true nature of women, they get extremely turned on by the images they have in their head. Erotica is one of the highest selling genres in the world. They love descriptive sexual thoughts. Hearing a man speak in these ways to them with a dominant aura is intoxicating. What happens is they're social programming causes them to ACT like they aren't naughty or get defensive with you. If you maintain the frame it will lower her social programming (conscious mind) and her wet ***** will do all the decision making (subconscious).

I had 4 same day seductions this summer with HOT women being mode one. READ THAT AGAIN.... SAME DAY. I'd say all 4 were 8's or up, all under 25 years old. I got there *****'s wet during the first convo. Have you ever done that? One sucked my **** in the car at the beach after an hour of meeting her. I spent 0 $. 0 $!!!!!!! One came to my house after the club. Another I met at starbucks and I have vids and pics to prove it. Didn't buy her one drink. Have you had a girl suck your **** after one hour of meeting her? Have you ****ed a girl in your car the same day you met her? I HAVE. I don't mind tooting my own horn to prove to you how stupid you sound. . Reading ARC's books has done more for me than this forum ever will lol.

You can keep being indirect all you want, just know you wouldn't want your bitches in the same room as this bad boy (hopefully you got bitches) REAL TALK

Piece of advice: Actually read a book before you critique it's philosophies.

Like I said, Mode one isn't for everyone. But anyone on here who wants to critique my approach game or mode one should actually read the books so we can have intelligent talking points and discussions.

DROPS MIC

 

[SW15]

non of them. They are all sales person and in some degree they probably know it won’t work. They might say things like but there is one way and if it doesn’t work there is some last tactic you can try, but it doesn’t guarantee anything. It’s all about money, they have to do this in order to make profit. Sometimes they will even sabotage your relationship to ask for more help/ coaching sessions

I have had suspicions about this. There have been times in my life that I thought about dating coaching but never did it. I have read online articles and books instead.

 

[SmoothSmooth]

@SmoothSmooth Unfortunately you are in fact wrong. Let me start off by saying Mode one (direct approach) isn't for everyone. It's for men who are in the top 20 percent of self assurance, backbone, erotic dominance, and confidence.

You obviously haven't read the books and are just assuming you know what mode one is. Mode one wasn't designed to get you laid. It was designed to weed out and decipher the type of women you are approaching and her level of interest, while saving your money and time. Getting rejected after a 5 minute conversation by stating your true intentions is way better than being indirectly vague and ambiguous for two weeks and paying for her food and drinks. I walk away from a mode one rejection confident and happy because I showed alpha qualities. I don't lose my balls after a rejection. Mode one allows you to NEVER GET PLAYED!

I've been indirectly smooth and conventional and have had my fair share of success in my lifetime. I speak with sub communication (********) with women online and texting, But the breakthrough I've witnessed being mode one direct has changed my whole approach game. The reason a lot of you guys get played is because you are manipulative yourselves.

I'd be willing to bet that almost 80% of the guys on here or even in society (including you) don't have the balls or backbone to approach a women in an explicitly sexual manner. It takes an extremely self assured man to do so in an erotic and smooth seductive way. The guys who throw shade at Mode One are usually guys who struggle with abrupt rejection. Mode one frees men from the failure of rejection. You don't just say "I want to ****k you". You have to be verballly smooth and seductive, confident bordering on ****y. Anytime you say something alpha to a woman, she will test you by looking into your eyes and seeing if you truly mean what you say. THAT's THE KEY TO MODE ONE! The biggest factor of mode one that you boys don't understand is how you hold your frame when women give you **** tests for being so bold. If you are unapologetic and hold the frame, 9 times out of ten the women will get wet for you. But ya'll still caught up in getting her damn number or taking her out on dates.

Being "thirsty" would be me asking for *****. I tell them "I know you want to share my company", "I can't wait for you to *** on my hard ****", I can't wait to stretch your ***** out". See the difference? I'm sure of myself, not "Thirsty". And if they reject me, I move on and leave them alone. That's not desperate silly goose...If you understand the true nature of women, they get extremely turned on by the images they have in their head. Erotica is one of the highest selling genres in the world. They love descriptive sexual thoughts. Hearing a man speak in these ways to them with a dominant aura is intoxicating. What happens is they're social programming causes them to ACT like they aren't naughty or get defensive with you. If you maintain the frame it will lower her social programming (conscious mind) and her wet ***** will do all the decision making (subconscious).

I had 4 same day seductions this summer with HOT women being mode one. READ THAT AGAIN.... SAME DAY. I'd say all 4 were 8's or up, all under 25 years old. I got there *****'s wet during the first convo. Have you ever done that? One sucked my **** in the car at the beach after an hour of meeting her. I spent 0 $. 0 $!!!!!!! One came to my house after the club. Another I met at starbucks and I have vids and pics to prove it. Didn't buy her one drink. Have you had a girl suck your **** after one hour of meeting her? Have you ****ed a girl in your car the same day you met her? I HAVE. I don't mind tooting my own horn to prove to you how stupid you sound. . Reading ARC's books has done more for me than this forum ever will lol.

You can keep being indirect all you want, just know you wouldn't want your bitches in the same room as this bad boy (hopefully you got bitches) REAL TALK

Piece of advice: Actually read a book before you critique it's philosophies.

Like I said, Mode one isn't for everyone. But anyone on here who wants to critique my approach game or mode one should actually read the books so we can have intelligent talking points and discussions.

DROPS MIC

BS, you can test her interest with small compliance tests. just shorten you replies and see if she continues the convo, see if she follows ur lead etc. only a fool would think 'mode one' is the best way to find out a womans intentions with you.
if you have strong body language and an attractive masculine vibe, they will already know your intent, you dont need to express it.

what is attractive to a woman is you screening her and challenging her first, finding out about her, that she has to prove her worthy of sharing a bed or drink with you first

 

[characternote]

mode1 isn't special. It 'works', but everything 'works' if you are her type/you approach the right girl

 

[SmoothHendrixPS2]

BS, you can test her interest with small compliance tests. just shorten you replies and see if she continues the convo, see if she follows ur lead etc. only a fool would think 'mode one' is the best way to find out a womans intentions with you.
if you have strong body language and an attractive masculine vibe, they will already know your intent, you dont need to express it.

what is attractive to a woman is you screening her and challenging her first, finding out about her, that she has to prove her worthy of sharing a bed or drink with you first

First of all, attraction and seduction are two different things. Any good looking man with sex appeal can get girls based off attraction. Seduction is when you can persuade a woman into wanting you when she originally may not have. BIG DIFFERENCE. Having both is like a cheat code.

Did I ever say small compliance tests didn't work? They can work, but you can get played easily by a manipulative timewaster, erotic hypocrite, or wholesome pretender. These are archetypes of women that mode one nips in the but. You sadly won't know because you won't open your mind and read the book. And yea strong body language and masculine vibe is used IN CONJUNCTION with being verbally direct. What better "challenge" than to challenge her social programming? That's what mode one does. You can screen her and all that basic game bull**** while being mode one. There have been men who have gotten charged with date rape because there was no verbal communication.

You never answered my questions of whether you've had same day seductions such as this "fool" writing this post... Did body language alone ever allow you to seduce women and **** them in the same day you met them? I highly doubt it. You need verbal game and communication to make magic like that happen.

It's ok if you're not in the top 20 percent of alpha males bro. We'll still love you here on so suave, the land of the unconsciously incompetent.

 

[SmoothHendrixPS2]

mode1 isn't special. It 'works', but everything 'works' if you are her type/you approach the right girl

Yea this statement is partly true. Mode one isn't going to work if you're ugly af, short, and not sexually attractive. Confidence is the biggest trait you need, which is why most men are scared to even try it. I personally got big balls and a backbone made of steel, so I gave it a try and am reaping the benefits.

There deff needs to be a level of attraction from the girl for mode one to work in your favor, but at the same time the mindset that there's a specific type of girl to approach is bull****. In this day and age, unless she is a nun or extremely religious, all women have a kinky freak side that is waiting to be unleashed. Doesn't matter what girl it is. If you think there's such a thing as "good girls" then you suffer from the madonna ***** complex and are holding yourself back. I'm not necessarily proud of it, but I've seduced married woman or those in LTR's. This is proof that women can't control they're sexual urges when someone is able to diffuse their social programming through DIRECT VERBAL GAME.

 

[characternote]

yeah, by 'right girl', I didn't mean a '$lut' or whatever, because I also think there's no such thing as a good girl. I just mean a girl who thinks you are hot or whatever, basically.

Same as I have good looking friends who literally DM random girls on insta and tell them they're hot and suggest meeting up for sex, who get some success. But as with 'mode 1' it's not actually 'seduction'. It won't work on a girl who doesn't want to be seduced by you. In fact, no game will. Be it indirect 'mysterymethod' (who many here think is the best) or the complete opposite (mode1, which you think is the best)

I'm in the 'it's irrelevant' camp, so I don't care either way lol

 

[SmoothHendrixPS2]

yeah, by 'right girl', I didn't mean a '$lut' or whatever, because I also think there's no such thing as a good girl. I just mean a girl who thinks you are hot or whatever, basically.

Same as I have good looking friends who literally DM random girls on insta and tell them they're hot and suggest meeting up for sex, who get some success. But as with 'mode 1' it's not actually 'seduction'. It won't work on a girl who doesn't want to be seduced by you. In fact, no game will. Be it indirect 'mysterymethod' (who many here think is the best) or the complete opposite (mode1, which you think is the best)

I'm in the 'it's irrelevant' camp, so I don't care either way lol

Text messaging and dm's are not mode one. Mode one is VERBAL communication. Meaning using your voice. I don't suggest being verbally direct with OLD, social media, or even texting (unless she opens the door for sexual talk). You can consider me indirect Mode 2 or vague and ambiguous when it comes to the phone. But mode one in person.

You're wrong though because seducing is exactly that, It is persuading a woman who doesn't want you into wanting you. When I tell a girl "You're fine af, I can just picture bending you over while you throw that phat ass back at me" and she gives me an adverse reaction, curses me out, calls me names... but I hold my confident frame and demeanor, which leads to her THEN getting turned on by me is seduction in it's purest form.

 

[characternote]

You're wrong though because seducing is exactly that, It is getting a women who doesn't want you, to wanting you.

Which the community (the small percent who believe that's possible and that doesn't include me) would say is exactly what indirect game is for (Mysterymethod etc, which is the opposite of mode1)
Opening a girl who isn't attracted to you and telling her all the sexual stuff you wanna do with her doesn't end well for anyone lol
But of course if you are good looking or even if you open a girl who happens to think you look hot, then direct game can of course work
But in terms of 'getting women who don't want you, wanting you', we'll just have to agree to disagree. I've never seen anything like it with fellow gamers, and not even seen anything like it in coaches infields! Of which i've seen many. It's just the stuff of anecdotes on reddit/seddit, tbh. (''I have a friend who is 4ft tall, broke, old and covered in burns, and he bangs hot teenage models every weekend from cold approach' kinda thing etc)

 

[SmoothSmooth]

mode1 isn't special. It 'works', but everything 'works' if you are her type/you approach the right girl

i am definitely top 20% and i am experienced to know that you are full of cap. you cannot 'same day lay' a woman who isnt a) highly promiscious b) likely intoxicated c) low status and d) already highly physically attracted to you.
you also will never loose an attracted woman by being indirect, but you will loose 99% of them by being direct.
you also cannot 'convince' a woman to sleep with you by your game or approach as characternote has already stated. any player knows you can tell within a few seconds if you have a shot or not

 

[Velasco]

Mystery's indirect Vs Mode one's direct game.

Meet: Alek Novy's level concept :

"Let’s say that moves fall on a spectrum of 1 to 20…

– With 20 being you pushing your **** up against her and grinding her as you pull her hair back (or i dunno grab her ***** as you lean into her face and talk dirty)

– With 1 being something like “Leaning in a little closer than normal and/or having deeper more sultry eye contact”.

When women complain about guys making a move, it’s about the level being inappropriate.

You’re like wait, if women give no signals, but then also complain when you make a move, what are you to do? Die a virgin or just accept being a douche?

The solution is that you only make a low-level move… That’s why it seems like there’s a logical contradiction. When women say “I hate it when men make a move”… In most cases it’s “I hate he went directly to a level 7 move and kept communicating at level 7 despite me still being at level 1”.

Women give most of their signals in a proceptive manner.

That means in reaction to your moves. The most common sign a girl can and will give is accepting your advances. That’s how human mating works".

i posted a report here recently where I was going at a level above level of appropriateness. I notice this. Went back a level. Then when I felt I was beyond this level, I went back to the level that was once inappropriate. Her NOW accepting my advances, indicates this is the level we're at now.