Which car, 98 MustangGT or 90 300zx twinturbo?

[Bible_Belt]

Looking at muscle cars under 10 grand, there are two that I like the most:

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.j...smission=Manual&doors=&max_price=&cardist=300

and

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.j...engine=&style_flag=1&doors=&fuel=&cardist=300

Based on the numbers at http://www.albeedigital.com/supercoupe/articles/0-60times.html
both of these cars have similar 0-60 and 1/4 mi times.

The 300zx is my sentimental favorite. It says 'new engine, new turbos' in the ad, so maybe the price is not as high as it seems. Those turbos burn out, and most of those cars are off the road, but with care or simple mods, I could hopefully keep it going.

If performance if your criteria, which of these cars do you like better? Which of them would be easier to modify for better performance? If I dropped a couple grand on mods, which car would be easier to improve?

 

[ValleyDJing]

Mustang. Come on now, there's no contest here.

By the way, a Nissan is not a muscle car.

 

[BacardiGuy]

The turbos on the 300zx are good for about 85-100k miles before needing to be replaced. Replacing the clutch and engine probably means the car was abused. It's also a 1990, the first year for the new body, it was pretty problematic. Find one in better shape or go with the stang.

 

[Bible_Belt]

a Nissan is not a muscle car.

I figured those two cars would make for an interesting debate. I like the mustangs, and I am against the type of rice-racers that are often little more than neon flames, ridiculous spoilers, and obnoxious exhaust fart-tips on economy cars. I have read that most of the cars in the 'Fast and Furious' movies have 1/4 mi times over 15 seconds, making it pretty silly to call them "fast."

However, having said all of that, some people get serious performance out of heavy modifications to import cars.

http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.j...engine=&fuel=&doors=&style_flag=1&cardist=300

This guy claims to be getting 375 hp out of a 96 Nissan 240SX. If so, it would blow away any mustang in my price range.

I am considering buying someone's souped-up hobby car. Has anyone here done that? I imagine it is riskier in regard to reliability and trusting their work, but I see people spending small fortunes on their cars and not being able to get their money back out when they sell it. It would seem to make monetary sense to be on the winning end of someone else's losing transaction.

 

[BacardiGuy]

He also looks to be using nitrous, which if is the case good luck passing inspection. If you're pulled over with it, it will be impounded.

A lot of imports have a large aftermarket following, making it easy and cheap to produce big numbes out of the motors. If you're going to buy someone else's project, make sure the work is done by a reputable shop. Whatever car you're looking at do a search on the web for a respective car forum, you'll be able to find information about common problems and what to avoid.

 

[Bible_Belt]

yeah, the quality of the work is key.

But you probably have more restrictive vehicle laws in New York state. I don't have any inspections or emissions testing, and I think nitrous is legal in most places? Or you can have it but not use it?

http://www.autospeed.com/cms/A_2172/article.html
"legal in 50 states in America"

http://www.sportscarforums.com/f14/illegal-modifications-14455.html

Here in most states I believe that nitrous is fine, as long as your not caught using it.

 

[BacardiGuy]

Anything is fine if you're not caught. It's safe to say if you're pulled over with a nitrous bottle connected, the car is going to be impounded. Not sure where you are, but look it up through your DMV, not some product website.

 

[Don Juan Montoya]

The 300zx is very difficult to work on because of the plumbing of the 2 turbos. If you look under the hood you will see how cramped it is. Any work on it will cost u $$$$$$$$.

 

[Bible_Belt]

yep, one has to pull the engine to do much of anything.

I actually just bought a black 90 300zxTT that looks almost like the one in the ad above, except it has not had very much done to it, and needs a lot of tlc. The turbos are only supposed to be good for 60k miles; I'm going to have both of them rebuilt and put in a turbo timer to hopefully make the turbos not burn out so quickly. I'm trying to not do any mods that will shorten the life of the engine. It already has an upgraded exhaust; intake and maybe a chip upgrade is all I will do to it. These three mods take the Z to almost 400 horsepower. I am wanting the racelogic traction control in a bad way, but it may be out of my price range. The car I bought is an automatic, and it will take me a while to get accustomed to it.

 

[The Bartender]

Lets see...be the average joe and buy a mustang . There are seriously 1000 of those everytime I drive to work.

I always loved the 300ZX. I'd go with that, plus it's gonna be faster and more eye catching.

 

[SELF-MASTERY]

300zx, man!!! The z32 is better than the new one. Make sure you get the turbo version. I might end up buying one by next spring.

 

[Derek Flint]

You could get a nice, mid-90's M3 for around 10K

 

[Vincent]

First off the mustang is not a muscle car.

Second don't get the 300zx simply because it's had it's engine replaced. Something else is bound to go wrong and when you're buying a car you're looking for something that will last for a while. If you are buying a car to modify and race get the 300zx is the better choice. 98 mustangs are the new 4.6 engine putting out 260 hp, the 300zx put out around 300 if my memory served me correctly.

Get a more recent rx-7, 300zx, etc. The one you're looking at looks like more trouble then it's worth. Also miata's are really good cars to track. Light as hell and with a turbo you can push out 250 hp. Plus the suspension has a lot of room for upgrades. That thing will handle like a go-cart when you're done.

 

[BacardiGuy]

lol.. I love how you emphasize reliability and then recommend an RX-7

Gorgeous cars though.

 

[Bible_Belt]

The Z that I just bought is a 90 TT automatic with 118K miles. The exhaust has been upgraded. I'm at least going to upgrade the intake, and have all of the regular maintenance done like rebuilding both turbos and replacing the timing belt. I also want the Jim Wolf chip upgrade and the Racelogic traction control, but those may wait until the next round of improvements. This car can easily get to 400 hp. Jim Wolf sells after-market turbos that take it past 700HP, but they cost as much as the car.

 

[Soupar]

First off the mustang is not a muscle car.

Second don't get the 300zx simply because it's had it's engine replaced. Something else is bound to go wrong and when you're buying a car you're looking for something that will last for a while. If you are buying a car to modify and race get the 300zx is the better choice. 98 mustangs are the new 4.6 engine putting out 260 hp, the 300zx put out around 300 if my memory served me correctly.

Get a more recent rx-7, 300zx, etc. The one you're looking at looks like more trouble then it's worth. Also miata's are really good cars to track. Light as hell and with a turbo you can push out 250 hp. Plus the suspension has a lot of room for upgrades. That thing will handle like a go-cart when you're done.

Yes, the mustang is a muscle car, don't be a douche.

 

[Vincent]

lol.. I love how you emphasize reliability and then recommend an RX-7

Gorgeous cars though.

That was one of the go-fast for cheap cars. If he wants a reliable car I have other recomendations, but he seems foolish enough to want to daily drive a car that he's done perfomance mods to, this is a good car to do it on, the turbo's are really easy to work on. Just get used to replacing apex seals.

Yes, the mustang is a muscle car, don't be a douche.

The only mustang I would even consider a muscle car is the Boss 427. The newer mustangs are not muscle cars. If you think it's a muscle car, tell me why. And I won't buy the 'it's a muscle car because it has a v-8', you'd better have a well thought out explanation cause in my opinion the 'true' muscle cars died in 1971 and 1972-1975 were decent cars but lost the heart and sole of what muscle cars meant. After 1975 they've been junk. Nothing but cutting power for economy which lasted until the 90's when technology was improved to increase power and economy. Just look at the corvette. 400 hp and 29 mpg highway? That's beyond impressive.

 

[Bible_Belt]

I agree that mods and reliability tend to vary inversely. I have a reliable car that I will keep as a daily driver. But some mods should not shorten engine life, right? I don't see much harm in replacing the intake, for example. The Jim Wolf chip upgrade that I want is the first mod that begins pressure boosts inside the engine, but I still think it will not be too hard on it. I think the massive boost kits are the way to drastically shorten engine life, although it's fun while it lasts. The one thing I like about the traction control mod is that it actually makes the car safer to drive and does not shorten the life of the car; it also saves tires.

And about 'American muscle,' are you counting the recent Mustang cobras, GTOs, and Camaros that are all capable of Corvette-like horsepower?

 

[Vincent]

It really just depends. It depends on the car, the initial reliability of the engine, the initial reliability of the turbo's, how it's designed, etc. A cone and a chip 'might' not damage the engine, but those cones only work for a little while and chips are kinda a joke.

If you really want to have a car that's more fun to drive just do suspension mods. A tight suspension will make any car more fun to drive, plus the increased traction will increase power output from the tire to the ground. That and new wheels/tire will make your car feel completely different. This is where you should invest most of your money, unless you're going for something you plan on competetively track.

If you want to track it and get more power then increasing the boost is a good place to start. A larger intercooler will also drastically help power without adding a lot of weight and putting too much strain on the engine. Replace all the tubing, replace your injectors and sparks. Then you're probably going to need to replace your camshaft(s).

Modding a car is serious business and requires some serious understanding of the machine. If this is the first time you've ever done anything like this, you're going to make mistakes, and it's better to get a cheaper car and tinker with it, then to get a more expensive car and do serious damage because of inexperience.

If it was me, I would go out and find a MR2 turbo, a 300zx turbo, a supra turbo, etc. Not the more recent gen because those will be way more expensive, try to stay under 5k if you can. Find a good one of those that haven't been modded. If it was modded and they're selling it, they're selling it for a reason, remember that.

Without knowing exactly what you want to do with your car it's hard for me to tell you what to do.

And no I don't consider those muscle cars. They're more sports cars then muscle cars.

 

[Bible_Belt]

Why do the cones only work for a little while? Do they clog?

There are 1001 mods for this car:
http://z32racing.50megs.com/Z/_tt_mods/tt_mods.html

Jim Wolf sells a 650 hp aftermarket turbo:
http://www.jimwolftechnology.com/customer_part_detail.asp?PartID=403

Not that I plan on it, but if I put that 650hp turbo and upgraded intercoolers, which parts of the Z would break first? I'm morbidly curious.

Do you still consider the quality chips to be a joke? The Jim Wolf ECU upgrade
http://www.jimwolftechnology.com/customer_part_detail.asp?PartID=248
and the boost jets that come with it add 60-80 hp and 10 mph onto the top speed. But this is crossing that line into boosting compression, and I may not go there.

I may leave the factory chip and run no boost, and put all my money into handling upgrades as you suggest. There's not a track near me, so testing out new top speeds is not exactly a legal activity, and I need tires anyway. I continue to be impressed by everything I read about the racelogic traction control. I might actually be able to afford the thing if I leave the engine stock. Also, the Z does not brake especially well, and some upgrades in that area seem very reasonable.