When she tries to run game on you?

[upcoming_DJ]

Advice from the old lady: I hope you are sitting down. You are going to get some tough love here.



I concur greatly with @fastlife here. I find it extremely hard to fathom that she would have almost zero relationship experience at 28 years old for one thing. If she is pretty she has had male attention since her teen years and perhaps since her adolescent years. I know I had attention from that age (12 or 13) and my 13 year old daughter turns every male head when she walks into a room. The question is, what has she done with all that male attention? How did she cope with it? Was she aware of it? At what point did she become aware of it? How did it make her feel? Etc. If you consider continuing down a relationship path with this woman these are pieces of information that are going to inform how she is habituated to behaving around men, and those habits in turn are going to show up in her interactions with you, and with other men. The sense that I get is that she feels pain and shame from what you revealed. You need to know why that is.

You are asking what to do about her running game on you. You are asking the wrong question entirely in my view. You need to be looking deeper at her character and what makes her tick. That is the information you need to mine to determine what to do next.

The thing from the weekend that you reported as well as the texts since indicate pettiness and gamesmanship (NOT to be confused with "game") going on between you. You are both behaving in a reactionary manner and responding in kind. This is immature and accomplishes nothing accept p issing off one another (as you can observe from the chain of events over the weekend.)

When she asks earnestly how you felt about the weekend, good, bad and indifferent, you refuse to reply and you throw the question back at her. THAT IS NOT WHAT A SECURE, MATURE MAN DOES!!!! That is what a scared little punk or little boy does. A MAN would have taken that as an opportunity to outline where he stands, what his standards of behavior are, and it was a great opportunity to exhibit leadership and exert your masculine frame. That is what fastlife refers to in the top part of what I quoted. Instead you revert to childishness. If you are to be successful in relationship (whether short or long term) with this woman or anyone like her, you need to show stability. From your stability she can begin to relax into your expectations (boundaries; frame) and you place yourself in a position to guide her insofar as acceptable behavior and you also show her that she can be secure in your guidance and your leadership.

Many of the issues I read on here from a number of the guys really come down to this basic problem. Lack of maturity to understand that game playing does not help you, rather it makes you appear weak, malleable, emotional and ungrounded. On a subconscious level those traits are repulsive to women. Period.

There is nothing wrong with vulnerability from a position of security and inner strength, in fact this is extremely attractive. But that is the polar opposite of the kind of petty behavior you exhibited here.

You yourself have some growing to do in order to manage your woman better. Concentrate on that whilst inquiring about the questions I suggest above. Trading jousts in the pettiness arena is not serving you well. Men lead and don't await an invitation to do so.

As you grow and improve you'll understand why fastlife suggests you move on from this woman with daddy issues. But right now y'all are evenly paired for water always seeks its own level. Hope that is useful.

very useful! and thanks very much for this great insight as well! all points well taken and I can definitely identify with a lot of it!

since I am a deep diver, I've inquired about her past in relations to the questions you posed above and here are some answers I got from her:

• she has been an insecure girl for most of her teens going into adulthood - it's not until recently (2 years or so) so that's been gaining more confidence
• she was a "late bloomer" - didn't start going out until age 19 and had her first sexual encounter around then
• since she was insecure, she usually auto-rejected
• something very personal but there was some abuse in her family - which she said fortunately she was not a victim of but that scarred her and left her with trust issues with men (one of the factors of her shame with men) - not sure if she was entirely truthful here or she is indeed very ashamed in alluding this
  
• because of this "shame" or her trust issues, she has had a difficult time connecting with men further than physical interactions

I plan on talking with her in person about this and still exert frame/masculinity concerning this matters and set some obvious guidelines as to what I accept and don't and I'll stick to those. If she breaks them I hard next. I understand this completely, especially now.

I think one of those factors is that since it's only been 3 months and we don't have anything "formal" I haven't really had more serious discussions with her. I've been focused on having fun and hooking up!

but it's obviously getting emotional now, and she's expecting more from me. and sh!t testing to see how far she can take **** or what I will allow.

I also know I was way too reactionary over the weekend and should have soft next her when she showered her first signs of disrespect.

learning lessons accepted - only way to keep growing !! thanks again

 

[upcoming_DJ]

Awesome progress, bro. I know it feels good to have a woman competing, even groveling, for your attention--and offering confirmation for what you've been working on the past year.

But the fact that that does feel good makes you an easy mark for women who want a relatively high value man but aren't secure enough to hitch her wagon to a man who has fully actualized and realized his own value. I know it feels like you have the upper hand, but that's her game--as it is the game of all insecure women initially.

Competition anxiety is a necessary part for any relationship that exists within your frame--but equally important is how she responds to that anxiety. There constructive manipulation--buying you food, sexing you up, cleaning around the house, making herself valuable to your mission (do you have one?)--and there's destructive manipulation--silent treatment, causing a scene at a bar, distracting you from your purpose so that you have to give her attention to get back on track. Right now she's running through her 'rolodex' of sh1t tests to see what works--and right now it all does: constructive manipulation appeals to your ego & destructive manipulation makes you dance.

The ideal is that you are the man who only accepts constructive manipulation into your life--and you find a girl who's natural propensity is toward constructive manipulation. And that girl will probably have an awesome father who she has a good relationship with. Don't lose sight of the fact that this is a learning experience & it's up to you to test things to figure out what kind of girl you like. Maybe you want a little more drama; maybe you need the emotional ups & downs; but just know that those pros come with cons and those cons will be ever-present no matter how much bargaining you do. That's an itch I had to personally scratch for myself and, boy, I nuked it lol. Hopefully you don't have to go as far down that rabbit hole as I did.

thanks very much for this - makes a whole lot of sense and summarizes all I've been reading on heartiste and the rational male blogs all these months -

"But the fact that that does feel good makes you an easy mark for women who want a relatively high value man but aren't secure enough to hitch her wagon to a man who has fully actualized and realized his own value. I know it feels like you have the upper hand, but that's her game--as it is the game of all insecure women initially." ... this is an eye opener! while I've had a certain level of awareness this has brought it to another level.

many thanks for this. and yes, I have allowed her the freedom to constructive manipulation with me.

hardly does she does the destructive manipulation but like you said its new and she's still figuring out what works and what doesn't so I'll just maintain frame and keep this very thing you said in mind to guide our interactions.

of course, at the end of the day I'm having tons of fun.

 

[sazc]

Those text messages saying she won't tolerate that kind of behavior, that is unhealthy and she doesn't ever want it to occur again....SHE is laying down HER standards FOR YOU

It's supposed to be the other way around....

All in all seems like you had a good chat there. Hopefully BOTH of you understand WHY it occurred and are committed to not having it happen again.

She did tell you that this kind of interaction is unacceptable to her so, if you both find yourself in this dynamic again, maybe only one more time, maybe a few more times (who knows) she is going to (eventually) call it quits.