what do women want out of online dating?

[Naughty Ninja]

Now that we've all gotten the rants out of our systems, the question is what is EACH AND EVERY ONE of us doing to improve ourselves in not just looking (working out), dressing and grooming ourselves but in all aspects of life? You can either sit around complaining or put that energy into bettering yourselves and your appearence. It can only help you.

 

[Burroughs]

Now it is clear why for most of history women were not entrusted with power or status over men. Women are tyrants with no native sense of fairness and right and wrong, and its a bad thing giving them power. At least if they're going to be afforded ruling relationships with an iron hand, they shouldn't be allowed to control economics and commerce matters too.

Only when women are once more relegated to the status of property owned first by the father then the husband will there be harmony in society

today society is in chaos because elite men pander to women so that 99% of the men below the elite status are enslaved..call it slavery through proxy.....it is an efficient system because the men who are being enslaved cannot comprehend this...

 

[TillTheEndOfTime]

Now it is clear why for most of history women were not entrusted with power or status over men. Women are tyrants with no native sense of fairness and right and wrong, and its a bad thing giving them power.

The above explains "the glass ceiling" in the workplace. It is not a matter of discrimination against women. It is the fact that women make terrible managers, executives, leaders. They hold vendettas and take everything personally. They back-stab like you wouldn't believe. The women who are the exception tend to be those with masculine characteristics/personality to begin with.

 

[spang]

me: have you been naughty or nice this year?

girl: just, no. thanks for giving it a try, though. i am flattered.

-----

biatch. now i want to insult her.

 

[yyc12]

me: have you been naughty or nice this year?

girl: just, no. thanks for giving it a try, though. i am flattered.

-----

biatch. now i want to insult her.

haha, why?? i like that response by her. i'm sure you're aware that every girl is not going to be into you.

 

[incognito42]

The best opener is being good looking & built. It blows the above opener out of the water.

I can fvck a few different chicks a week with minimal effort because of the tips I've learned, whereas I've personally watched friends of mine who are better looking with great real life game struggle online because they have no online game or strategy. They get far less results and when they do get chicks it takes dozens of message exchanges to get to that level.

I get so sick of peopl crying about looks being 100% of everything that matters online. Im not a great looking guy, im about 5'10 with red hair and pale skin--i know, the dream guy lol. however I went from 245 lbs down to 185 lbs in 3 months from being disciplined with how I eat and workout. Now I get laid with ease on pof due to following certain online dating guidelines. Being attractive is important, but Following the advice the right advice is really important

 

[incognito42]

Yeah it might be 30%, I think that's accurate. That's not to say that there's no point in him improving but he has hit the ceiling in all physical/game respects. The only thing that can get rid of the height issue is money/fame to where you're in the top .5% SMV. I think once you get to that point you have so many people throwing themselves at you you can't even distinguish any one factor.

I'm 5'10 and I'd say I might lose out on 5% of chicks on pof because of my height

 

[Stagger Lee]

I can fvck a few different chicks a week with minimal effort because of the tips I've learned, whereas I've personally watched friends of mine who are better looking with great real life game struggle online because they have no online game or strategy. They get far less results and when they do get chicks it takes dozens of message exchanges to get to that level.

I get so sick of peopl crying about looks being 100% of everything that matters online. Im not a great looking guy, im about 5'10 with red hair and pale skin--i know, the dream guy lol. however I went from 245 lbs down to 185 lbs in 3 months from being disciplined with how I eat and workout. Now I get laid with ease on pof due to following certain online dating guidelines. Being attractive is important, but Following the advice the right advice is really important

But this very thread is about the OP using the very same tips and advice from on here and getting shut down at the opener. That's when looks (and age) are 100% of everything. You are probably better looking to girls than you give yourself credit for. Most looks advocates say that looks are 75%-90% of it, so acknowledge strategy is a small but necessary part.

Your better looking friends may have ineffective online strategy but may also be going after better looking, more desirable girls and that's a whole different ball game.

The bottomline is good online strategy may be necessary but it's a small part of the equation. Online dating was better for me when my display age was under 30.

I do agree with you that height is not much a factor that guys make it out to be as long as you're over 5'9. That's just faulty attribution and if they were to wear 2-3" lifts it would not make much difference.

 

[evan12]

Here is a big difference between men and women:

If a chick isn't attractive to us, it's nothing personal. For example, we generally don't "hate" fat women. (Unless shes really mean or cawkblocks.). Most guys would at least be polite to an unattractive female.

Women, on the other hand, RESENT men they aren't attracted to. With them, it IS personal. Not only must Mr. Unattractive not associate with HER and her friends, she will get pissed off if she finds out some other woman wants you.

I purposely told one of the guys in my circle about when I hooked up with that teacher lady knowing he would tell the females (who find me "not hot"). I did it on purpose .

A couple weeks later, the chicks are still not talking to me. Haha.

no man , a good woman is nice with every body , these women their natural behavior is rude so they only nice with attractive men untill they get them . so dont try to give execuse to bitckness of some women .
I knew some very beautiful women treat every body with kindness

 

[WrEcKLeSS2000]

You are totally right that women's discrimination against men (based on looksism, ageism and status) is the true widespread prejudice/bigotry/discrimination/sexism.

The reason is because women don't just deny friendship and sexual relations with unattractive men they discriminate against. They would be within their right to do that as shallow and unfair as that is. No, women think men who they are not attracted to should have no employment, rights, status or freedoms. If it were totally up to women, men they are not attracted to would be lower than a slave in the 1800's, even a total outcast from all of society.

Women's discrimination and hatred against men they are not attracted to goes way beyond denying romantic relationships. It extends to economic opportunity and social standing.

Not that men are protected from women discriminating against them in employment anyway, but certainly not protected from discrimination based on looksism.

And the worst part is a man doesn't have to be ugly, or old or have an objectively bad personality to be loathed by super-hypergamous women. You can be 2-3 rungs better looking than the woman but because you're only a L6 and not an L8, you don't qualify as a person.

Now it is clear why for most of history women were not entrusted with power or status over men. Women are tyrants with no native sense of fairness and right and wrong, and its a bad thing giving them power. At least if they're going to be afforded ruling relationships with an iron hand, they shouldn't be allowed to control economics and commerce matters too.

Totally agree with Stagger Lee.

Women abuse their power and treat men with no respect when they have it. Online dating sites are a perfect example of that. Women with all the power who get messages from tons of dudes. They have all the power. They get the messages and decide who they will go out with or just get an ego boost. I'm so sick of all this garbage. I'm sick of online dating. I send out many messages and get a few replies at most. And from those replies, 99% disappear for no reason.

Unfortunately, this epidemic will never change and will only get worse. Women are so lucky with all the rights and power they have today. 50+ years ago, they had no such power and needed a man to survive.

Now, women are more independent and do not need a man just to support themselves.

This doesn't give them the right to treat men with disrespect and act like they are so picky and it's disgusting. They need to know their role and shut their mouth.

I'm just venting from my frustration with dating sites and my annoyance of never having a girlfriend.

 

[TillTheEndOfTime]

I can fvck a few different chicks a week with minimal effort because of the tips I've learned, whereas I've personally watched friends of mine who are better looking with great real life game struggle online because they have no online game or strategy. They get far less results and when they do get chicks it takes dozens of message exchanges to get to that level.

I get so sick of peopl crying about looks being 100% of everything that matters online. Im not a great looking guy, im about 5'10 with red hair and pale skin--i know, the dream guy lol. however I went from 245 lbs down to 185 lbs in 3 months from being disciplined with how I eat and workout. Now I get laid with ease on pof due to following certain online dating guidelines. Being attractive is important, but Following the advice the right advice is really important

Your comparison to your buddies is extremely subjective, so I can't comment on that anecdote.

However, here is what I know about online dating and it is tried, tested and true beyond any scientific measure:

1) Men almost always initiate message. OKC statistics showed that men are responsible for over 80% of first messages.

2) What happens when a man initiates a message? I can GUARANTEE you that immediately after getting your message, she quickly scans through it and looks at your profile.

She's NOT looking at your profile to judge if your message was "witty" or "interesting" enough. Guess what she's doing on your profile? That's right, looking at your pictures. She's not even reading the content yet. Notice that this behavior is exactly the same as that of men online. No surprise there. We're all human after all, regardless of gender.

Continuing....if she thinks that you're attractive, she scans through your profile. If she doesn't think you're attractive, she stops looking at your profile and deletes/ignores your message. Does this sound familiar to anyone who constantly notices a girl that you messaged has visited your profile but didn't respond? Then she looks at your pictures again. She decides one more time if you're attractive. Then she looks through your message in greater detail and responds.

I have messaged more girls than I can count and they ALL followed this pattern to the letter. I can tell by the time frame between when I sent my message, when she viewed my profile, how many times she viewed my profile and when/if she messaged me back.

The above pattern was virtually independent of whatever message I used.

If a hot girl messages you, would you be like: "oh she's a super model, but her message was just "hi"....booooring. NEXT!" :crackup: :crackup: :crackup: :crackup: Give me a break right? You think girls are that much different?

 

[incognito42]

Good points. But my point is it's not as much about beingbuilt like a Greek god or having natural looks asstunning a brad Pitt, if most guys ate better, worked out, had a little style and followed these techniques the average guy can rip through pof.

My friend actually messaged hideous wildabeasts. I saw his account. Your point is valid in that from your perspective who's to say I could be nailing hb2s left and right while my fiend I getting shutdown by 9s and 10s so my friends succes in compaoson with mine can rely on other factors aside from what online messGing techniques were using, but trust me when I say he messaged ugly trolls and 300 lbsers that I would never even spam. Naughty ninja witnessed it as he had access to my friends account. He is a good looking dude that has run through tons of young hotties around town but he flat out didn't get as good of results as me because he thought some of NNs techniques were too "cornball" for his personality. He did have success with the "hey what's up", or "youre so hot!" technique because he was a good looking dude but he clearly had a much lower success rate than me

But this very thread is about the OP using the very same tips and advice from on here and getting shut down at the opener. That's when looks (and age) are 100% of everything. You are probably better looking to girls than you give yourself credit for. Most looks advocates say that looks are 75%-90% of it, so acknowledge strategy is a small but necessary part.

Your better looking friends may have ineffective online strategy but may also be going after better looking, more desirable girls and that's a whole different ball game.

The bottomline is good online strategy may be necessary but it's a small part of the equation. Online dating was better for me when my display age was under 30.

I do agree with you that height is not much a factor that guys make it out to be as long as you're over 5'9. That's just faulty attribution and if they were to wear 2-3" lifts it would not make much difference.

 

[incognito42]

Your comparison to your buddies is extremely subjective, so I can't comment on that anecdote.

However, here is what I know about online dating and it is tried, tested and true beyond any scientific measure:

1) Men almost always initiate message. OKC statistics showed that men are responsible for over 80% of first messages.

2) What happens when a man initiates a message? I can GUARANTEE you that immediately after getting your message, she quickly scans through it and looks at your profile.

She's NOT looking at your profile to judge if your message was "witty" or "interesting" enough. Guess what she's doing on your profile? That's right, looking at your pictures. She's not even reading the content yet. Notice that this behavior is exactly the same as that of men online. No surprise there. We're all human after all, regardless of gender.

Continuing....if she thinks that you're attractive, she scans through your profile. If she doesn't think you're attractive, she stops looking at your profile and deletes/ignores your message. Does this sound familiar to anyone who constantly notices a girl that you messaged has visited your profile but didn't respond? Then she looks at your pictures again. She decides one more time if you're attractive. Then she looks through your message in greater detail and responds.

I have messaged more girls than I can count and they ALL followed this pattern to the letter. I can tell by the time frame between when I sent my message, when she viewed my profile, how many times she viewed my profile and when/if she messaged me back.

The above pattern was virtually independent of whatever message I used.

If a hot girl messages you, would you be like: "oh she's a super model, but her message was just "hi"....booooring. NEXT!" :crackup: :crackup: :crackup: :crackup: Give me a break right? You think girls are that much different?

I agree on #1, there's no way #2 is true "beyond any scientific measure". I used NNs mom/roommate opener on hundreds of girls and I've had more than I can remember message me back and give numbers WITHOUT ever viewing my profile. I know because when I checked who vgiewed my profile, they hadnt. Also topics would come up regarding my profile or a pic that wasn't my profile pic, and they would respond as if they never saw my profile/specific pic. What was happening was NNs opener was so good, and I had a profile pic with my shirt off, and they ended up so engaged at that point that they messaged and carried on convos to the point of giving me their number, without ever checking my profile. Now youre going to point out that my shirtless profile pic probably was what hooked them, and that the message was mostly useless. That's just not true though, and I know because I've tried messages like "hi", or something short and sexual, and all types of other openers paired with my shirtless profile pic and did NOT get responses as frequently and in fact noticed chicks viewing my profile MORE often, simply because I hadn't engaged them with any charm or anything different than that of the 100 other messages they received in the past week. With a simple "hey whats up" they have no choice BUT to look at your profile (if they have any interest whatsoever) in order to gauge anything about you, since you opened them with something so boring

My shirtoless pic/s are good, but not unattainable nor are they results that aren't possible for anyone here within a few months. The type of shape I was in in those pics were only taken 6 months after I was 25-30% body fat

No one is arguing that women don't or shouldn't base their decisions in large part about looks. I don't know why guys whine and cry about it. I get that it can be frustrating if you never get laid, but even guys who never get laid have standards to where there's certain chicks they would never and could never bang. That's life, and it's kinda hypocritical to complain about it because if anything guys care more about looks when choosing a partner than girls do, and guys are much meaner about letting it be known if a chick is ugly or fat, etc

 

[goldengoose]

They want to get laid by a super hot guy

A guy that is RICH, tall, dark, and handsome who will take care of them

An ego boost to see how many AFC guys will hit them up

Fatties to see if they can get a man

Single mothers with 2 or 3 kids looking for a sucker

Girls with mental problems looking for their next victim

Ugly chicks who think they are beautiful who want guys to fall all over them

Girls who like to b!tch about men on their profiles

Girls who say they hate the men on the site but are on 24/7



If the girl digs you she will write to you whatever you say. Just for fun I just wrote hi or hello to see what they say. They still wrote back to me asking questions and stuff. I even made fun of a few of them and they wrote back to me laughing and said I was funny. :crazy: You're not missing out on much with those girls. Most of them are just dumb and have no idea what they want or even who they are. Its hard to just look at a pic and see if this is the right person for you when you cant see them or talk in person. I wouldn't write stuff about a spanking until you are talking to her in a couple of messages so you know she is into you or not. The first one is boring and is probably what most guys say.

 

[goldengoose]

Now that we've all gotten the rants out of our systems, the question is what is EACH AND EVERY ONE of us doing to improve ourselves in not just looking (working out), dressing and grooming ourselves but in all aspects of life? You can either sit around complaining or put that energy into bettering yourselves and your appearence. It can only help you.

I agree with some of this. You can only do as much as you have to work with though. You can dress better, try to take better pictures, work out, get a hair new style, lose weight, grow a beard or goatee, shave everyday, try to have a new attitude, or whatever. If your face is ugly, you are too short, you are boring with no personality, you have no goals or future, have a ****ty job, no money, nothing going for you, too old, then there is nothing you can do to change that. Most of them time it's the luck of the draw and how you were born. People have to accept that for the most part. The only thing you can to change is it have power and wealth. I feel sorry for some guys because it must be frustrating doing all these things to try to get women to be interested in them.

 

[Crown Champion]

if they dont want to respond to the first message, why do they bother to respond to the perverted one and with such distaste? if they dont want return a polite message, why do they take time out of their day to insult me for being a little ballsy?
i could care less i think its funny. i want to understand the psychology of the whole thing. i did get one or two to play along but not for long. my reasoning is if theyre gonna ignore me i might as well send hilarious messages.

Women like to do this to men because that's what they do. They like to make you feel bad when they can because you make more money than them and are better at sports, so they like to go out of their way to give you snark, get fat and cut off their hair.

 

[goldengoose]

"hi how are you? i like your profile and you seem really cool. lets meet up for a drink sometime."

vs.

"have you been naughty or nice this year? im bet you been naughty. you need a spanking."

the first method usually gets no response. the second one either "fvck you as$hole pervert!" or "what?" or no response.
i know the looks thing is a huge part, but besides that what is it they really want to hear? ive sent the first message then the second to the same women.
if they dont want to respond to the first message, why do they bother to respond to the perverted one and with such distaste? if they dont want return a polite message, why do they take time out of their day to insult me for being a little ballsy?
i could care less i think its funny. i want to understand the psychology of the whole thing. i did get one or two to play along but not for long. my reasoning is if theyre gonna ignore me i might as well send hilarious messages.

those girls get repulsed by guys who they think are lower value than them. they get mad if a not good looking guy says something in a sexual tone to them. they ignore the generic ones. they react bad to the sexual ones because they are repulsed. that is what they do to you.

 

[incognito42]

I agree with some of this. You can only do as much as you have to work with though. You can dress better, try to take better pictures, work out, get a hair new style, lose weight, grow a beard or goatee, shave everyday, try to have a new attitude, or whatever. If your face is ugly, you are too short, you are boring with no personality, you have no goals or future, have a ****ty job, no money, nothing going for you, too old, then there is nothing you can do to change that. Most of them time it's the luck of the draw and how you were born. People have to accept that for the most part. The only thing you can to change is it have power and wealth. I feel sorry for some guys because it must be frustrating doing all these things to try to get women to be interested in them.

average looking guys who can commit themselves to eating right and lifting weights can bang all the chicks they want on POF

Im convinced that 95% of the guys here dont workout 4-5 days a week, dont eat a strict diet 5-6 days a week, and arent really trying to position themselves to have chicks online wanna fvck them

6 months before I got on POF I was 5'10, 245 lbs, red hair and pale skin. I wasnt getting any ass. I got down to 185 and have a cutup body and now can bang as many chicks as I want on POF. I'm better looking because Im in shape, but other than being cutup Im very average looking and a bit odd looking considering I have red hair and pale skin. Oh yea and I make only $25,000 a year. Im quiet, reserved, not really the life of any party. Maybe seen as having no personality often times. This argument that looks is EVERYTHING and that you don't need a solid system on POF is BS. By just saying "hi" and going into long winded conversations before I get a number would and has (Ive triedbefore) resulted in 3-4 times less numbers and it increases the length of time invested in getting each number by many hours

Tall, dark, handsome, great job making 6 figures, goals, etc? Yeaaaa right!!!!! Well I do have goals but I never tell these chicks about them

 

[omega05]

Now that we've all gotten the rants out of our systems, the question is what is EACH AND EVERY ONE of us doing to improve ourselves in not just looking (working out), dressing and grooming ourselves but in all aspects of life? You can either sit around complaining or put that energy into bettering yourselves and your appearence. It can only help you.

the rants will never disappear from this forum and that's one of my problems with this place. It just comes off as a bunch of bitter guys complaining that all women want is a hot/rich guy. Why are dudes living in the hood able to have multiple baby mothers? Why are 16 year olds able to pull girls with ease or little work? You people need to play with the hands you were dealt or worry about yourself.

 

[bukowski_merit]

She's NOT looking at your profile to judge if your message was "witty" or "interesting" enough.

While I believe that having an interesting or witty profile has a minimal effect on your overall performance with women online. There are absolutely women out there who can get a lot more interested in a man if he can distance himself from all the other men in her area. 99% of men's profile lack personality.

Guess what she's doing on your profile? That's right, looking at your pictures.

I think each woman has a baseline for the minimal amount of physical attraction she needs to be interested in a man. But this baseline will move depending on the woman, how she's feeling, the level of current interest she has from "online" men in her inbox, and other unknown reasons.

I've messaged women - got no response. Then a while later messaged her again from the same profile (same pics) and gotten a response. This is because some of those characteristics changed.

A lot of the reasons I listed above is why I love to message women who are online at like 3am. They're normally the most bored, in a horny or "wanting to cuddle with someone" mood, and there's not nearly as much competition online.

With all this said - I've defintely fvcked way better looking women who I meant IRL instead of online. In fact, I'd say my personal standard for women is much higher IRL than it is online.... The best looking woman I've fvcked from online was this hot little asian girl who was an 8. I've fvcked 3 girls I considered 10 IRL (one was the "miss [of my state]"!) , all 3 were women I meant in the workplace! Which is the easiest place in the world to have your personality overcome any apperance shortcomings (but this is another post entirely).

---

I do think my pics online make me look like a 7, when I'm more close to a 6 (just being honest here). And for the most part - once you have a woman into you - that isn't going to matter much.... There is one exception though and I actually have a rule because of it.

I NEVER meet a woman from online for the first time if she wants her friends to be there (for example "me and my friends are going to be at [club name]... come out and meet me!") The reason for this is if she's expecting a 7 to show up and a 6 shows up - if she's by herself, she honestly won't care that much (especially if you have good game)....

IF she's with friends - her reputation can be tarnished. She starts becoming concerned about what they might think. Etc.

I've experienced terrible experiences because of this.

So the rule had to be made.

----

That's about it


---

the rants will never disappear from this forum and that's one of my problems with this place. It just comes off as a bunch of bitter guys complaining that all women want is a hot/rich guy. Why are dudes living in the hood able to have multiple baby mothers? Why are 16 year olds able to pull girls with ease or little work? You people need to play with the hands you were dealt or worry about yourself.

Blame Heartiste/Roissy for this.

Seriously.