What constitutes as shyness?

[oc16]

Let's look at these two scenarios and see if we are in agreement

A.) Guy likes girl/woman and she also gives guy all, some or one big IOI (e.g prolonged eye contact, touching, nervousness, playing with hair, etc.) Guy still fails to ask girl out.

Shyness? YES ABSOLUTELY

B.) Guy likes girl/woman but she doesn't provide any IOI'S (e.g no prolonged eye contact or an avoidance of eye contact, not engaged in convo/terse, seems aloof). Guy fails to ask girl out.

Shyness? I'd say NO, since most guys need some assurance or a gut feeling the girl likes them back.

I'm posting this because others have said shy men wait for a "green light" before they make a move. Isn't that the way it's supposed to work?

 

[Shift]

I would agree that it's more effective to approach/ask out women that are already displaying IOIs. Lately I've been reading "How to Be a 3% Man" by Corey Wayne. Overall pretty solid book so far. He makes a point in it that girls are the ones who truly do the chasing. They'll put themselves into your orbit in some manner, whether it's contacting you, touching you, flirty eye contact, etc. and then it's your job to approach/ask for a date. Now to some extent you have to put forth a little bit of interest first, i.e. you smile at her when you make eye contact and if she smiles back that's your green light to approach.

 

[oc16]

I would agree that it's more effective to approach/ask out women that are already displaying IOIs. Lately I've been reading "How to Be a 3% Man" by Corey Wayne. Overall pretty solid book so far. He makes a point in it that girls are the ones who truly do the chasing. They'll put themselves into your orbit in some manner, whether it's contacting you, touching you, flirty eye contact, etc. and then it's your job to approach/ask for a date. Now to some extent you have to put forth a little bit of interest first, i.e. you smile at her when you make eye contact and if she smiles back that's your green light to approach.

Awesome bro, I'm reading the same book..it's pretty good so far.

I think he is spot on when he says women are attracted to men whose feelings are unclear.

 

[Shift]

Awesome bro, I'm reading the same book..it's pretty good so far.

I think he is spot on when he says women are attracted to men whose feelings are unclear.

I like it because it's much along the same school of thought as the DJ Bible, which I can attribute to much of my first success in improving my game. It tends to focus more on mindset. Actually the first book I've bought on game ever. The market is just so flooded with garbage on memorizing routines, peacocking, and all that formulaic junk. Corey's book provides a rather refreshing contrast to the typical PUA community stuff.

 

[ubercat]

Agree it's a good book. However with regard to the scenarios it's a bit chicken egg. I've often approached woman who were showing no iOIs and done fine.. I think often the fact that you approached shows confidence and that turns them on. We do have members here who are into daygame.It's a bit too balls out for an old fella like me now but I used to do it back in the day. Nowadays I use indirect situational approach. That whole style of game wouldn't exist if the guys had to wait for IOIs.

 

[Mike32ct]

Let's look at these two scenarios and see if we are in agreement

A.) Guy likes girl/woman and she also gives guy all, some or one big IOI (e.g prolonged eye contact, touching, nervousness, playing with hair, etc.) Guy still fails to ask girl out.

Shyness? YES ABSOLUTELY

B.) Guy likes girl/woman but she doesn't provide any IOI'S (e.g no prolonged eye contact or an avoidance of eye contact, not engaged in convo/terse, seems aloof). Guy fails to ask girl out.

Shyness? I'd say NO, since most guys need some assurance or a gut feeling the girl likes them back.

I'm posting this because others have said shy men wait for a "green light" before they make a move. Isn't that the way it's supposed to work?

I agree with your thoughts. While you don't HAVE to wait for a green light, it helps.

Similarly, some PUA types are too quick to call something "approach anxiety." Sometimes, you honesty just don't want to approach a particular female. She is not your type or she seems like bytch and you can't be bothered or she is too old/young, etc. It doesn't necessarily mean that you are "afraid." Sometimes, you just have no interest in approaching someone (or some group), and you shouldn't force yourself. Your game will be much better and more genuine if she is someone that you WANT to meet.

 

[Shift]

Agree it's a good book. However with regard to the scenarios it's a bit chicken egg. I've often approached woman who were showing no iOIs and done fine.. I think often the fact that you approached shows confidence and that turns them on. We do have members here who are into daygame.It's a bit too balls out for an old fella like me now but I used to do it back in the day. Nowadays I use indirect situational approach. That whole style of game wouldn't exist if the guys had to wait for IOIs.

Well sure, there may be some scenarios where you have to grab their attention first, but very quickly, you should be able to determine interest level and whether or not she's worth pursuing. The queues may be very obvious or may be subtle. When your game gets to a certain level you will pick up on these more subconsciously. Some guys will waste a lot of time on girls who were not displaying much interest before OR after the approach.

 

[devilkingx2]

I agree with your thoughts. While you don't HAVE to wait for a green light, it helps.

Similarly, some PUA types are too quick to call something "approach anxiety." Sometimes, you honesty just don't want to approach a particular female. She is not your type or she seems like bytch and you can't be bothered or she is too old/young, etc. It doesn't necessarily mean that you are "afraid." Sometimes, you just have no interest in approaching someone (or some group), and you shouldn't force yourself. Your game will be much better and more genuine if she is someone that you WANT to meet.

unless she's scowling you probably can't tell her personality just from looking at her(even then, scowling is just an indicator of her current mood)

 

[Mike32ct]

unless she's scowling you probably can't tell her personality just from looking at her(even then, scowling is just an indicator of her current mood)

Fair enough.

 

[Serenity]

The guy is shy in both examples. If a guy likes a woman but fears any risk to find out if she's interested, then he is shy.

Positive response to increasingly bolder advancements on a woman is a way to be sure she's interested. Both of the guys in your examples don't make advancements on women they are interested in, that makes them shy.

You can't rely on IOI's. Many show these signs without being particularly interested and many are very interested but unconsciously or consciously avoid showing it. Not showing interest is a major feature of being shy, which could be the woman in example B.

 

[devilkingx2]

guy A is shy, guy B is just smart.

if you've been interacting with her and have no reason to believe she has any interest, then i can understand why you wouldn't bother asking her out

 

[l__i__l]

'Shyness' is just a sweet guise for low confidence.
A guy with high confidence will approach in both situations with little regard for the consequence.