Watching other dudes lift at the gym

[stormwriter]

Very often, i see dudes that are ripped, and have a physique that i would like to have. The strange thing is, they don't seem to be pushing to their limits. I've seen the same guy several times, doing like 70lbs on the lat pulldown. I know i can't compare myself, and my abilities to someone else. However, i do double that, and he looks stronger and way more ripped than i am. It seems like he's always doing a light workout. He doesn't appear to be pyramiding up to a higher weight either. I can't figure it out. I would go ask him what his routine is like, but he looks like a ****.

When i'm at the gym, i try to lift as heavy as i can, and i'm visibly pushing the limits. Maybe his longer, lighter workouts benefit him more? Maybe he did a heavy workout that morning, and now he's just "touching up"?? Strange.

 

[victor von doom]

it all depends what you are training for.

He's probably happy with the amount of mass he has and trains for maintenance. For what you mention, his logic sounds retarded, but whatever.. I guess - it all depends on your definition of "ripped" and "huge"..

However, you should never base your workouts on how others train just because you like the way he looks.

For example, if you still want more mass - you continue to train as you were... then when you reach your mass goal, cut down, and if after you are cut - you think you need more mass - then start bulking again, etc.. until you get the body you want.

 

[madgame]

Two friends of mine are pretty big too and I bet u everyone would think ..damn they got so big cause they got a good work out routine, etc. but actually thats how they look naturally. Of course they cant compare to ronnie coleman or any other big bodybuilder but they're definetly what ppl would consider muscular/big (and not fat at all). Both of them dont work out constantly and with too light weights/too many reps/not to failure. I even remember how one of them didnt work out like for half a year and stayed the same (more muscular than a lot of ppl would want to be..i bet u). I guess a few ppl just got "great genetics"....however I bet if u look around and watch a few other big guys at your gym and how they train a lot if not most of them lift heavy. If u think a lighter work out would beneift u more tho u can still do it for like a month or so and look afterwards if ure able to lift the weights that u used to lift before more times than before. Im pretty sure u wont or at least u wont get greater results than u usually do in one month...but maybe itd be a good experience to try it and really see for your self that its not better (maybe it is tho..u never know).

 

[Reto]

I agree. Genetics play a huge part in getting to where you want to be. Some of us have to work harder than others to make the same gains. It sux, but that's life.

That's one of the things that p!sses me off about this forum. "you should do my routine" or "Take these suppliments". You've got to find what works for YOU. I'm not saying don't try someone elses routine. Do. You just have to try to find what stimulates your muscles to grow. Everyone is different. My routine isn't enough for some. Some one else's might be too much. Try variations of work outs and find what works for you...

 

[Golden Arms]

80 % of how you look is not what you do in the gym, but outside the gym

 

[elvis aint dead yet]

Very true with the last statement. Muscle is build with food, protein, rest, and more rest.


While you shouldn't depend on other peoples routines. You can learn and see what works for you. It's all about patience and practice, just like anything.

However, it's always not about the heaviest weights either.


There are too many people who go to the gym and lift extremely HEAVY and do a couple of reps and a couple of sets and think they are going somewhere. For many of these people, it's more about SHOWING OFF, then about working out.

One thing to remember, Lifting Heavier = more chance of injury and stress to your joints and muscles.

SO maybe the guy was injured and is just getting back into working out.

TOO MANY PEOPLE JUMP THE GUY and start pushing themselves beyond what they are ready for. Too many people use supplements and then push themsevles beyond what they are ready for. and then they get injured.

Try different things and don't be the EGO Maniac who just goes to the gym to SHOW OFF.

 

[madgame]

sorry but i have to disagree. Of course u shouldnt base ur routine on somebody else's and do jsut what they do, but I think that my routine would work for most ppl too (everybodys different...yeah of course, but the basics principles apply to everybody, so I think that everybody would make good gains if they used the same routine as somebody else who gets great gains....I think this whole "everybody is different and thus everybody needs a different routine is b/s. The same principles apply to everybody. The only things that may vary is that some ppl will have to consume more calories than others, and that some ppl have better genetics, but i think as longs u don want to become a professional bodybuilder but just get enough muscle to look good/athletic, almost everybody will be able to achieve that (tho some might take longer to do so).

 

[NMMWCR]

I switched recently to doing half my normal weight for 30 reps, and a second set ten pounds heavier for 20 reps. (Don't kid yourself if you think doing 30 reps with the girlie weights is easy!) I lift slow and controlled with strict form which keeps me at near failure for a very long time, relative to 8 reps heavy. I'm not taking it all the way to failure just getting to the 30/20 number and moving on, adding more weight next week if I reach the magic number. After months of zero progress, I am growing again.

Sometimes you have to break all the rules to shake your body out of a homeostatic state. This is why it is critical to carry a notepad and log what you did on each workout, and what you have been eating. When you hit a plateau, you have somewhere to look for options on what to change.

 

[Revlis]

^^^ Good post.

You need to shake things up if your doing the same over and over again. Muscles need to be shocked to grow and changing your reps is a great way to surprise them.

 

[madgame]

Oh yeah I didnt even think of that possibility. But Ive read before that some ppl suggest that u switch to high rep numbers for a few weeks (months) after working out in the low rep range all the time, cause low reps train mostly fat twitch fibers and high reps train mostly slow twitch fibers. Maybe the dude at your gym did just that?

@NMMWCR: Maybe ud get the same/even better results if u did work out in the high rep range, but still took it to failure? or have u tried it already but didnt get better results?(just wondering)

 

[victor von doom]

Originally posted by elvis aint dead yet

However, it's always not about the heaviest weights either.

Wrong.

For the most part it is. Muscles will not grow unless given a reason to grow. You will not achieve this by doing 20 garbage reps at 60% of your 1RM - all that does is fatigue your muscle. That "burning" you feel isn't growth stimulation - it's the lactic acid byproduct of muscle fatigue.

Muscles grow by hitting it hard and shocking the fast-twitch fibers into activation. this can only be done by consistently going heavy.

There are too many people who go to the gym and lift extremely HEAVY and do a couple of reps and a couple of sets and think they are going somewhere.

If they are doing it with proper form, and are working at the appropriate intensity - (failing at the optimal 4-8 rep range) then they will get results if they are eating enough. It's straight science that applies to everybody.

For many of these people, it's more about SHOWING OFF, then about working out.

that may be true, but if they are big to boot, it's probably working then, isn't it? It sounds like a touch of jealousy to me.

One thing to remember, Lifting Heavier = more chance of injury and stress to your joints and muscles.

This is only true if your form is utter garbage.

But other than that, it's utter hogwash. Lifting heavier with proper form = more muscle, denser, fuller looking "cuts" when you rip up, and stronger joints.

You sound like one of those skinny personal training "gurus" who try to justify their lack of size and mass by saying that the super-diesel meatheads are full of shyt because they lift heavy. Heaven forbids you go balls to the wall with heavy compound exercises.. you may get, gasp! too big!

TOO MANY PEOPLE JUMP THE GUY and start pushing themselves beyond what they are ready for. Too many people use supplements and then push themsevles beyond what they are ready for. and then they get injured.

pushing your limits and testing yourself are part of the iron game. that's why it's so fukking cool. Injuries come with the game. When you get injured, your joints heal and come back stronger. So what's your point, here? You just come off like someone who's afraid to push himself to that limit.

Try different things and don't be the EGO Maniac who just goes to the gym to SHOW OFF. [/B]

Your real message is train like a girl, and don't go too heavy because if not you might hurt yourself.

You sound like my mom.

 

[victor von doom]

double post..oops.

 

[victor von doom]

Originally posted by NMMWCR
I switched recently to doing half my normal weight for 30 reps, and a second set ten pounds heavier for 20 reps. (Don't kid yourself if you think doing 30 reps with the girlie weights is easy!) I lift slow and controlled with strict form which keeps me at near failure for a very long time, relative to 8 reps heavy. I'm not taking it all the way to failure just getting to the 30/20 number and moving on, adding more weight next week if I reach the magic number. After months of zero progress, I am growing again.

This is a very unscientific way of saying that works.

We have no idea what you were doing before, your eating and rest habits, etc... but if you were getting "months of zero progress" then you were obviously doing something very, very wrong.

but I will say this that 20-30 rep crap your doing will do absolutely nothing for your strength - you may get a little rebound hypertrophy for the first month or so.. but that workout you are doing right now is going nowhere super-fast.

 

[elvis aint dead yet]

Funny That Victor always thinks he knows it all.


I never said lift light.

I said there are too many people who think Maxing out after 1 or 2 reps is the way to build muscle.


I've done plenty of workouts in my life where I could barely lift my arms or I could barely walk when I left the gym.

While this did work to build up my muscle, I also change my routine around all the time.


I've seen too many people at gyms and fitness centers who max out on 1 and 2 reps then take a 30 minute break and come back and try to life even more weight while their spotters help them. It's a joke. And there are too many people who do this.

It's funny to see these people walking around bragging and hanging out at the juice bars for the majority of their workouts.

Some of these guys look big, but many of them that do this also look weird because they might have a huge chest, but they have no muscles in their legs and so on.

I wasn't saying not to lift heavy, all I was trying to say was, DO NOT CONCERN YOURSELF WITH LIFTING MORE THEN THE NEXT GUY.

That normally leads to EGO's and half-azzed workouts.

I do not agree that doing 20-30 reps is going to build you muscle. Maybe it's good if you want to cut, but normally I stay between 6-12 reps and do around 2-5 sets per exercise.


" When you get injured, your joints heal and come back stronger. So what's your point, here? You just come off like someone who's afraid to push himself to that limit. "

And VON, you obviously either never have lifted or have never been injured. That is the stupidest statement I've ever read in my life.


If you overtrain, ignore your injury, then your not tough, your an idiot. INJURIES DO NOT COME WITH THE GAME. Why would you want to get injured, thats just stupid? While bodybuilding will bring on some pain, it's those that learn what pains they can ignore and what they cannot ignore that can stick with it through the long haul.

I'm not talking about a few years, I'm talking about people like me who plan to workout and bodybuild for the rest of our lives.

Why would I risk serious injury just to show off for a few weeks. That's stupid. I'm not going to be Ronnie Colemen, don't want to be, but I'm 220 pounds and I know what pains and nagging problems my body can take and can't take. Injury is not something you want to ignore because again, JOINTS are not something you want to destroy and expect them to come back healthier and stronger.

There are many times where, if you ignore that injury, it'll nag you for the rest of your life. And there are plenty of HUGE Guys who had to stop lifting for years or more because they messed themselves up by ignoring INJURIES.

Why risk being serioulsy injured just so you can say I BENCHED so and so pounds last week.

JOINTS and MUSCLES will not HEAL automatically if you are seriously injured. In fact, that is the stupidest thing I've ever heard.

I agree go out lift hard but lift smart.

Better to take a few weeks off or drop down the weight for awhile because believe me, people who do get seriously injured, DO NOT COME BACK Stronger. Whether it be a chest injury, shoulder injury, leg injury, and so on.

 

[victor von doom]

elvis,

I don't think I know it all - I just happen to know more about training than most of the people who post on this forum - and that includes you.

Look, I could give a flying fukk about your justifications for not going hard... ever heard of a spontaneous injury while lifting ?- THEY DO HAPPEN IN THE IRON GAME - I'm sure anyone with a rotator or wrist injury can attest to that. And when they heal - they do come back stronger - because they can handle more weight - it's part of the adaptive response your joints undergo when you use progressive resistance.

as to the rest of what you typed... whatever, believe what you want - makes no different to me.

 

[elvis aint dead yet]

Another internet tough guy who thinks he knows it all. Wow, what a freaking surprise.


If you actually could read, you'd understand that I never said don't lift hard.

I'm just saying you are an idiot to say GET INJURED so you can come back stronger.

Have you actually ever seriously injured your wrist or any other body part? I doubt it.

It not only takes tremendous amounts of rehabilitaition on your part, it takes months and months of it.

So if your rehabilitating for months and months you are not lifting the way you used to and your not doing many of the things you used to do.

While you might be able to get back to where you were, don't fool yourself into thinking a serious injury will make you stronger.

Just go ask tons of professional body builders and sports players who were seriously injured. They might never like to admit it, but the bone, the muscle, the joint is never as strong as it once was.

Your theory that hey, BREAK A BONE, and it'll only come back stronger is plain out stupid.

You need to learn to read before you actually respond.

I never said not to work out hard. I was responding to the original posters message where he saw some stronger guy lifting light.

Maybe the guy was injured or so on.

 

[victor von doom]

Originally posted by elvis aint dead yet
Another internet tough guy who thinks he knows it all. Wow, what a freaking surprise.

another self-righteous internet a$$hole... what a freaking surprise.

If you actually could read, you'd understand that I never said don't lift hard.

If you could actually read between the lines THATS EXACTLY WHAT YOU ARE SAYING. OR AT THE VERY LEAST IMPLYING THAT IT'S WHAT MEATHEAD EGO LIFTERS DO TO IMPRESS OTHERS.

I'm just saying you are an idiot to say GET INJURED so you can come back stronger.

I never said that.

I said that injuries are something that happens when you push yourself (i.e. lifting heavy) - in many cases, lifting injuries just HAPPEN WITH NO FOREWARNING. it's not a gradual process.

I also said that when you injure your ligaments/tendons due to the stress of heavy lifting - they will grow back stronger, in the anticipation of handling the ever-increasing stresses they will subjected to.

Have you actually ever seriously injured your wrist or any other body part? I doubt it.

Actually I have -

I blew out my wrist - with no warning - repping 150lbs on the barbell curl (with the olympic bar) - the shearing stress from the long bar just fukked the wrist up on the sixth rep - there was no warning, no pain, it just happened. And it wasn't a case of ego lifting - as I had repped with 150 comfortably on previous ocassions...

After it healed, I am up to 165 x 4 with no problems.

I blew out my rotator cuff setting down 120 lb. dumbbells after a set of flat dumbbells.. I couldn't do any kind of pressing or curling movement for four months.. when I got the green light to return I am up to 150's with no problems.

And your point is??

It not only takes tremendous amounts of rehabilitaition on your part, it takes months and months of it.

yes it does.. but when you come back healed, it comes back stronger. look at pitchers post Tommy John elbow tendon surgery - it gives them an extra 3-4 mph..

So if your rehabilitating for months and months you are not lifting the way you used to and your not doing many of the things you used to do.

muscle memory is a beautiful thing. After my rotator injury I was back to my old pre-injury weights in under 10 weeks. 16 weeks after that I was hitting personal bests in most of the big lifts with no discomfort at all.

While you might be able to get back to where you were, don't fool yourself into thinking a serious injury will make you stronger.

what do you describe as a "major injury" ? It's all relative.

Just go ask tons of professional body builders and sports players who were seriously injured. They might never like to admit it, but the bone, the muscle, the joint is never as strong as it once was.

Totally wrong, and an inapplicable argument. The joint may not be able to take the shearing stresses of multiple hits or constant pounding of game situation - but it will still be as strong as ever
- that example is completely contra to what you would encounter in a recreational bodybuilding gym environment.

Your theory that hey, BREAK A BONE, and it'll only come back stronger is plain out stupid.

no. I said that injuries happen when you push yourself, and given that one should not be afraid to push oneself because of a fear of injury - that only limits your gains. It's kind of like saying don't go all out in a football game because you are afraid of injury - what the hell is the point of playing then?

the chances of breaking a bone from weightlifting are miniscule at best. You have to progress into the superhuman levels of strength - not something that's going to happen with your philosophy.