Too Much Chauvinism Around Here
- Thread starter Mr.Style
- Start date
Rollo Tomassi
Master Don Juan
Ah, I wish I had picked up this thread sooner. I appologize for my recent absence, I've been in Europe lately on business.
Now then, from reading the original post, the problem I see is in defining 'Chauvinism', particularly as opposed to 'Mysogyny.' The biggest fallacy I think most AFC guys and practiaclly all women I've read write on Chauvinism subscribe to is that women own this term. It is absolutely possible to describe a woman as a Chauvinist, but in a modern context it has been uniquely defined in the masculine. In fact, to get down to the roots of the term when it was defined as a masculine attribute, the original terminology was "male chauvinist pig" courtesy of Gloria Steinem and the militant feminist movement of the 1970s.
More important is how the term has become synonymous with masculinity. For the past 40 years it's been developed in westernized society that masculine=chauvinism and that any uniquely masculine trait, behavior or characteristic is at the very least suspect, if not outrightly so, chauvinisim. They very fact that the title of this post specificly implies men as chauvinist is a testament to this fact. Even the term 'Feminist' at least gets a specifc gender associated with it.
Why is this? Why should a man be labeled 'chauvinistic' for expressing his masculinity? Masculinity and the behaviors that are derived from it are no more negative than those expressed in the Feminine depending upon indivdual conditions. But it's the masculine that is villified by both sexes (at least in the last 55 years).
Why can't the masculine be a positive? The underlying theme for this entire forum is an effort to get back to a positive definition masculinity. That's not advocating a wife-beating, caveman ideology, rather it's a move back to defining the masculine in terms that don't equate it with chauvanism.The difficulty occurs in attempting to relate to both men and women a need to unlearn this predescribed terminology that even our own parents helped brow-beat into culural consciousness. Chauvinism as masculinity has been parroted constantly for so long now that a new generation of AFC sons from AFC fathers now resort to internaizing this doctrine and ego-investing themselves in avoiding anything even remotely construed as masculinitiy in a desperate attempt to identify with what other women repeating the same ideology (masculine equals domineering sublimation) have been socially conditioned to accept as what a man should be to achieve the 'gift' of their intimacy.
Then men are ridculed (even by their own) for even prompting the thought that something might not be entirely equitable in gender relations when behaviors consistently don't match ideology. The man to even subtly point out inconsistencies in womens behaviors is automatically a Chauvinist for exposing a weakness in this argument. And now we come full circle and hear a constant bemoaning from feminized pop-culture, "Where are all the REAL men these days?" Why can't we have Superman again? All in complete, blissful ignorance of the history and circumstance that have lead to the decline of positive masculine males.
The only reason you have any impression that this site is based in Chauvinism is because you have no grasp of what the true definition of the term is. It's far easier in your misguided attempts to identify with the feminine, to spit back the unfounded rhetoric women say they approve of as a condition for their intimacy while simultaneously contradicting themselves with their own behaviors.
For far too long young men have bought the basic Carl Jung pyscho-babble women have repeated since the 60's - "Men need to get in touch with their feminine side" as if this were the ultimate in female identification and an avenue to their intimacy. In fact the opposite is true - men need to rediscover their masculine sides and be unafraid of the consequences. In my experience this forum makes the single best attempt to do this in modern culture, without resorting to mysogyny, which is the term that you're really reaching for. Name another? Name another site that isn't a scam to profit from the insecurities of AFCs. Name another that isn't selling a 'method', a series of motivtional CDs or "How to get girls" books?
Stop buying the lie that masculinity is laughable, ridiculous or definitively negative. The world desperately needs Men. Men with strength of will to disagree with a feminized popular culture when it tells him he's pitiable because he's been poisoned with testosterone and the traits that make him masculine are to be controlled as character flaws.
Now then, from reading the original post, the problem I see is in defining 'Chauvinism', particularly as opposed to 'Mysogyny.' The biggest fallacy I think most AFC guys and practiaclly all women I've read write on Chauvinism subscribe to is that women own this term. It is absolutely possible to describe a woman as a Chauvinist, but in a modern context it has been uniquely defined in the masculine. In fact, to get down to the roots of the term when it was defined as a masculine attribute, the original terminology was "male chauvinist pig" courtesy of Gloria Steinem and the militant feminist movement of the 1970s.
More important is how the term has become synonymous with masculinity. For the past 40 years it's been developed in westernized society that masculine=chauvinism and that any uniquely masculine trait, behavior or characteristic is at the very least suspect, if not outrightly so, chauvinisim. They very fact that the title of this post specificly implies men as chauvinist is a testament to this fact. Even the term 'Feminist' at least gets a specifc gender associated with it.
Why is this? Why should a man be labeled 'chauvinistic' for expressing his masculinity? Masculinity and the behaviors that are derived from it are no more negative than those expressed in the Feminine depending upon indivdual conditions. But it's the masculine that is villified by both sexes (at least in the last 55 years).
Why can't the masculine be a positive? The underlying theme for this entire forum is an effort to get back to a positive definition masculinity. That's not advocating a wife-beating, caveman ideology, rather it's a move back to defining the masculine in terms that don't equate it with chauvanism.The difficulty occurs in attempting to relate to both men and women a need to unlearn this predescribed terminology that even our own parents helped brow-beat into culural consciousness. Chauvinism as masculinity has been parroted constantly for so long now that a new generation of AFC sons from AFC fathers now resort to internaizing this doctrine and ego-investing themselves in avoiding anything even remotely construed as masculinitiy in a desperate attempt to identify with what other women repeating the same ideology (masculine equals domineering sublimation) have been socially conditioned to accept as what a man should be to achieve the 'gift' of their intimacy.
Then men are ridculed (even by their own) for even prompting the thought that something might not be entirely equitable in gender relations when behaviors consistently don't match ideology. The man to even subtly point out inconsistencies in womens behaviors is automatically a Chauvinist for exposing a weakness in this argument. And now we come full circle and hear a constant bemoaning from feminized pop-culture, "Where are all the REAL men these days?" Why can't we have Superman again? All in complete, blissful ignorance of the history and circumstance that have lead to the decline of positive masculine males.
The only reason you have any impression that this site is based in Chauvinism is because you have no grasp of what the true definition of the term is. It's far easier in your misguided attempts to identify with the feminine, to spit back the unfounded rhetoric women say they approve of as a condition for their intimacy while simultaneously contradicting themselves with their own behaviors.
For far too long young men have bought the basic Carl Jung pyscho-babble women have repeated since the 60's - "Men need to get in touch with their feminine side" as if this were the ultimate in female identification and an avenue to their intimacy. In fact the opposite is true - men need to rediscover their masculine sides and be unafraid of the consequences. In my experience this forum makes the single best attempt to do this in modern culture, without resorting to mysogyny, which is the term that you're really reaching for. Name another? Name another site that isn't a scam to profit from the insecurities of AFCs. Name another that isn't selling a 'method', a series of motivtional CDs or "How to get girls" books?
Stop buying the lie that masculinity is laughable, ridiculous or definitively negative. The world desperately needs Men. Men with strength of will to disagree with a feminized popular culture when it tells him he's pitiable because he's been poisoned with testosterone and the traits that make him masculine are to be controlled as character flaws.
Bonhomme
Master Don Juan
Beautiful, Rollo
Yes, there are a few downtrodden AFCs who will spout misogynistic crap -- and that's not necessarily a bad thing altogether, since it's a natural overcompensation reaction. But true masculinity has no need for such grandstanding. It just is.
Better stated than I could have done. Even some hard-core feminists have come around to realizing this, much to their own chagrin.
Yes, there are a few downtrodden AFCs who will spout misogynistic crap -- and that's not necessarily a bad thing altogether, since it's a natural overcompensation reaction. But true masculinity has no need for such grandstanding. It just is.
Mr.Style
Don Juan
No Rollo, the reason I posted that I thought there was too much chauvinism around here was because I was reading posts left and right stating that all women are "b*tches", "sluts", "*****s" etc. The only one being misguided here is you in turning this into a pedantic argument about the use of the term "chauvinistic". If you're happier with the term "misogyny", fine. There is too much misogyny around here. Is that better?
Rollo, did you even read my posts on this thread? People flamed me constantly despite my consistent and repeated claims that the reason I opposed the chauvinism (or misogyny, if you prefer) was because it was CONTRARY TO THE TEACHINGS OF THE SITE. I was supporting the site and saying that certain contributors were dragging it down! How have you not grasped that? I suggest you reread my comments from start to finish as I think you have completely misinterpreted the situation.
Are you for real or are you taking the piss? Reread my comments. NEVER DID I SAY THAT MEN SHOULD NOT BE MASCULINE. THIS WAS EXACTLY WHAT I DID NOT SAY.
The point I made Rollo, which you did not grasp, was that a man can be masculine without resorting to the sorry situation in which he must denigrate all women in order to make himself feel masculine. That is what I believe and that is what this site teaches. Do you understand now?
PuertoRican_Lover
Banned
Sorry kid Rollo has it right, YOU got it wrong!!!
All hors ARE hors!!!!
It is the man's nature to respect a hor as a hor - to do anything else would be going against his mandood!!
If the girl you are sexing isn't your wife then she is hoing!!!!
Say "No" to loving a Ho!!!
All hors ARE hors!!!!
It is the man's nature to respect a hor as a hor - to do anything else would be going against his mandood!!
If the girl you are sexing isn't your wife then she is hoing!!!!
Say "No" to loving a Ho!!!
frivolousz21
Master Don Juan
so according to you..we wait till marriage for sex??
englishman
Master Don Juan
Im with rollo in as much as not to be ashamed of being masculine, but im with mr style when he says theres a lot of hate terms used to define women on here.....as well as a fvck of a lot of usefull stuff to....
Thanks rollo and style for raising the bar!
Thanks rollo and style for raising the bar!
PuertoRican_Lover
Banned
A man has to do what a man has to do - if you want to pimp then pimp, if you want a LTR then have a LTR - if you want to get married then get married - but when you are pimping (sexing( a girl just acknowledge and respect a hor for what she is - nothing more and nothing less!!! If you don't then you (the man) will pay dearly!!
I have a question. If acting like a jerk got you laid and acting like a nice guy got you into the friend zone.
How many would choose to act like a jerk?
Einstein once said the definition of insanity was trying to do the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result each time.
If acting like a nice guy over and over again kept landing you into the "ewww I wouldn't sleep with him, he is like a brother" zone and being more like a jerk got you laid. Why would anyone insist on still being sweet and nice?
I just don't understand this part of human behavior. It's like if smoking cigs, earned you a screaming hideous death, why would anyone continue to smoke?
I do recognize the difference between a Don Juan and a jerk.
How many would choose to act like a jerk?
Einstein once said the definition of insanity was trying to do the same thing over and over again and expecting a different result each time.
If acting like a nice guy over and over again kept landing you into the "ewww I wouldn't sleep with him, he is like a brother" zone and being more like a jerk got you laid. Why would anyone insist on still being sweet and nice?
I just don't understand this part of human behavior. It's like if smoking cigs, earned you a screaming hideous death, why would anyone continue to smoke?
I do recognize the difference between a Don Juan and a jerk.
Francisco d'Anconia
Master Don Juan
What you are describing is two parts of human conditioning.
- People do particular things repeatedly because there is a specific payoff for them.
- People gravitate to actions that are comfortable to them.
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Mr.Style
Don Juan
Great. Mr Exclamation mark!!!!!
"All hors ARE hors!!!" you say? The actual argument, if you'd bothered to read it, was that not all women are hors.
I wonder how people like yourself would feel if you had a daughter and some guy showed up on your doorstep using the kind of language you use towards your own daughter. I wager you'd kick the sh*t out of him because it's simply disrespectful.
The point of this site is not to be a jerk or a nice guy but to be a DJ. Someone who is suave (hence the site's name) and who carries himself with honour and dignity and doesn't feel the need to go around calling every woman a "ho!", "beeyatch!" "slut!" etc.
Watch a James Bond film and observe how he acts. Now let's replace his attitude with the attitude of some people on this site:
Miss Moneypenny: Hello James. You're looking well.
Chauvinist: You got that right beeyatch! I'm the shizzzle dizzle!!!Wanna fizzle my nizzle?!!!
Miss Moeypenny: Uh, are you feeling alright James?
Chauvinist: No doubt, ho! Now shake your pretty little azz into the kitchen and make me some tea like a proper little hor, you dig?
In other words gentleman, that attitude is completely contrary to the teachings of the site and makes you come across as a d*ckhead instead of charming. A real man treats others with respect, the way he would like to be treated, regardless of a person's skin colour, religion, gender etc. Think of the great man in history and you'll find most, if not all, embodied these qualities.
It's time people on this site stood up against those coming here and teaching things contrary to the site. This place has been hijacked and something must be said. I'm saying it.
PuertoRican_Lover
Banned
You are right, this site has been hijacked - by Homos and effeminates!!!! I've been doing something about it as well as other DJ's - to undo the wrong of 40 years of maligning the minds of the world!! Just my little contribution.
So no, not all women are hors - just all hors ARE hors!! If she has her legs open she is hoing --- what can't you understand??
I haved call all my family members who are hors "hors" and I don't call them "mothers" - I call them hors with babies!!!! I called my sister a hor 15 years ago when she was hoing and I do it today to all of my nieces!!!!
I'd call my daughter a hor if she was having sex and then I beat the hell out of her then I would not allow her into my home and throw her shyt out of the house ---I’d say, "Go live with your pimp, HO - you are no longer a child – you have eaten of the forbidden fruit and now have knowledge beyond a child’s and you shall no longer choose to abide by my wisdom but instead you will make decisions based on your own corrupted hordoms – go your way!!!”
Then I kick her for her wasting my time being a good father - raising her to be a woman!!!
Don Juanabbe
Master Don Juan
Not all women are hors, but the majority of them these days are hors. Simple.
That's why men need to be extra careful these days, because more often than not, that sweet, gentle, innocent little creature is actual the wolf in sheeps clothing. Guaranteed.
We have all been collectively guilty of assigning value to hors that they are not worthy of.
This messageboard does alot of good things but unfortunately it also helps cultivate a young man's ability to attract hors.
We are essentially learning to counteract hordom on here.
With a real woman, ALL of this sh*t goes out the window, you won't need it, and it won't work.
Understand now?
That's why men need to be extra careful these days, because more often than not, that sweet, gentle, innocent little creature is actual the wolf in sheeps clothing. Guaranteed.
We have all been collectively guilty of assigning value to hors that they are not worthy of.
This messageboard does alot of good things but unfortunately it also helps cultivate a young man's ability to attract hors.
We are essentially learning to counteract hordom on here.
With a real woman, ALL of this sh*t goes out the window, you won't need it, and it won't work.
Understand now?
PuertoRican_Lover
Banned
It never has been a mystery for thousands of years except today women have gone outside of their natures and thus this forum exists for men to handle these deranged creatures, especially for those men who fear approaching a woman let alone a hor!!!!
These hors are trouble and one must proceed with caution when dealing with matters of the heart and penis!!!!
Mr.Style
Don Juan
My argument was that one should not term all women as hors. I'm glad you have finally understood what I have been saying.
PuertoRican_Lover
Banned
There is no argument - no one ever stated "all women are hors"!!
YOU were actually WRONG by saying "we said" all women are hors" - so don't act as if your argument was correct because you never had a basis to your argument!!!
"I am" correct in my stance to say all hors are hors!!!
Do you think Muslim women are hors??? Absolutely not!!! So, why would anyone have such a foolish notion!!!
The overwrwhelming majority of American women (including christians) are hors - now that is a fact!!!!
YOU were actually WRONG by saying "we said" all women are hors" - so don't act as if your argument was correct because you never had a basis to your argument!!!
"I am" correct in my stance to say all hors are hors!!!
Do you think Muslim women are hors??? Absolutely not!!! So, why would anyone have such a foolish notion!!!
The overwrwhelming majority of American women (including christians) are hors - now that is a fact!!!!
PuertoRican_Lover
Banned
I'm not mocking christians but I have heard of hundreds of thousands of women call themselves "christians" in my life whether on TV or in person, or in magazines, on the radio, and they were hors and wicked women who speak and do filth - they are the ones mocking God!!!! Go against them and be not against me!!!!
Hell, millions of homos and hors are calling themselves christians and many christians embrace these homos and hors as good!!! You never hear these homos and hors call themselves Muslims!!
WHY NOT? You ask? Because Islam is not a corrupt religion!!!! They deal correctly with the recalcitrant ones!!!!
Hell, millions of homos and hors are calling themselves christians and many christians embrace these homos and hors as good!!! You never hear these homos and hors call themselves Muslims!!
WHY NOT? You ask? Because Islam is not a corrupt religion!!!! They deal correctly with the recalcitrant ones!!!!
