too late too soon?

[thebiglimp]

i first posted this in the mature room before realizing that my dating level is way too elementary...

mkay so the first dating attempt for me in a long time and i blew it.

i would like you gents' professional analysis on the situation. I'm quite new at this so i don't know how to dissect it and gain from it.

the whole event takes about a month which i will divide into approx. dates.

day 1-10: girl who works at the bar i frequent show interest.

day 11- i talk to her for maybe 3 minutes before being interrupted.

day 12-19: more body language/eye contact from the girl and also now from me. (i wasn't even interested in her first but why not eat the fruit?)

day 20: ask her phone number, saying i want to take her to the dinner. get a 'yes', then phone number... and here's where's the idiocy begins. i ask for her name afterwards. her smart phone is gone, btw. she shows me a cheap phone saying that her phone is in repair atm. and can only kakaotalk [IM service] (totally legit excuse,btw)

day 23, sunday: try calling but no answer. text her hi. get a hi back.
me: what are you doing?
her: busy with work i couldn't get done during the week
let's have dinner tonight
sorry, busy tonight but i'll be free at afternoon sometime next week

now, i take this as a strike one and a downgrade- it's suppose to be a dinner, at an afternoon meet. next couple of texts are idiot blubber on my part.
since getting her number i've been too excited that by now i have lost control of my cool.

day 24-25: more idiot texting on my part. no wit, just awkward impersonal questions that she doesn't seem too interested to answer.
last text i send her is 'oh god i think i'm failing at this text thing' her: no it's just me i still haven't fixed my phone so i can only do this on a computer.

day 26: i go to the bar on a business. by now i am completely frozen up. naturally, she's overly friendly to me now but i am unable to make conversation. i seriously only said hi and bye to her the whole 4 hours i was there.

day 27: call again, phone still doesn't work.
i know she is off today because i know the employee schedule of the bar.

text- me:hey let me know if you want to meet up today. and yes, i am pressuring you.
her 6 hours later: sorry i was out all day. i will be like this from now on.
i chat some more unproductive blabber, realizing it's already strike 2.

day 29: business at the bar again (i have dealings with the owner) she seem very uncomfortable around me now, avoiding me altogether. naturally, i act the same. then i stop her on my way out, say 'i don't wanna bother you about this anymore but i still wanna go on a date with you.'. her: 'i don't want...' me: 'so no date?' 'no?' her: 'no'

the end. lolol.

yeah, i'm pretty bummed out by the loss but even as i type it out now, it's pretty funny how bad i was at this.

what i'd like to know is, how was the dinner downgraded to an afternoon meet at my first text, and if i came on too strong both instances of text. it really is a deal breaker that i couldn't talk to her on the phone since that could've felt much more natural to me.

i'd also like to know if it's possible that she was only seeking attention to begin with.

 

[Tictac]

Too slow brother.

You spent a month doing what should have been done in no more than a week.

And you let her steer the whole thing - which is why you feel all butt-hurt now.

Just ask 'her' out next time. And don't give a damn about whether 'she' accepts or not.

 

[thebiglimp]

sorry, i don't get where i let her have the wheel. and where was she turned off?

i did ask her to a dinner as i was getting her phone number. said i pick the place, you pick the time. which was my first mistake, as i found out later by reading up on the tips.

 

[stevo]

Oh no leave her alone.

If her phone doesnt work, that immediately complicates the usual scenario so instead you'd have to ask, finalize the date face to face and if she doesnt show up, downgrade her till she continuously show IOI or wait till after she gets off work late night and do something together.

As of right now.

First reason to leave her alone. She told you "I'll be like this from now on" after rejecting you.

Second reason she's acting overly busy meaning she has expired IL.

Stay away from that bar for a month if you can but if you do go, smile and keep on your business only speak to her if she speaks to you first. If you do speak with her just be courteous "hey, how are you" and keep it moving

And finally you acted like a caveman who's never seen pussie before, who never believed he could attract women. Fix that!

 

[thebiglimp]

stevo, i already know it's over and am not interested in further investment.

i just wanna know where i screwed up so that i don't make the same mistake again.

were my texts too forward or was it my awkward behavior toward her after getting the number? i'm pretty certain it was the behavior but i still wonder if my texting was also harmful.

 

[stevo]

Yes your text message did not assist in increasing her curiousity nor interest.

Let's break it down.

day 23, sunday: try calling but no answer. text her hi. get a hi back.
No. When you call and she doesnt answer, you wait for her to get back to you.

When you text, you do not just say "hi", give her something for her to have something to give back. "Hey, how are you doing?" (if she has your number) she responds with blah the blah "That's sounds like fun, remind me what day works for you to go out to dinner?" Straight to the point you could extend the pleasantries for one more text before going to the point if you want to.



me: what are you doing?
No. It's too early for you to care what's she's doing. Comes off needy and creepish.


her: busy with work i couldn't get done during the week
let's have dinner tonight
Lol. She's not a pusssie on demand just yet, you cannot just summon her with so short notice. Also this opens up too much avenue for her to say no. Instead ask her what day works for her, she'll tell you then you pick the time.


sorry, busy tonight but i'll be free at afternoon sometime next week
Your response should be: "Fantastic, let me know which particular day works for you"


And that should be you final response till whenever she gets back to you and if she doesnt ever get back to you, then oh well.



day 24-25: more idiot texting on my part. no wit, just awkward impersonal questions that she doesn't seem too interested to answer.
last text i send her is 'oh god i think i'm failing at this text thing' her: no it's just me i still haven't fixed my phone so i can only do this on a computer.

No need for this, very unnecessary and that reduces the interest level.

Till you die, never ever ever criticize yourself. Ever. Even when you fcuk up, learn your mistake but carry yourself like that is the very best move possible especially if it was what YOU wanted to do.


day 26: i go to the bar on a business. by now i am completely frozen up. naturally, she's overly friendly to me now but i am unable to make conversation. i seriously only said hi and bye to her the whole 4 hours i was there.
Repercussion of putting her on a pedestal and acting like you cannot get pussie.

Your interaction when you see her at the place should not be in-depth. Measure how she comes on to you to determine how much you let out but you are there on business and that should be it. You speak to her (if she didnt get back to you like you asked) then there's nothing to talk about, you are a busy man with too many pussies to consider.


day 27: call again, phone still doesn't work.
i know she is off today because i know the employee schedule of the bar.
Unnecessary. This is chasing and acting needy, dries their panties.



text- me:hey let me know if you want to meet up today. and yes, i am pressuring you.
her 6 hours later: sorry i was out all day. i will be like this from now on.
i chat some more unproductive blabber, realizing it's already strike 2.
You just called but you reward her ignoring you by reaching out to her some more? This is you intentionally though subconsciously reducing your value.

You never pressure a woman whom you do not own her pussie yet. Your choice of words were needy and you do not even know if tonight works for her even if she wanted to go, only way to know is ask but why would you make her think you have nothing better to do? You should not be available on such short notice and neither should you make plans on day off if you havent already owned her pussie. People have lives you know and humans almost always make prearranged plans to fill their estimated free time.


day 29: business at the bar again (i have dealings with the owner) she seem very uncomfortable around me now, avoiding me altogether. naturally, i act the same. then i stop her on my way out, say 'i don't wanna bother you about this anymore but i still wanna go on a date with you.'. her: 'i don't want...' me: 'so no date?' 'no?' her: 'no'
You asked her out like 20 times already, do you ever quit? at this point its just upsetting and creepy and needy, you get the picture.



Look at it this way. At the start you put 50% and wait for her to put 50%, if she doesnt, downgrade her as long as she put in atleast 40% anything below that should not even be worth you looking or speak to.

After you fcuk her, you put in 40% and let her show you she's worth your time.

Also remember, with women you strike when its hot, be sexual.

Also remember, bar dealings are mostly for that very moment. If escalated correctly that day then further dealings might be an option.

You've been schooled. Learn and dont make the same mistake twice.

Go into the world and make panties wet.

 

[thebiglimp]

thanks, man. that's refreshing n entertaining. mm mmm.


(Your interaction when you see her at the place should not be in-depth. Measure how she comes on to you to determine how much you let out but you are there on business and that should be it. You speak to her (if she didnt get back to you like you asked) then there's nothing to talk about, you are a busy man with too many pussies to consider.)

this part still baffles me because i did all i could to act casual and not talk to her at all, even though she was wanting to engage in conversation.

do i have to match the vibe in these kind of situation?

and why did she suddenly flip 180 degrees on day 29?

 

[stevo]

You do not understand.

She response determines how much you let out.

She wants to engage in conversation, you talk but not for too long and refer her to communicate with you later because again you're there on business.

If she wants to talk and you act just casual, it comes of shy and ball-less.

She'd lead you to what attracts her, follow then own it.

 

[Bokanovsky]

Day 257: OP finally realizes that she's not interested.

She gave you her number because not giving you one would have let to awkwardness. Plus, you are a customer who (presumably) tips her. She's string you along, wasting your time.

 

[thebiglimp]

lol at day 257.

she prob. thought i was a co-worker. i never drink there.

but what about all the attention seeking from day 1-10? like just staring, standing close to me, laughing too hard at my not-at-all-funny comments. and we were alone in the bar one night and she got fidgety as hell. i mean wtf, it was like she had snorted something. i was so sure then i had her.

but that's all downright attention seeking?

anyways, lesson learned: my approach sucks.
time to move on, eh?

 

[Bokanovsky]

lol at day 257.

she prob. thought i was a co-worker. i never drink there.

I don't understand this. How could she "think" you were a coworker? Doesn't she know who else works at her bar? And if you never drink there, why do you frequent that bar? Some context is needed.

 

[thebiglimp]

bar has a sound system. i do sound system install.

also, what's up with her 180 degree behavior on day 29?
right before that day we texted quite a bit and it ended on a good note, actually.

 

[RangerMIke]

Women give their numbers out even if they have low interest. For reasons explained above... it's easier to just screen you out than to say no. My guess is that you never really had a shot at her. I think you waited too long to make a move. Hey... live and learn. Next time see a girl: make your move.

 

[thebiglimp]

i dunno, the attention seeking (the staring, body positioning, ect..) was pretty strong, otherwise i wouldn't have bothered to dip my feet in the dating game that i'm so unequipped for in many ways atm.

the fidget was most crazy and it was what secured the decision for me. we were sitting close by, the owner left for an errand to where we became alone and she just went ant-sh1t, adjusting everything around her, dusting the bottles. (which nobody ever does there , esp. without the boss watching)
so i shot her a conversation and that was the short 3 minute chat we had.

if all that was for power play(?) on dominating my attention, i want to know what to watch out for the next girl i encounter.

 

[Harry Wilmington]

Your mistake came in the first 10 days, when she was "allegedly" showing interest and you did nothing. You always want to strike when you're the "new guy" in her eyes, when you're in the "unknown" category and are somewhat mysterious to her. You frequenting the place everyday probably didn't help - at least that what it sounds like you were doing. If not, you should have had a convo with her in those first 10 days, asked her out, set a time and day for it to happen, and THEN gotten the number - that way, her "oh my phone doesn't work well" line wouldn't have worked as an excuse.

 

[Thorninmyside]

bar has a sound system. i do sound system install.

also, what's up with her 180 degree behavior on day 29?
right before that day we texted quite a bit and it ended on a good note, actually.

I don't think it was a 180, but a ten point turn from day 20.

I'm also gonna guess that the number she gave you is not her main number and uses it for texting side guys while her boyfriend calls her fully functioning smart phone that you didn't get the number for.

 

[RangerMIke]

if all that was for power play(?) on dominating my attention, i want to know what to watch out for the next girl i encounter.

Every woman is different. Some come onto you like gang busters, when they have high interest, some withdraw and pull back, when they have high interest. A lot of what the PUA people teach is silly. Truth is when you have enough experience you just know.

The only thing men can do is just assume she has high interest and act on it, because you really won't know for sure until you try. Strike when the iron is hot... right from the start. If you don't she'll assume you have some hangups or your gay. I get rejected by more women than not even by women that have high interest because they are involved with other dudes.

 

[thebiglimp]

thanks guys, these are really helpful stuff.

so thorn, you think she already got what she wanted when she gave me her number? that's cruel in my book.

the story was that her boyfriend ditched her 3 months ago for an old flame. the phone number deal was genuine afaik.

also, i wonder if some women may find my texting to be too strong.

i mean it was her number, name, then right off the bat without knowing anything about eachother, 'let's go on a date'. would girls with high IL always accept that or even with that level some would find it a turn off that i was too drilling?

 

[VladPatton]

First and foremost, beware of bartender chicks. Second, since you frequent that place often, all you had to do is get yourself a beer, chat with her once, as an intro. Pop in there again, and ask for your date after casually sipping another beer, ready to bounce. Then get the digits and set up a time and place. Keep it brief, quick, and practically business-like in the simplest way possible. Forget IOI's and body language BS. Always make like you're busy, and strike quick. She says yes, you jet, she says no, you jet. Set it up and knock it down afterwards. No cutesy texting in between. Forget dinners, do a cheap introductory coffee date. Save your cash, you know nothing about her. You can hate her attitude 10 minutes into the date.

Now, to save face because you need to do work there, make like nothing happened. Say hello, be cheery, don't bring anything up, and do not show awkwardness.

We all failed, trust me, but now you know what to do. Good luck.

 

[Amilz]

You seem like you are very precise and over analyze things. A lot of people are simple when it comes to everyday interactions. They take everything at face value and that's why they are good at socializing. I over analyze everything. I have trouble talking to random people because I'm already construing what they are thinking based on my own perceptions and experiences.

Women I imagine are going to be a hesitant towards someone who is controlling and intense in how they interact with people. You neatly categorized by date how interactions with this women went. It's almost like you are programming. You imagined she was interested when she clearly wasn't and it was overbearing to her that you kept pressuring her. I've done the same thing.

Maybe you trying dating a women who has more of a professional career like a professor, lawyer, author, etc. Your field sounds like you have to do some critical thinking. Find a woman who is a critical thinker or appreciates one.