Tom Leykis

[potato]

I think many marriages fail these days is because of the expectations that people have going into them thanks to the media/matrix.

It's more likely that our society encourages selfishness, much more today than in the past.

I see old couples who are very happy togethar. They're not happy because of their partners good looks but because they enjoy each others company and have enjoyed living with their partner.


If the man decided in his youth that he didn't want to get married and wanted to sleep around and have fun then he would have had a wild time but how would he have ended up? And during the wild years would he have been happy sleeping around? No because just like drugs, after a while the great feeling fades and it becomes meaningless.

Exactly. People in loving relationships tend to be happier and healthier than those who aren't.

 

[DJDamage]

Exactly. People in loving relationships tend to be happier and healthier than those who aren't.

Can anybody really name 5 couples that they personally know that live in a happy relationship together and are doing everything right?? I don't.

I know alot more couples that live in either a boring mundane relationship or are miserable together.

 

[STR8UP]

Can anybody really name 5 couples that they personally know that live in a happy relationship together and are doing everything right?? I don't.

One of my sisters seems to have a decent marriage. Other than that....I see quite a few couples trudging through, and quite a few more who cheat on each other.

I've always said that I would bet that out of the 50% of marriages that survive, the majority of those probably would be better off divorced. And TRULY happy couples? Definitely less than 10% after a couple of years.

 

[window]

perhaps in 30 years we might see the stat change for the better because of sites like this...for me the internet is the greatest invention since the wheel. Cannot be underestimated.

 

[Hooligan Harry]

People get married for the wrong reasons. They get married because they fear they cant top their current lay or they get married because they feel pressure from society. Some get dragged into by women who need the security of marriage while others marry because they hope its going to fill a hole in their lives.

I come from a very family orientated family. While I only have one sister, the entire family is close. Aunts, uncles, cousins. Now while each and every family has its ups and downs I would not trade anything for that. To me there is nothing more important then immediate family and then extended family.

I have no problem signing a contract with a woman who is prepared to stay at home and raise kids. As someone who wants children I am realistic enough to understand that someone needs to provide for them and they do need their mothers. She needs to know that she will be taken care of if things dont work out. If she is going to give up her independence and career then she needs to cover her arse.

If I was not going to have kids there would be no reason to get married. Im a traditional guy from a traditional family. Traditional families work better because gender roles are fixed.

Just because the majority of people who get married get married for the wrong reasons that does not automatically mean that marriage is a bad thing.

 

[STR8UP]

perhaps in 30 years we might see the stat change for the better because of sites like this...for me the internet is the greatest invention since the wheel. Cannot be underestimated.

I've always said that the feminist pendulum, if it hasn't reached the bottom, it is close, and we will begin to see some changes in the way men and women interact in the future.

And as for the internet....it's arguably the best invention of all time! I just started a business venture for about $600, and have already seen about $200 in sales in the first two days on a product that costs me pennies to produce. Start a business, take a class, learn how to deal with hoochies....it's a one stop shop!

 

[mintxx]

I just had a listen to Tom Leykis via a podcast. I had to stop after 4 minutes because he sounds like a pre-op trannie with really small lungs and a fat neck. No doubt he speaks the truth, but this guy's shrill whining and slow-paced, poorly articulated monologue is probably turning people away from it. How the hell did he get on the radio?

 

[SoCalMike]

Tom Leykis is a fat fvck who only gets laid because of his money. Some of his advice is good, like don't date a single Mom (unless you want to adopt a child), use birth control unless you want a child, and don’t’ feel pressured/rush to get married. But this is all common sense.

Most of his show is just shock jock crap designed to get ratings.

 

[wjh]

But this is all common sense.

Uncommon common sense.

 

[window]

I think what Leykis's message is is to maintain space between you and your woman. Most men try to metamorphose into a combined being from day one when they rock up at the front door with 12 dozen roses

 

[STR8UP]

So, go ahead take your shots, I just wanted to say my piece. I am a straight forward intelligent giving person that gave my time and sout to a very bad man. My point, everything has to be worked at and when you make a committment its easy to run away and go and satisfy your id, a good person keeps their promises and people are not to be used for your own selfish reasons.

Nobody is "taking shots" here. Fact is, marriage is often a boon to women and a barrier to men.

The problem here is not that women are bad, it's that they are who they are, and with divorce laws today set to basically screw men.

I am all for an "equitable" divorce. If the woman was rich going into it she sould be able to keep her money, etc. But the problem comes when you get guys like Paul McCartney and Phil Collins getting RAPED to the tune of $40-50 million by a woman who wouldn't know a musical note from the chinese scribble inside a fortune cookie.

You might be a great person. If so I'm sorry you got screwed. Men fukk women over as well. But when it comes down to it, it is usually women who push for marriage because of societal conditioning and the fact that it is far more beneficial to them.

Good luck to you.

 

[decades]

I would like to step off the "edge" to provide my view. I came to this site curious, it was suggested by a member from another site that addresses infidelity. I think 10 years ago I may of been suprised by the number of men that have run across manipulating self absorbsed, half witted women looking for a gravy train. After being with my stbx husband these past 11 years and seeing the women he chose to destroy our relationship with, I am now not so naive.
At first I was bitter and going down the track of "men are pigs" I now believe people without moral character and fortitude are pigs. For every pig there is a pig fu*ker.
I was never looking for someone to carry me or to be my "king" I wanted a partner. Someone to have my back when needed. A friend, someone you knew that if the chips were down they would be there to support you, and visa versa.
I work, I am educated and I love taking care of my home and family. In fact I love to work. I joke with my friends at work, (and they are not all female), about how I am a man in a womans body.
I believe marriage is a promise, a spiritual emotional bond. Its not about only having sex with one person the rest of your life, its about building a life, making a full circle. What kind of society will we have in the future, when there is no remorse, responsibility or ethics?
Statistically women come out on the losing end of the economic curve after divorce, especially women with children. I had to quit my second job now, to be home more for my son. I did not make more than my husband, but I put my masters degree on the back burner after our son was born, because of priorities. I trusted my husband enough that when our son was older, I would go back and finish my masters so that we could build a better nest egg, wrong. My husband was able to finish his master because I went to the graveyard shift, and then stayed home and took care of our son and home during the day. While I was making huge sacrifices, he was violating my trust and our bank account to make his own personal accomplishments.
So, for all you guys that think you deserve to keep your money because you make more and that women get married to find an easy way out, you are not right in every circumstance.
Sacrifice, committment and genuine trust and truth are very hard things to find in todays society on both side of the gender fence. There are many needy worthless women out there, I know my husband has found more than one in his conquests. There are also manipulating, lying, self righteouss narcassisstic basta*ds out here too.
So, the point I am making is that people are individuals. I learned after being in the military and being in situations where the person next to you could at any moment be a deciding factor in your survival, I learned pick your friends with great care, by their moral character. How someone responds to overwhelming stress will tell you volumes about their personality.
I just wanted to post on here because its a male dominated forum, to let you know not all women are the same. Not men are all the same. All I wanted in my realtionship was someone to trust and someone I could be me with.
I wanted a sex partner, a partner to free my soul with, and what I got was a slow grinding fu*k over. After reading these posts on this site, I found that I was not going to get anything useful out of it for me.
So, go ahead take your shots, I just wanted to say my piece. I am a straight forward intelligent giving person that gave my time and sout to a very bad man. My point, everything has to be worked at and when you make a committment its easy to run away and go and satisfy your id, a good person keeps their promises and people are not to be used for your own selfish reasons.

good post. you make a good reminder to not over generalize about people.

 

[Mr. Me]

Welcome to the forum, Tess. Sorry to hear how things went for you.

It's not that this forum is "male dominated". That's a feminist label. This is a men's forum, for men, by men. So inherently, it's male. Do we ever hear the words "female dominated" to describe Oprah's site, or do we hear the word "empowered"?

Therefore, this is a site for men empowering men.

Statistically women come out on the losing end of the economic curve after divorce, especially women with children.

That's because they live better when married to a husband paying for things. Just another example that marriage is more advantageous for women then for men. Once deprived of that income, their quality of life suffers.

When I read "I am a man in a woman's body" and how you had worked two jobs, worked the graveyard shift and then stayed home to take care of the baby, I get the sense that this didn't exactly spell the good life to the STBX.

For lots of couples, this idea of settling down, having babies and living the "family" life turns out to be less satisfying then they thought. The reality and stress of meeting the growing bills, the diminishing sex life, the partner commonly getting out of shape, nagging, the routine of it all, etc., leads to someone feeling trapped, as in "is this all there is?".

A recent poll of parents showed that most of them didn't really like having kids now that they had them.

I always noticed that the dads I'd see on the street pushing strollers are usually never smiling. I mean, some guys adore having kids tumble all over them, but many guys prefer it be a hot chick. So marriage and kids, for lots of guys, is where things turn. The wife gets complacent and lets herself go. She nags. The kids create a turmoiled house leaving their toys strewn all over the place. You work hard just to see your money being spent on diapers instead of on great vacations. When you do vacation, it's not to Venice with your sexy wife where just the two of you can go on a moonlit gondola ride down the canal and sup leisurely into the night at a cozy candlelit table lingering over a bottle of Chianti, it's to Disneyland with a horde of screaming, restless, whining kids with runny noses who have to use the bathroom desperately while you're waiting on line for an hour just to spin in a oversized cup.

Then, eventually, after years of this and other problems, typically, the kids leave home, the guy, who's been stuck at a job he didn't like for years but from which he couldn't change because he had to provide, retires and within a few years, dies.

Thoreau wrote, "The mass of men lead lives of quiet desperation". Wonder why he'd observe that.

The woman's response is usually that of berating men for not wanting that kind of life. "Mid life crisis!" they'll contend. "Grow up!" they'll harass. "This is what you're supposed to do!" they'll try to brainwash.

Really, they're just showing that they attempt to browbeat non-conforming guys into that life - because again, the women mostly want it, not the guys. Generally speaking, of course.

There are always exceptions.

I'm not condoning what your STBX decided to do about his lot in life and I'm not saying that you're responsible for his decisions.

So, yes, you can get something out of this site, if you're open to it.

 

[Vulpine]

Tess, we feel your pain.

You are a victim of a nasty, nasty man. It's easy to see how you aren't to be held accountable for your involvement in the marriage; it's also easy to see how you shouldn't be held responsible for any negative outcome, either. You are entitled to much, much better, princess.

I work, I am educated and I love taking care of my home and family. In fact I love to work. I joke with my friends at work, (and they are not all female), about how I am a man in a womans body.

Weren't we just discussing whether or not men are "afraid" of professional women?

 

[Warrior74]

Tess. Sucks to be you. Welcome to the club of people who have been screwed over after dedicating themselves to their family..I've been in that club as well. But make no mistake you won't get much sympathy from me. So you think you deserve money for doing things at home you would have done and still do anyway? You think home life has a price tag? Really? What do you pay yourself now for cooking, cleaning and taking care of kids? Because the only difference is this...you want this mans money for doing what you did in the past, what you do currently and what you still will do in the future. He owes you nothing for that. You did it voluntarily. You want his money out of spite and anger and frustration and revenge. If you could be honest about it that would be really cool, but your not so it isn't.

We all make sacrifices in relationships. I sacrificed a good job in LA because my ex didn't want to go. Should I sue her for possible unearned incomes? No. I made my choice willingly. I learned my lesson. Never put someone else's interest before my own unless they be blood and even then only under great consideration.

You deserve nothing. You are equal to a man aren't you? If yes...you deserve nothing...if no...well...I doubt you will admit to that.

Your quality of life is your responsiblity only. This is the lesson. Learn it well. Nobody owes you jack shi.t.

 

[Colossus]

Tess-

What happened to you was beyond unfortunate. However after reading both of your long posts the one thing that stands out was a lack of any personal accountability on your part. You want reparations for what you did in the past becasue you were expecting something in return. No one owes you (or any of us) ANYTHING in this world unless they TOOK something from you with the explicit condition they would RETURN it.

I dont think anyone is going to argue you got screwed, big time. You and your ex husband clearly had incongruent ideas of what marriage should entail. But you need to be accountable for YOUR part in that choice. If you are as good at character assesment as you say you are, then we could argue based on your 2 posts that you failed to do so before you got married. Coming here and saying that you wil not get anything out of this male-dominated forum only belies your residual misandry and unwillingness to accept a viewpoint that doesnt validate your own.

This is not a personal slam. There should be some justice for what you lost in your marriage, but at the end of the day your ex husband violated YOUR EXPECTATIONS of the contract.

You CAN get something positive out of this site as there are plenty of wise, upstanding men here who have a lot of knowledge and experience. There are also a number of bitter misogynists who tend to always see women in a negative light.

We are all going to have our moments and times of dissention towards the opposite sex, men and women. This is a community FOR men, BY men; with the purpose of promoting independence in thinking and building the life YOU want, not what someone else expects.

 

[Vulpine]

Tess, we feel your pain.

You are a victim of a nasty, nasty man. It's easy to see how you aren't to be held accountable for your involvement in the marriage; it's also easy to see how you shouldn't be held responsible for any negative outcome, either. You are entitled to much, much better, princess.

If most people can agree that we attract people and are attracted to people who have the same qualities as us, don't you think it's possible that it's not just them who have 'issues'?
Also, if you surround yourself with these types of [wo]men, and BLAME THEM, its easy to assume that EVERY [wo]man on the planet is EXACTLY the SAME as these low quality [wo]men.
And that IMO is an error.
Secondly, even when/if there is a 'pattern', it cannot PROVE that EVERY SINGLE person falls into the EXACT same pattern. So, therefore, no CONCLUSION can EVER be finalized or arrived to. To think so is delusional.

When we aren't sure of our own boundaries, we tend to blame the environment for our mistakes in judgment and any offenses we may perceive. When we doubt our judgment, we often look outside for validation and confirmation. And often, in order to feel 'safe' , we tend to promote and propagate our personal beliefs as indisputable FACTS. So, the belief is often that if we can get enough people 'on our side', believing whatever particular belief we have, we will have 'proved' that it IS true. ie "See? They agree with me. Therefore, I AM right. It is TRUE without a shadow of a doubt.Why? Because they BELIEVE me."

Think of the notion of 'safety in numbers'.
Imagine you really DO recognize you have an irrational belief ie. 2+2=5, and you promote it massively, eventually you just may have enough 'followers' to 'believe' you speak the truth. So technically, you would feel safe now, that so many people believe this same irrational belief as you do. Now it feels justified to you. Therefore, now it's REAL.
When at the end of the day it's bullsh¡t.


And when we begin to doubt our own judgment, it scares us so much that we begin to point fingers to the external.
Instead we could just be grown [wo]men and look inside for the answers.
This is why you see certain 'methods' used to 'protect' [wo]men from being taken advantage of. Because they have trouble looking inside for the 'blame' and instead just place it squarely on the person or the environment, rather than themselves.
Because it appears that it is simply easier and better to LOOK like you are assertive and non reactive and use false actions and behavior (the persona is often that which we are NOT actually. When you see someone who appears 'confident' under pressure, yet feel extremely anxious and insecure in other circumstances, you can see their real character and emotional maturity level. They're acting. So in order to cope, they put on a false persona to act for them and pretend and appear to be a confident person, or it can be a funny person, or sexual person, etc. We often assume the persona that is in opposite to who we really are inside.) than simply do the work and eventually BE the confident, assertive [wo]man, who has strong boundaries. You see the multitude of 'conclusions' and methods. All used to hide [wo]men from looking inside and seeing the holes in their boundaries.

Tess, your posts are doing this site a huge service by illustrating, demonstrating, or punctuating a lot of what we preach. Keep up the good work.

 

[SoCalMike]

screwing suzie q because your wife does not look like she did when she was 25

First let me say that your husband cheating on you was NOT right or acceptable behavior at all.

That said, I suspect from the quote above that you may have let your appearance slide quite a bit.

If that is not true, I apologize. But if it is, then you must understand one fundamental thing which applies to about 90% of men: WE WANT OUR WIVES TO LOOK GOOD.

I have had two relationships end badly because my SO was not taking care of her body. I like food, but I also work out like a madman so I can eat a lot and not gain weight. But my SO's didn't work out with me, they just ate with me. So naturally they started getting fat. I would discuss the issue as politely as I could, but they didn't listen. They would hardly ever come work out with me, and very rarely would they go on their own either.

They knew I loved them and figured I'd never leave them over it. But eventually their unattractive appearance began to damage the relationship, and in the end it destroyed it.

If this is what happened to you and your husband, then please accept that you are partly to blame.

If not, then never mind. I realize some guys are just scum and will cheat on the most beautiful and sweet women out there. But those types are rare. That is why I suspect you may have had a hand in him being tempted by other women and eventually cheating with one.

 

[Warrior74]

My response to you is: If you were to go into surgery with the "assumption" of trust and faith in your surgeon and it turns out to be otherwise and you end up with your balls in the specimen bucket in lieu of what was "sopose" to be in there I would say your quality of life is YOUR responsibility and not his/hers. In interviewing your surgeon you only know what is told to you or being presented in order to gain your trust and or buisness. Marriage is the same, the other person in many circumstances shows the best side of themselves and at times it is very difficult to disern what is actually there. Yes, I think my time at home is worth something. Yes, no one is paying me for that time now, but Im not having to suck some lying **** wads **** when he was stabing me in the back. And yes Im not having to divide my time so that he could go to school and advance while I worked and took care of home. My fault? Maybe, my point was, it was a contract, he was to advance then I. If your partner in buisness made a million dollars on a idea and then ditched you, you would want your 50% and if you say no, your lying. Im not asking for half of everything for the rest of my life, Im asking for half of what I put into it for the years I put into it. It takes two to make a baby, and it should take two to take responsibility for a child, and that goes both ways. If either party does not want to support a child for the next 18 years then they should be taking precautions. We chose to have a child TOGETHER, it was not emmaculate conception. It sounds to me as though you think its a females responsibilty to make a home for a child, thats too bad. I put my family first, because I chose to, because I had trust and faith in the partnership I chose. Did I learn something? Yes, I learned that divorce is unfair and ugly and the man usually wins because of attitudes like yours.
I dont want to be a bitter old lady one day that thinks all men suck and only use people etc. but reponses like your guide me into the direction that guys like you think the world owes you and that having a family and raising children is meaningless and worthless. Go pay a housekeeper, baby sitter and cook, see how much it costs. Maybe I should have been charging for my BJs then I wouldnt be worried about a bankruptcy right now. I wonder.... did your mommy breast feed you?

See how weak you are. Decending to personal attacks because you got your emotions all riled up. Go back and re-read my post. Should I sue my ex for lost wages? My career stalled trying to keep my family happy and putting my happiness on the back burner. I am speaking to you as an equal and you keep implying that you are not. We do the things we want to do because we want to do them. Later we may have wish we hadn't have done them....but we choose that course of action. And ultimately we are responsible for our own actions. We are never responsible for our spouses actions. You cannot control other people.

It sounds to me as though you think its a females responsibilty to make a home for a child, thats too bad

Here is where you are making assumptions. And of course being the intenet and knowing nothing about me you are so wrong that if you knew me you would know how stupid a statement that really is.

Should I get money for all the time I spent being the primary care taker of my daughter for years 1-3 of her life, while the ex sat around on her fat ass doing nothing? According to your logic I should. Yet the courts give her custody because she's "the mother" and makes me pay money to her. Everyone knows I was a better parent then she is. But the system is titled in her favor. You see there are two sides to every coin. So really read what I said. Read it a few times and you might get the point I am making.

Life owes you nothing. My parents (who are still married to this day) told me this. All he owes is support for his child. That's it. And most real fathers have no problems doing that.

If I was married to some rich woman, I wouldn't K-Fed her. I'd leave with what I came with, but if I have custody of our kids I expect her to help take care of them. I didn't earn her money and if I helped her it's because I wanted to. If I wanted to be in business with her, I would do that and get my money legally. You get me? But if we are talking about bjs for cash....well there is a name for that line of work.

 

[Mr. Me]

Tess sounds like she's in the "anger" phase, and rightfully so. She's still processing what's happened in her life. And in doing that, she's "demonizing" her STBX and lashing out so that she feels better about herself, you see. She's taken a blow to her world, her self-worth and self-esteem. And she's fighting back.

I've seen this many times before. What she really wanted was to vent and have others tell her she's right, and validate her feelings. And she is right about some things, but we disagree on other points. But that disagreement is like rubbing [rejection] salt in a still new wound for her.

But we can't all agree with her as we're not like her girlfriends, though I'm sure she has our empathy.