Thoughts -- LTR Advice

[Buddha_Mind]

It's been about 5 real months since I've been here. I was honestly growing tired of some of the attitudes on this forum -- but I want to say that some of the things here do ring true. This I have learned in the last 5 months. There are definitely good women out there -- and there is a balance -- women have to work just as we do towards a better relationship and learning to modify our behaviors to keep things interested.

I know my return for this post might upset some people, but I'm not looking for arguments or ego-battles, ect, I'm looking for some perspective I suppose. I admit that this place holds some truths that can help frustrated men. I do not think everything on this website is reasonable or balanced or healthy -- but there is a measure of truth in some of the differences in male/female psychology.

My question to you all is about LTR's -- and I know some may only be able to offer whatever opinions they have.

How can we keep an LTR growing and breathing? How do we keep sexual tension? How do we find a balance of being understanding and caring (when we really do care about our companion), but wanting to keep them stimulated and growing and feeling sexually challenged?

I have been finding recently some struggle in this regard. I need to know how to better keep my woman sexually lit. I need to know how to better breed sexual tension. I'm not looking to cheat, to play the field per say, I am looking to be patient with her which I do think is important to keep LTR's growing -- after all, we can't act like we ourselves don't make mistakes and a good woman will be patient with us too.

I believe I've slipped into some degree of betaness giving too many compliments, giving too much schmooze in general, and I'm looking for a way to flip this around and not lose the frame in general. What can we do to feel more alpha? I am working on creating my own buisness after years of doing outdoor education -- this buisness is related to my technical abilities regarding computers, ect, and does not relate to my outdoor skills. I forsee a great fiscal strength in this.

One thing I've really realized is that a big part of relationship success is communication. And we've got to be careful how we do it. We have to frame ourselves as being strong (which we are). But there is an important aspect in an LTR to keep communication strong so each person can understand what the other person is dealing with. Life can be complex with many variables. Caring about someone takes some degree of patience and honesty. I'm not saying being a wuss nice guy -- which in some ways I am a good person and have likely been too nice at times -- but what do we do to be understanding, create sexual tension, and not be bull****ted? The goal here is to keep the woman, not have affairs, but to kindle warmth and breed attraction.

Genuine responses only would be appreciated. Some insight could help me.

-BM

 

[Buddha_Mind]

My real question is, can some of you in healthy LTR's shed light on some healthy habits, mindsets, frameworks, ect to breed success and strength in that relationship?

My game has been slipping and I need to pick up my ass and tie up these loose strings. Slacking isn't the way to have good women.

 

[Buddha_Mind]

Alright, my first few posts here were a result of scattered mind. Perspectives are valued, and please don't flame. I know there are haters but I'm genuinely looking for constructive and down to earth advice. I fear I am losing my frame and have slipped into beta-ness. I need a boost to rekindle my frame and mindset.

1. Met a woman 5 months ago and we've fallen into a short-term LTR to this point. We've learned incredible amounts about each other. Spent lots of time together thus far. Were long distance for 2 of those 5 months and talked nearly every night. This was not a bad thing as we learned great deals more about each other and was genuinely fun for both of us. I broke this DJ rule but it seemed circumstantial, although it could all be coming back to bite me in the ass.

2. Left a job in CA that was not supporting me financially enough and returned to be back near her and my family. Have been working to create my own IT business which already is getting great deals of interest. Am developing marketing materials and already finding my first clients. I am charging a great deal of money for my time and see this being an immense opportunity for financial strength in my life that has before been absent. Fear my leaving my job has framed me as beta. Yes she was a big reason -- I desired to be with her and around her -- and maybe this was a mistake. But I feel in some ways at a certain point sacrifices have to be made to have a good relationship, and my outdoor job was not allowing me any ability to provide, nor any way to have anything other than constant mobility. I desire an LTR and am tired of being a rogue drifter.

3. Her sexual IL has dropped immensely. She is overwhelmed with school and work, her free time is spent mostly with me. I do great deals of work to setup enriching and adventurous gatherings and experiences that can bring us closer together. I try my best to take leadership in these moments. Just last night she was feeling overwhelmed with lots of her stress and we had some very long discussions that has led to this post and myself realizing that I have indeed falling into beta attitude, caught up amidst chemicals of love and romance, and that SS, although holding some degree of jadedness, could be a constructive opportunity for perspective and advice to regather my frame.

4. I've been too schmoozy and lovey dovey and all of that garbage. Too many kisses and have made her feel uncomfortable at times. I don't know what the **** has happened to me honestly -- I know better, but lots of things like, "you're like nobody I've ever met", and "you are my tree" has allowed me to slip as well. How do I pull from this lovey dovey crap and stimulate her sexuality again? What are some constructive methods to reverse this trend before it's too late?

5. She is incredible in communication and allowing me to know how she feels. Our discussions has prompted me to do some further research and reassert myself, for fear of continuing these de-sexifying-de-seduction behaviors I've somehow fallen into blindly. Acknowledging her concerns and guiding this relationship is one of my major mental priorities -- not falling into her demands -- but recognizing that I'm not stimulating her mentally and I'm falling into beta attitude. If this continues I'm nixed. I know this. She has not given up yet -- she desires for us to grow -- she wants to be with me and our concerns were good to talk about. There are things she does too that trouble me and this was expressed outright together.

I fear my schmooze + leaving my job in CA (although yes she was a primary catalyst, but I know right here is a better place for me in many regards, and our relationship surely would have died long-distance and likely wouldn't still be alive if I hadn't returned) + allowing her to get angry with me or "walking on egg shells" with her has dried up her sexual desire and made her feel absent or even unattractive. I have been confronting her misbehavior in the moment and it is having positive effects.

What I am really after here, is how do I recapture my frame? My method so far is:
(a) no more walking on egg-shells/tolerance of anger -- being patient and not losing my cool and acting as a strong tree -- but making it very clear what behavior I expect of her.

(b) continue expanding my IT business to create strong profits and build a new identity doing small business IT work and creating a more self-enabled life with more money than I've experienced before.

(c) continuing physical fitness expansion and strength gains to keep my body-mind healthy.

(d) envision myself as being attractive to all women, the "man", but her as my #1 lady (not cheating, but rather acknowledging that women desire me and I *choose* her).

(e) continue building a base that she can take shelter in (not just financially, ect, but emotionally). I've been incredibly patient with her and he has been astounded by this and has grown more attraction for who I am because of this.

(f) stop the schmoozing. kissing only as a reward for important moments. no more lovey-dovey-garbage. moving into the 2/3rds rule and giving less in my text responses and less in my conversation...not to hide or filter..but to rather keep her craving more and desiring more..

(g) going to be flirtatious with other women in front of her in a mild sense that is not hitting on them but creating a cloud of sexual desire around me...I am unsure how she may respond to this..she does not like the idea of other women hitting on me...she does not like the idea of other women wanting her man..

(h) less apologies/no more sorries -- apologizing for interrupting her, ect has become a trend of mine because of her temper -- no more sorries or apologies but rather assertive attitude and acting as I wish to act.

(i) exaggerated ****y-ness -- being bold and confident even though sometimes not feeling this way -- making strong proclamations about my success and what I stand for.

..these are just ideas but I seek new perspectives...I do not believe the frame is entirely lost yet, but I am 100% aware of the warning signs now and it needs adjustment ASAP. I know there is a small window here to turn things around otherwise I have fallen into a betahood. I'm definitely not a beta, but her love and warmth and all of that has pulled me in and I've suddenly been schmoozed over like under the influence of a drug..I need to pull from this and recognize strategy and a bit of zen disconnection...to create some degree of mental distance from the love aspect and although she cares about me a great deal, need to stimulate her sexually far more through this change in attitude..

I'm confident if I make changes quick and real-time, take her by surprise, she will suddenly begin to desire me more..I know she still cares a great deal..but if I don't get on this now I'm in trouble.

Love guys. I am sorry for my negative attitude at times. I need some positive insight and vibes.

 

[betheman]

Im not in an LTR, however, in a nutshell my opinion is, the things that attracted the woman initially, you should keep, we get into an ltr, and we change, consequently we lose a degree of our attraction.
when into an ltr, keep some mystery, a little distance be a little unpredictable, dont explain or apologise, unless you really have messed up.

 

[Matthew Lyon]

What keeps a relationship going is experiencing gaps of separation or "alone time". The only way to excel at getting better in relationships is to give each other space on a consistent basis. It is absolutely necessary. In other words, make it a habit not to spend too much time with her. This will allow the both of you to gather your feelings when apart in those spaces of alone time. And one of you may decide you want something different. There's nothing wrong with that. And there's no guarantee any relationship lasts forever either. But by giving each other space you will greatly increase your chance of staying together for at least a long time.

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

BUDDAH, I got your PM, but for the benefit of the collective here, read this:

http://roissy.wordpress.com/2009/08/14/relationship-game-week-a-readers-journey/

The is a textbook example of an LTR reframe. Once you've read it, we'll discuss.

 

[Scaramouche]

Dear Bhudda,
welcome back we need balance on this site.....look to keep a relationship fresh and dynamic,never see them more than three or max four times a week.and remember if you become a slave to them,thats exactly how they will see and treat you....svex say max three times a week,then discreetly get a few interests,if you really feel starved for affection,find a safe plate or two...and good luck with your new business mate.

 

[Blues]

Great thread.

Been looking for sound advise on maintaining a solid LTR.

One thing i would like to know is that i'm basically a very affectionate guy towards my gf, physically and verbally.

Would like to know if this is a bad thing in the long run?

Should i give her affection sparingly?

 

[Buddha_Mind]

Go_ddamn I miss you guys. I need to fine tweak myself. I've fallen asleep behind the wheel recently...

Revamp.

More thoughts in the morning. Thought digestion.

**

Blues, gut response from some present circumstances -- too much praise, ect will run dry and become "cheap" and expected..women are not puppies..use praise or other physical gestures as rewards for special moments..(going to be one of my first lines of adjustment here myself)

 

[Blues]

Hey BM, its not gona be an easy adjustment for me as it feels very natural being affectionate. I reckon i have to be more selective in how i dish out such gestures.

I just dont wana make the interaction between us 'business-like' if you get what i mean.

Arent we suppose to train our woman to be like our little puppies

 

[Rollo Tomassi]

BLUES, you need to internalize and practice the 2/3rds rule:

V. Adhere to the golden ratio

Give your woman 2/3 of everything she gives you. For every three calls or texts, give her two back. Three declarations of love earn two in return. Three gifts; two nights out. Give her two displays of affection and stop until she has answered with three more. When she speaks, you reply with fewer words. When she emotes, you emote less. The idea behind the golden ratio is twofold — it establishes your greater value by making her chase you, and it demonstrates that you have the self-restraint to avoid getting swept up in her personal dramas. Refraining from reciprocating everything she does for you in equal measure instills in her the proper attitude of belief in your higher status. In her deepest loins it is what she truly wants.

 

[squirrels]

"Consider the lilies how they grow: they neither toil nor spin."

Ask yourself why it isn't natural for you to behave as a man in a relationship. This isn't something you can fix with "tactics"...if you have to force yourself to do things to maintain the relationship, they will seem unnatural, stilted, like you are trying to "force" the relationship to continue.

Ask yourself first whether, deep down in your heart, you WANT this relationship to continue, or whether you are trying to keep it alive to protect your own emotions.

If you really DO want it to continue, you have to ask yourself what it is that's making you behave in a "beta schmoozing" manner. Where most people go wrong is giving the "relationship" a life of its own and, when things aren't going well, assuming that the "relationship is busted", when really either the relationship wasn't meant to be in the first place, or something is wrong with one or the other of the parties to it and how they think and feel about each other.

What do you think your supplicating attitude is telling you about yourself?

 

[Buddha_Mind]

Squirrels, I think it's natural for men in a relationship to want to keep their women happy. This isn't necessarily a bad thing. It's simply because a man cares about his lady and wants the best for her -- there is nothing wrong with that. Some level of schmooze can be good as it is nurturing...good people are often a result of good nourishment..ie, hugging children is shown that it makes them into more loving adults...over-schmoozing is really rooted in a concern of care for her -- but what I'm realizing is that over-schmoozing doesn't make her sexually come alive in those ways -- it does come off as "too much", or "over the top" and it becomes cheap. Kissing too frequently can really take the specialness out of a kiss -- these sorts of things should be used as tools and moments of sincere and genuine connection. Just as overpraising a child can't be healthy either -- we don't want to balloon a person's sense of importance and make them feel like they're above us (which was over-schmoozing can do).

The truth is if someone really cares about you, not only will they not give up in some moments of weakness, but they'll be somewhat patient. It's easy to care about someone when everything is prim roses. A good woman will stand through some frustration if she really cares about the relationship. All relationships will take work on both parties part.

What I am trying to do is pull from my beta-regression and re-assert my frame as an alpha male -- and perhaps it is this identity that I need to more greatly internalize. I'm not an ego-bloated person, but I am surely 100% confident in my abilities and what I have to get done. I'm effective in my world, and that's an alpha trait. But like I've said, too much lovey-dovey **** can make things disgusting.

I do agree that some relationships just aren't meant to be. But even relationships that "are" meant to be are going to have some rough windows. It's take work and communication and understanding. These are the things I am working towards presently.

ROLLO -- I'm taking your 2/3rds advice on this. I think natural inclination is going to find this counter-intuitive -- I want to return her contact attempts, ect real-time so I'm "there for her" -- but I think setting up some bit of lag and delay, ect, shorter text responses (that are still warm and genuine) will be more effective...text message discourse for example..ie, texting back and forth about something is best left for genuine phone conversations. I definitely agree most men fall into the trap of over-texting -- I've done this! But I have caught myself here. And when we are aware of our actions and mistakes we can adjust. I've broken a few of these commandments my man, but I don't think chips are in just yet. She is definitely giving me all indications of wanting and caring about this relationship.

My goal is to truly inspire greater sexual desire within her by playing a greater level of Game on my lady. And I think even to have successful marriages, ect, this game has to keep flowing and growing and can't stop. We can't get on auto-pilot. Keeping things fresh is utmost important. Just being back on this forum has helped rekindle my mental framework that's been so effective in building lust and attraction, ect -- but I've fallen into love-land (which is a great place) -- but we've got to make sure we're driving that rocket ship through love-land, not sitting in the backseat letting her drive..because she will zip in random directions...as a female's emotions are highly dynamic...we've got to be a steady center point to bring her back when she gets emotional, ect. And times in our own weaknesses, our own emotional vulnerabilities, we've got to work damn hard to compartmentalize it and not let it fragment what we have going well.

This is not going to be an overnight change, it is going to be soft and subtle, and it is going to come with a changed mind...changing perspective.

I think at the end of the day we have to tell ourselves that we truly are "The Man", this is OUR LIFE -- it is OUR SUCCESS -- nobody is going to hand it to us or do anything for us. Good Relationships Take Work. My end of the obligation is what I am working to upkeep -- and that's keeping her knowing that I'm solid and something to lean on -- that I don't get unrooted by her emotional ebbs and flows and fears and doubts and stresses -- and that I give her space to be who and what she is while nurturing her...I'm not tethering her down or controlling her, but letting her fly free and to return to take roost in my branches..

I've definitely been having some serious concerns, a few of my friends recently separated (I married them actually) and it was a pretty tough situation. I was there at their house shortly after she told him she'd slept with his best friend...I can't even get into the logic behind it...this girl you'd never expect that of and not to mention the dude she slept with is a manipulative jerk. But I've definitely received some flak from the situation and keeping my mind in the right place has been difficult. I can't even express how intense it was being around them -- and considering they always appeared to have a "healthy relationship" and was a role-model in my mind for healthy relationships -- it has been hard to see that fall apart.

But I've realized too that nobody's surrounding relationship can truly affect yours. Just like if they guy next to you is cramming fast food into his mouth everyday doesn't mean I have to. We have our actions and choices and it is our objective to be aware of our own relationships only. Other people's relationships can't be a reflection of our own...they are our own entity..

So digressing from my diatribe, back to the intent of this thread:
1. Rollo -- very helpful link -- this is exactly what is occurring, I'm going to internalize your commandments and take the advice from that column...I see good things generating from this very much.

2. I've got to keep my game knowledge up and fresh, even if things are going well, just so I can maintain my mind and stay aware of the dynamics -- I truly want to be a strong tree.

3. I've got to keep working on self-progress, building my base, and strengthening my body-mind.

4. 2/3rds rule, less schmoozing.

5. Heavy social practice and talking to people of all sorts, men, women, everything, when she's around not abstaining from talking to a beautiful woman as a human being...my lady seeing this other woman light up will only believe she's truly got a great catch...everyone knows if others want what they have, than it must be good. And here's the deal with this one -- is knowing that I want her too -- so not letting these other women get into my head or get the best of me...they are just people...and I can't blame them for wanting to be with me...after all, a hard working man who cares about what is around him, pushes himself, and takes care of business is a good catch. But out of respect and care for her, she is my #1.

6. Communication -- she is able to talk about most anything, and I think it's good we keep doors open and I understand better what works for her and what doesn't -- what makes her feel uncomfortable and what makes her feel turned on -- this going to help our sex life and we'll be able to have great communication during sex and really tune into what we both desire and the intricacies of each others body.

**

To be the Man we've got to think of ourselves as the Man. Know this is Our Life. Success is up to Us. Good relationships are within our grasp and under our creation. And you can't ****ing give up even sometimes if you want to. Pushing through the humps brings people closer together, and is truly an aspect of life whether alone or with your dream girl.

I've got to keep reading and practicing. Trying new things and gauging her response. Not being afraid of upsetting her. Hell, better to upset her a bit then walk on egg shells and become submissive. That's a sure route into ****sville and dumpland.

And I care about her enough to truly challenge her...and as I do challenge her, she'll only grow closer to me (and when I say challenge I'm not saying ***** her out or be mean, cruel, ect. -- I mean challenging her behavior and perspectives). Ultimately I do think women want to grow closer to a man, and they want that man to be a guiding force and a loving leader. They don't want an as$hole or abuse or complete ****ery (although some women really really are fuked in the head) -- but I think they want someone who takes firm leadership, is stable amidst their ebbs and flows, and is firmly rooted.

Thoughts? This is going to be an on-going transformation...I'm truly excited to see the fruits from this.

-BM-

 

[Buddha_Mind]

Squirrels I also think that people go wrong when they hit rough patches and give up. There is truly rough patches in all relationships and in times of being alone. Not every moment in a relationship is going to have the same lust and bang that it started with. But being steady and pushing through the rough windows I really think catalyzes growth and brings people closer together...which ultimately will create a deeper bond and a better bond than what existed in the beginning.

 

[pipe007]

I am fortunate enough to have a stable LTR. Its been 6 months now, and at this point in time, my gf is making plans for the future, and she wants to stay with me for the long haul.

this are some key elements I believe MUST be present for you to be satisfied in a LTR.

1) partner selection skills
- you will never be happy if you cannot choose as best to your abilities a partner who has your same core values and aspirations. who treats you the way you believe you should be treated.

2) your ability to communicate
- your ability to say what you like and what don't like. to CLEARLY state what you are not willing to put up with, set up rules and boundaries clearly from the beginning of the relationship, and mean it. this includes things like respect, honesty, trust, loyalty, and communication.

3) Learning to maintain the Dominant frame
- doesnt mean you will dominate her, but that you will remain in control of yourself, and your emotions. the moment you feel you are slipping away (wussiness) then you catch yourself and get back in line. That you put your foot down everytime your girl tries to test you, where you clearly communicate your values and your command for respect. I try to please her, and do what she wants as well, but within the big picture, she knows that if she crosses the line, she is gone.

4) she must have some fear that you could walk away from her life if she tried to willingly disrespect you. meaning lying, being dishonest, manipulating you, making you feel inferior, or any kind of B.S, naggs at you for no reason. that no matter how much you love her, you will never be treated as anything less than a king in her life. Always keep yourself ready to walk out of the relationship no matter how long you been together or how much you love her!!!

5) This is really important, SPEED OF COMMUNICATION, if something bothers you, if she said something to upset you, anything that you feel she should know, that you communicate this AS SOON AS YOU CAN, the earlier the better, don't let those feelings of resentment accumulate because they will come out at some point, and its going to end up in an argument. it is always good to be able to clearly communicate what you like and dont like and what you want in a given situation. dont wait!! NEVER WHINE, never complain about something you dont like, you communicate directly that you dont like something with power, not whinning like a boy. you look at her directly in the eye, and mean what you say.

7) keep improving yourself and working on yourself, even if you are in a relationship, keep going to the gym, dont stop and take the relatinoship for granted, keep learning, keep socializing, keep expanding yourself and your comfort zone, and she will always be happy to be there with you. dont become boring, predictable, always put the gas to the car same way always put the effort to move the relationship forward (if she is worth it).

8) Rollo's rule, never give more than what she herself is offering you. WORST case scenario should be equals, best case, you maintain upper hand. this means, you dont text her more times than she does, you dont call more times than she does, you dont say I love you I like you more times than she does (some guys say dont say it at all), you go where she wants, and go to her friends or whatever as long as she respects and wants to go along where you want and with your friends, learn to negotiate. you don't give her kisses, hug her all the time, if she is not at least eagerly happy to return those kisses and give you some of hers. if it feels like you are pushing her into it, then STOP, and lay back, give her space. dont initiate kino until she does.

9) NEVER EVER EVER EVER, ask her why she is going somewhere (as long as its respectful) like to a friends house, dinner whatever non threatening situation. never ask her why she is going to the mall, or whatever or why she didn't tell you, dont try to control what she does. (you should have screen her enough that you know she can make respectful decisions of where she is at at all times). the only questions I ask my girl when she tells me she went to her friend's house or whatever is, what you up to? and who else is there with you? nothing else. let her be free in her decisions to go where she wants. AS LONG AS ITS RESPECTFUL. my girl knows she cannot go clubbing without me, that is a rule we set up at beginning of relationship.

10) be the man.
act like a man, make decision, make plans, let her make plans as well, but you be the one who carries the relationship where you want to. and if she doesnt want to go with you, YOU GO YOURSELF!, dont stop doing something you like because your girl doesnt feel like joining you. be a man, lead her by the hand, plan whats gonna happen and how its gonna happen. plan the dates. never stop making plans, be a leader not a follower!!. dont get boring boyfriend who just likes to stay home with her and watch movies then sleep.
be action oriented!

11) keep believing you are the prize, the king, and that you could have any girl if you wanted to. subcommunicate this with your actions, if u remain attractive to women in general, other girls will always send IL signals to you, and your girl will pick up on these signals and be happy, emotional, that she's got you!.

12) surprise her, do something nice for her every once in a moon, reward her for good behaviors as soon as they happen (could be a smile all the way to a nice dinner) and punish inmediately those behaviors that you dont like (retreating attention, kino, or going NC).

13) have her miss you, dont see her every day, have things going on in your life, dont stay in her house stuck like gum 24/7, and when you see her, have something in mind, have a plan, do something fun together. dont just stay there bored with her. give her space to miss you, for that reason, dont text call her all the time, give her space, so she can think of what you are up to so she can initiate texts, calls.

14) win her friends and family, if you do that, you are in, and you will have allies everywhere who will support the relationship, make friends with her sister, brother, mom, dad, friends. just do it, its worth a million dollars.

15)every now and then plan some nice trips or outings where you guys can spend time together, the reasoning for this is that you can then test her, and realize if you guys can stand each other for a whole weekend together. or a week like going on a cruise. if the relationship is strong, then you guys will have a blast together during that week/weekend, and relationship will grow stronger. if not, then you know this person is not for you. (if she can't stand you for a week, she will never put up with you in 2, 5 ,10 plus years).

these are some ideas that I use in my current relationship, and they WORK!
thoughts?

 

[Buddha_Mind]

Pipe -- this is great advice and exactly what I'm looking for. I agree with most of this and have internalized these things -- I really hope things keep flowing well for you.

These are lucky ladies, that is for sure.

 

[Buddha_Mind]

PS -- I've probably been guilty too of overtexting at times -- we live and learn as your tag says and recover from our mistakes. I think good people allow for some level of mistakes (to a certain line) -- and we too as males need to understand the same thing about our ladies -- ie, they are going to make mistakes too -- we ought to be patient and understanding. If they crossed that particular line, than we do deserve better.

And by saying "lucky ladies", I'm saying, a woman who has a man in her life who communicates, plans activities, works to be seductive, works on self improvement, takes care of his business, ect is a fine catch indeed. They are lucky...and your lady is lucky to have a man such as yourself.

peace brothers.