The X factor

[ketostix]

Primary: Ethnicity, Class, Social Proof etc
Secondary: Height, Looks, Health etc
Tertiary: Muscles, Game, Intellect etc.

MM

I agree with there being different levels, primary, secondary and tertiary, but I disagree with what you are placing in the layers. I put the x factors at the primary level. Ethnicity isn't primary because I know guys of every ethnicity that do well with women. Class and SP is more a result of having primary than the cause. Another example, as long as you are near average height, height would be tertiary, because I know shorter guys who out perform tall guys all the time.

 

[ketostix]

We are not allowed to talk about looks ...

And the worst part is I'm not even talking about looks really.

 

[L777]

Facial symmetry? **** I can't think of anyone I know who doesn't have a symmetrical face really. But not everyone I know is good with women!!

This is a very strange theory to say the least.

 

[ketostix]

Facial symmetry? **** I can't think of anyone I know who doesn't have a symmetrical face really. But not everyone I know is good with women!!

This is a very strange theory to say the least.

You got to be kidding. Almost everyone has some asymmetry. Few have perfect symmetry. Some people are so asymmetrical you can easily see the crookedness, women are even better at spotting it. While most of the time it's not a large amount and you don't consciously notice or realize the asymmetry or symmetry for that matter, but you unconciously do. And the women realizes she's attracted or not attracted even if she can't or won't put a finger on why.

 

[wolf116]

Facial symmetry? **** I can't think of anyone I know who doesn't have a symmetrical face really. But not everyone I know is good with women!!

This is a very strange theory to say the least.

It's a well documented finding in the whole animal kingdom.

Some species of butterfly only mate with males who have perfectly symmetrical wing patterns. If not, they have absolutely no chance of ever getting laid, even if they are the only male left!

 

[Luke Skywalker]

I agree with there being different levels, primary, secondary and tertiary, but I disagree with what you are placing in the layers. I put the x factors at the primary level. Ethnicity isn't primary because I know guys of every ethnicity that do well with women. Class and SP is more a result of having primary than the cause. Another example, as long as you are near average height, height would be tertiary, because I know shorter guys who out perform tall guys all the time.

When you read threads about Homeless people (that aren't good-looking) scoring girls and getting laid, that pretty much debunks 'social proof', 'class', or whatever, or people in jail convincing charming female jail guards.....so what is their x-factor then?

 

[ketostix]

When you read threads about Homeless people (that aren't good-looking) scoring girls and getting laid, that pretty much debunks 'social proof', 'class', or whatever, or people in jail convincing charming female jail guards.....so what is their x-factor then?

Well I wouldn't believe those stories in the first place. I never said SP is an x factor. It is one result of having the x factor. But if a homeless person attracts women his x factor would be the same as what I explained in this thread, expressiveness and maybe symmetry.

 

[schttrj]

guys, we are talking about x-factor.... and u all are going to find the causes of attraction. what is the x-factor? x-factor is when a person goes out in a group with his friend, he gets noticed out immediately and there is kind of casual attraction starting on from that very moment. here i wanna say something, havent u met somebody (im talking of a guy) who is kind of just fascinating, he pulls u in... in whatever he does, just like that. let me tell u something, x-factor is not specifically in relating to the opposite sex. i can bet my last dollar that u have met somebody in ur family or among ur friends, who u just start liking instantly, the way he looks, the way he moves, the way he talks, he as a person, in his every actions and behaviour, he either looks like brad pitt or he is either simon webbe, or the sober version of tommy lee jones, he is just pulling u towards him and u would see taht every one says they like him, or taht he is good or so. THAT IS THE X-FACTOR. well, well, well.... here u should found out, that its not looks, not symmetry, not expression but the whole package, i was talking of..... ie teh ALPHA MAN. Believe me, i have been with a lot of alphas, in friends and some alpha bros too, who just pull u in like taht. they can come in any personality or any looks, what they do is they stand out from the others adn are very cool in overall. thats what they are. this is what i call the x-factor is.

and guys, i need a reply on my opinion, if any of u agree or disagree with me...

 

[Señor Fingers]

Keto,

I think your analysis is sound when we are talking about first impressions.

I have watched how women react to men who just show up at a venue, and it usually goes down like this.

1. Look at the face, most importantly the eyes. Is there a devious glint? Does he shy away from their gaze? Is he well-groomed? Symmetry and good looks help a great deal here.

2. Look at clothes. Is he a slob? A hipster? What is his style? Most women are forgiving of this particular scan if all the other elements are in place.. they would be thrilled to make you their personal fashion project if you are hot.

3. Look at shoes. I'm not sure exactly why, but women have a footwear fetish. If you are rocking some stylish kicks, that's extra brownie points for you.

4. Look at you SEXUALLY. This is when they look at your physique, especially your ass. You don't need to be a bodybuilder or anything as women have very different ideals of a sexy body.. some like us wiry and thin, others like a little teddy bear chubb and some do go for the buff, this is probably where tastes are most wide and varied. In general, if your shoulders are wider than your hips (v-shape torso) and you are not deformed, then you are fair game.

A woman goes through all of the above and assigns you a rating in about 3 seconds.

Now where a lot of guys get lost is in thinking that this rating is set in stone.

THIS IS PURE AND UTTER BULLSH!T!

You can dramatically increase your sex appeal DRAMATICALLY in a myriad of ways. You can go from a 6 to a 10 if you have any of the following working to your advantage:

Social Prowess
How do you handle yourself around other people? Do you actively steer conversations, or are you passive and quiet? Is it common for you to network and introduce people? How often do you find yourself just vibing in a social setting?

Emotional Intelligence
How well do you understand people? Are you able read their facial expressions, voice tone and body language and deduce the 90% of what they are really communicating? Are you good at getting people to open up, or do you usually talk about mundane topics like the weather?

Contagious wit & charm
Are you mentally quick on your feet? Do people belly laugh around you naturally? Do you find that most folks just want to be around you? Are you the "life of the party"?

Sense of Adventure
Are you a spontaneous being who is not afraid of taking risks? Do you frequently organize trips for yourself and your friends? When was the last time you said "fukk it" and did something truly unexpected?

Purpose & Ambition
Where are you going in life? What are your dreams and aspirations? What are you doing RIGHT NOW to make them happen?

Sincerity & Humility
How honest are you with yourself and the people around you? Do you find yourself filtering your thoughts out of fear of what people will think? Or do you run to the other extreme and cut people down with your truths?

Intelligence
Are you a flaming dumb-ass who just watches television and plays X-Box all day? Read any good books, lately? Are you constantly learning something new and valuable?

A woman can determine many of these things about you in a very short span of time. Spend a full day with her and she has a pretty good idea of how "hot" you are. You can turn up the heat as she unravels you and discovers more hidden treasures over time, but for the most part all she needs a few hours to gauge her attraction.

On the flip side of all this, I would say that the same applies for men (except we notice and play greater importance on the physical by far). I've dated plenty of girls who weren't "my type" just because I found them to be intriguing, or the chemistry was impossible to ignore.

Ultimately, I think it's kind of silly to try and encompass something as subjective and complicated as the nature of attraction into a comfortable little package. Human nature thrives off variety, and the differences between us all (personal tastes, beliefs, attitudes) will be the ultimate x-factor, stirring this pot of chaos we call seduction.

 

[schttrj]

Keto,

I think your analysis is sound when we are talking about first impressions.

I have watched how women react to men who just show up at a venue, and it usually goes down like this.

1. Look at the face, most importantly the eyes. Is there a devious glint? Does he shy away from their gaze? Is he well-groomed? Symmetry and good looks help a great deal here.

2. Look at clothes. Is he a slob? A hipster? What is his style? Most women are forgiving of this particular scan if all the other elements are in place.. they would be thrilled to make you their personal fashion project if you are hot.

3. Look at shoes. I'm not sure exactly why, but women have a footwear fetish. If you are rocking some stylish kicks, that's extra brownie points for you.

4. Look at you SEXUALLY. This is when they look at your physique, especially your ass. You don't need to be a bodybuilder or anything as women have very different ideals of a sexy body.. some like us wiry and thin, others like a little teddy bear chubb and some do go for the buff, this is probably where tastes are most wide and varied. In general, if your shoulders are wider than your hips (v-shape torso) and you are not deformed, then you are fair game.

A woman goes through all of the above and assigns you a rating in about 3 seconds.

Now where a lot of guys get lost is in thinking that this rating is set in stone.

THIS IS PURE AND UTTER BULLSH!T!

You can dramatically increase your sex appeal DRAMATICALLY in a myriad of ways. You can go from a 6 to a 10 if you have any of the following working to your advantage:

Social Prowess
How do you handle yourself around other people? Do you actively steer conversations, or are you passive and quiet? Is it common for you to network and introduce people? How often do you find yourself just vibing in a social setting?

Emotional Intelligence
How well do you understand people? Are you able read their facial expressions, voice tone and body language and deduce the 90% of what they are really communicating? Are you good at getting people to open up, or do you usually talk about mundane topics like the weather?

Contagious wit & charm
Are you mentally quick on your feet? Do people belly laugh around you naturally? Do you find that most folks just want to be around you? Are you the "life of the party"?

Sense of Adventure
Are you a spontaneous being who is not afraid of taking risks? Do you frequently organize trips for yourself and your friends? When was the last time you said "fukk it" and did something truly unexpected?

Purpose & Ambition
Where are you going in life? What are your dreams and aspirations? What are you doing RIGHT NOW to make them happen?

Sincerity & Humility
How honest are you with yourself and the people around you? Do you find yourself filtering your thoughts out of fear of what people will think? Or do you run to the other extreme and cut people down with your truths?

Intelligence
Are you a flaming dumb-ass who just watches television and plays X-Box all day? Read any good books, lately? Are you constantly learning something new and valuable?

A woman can determine many of these things about you in a very short span of time. Spend a full day with her and she has a pretty good idea of how "hot" you are. You can turn up the heat as she unravels you and discovers more hidden treasures over time, but for the most part all she needs a few hours to gauge her attraction.

On the flip side of all this, I would say that the same applies for men (except we notice and play greater importance on the physical by far). I've dated plenty of girls who weren't "my type" just because I found them to be intriguing, or the chemistry was impossible to ignore.

Ultimately, I think it's kind of silly to try and encompass something as subjective and complicated as the nature of attraction into a comfortable little package. Human nature thrives off variety, and the differences between us all (personal tastes, beliefs, attitudes) will be the ultimate x-factor, stirring this pot of chaos we call seduction.

really well put.

 

[Mad Manic]

I agree with there being different levels, primary, secondary and tertiary, but I disagree with what you are placing in the layers. I put the x factors at the primary level. Ethnicity isn't primary because I know guys of every ethnicity that do well with women. Class and SP is more a result of having primary than the cause. Another example, as long as you are near average height, height would be tertiary, because I know shorter guys who out perform tall guys all the time.

I don't believe you know chinese and indian guys who take attractive white women to bed, sorry. Not unless they are seriously compensating in a huge way with other stuff. But Social Proof, Race and Class IMO go in the primary category.

Why?

Do the popular guys with tons of friends in the cool groups get laid? Yes, usually.
Do all the statistics show that people date and marry within their race and class? Yes, they do.

So ethnicity, class and social proof make up the top layer.

Second layer is height, looks, health etc. These things are considered important and people spend a lot of time and effort trying to improve these things. With improvement comes progress but sometimes it's not enough if you don't satisfy primary layer factors.

Third layer is muscles, game, intellect etc. Although it's good to improve these things, rarely do they bag women on their own without satisfying primary/secondary criteria unless you really succeed in one of these things. e.g.) An incredible jaw dropping physique, being an awesome seducer or being so clever you can do so many things etc.

MM

 

[Mad Manic]

Facial symmetry? **** I can't think of anyone I know who doesn't have a symmetrical face really. But not everyone I know is good with women!!

This is a very strange theory to say the least.

It's to do with ratios between the features of the face, apparently there are optimum ratios that we percieve as most attractive.

MM

 

[schttrj]

I don't believe you know chinese and indian guys who take attractive white women to bed, sorry. Not unless they are seriously compensating in a huge way with other stuff. But Social Proof, Race and Class IMO go in the primary category.

Why?

Do the popular guys with tons of friends in the cool groups get laid? Yes, usually.
Do all the statistics show that people date and marry within their race and class? Yes, they do.

So ethnicity, class and social proof make up the top layer.

Second layer is height, looks, health etc. These things are considered important and people spend a lot of time and effort trying to improve these things. With improvement comes progress but sometimes it's not enough if you don't satisfy primary layer factors.

Third layer is muscles, game, intellect etc. Although it's good to improve these things, rarely do they bag women on their own without satisfying primary/secondary criteria unless you really succeed in one of these things. e.g.) An incredible jaw dropping physique, being an awesome seducer or being so clever you can do so many things etc.

MM

just would like to say, why are you talking about ethnicity and all? first, tell me, how many of u are so successful in ur homeplace that u need to go out of ur country to get different ethnic girls? and then again, a charmer is a charmer. no arguments or debates here, discussion allowed here i think. thats why my sis still tells me that george clooney is cool or why aishwarya rai, an indian, became miss universe. if u dont know her search her in teh google. it is the same thing, x-factor or that what it is called, that pulls everybody in. havent u ever seen black boys with white girlfriends? now, if u all are going to say, i want to become a PUA that can pick up any girl, then u are doomed to fail. nobody can charm every girl. but definitely u can double ur dating number by getting a game or if u have the x-factor, u have an advantage.

 

[wolf116]

I know an Indian guy who is quite good at bedding good looking white chicks. The thing is, he doesn't act Indian at all. He is pure Indian without the accent and looks cool. He is not special in any way, just an out of shape student. He succeeds by blending in to the culture and having no fear of rejection. He follows the mystery method model and is currently in a relationship with a hottie.

Anyway, race is not an X factor as the biggest pimp I have ever known is a half cast islander.

 

[ketostix]

I don't believe you know chinese and indian guys who take attractive white women to bed, sorry. Not unless they are seriously compensating in a huge way with other stuff. But Social Proof, Race and Class IMO go in the primary category.

I do know an Indian guy who picks up more attractive white women than just about anyone. I'm not so sure why they have to be white but anyway. No one gives a sh!t what your ethnicity, well at least most white women don't, they are the least "loyal" to their race. If you're smooth and expressive, in other words have the x factor, you will do as good as a white guy.

Why?

Do the popular guys with tons of friends in the cool groups get laid? Yes, usually.
Do all the statistics show that people date and marry within their race and class? Yes, they do.

Well then date and marry within your rce and stop complaining. Oh I know you're going to say "people date and marry within their race" then you're going to turn around and contradict yourself and say white guys get all your women.

So ethnicity, class and social proof make up the top layer.

Man if most asians date asians etc. Do you think these other ethnicities look up to the white race. That's ridiculous. Regardless of your ethnicity if you're smooth and expresive you will have SP.

Second layer is height, looks, health etc. These things are considered important and people spend a lot of time and effort trying to improve these things. With improvement comes progress but sometimes it's not enough if you don't satisfy primary layer factors.

I've already debunked the height and to some degree looks argument at the start of this thread. That was the whole point of this thread. So we will continue to disagree. Howver I will say health is a big part of being smooth and expressive so I'll agree that health or better the perception of being healthy is in the top layer.

Third layer is muscles, game, intellect etc. Although it's good to improve these things, rarely do they bag women on their own without satisfying primary/secondary criteria unless you really succeed in one of these things. e.g.) An incredible jaw dropping physique, being an awesome seducer or being so clever you can do so many things etc.

MM

OK I don't disagree that these things are tertiary, but I believe if you really have the primary stuff down all you need is a little of the secondary and none of the tertiary to do well. We just disagree on what all is necessary and at what level of importance things that are need fall.

 

[ketostix]

I know an Indian guy who is quite good at bedding good looking white chicks. The thing is, he doesn't act Indian at all. He is pure Indian without the accent and looks cool. He is not special in any way, just an out of shape student. He succeeds by blending in to the culture and having no fear of rejection. He follows the mystery method model and is currently in a relationship with a hottie.

Anyway, race is not an X factor as the biggest pimp I have ever known is a half cast islander.

As I just told MM I know of an Indian guy that is similar, but he just won't hear of it.

 

[ketostix]

Keto,

I think your analysis is sound when we are talking about first impressions.

I have watched how women react to men who just show up at a venue, and it usually goes down like this.

1. Look at the face, most importantly the eyes. Is there a devious glint? Does he shy away from their gaze? Is he well-groomed? Symmetry and good looks help a great deal here.

2. Look at clothes. Is he a slob? A hipster? What is his style? Most women are forgiving of this particular scan if all the other elements are in place.. they would be thrilled to make you their personal fashion project if you are hot.

3. Look at shoes. I'm not sure exactly why, but women have a footwear fetish. If you are rocking some stylish kicks, that's extra brownie points for you.

4. Look at you SEXUALLY. This is when they look at your physique, especially your ass. You don't need to be a bodybuilder or anything as women have very different ideals of a sexy body.. some like us wiry and thin, others like a little teddy bear chubb and some do go for the buff, this is probably where tastes are most wide and varied. In general, if your shoulders are wider than your hips (v-shape torso) and you are not deformed, then you are fair game.

A woman goes through all of the above and assigns you a rating in about 3 seconds.

Now where a lot of guys get lost is in thinking that this rating is set in stone.

THIS IS PURE AND UTTER BULLSH!T!

You can dramatically increase your sex appeal DRAMATICALLY in a myriad of ways. You can go from a 6 to a 10 if you have any of the following working to your advantage:

Social Prowess
How do you handle yourself around other people? Do you actively steer conversations, or are you passive and quiet? Is it common for you to network and introduce people? How often do you find yourself just vibing in a social setting?

Emotional Intelligence
How well do you understand people? Are you able read their facial expressions, voice tone and body language and deduce the 90% of what they are really communicating? Are you good at getting people to open up, or do you usually talk about mundane topics like the weather?

Contagious wit & charm
Are you mentally quick on your feet? Do people belly laugh around you naturally? Do you find that most folks just want to be around you? Are you the "life of the party"?

Sense of Adventure
Are you a spontaneous being who is not afraid of taking risks? Do you frequently organize trips for yourself and your friends? When was the last time you said "fukk it" and did something truly unexpected?

Purpose & Ambition
Where are you going in life? What are your dreams and aspirations? What are you doing RIGHT NOW to make them happen?

Sincerity & Humility
How honest are you with yourself and the people around you? Do you find yourself filtering your thoughts out of fear of what people will think? Or do you run to the other extreme and cut people down with your truths?

Intelligence
Are you a flaming dumb-ass who just watches television and plays X-Box all day? Read any good books, lately? Are you constantly learning something new and valuable?

A woman can determine many of these things about you in a very short span of time. Spend a full day with her and she has a pretty good idea of how "hot" you are. You can turn up the heat as she unravels you and discovers more hidden treasures over time, but for the most part all she needs a few hours to gauge her attraction.

On the flip side of all this, I would say that the same applies for men (except we notice and play greater importance on the physical by far). I've dated plenty of girls who weren't "my type" just because I found them to be intriguing, or the chemistry was impossible to ignore.

Ultimately, I think it's kind of silly to try and encompass something as subjective and complicated as the nature of attraction into a comfortable little package. Human nature thrives off variety, and the differences between us all (personal tastes, beliefs, attitudes) will be the ultimate x-factor, stirring this pot of chaos we call seduction.

OK I'm not saying those things you've mentioned are bad at all but you are taking things way off from the focus on the fundamental thing(s) a guy must have to create attraction. I believe if you have these fundamentals then you don't need a laundry list of everything else. And conversely, if you don't have the fundamentals you won't get the opportunity to showcase every other quality you have and they won't gain you much anyway besides getting in the friends zone.

 

[DonGorgon]

And the worst part is I'm not even talking about looks really.

ooh and we are not supposed to talk about race either. :nervous:

 

[schttrj]

gosh! this post is just going to a confusion!

keto, what do u mean by x-factor urself? is it anything that causes attraction that you can act upon or is it one magical thing that u dont know what is happening but ladies just are drawn towards him?

guys, u all also answer please.

 

[StevenR]

There was this "mask" that some social scientists used to measure facial symmetry, and I measured myself as per their directions and I fit the mask fairly well. I also seem to have hands and feet that are more symmetrical than average. I have never had to worry about trying on both shoes to make sure they fit like other people apparently do. That being said, I am not "in the good with women" category at all. I am what you guys call an AFC.