The Secret To A Healthy Relationship

[joekerr31]

the only thing im saying is that men who handle their own sh*t do well in life.

men who need their woman to 'talk it out' with typically are AFCs and get screwed.

wanna talk about your insecurities, fears, anxieties, etc.? go have a beer with your buddies, call up your mom, whatever. do NOT have these conversations with your significant other.

women want a man who leads, who is a protector - the more you yack about stuff that suggests you aren't these things, the more are asking for big trouble in your relationshiop.

chics like iqqi will tell you that what they want is a man who is open to sharing. but as millions of guys will attest to... these same women are repulsed when their man actually does show them their weaknesses.

iqqi posts stuff on here all the time that contradicts itself. in other posts she tells guys to suck it up, stop being a baby, women don't want to hear that crap, they want a strong man. then the next post its women want men who share their feelings, who are their best friend, etc.

I like iqqi, but her advice is all over the map half the time.

love your woman, enjoy your woman, do things together, talk about life and future plans - BUT FOR HEAVEN'S SAKE - keep your damn insecurities, anxieties, etc. to yourself!

1) she can't help you with them and
2) its PATHETIC if a man has to turn to a woman to 'find his inner strength'. you might as well write a letter to Richard Simmons asking him for guidance.

 

[reset]

I would just hope that when the going gets tough, the chick is supportive. Even if you're not yapping about what's bugging you, you don't want a girl who gives you a hard time if you're not in the best mood.

 

[joekerr31]

I would just hope that when the going gets tough, the chick is supportive. Even if you're not yapping about what's bugging you, you don't want a girl who gives you a hard time if you're not in the best mood.

im not saying you have to hide your mood, just not turn to her to fix it.

what i've found is that almost all women are more than happy to make you feel better through sex, massages, doing whatever you want, giving you space, cooking for you, etc.

what i've also found, and admittedly this is from my younger days, is that when you share your problems too much with a woman, they dont really know how to respond.

as men we aren't looking to just 'vent', we are looking to take action. women on the other hand just vent.

so typically when men 'share' with their woman, it just leads to frustration because she rarely offers any advice on what to do. heck, thats one of the turn ons about a man to a woman, that they take action, know what to do, etc.

there are too many men today acting like woman and then getting actual women (like iqqi) patting them on the back saying 'keep up the good work'. meanwhile those same women are off banging guys like latinoman who has his sh*t together.

 

[joekerr31]

oh let me make this even simplier.

when a man shares his insecurities, fears, etc. with a woman, its kind of the equivalent to when a woman doesn't shave her legs or armpits.

when it happens now and then, you can live with it. but when it starts happening regularly, it can be a deal breaker.

hey, its not fair, but thats life. no matter how much you love a woman, if shes got hairy legs you'll probably leave her at some point. just like a woman might love you, but if you're a charlie brown too much, she will walk out on you.

as men we say we want a natural woman. as long as she is natural AND beautiful (by natural we dont mean hairy legs). similarly, women want a sensitive man, as long as he is sensitive AND strong (by sensitive they mean sensitive to their emotions, not open about their fears, insecurities, etc.). show too much weakness around just about any woman and i'm telling ya, they will get tired of it fast. because while they come home to a wimpy man, they see Sally come home to Latinoman and wonder why they got stuck with the wussy.

 

[reset]

when a man shares his insecurities, fears, etc. with a woman, its kind of the equivalent to when a woman doesn't shave her legs or armpits...

:crackup:

Yeah I get it. I'll settle for the sex, massages, and cooking. Being a former matrix guy, I did my share of opening up and talking about my problems and everything, (like charlie brown visiting lucy's 5 cent psychiatrist booth) and you become their girlfriend at that point. I see now why that is just not the natural order of things. I don't think guys should be encouraged to be more sensitive and open about their feelings, unless they are so strong in themselves that they don't care, and in that case, the feeings they are expressing are more likely to be strong and rational anyway.

This all comes from men needing female validation, you have to move away from that. I'm at the point where I prefer to not talk about deep stuff with chicks anymore. That's what you guys are for. I feel better about it.

 

[LovelyLady]

Gentlemen, I have here the secret to having a healthy relationship with a woman and it doesn't involve spewing any testosterone or beating ones chest.

hmm.... I don't know about that...


I kinda' like a man who oozes testosterone and beats his chest.

 

[reset]

There was an interesting link here recently, but I cannot find it, it was about how "talking about the relationship" was counter-productive.

But in a nutshell I think the essence was what joekerr said.

edit--here it is.

http://www.sosuave.net/forum/showthread.php?t=141908

 

[The Bat]

joekerr's got it. Don't whine, complain, or moan about your problems to your woman. In fact, don't do that to anybody.

I can't tell you how many times guys come up to me and do exactly that. The best part of the whole interaction is that I solve their problem in under 5 minutes. "Oh, you hate your professor? Well, study hard and work hard.....Oh, you hate your boss? Well, work hard.....Oh, you hate your father? Look it, he could've choose to not fed/shelter/clothe you when he had the chance, but he didn't...." Do you see where I'm going with this?

A man makes a(ny) relationship fun, exciting, and adventurous. He doesn't turn into a weekly Dr. Phil session. He acts. There is a reason why they say, "Actions speak louder than words."

 

[joekerr31]

There was an interesting link here recently, but I cannot find it, it was about how "talking about the relationship" was counter-productive.

But in a nutshell I think the essence was what joekerr said.

see, all this sh*t about women helping men all started with that stupid f*cking movie, i forget which one it was, with jack nicholson, where he tells some chic 'you make me want to be a better man.'

after that it was like guys started to think that somehow their maturation as a man had something to do with women. that they had some secret insight into life and could help a man become better.

give me a f*cking break.

http://youtube.com/watch?v=4aqomiIo2Ug

i wish im with busey was still on - it was a great show. busey took a total AFC and tried to teach him how to live life like a man.

 

[Phyzzle]

Wow, an actual line-in-the-sand definite disagreement between the sosuave way and that other way.

I am firmly against talking about fears and insecurities (if any) with a woman I'm interested in, unless there is some practical reason for doing so. Any female will admit that it's easily possible to overdo it. And yet, underdoing it doesn't seem to be any sort of danger.

If you're afraid of heights, just tell your S.O. that you don't like heights. No need to go into therapeutic detail.

"So your dislike of heights is NOT a deep-seated fear based on traumatic childhood events? Yeah, we need some space to take a break from each other." WTF no woman is going to say that!! No woman is going to loose interest because of the absence of insecurities.

 

[Colossus]

the only thing im saying is that men who handle their own sh*t do well in life.

men who need their woman to 'talk it out' with typically are AFCs and get screwed.

wanna talk about your insecurities, fears, anxieties, etc.? go have a beer with your buddies, call up your mom, whatever. do NOT have these conversations with your significant other.

women want a man who leads, who is a protector - the more you yack about stuff that suggests you aren't these things, the more are asking for big trouble in your relationshiop.

chics like iqqi will tell you that what they want is a man who is open to sharing. but as millions of guys will attest to... these same women are repulsed when their man actually does show them their weaknesses.

iqqi posts stuff on here all the time that contradicts itself. in other posts she tells guys to suck it up, stop being a baby, women don't want to hear that crap, they want a strong man. then the next post its women want men who share their feelings, who are their best friend, etc.

I like iqqi, but her advice is all over the map half the time.

love your woman, enjoy your woman, do things together, talk about life and future plans - BUT FOR HEAVEN'S SAKE - keep your damn insecurities, anxieties, etc. to yourself!

1) she can't help you with them and
2) its PATHETIC if a man has to turn to a woman to 'find his inner strength'. you might as well write a letter to Richard Simmons asking him for guidance.

I agree with Joekerr and Phyzzle.

This recent influx of Loveshackers is ripely apparent in some of these posts; which is good because things can get stale around here. And there is nothing more fun than squashing an AFC viewpoint.

The OP is partially correct--communication is the key to a healthy relationship, once you have rectified your own masculinity and chosen the appropriate woman.

I used to be part of the camp that advocated sharing all your insecurities, fears, sorrows, etc with your woman. It's a slippery slope, boys. The effect of these conversations has a cumulative, counter-intuitive effect. You think that through intimate disclosure of your weaknesses you are going to build strength and trust in the relationship, but instead you create a power disparity. She eventually stops looking to you as the protector--the point of strength--and starts to see you as a partner; an analog in the relationship equation where the power (leadership) can flow to either side.

Let me give you a little anecdote. A year or so back I was in boxing club here at school. I had decent skills, but i wasnt that experienced with sparring. There was a new member that had some considerable ring experience, and he always wanted to spar. So i obliged him one night, being the only other heavyweight in the club at the time.

The first go-around we only traded bodyshots (no mouthguards), and i was clearly outmatched. I guarded well, but he was a big kid who hit hard. I was glad i forgot my mouthguard that night. After that this guy wanted to spar all the time, and frankly i was a bit nervous. I knew i would probably get my as$ handed to me, and i couldnt dodge it forever. So one night i told my gf about it; more or less spilled my insecurities to her about getting my as$ whooped in front of the whole club.. We only talked about it for a few minutes, but i got the distinct feeling that she respected me a little bit less after that.

I actually never ended up sparring the guy after that; he left the club and i got busy with school. The point is you cant take all your fears and weaknesses to your girlfriend. They may say they want know them and help you, but they dont. The essence of a woman is beauty, and the essence of a man is his strength. If you spend enough time with a woman she is going to be fairly aware of your insecurities anyway. I used to pull self-disclosure crap like that all the time with her, and i learned that some things are better discussed with someone else. Be it a mentor, a buddy, a parent, or whoever. I think it's imperative for a man to have a solid network of outside, man-to-man support. Iron sharpens iron. Women CANNOT bestow masculinity. They can arouse what's already there, but a Man should deal with his own problems.

 

[Burrito Supreme]

The OP never mentioned discussing your weaknesses and fears ... He simply said COMMUNICATE!

He didnt tell you to ***** and whine and cry, he just said to TALK if there is a problem in the relationship!

It is so much better to talk about things rather than shout and scream and call names

Thanks Lishy.

Some people can't read apparently and like to draw out their own conclusions.

My guess is that those who disagree with me have tried to be nice in the past but were too nice and it backfired.

Huge difference between the two.

 

[reset]

That busey stuff is great, hadn't seen the show before.

 

[Nighthawk]

Thanks Lishy.

Some people can't read apparently and like to draw out their own conclusions.

My guess is that those who disagree with me have tried to be nice in the past but were too nice and it backfired.

Huge difference between the two.

Perhaps you could read some of Lishy's posts at Loveshack where she obsesses over guys that don't communicate and are emotionally distant.

 

[reset]

Perhaps you could read some of Lishy's posts at Loveshack where she obsesses over guys that don't communicate and are emotionally distant.

This seems to be the theme, and I'm not posting about Lishy necessarily. They say they want one thing, yet who are they WITH? Guys who they can't figure out, and who push all their buttons.

Now, I once asked for female advice online, and I got "be yourself, tell her how you feel, don't hide what you're thinking, let her know how serious you are about her, etc." And this lady was great and supportive and very genuine and I appreciated that she seemed to care. But at the same time, she was completely obsessed and couldn't stop talking about a guy who would not return her calls, who she thought only wanted her for sex. Then she asked me why he was being so aloof. And I basically told her, the guy knows what he wants and he's doing his thing and it's driving you nuts.

So, lesson learned.

 

[My Name is Nobody]

Perhaps you could read some of Lishy's posts at Loveshack where she obsesses over guys that don't communicate and are emotionally distant.

Well that speaks a thousand words right there.

 

[Phyzzle]

Some people can't read apparently and like to draw out their own conclusions.

Ahem.

If you want a long and healthy relationship, then you have to open up to your partner and part of that opening up is exposing your weaknesses to her

What conclusions might we draw from this?

Indeed, Lishy, you have a bit of a crush on a guy right now. Can you list out the fears and insecurities he's told you about? I'm guessing he hasn't told you about any, yet notice that you remain attracted to him.

 

[Mr. Me]

The OP never mentioned discussing your weaknesses and fears ... He simply said COMMUNICATE!

Lishy, then you missed where the OP posted this:

"part of that opening up is exposing your weaknesses to her"

BurritoSupreme's message about communication is actually poorly communicated. Being civil in discussing matters is being called "communication", when it's more about the mode of communication or how someone communicates, since screaming also aptly falls under the umbrella of "communication". Burrito also confuses being "open" with "communication". Two different things.

Burrito's post is as if I were to discuss how to become a virtuoso at the piano and posted "It's all about musical notes!"

 

[Commando]

This seems to be the theme, and I'm not posting about Lishy necessarily. They say they want one thing, yet who are they WITH? Guys who they can't figure out, and who push all their buttons.

True, you do see that from time to time. I guess that is why a typical afc will become embittered and convinced that women prefer jerks. Extreme button pusher.

Parterships like that are toxic in their very nature. There is something broken in each person that fuels the attraction and often those relationships are short lived, full of drama and usually end badly.

Genuine communication backed up with principles and core values, is a good suggestion. Mutual respect. It should work both ways and it does in the most fulfilling relationships. If you are not seeing that then bail and avoid the unneccessary drama.

Whether that relationship lasts or not, even in a fwb situation. Even if it does end you should be able walk away with your dignity in tact and with the self respect that you did not compromise yourself or not assert your beliefs, worries, and concerns when you had them.

 

[reset]

True, you do see that from time to time. I guess that is why a typical afc will become embittered and convinced that women prefer jerks. Extreme button pusher.

True, but here we talk about being more of a self-actualized man. I think that biterness period is totally appopriate. How else is a guy supposed to react when he realizes that he believed a lie? Women told him one thing, he figured "ok I'll do what they say", then those same women tell him "I see you as a friend". So, he knows what's happening. He's opening up, being too emotional and sensitive, and what he thought the outcome would be, backfires.

So the natrual conclusion is, do more of what works, and less of what doesn't. And at first, it's going from one extreme to the next. Totally normal to go from afc to jerk.

Then, eventually (hopefully, this is the stage I'm at) the guy realizes there's really nothing to be "bitter" about. This is reality. It's nature. Women are attracted to guys who are masculine and who they can't figure out. That's just how it is. They are being women. It's natural. Nothing to be bitter about.

The bitterness, I think, is more of a self-hatred at being gullible. Once the guy learns to accept himself, he learns to operate in reality, and not be mad at women. He just has to do things differently, and the result of that is more rewarding relationships.