The Nice Guy Myth

Razor Sharp

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Great Article!

There are any number of geek guys running around out there without the love and companionship that many people and all golden retrievers deserve. Sometimes these guys sit down and try to figure out why they’re living a life devoid of love, romance, sex and discussions about whose hair it is in the shower drain.

They undertake a deep self-assessment, questioning all their long-cherished beliefs about themselves, and this is what they conclude: They’re too nice. And that’s hilarious!

Guys, you’re not “too nice.” That’s like saying you can’t get seated at an L.A. restaurant because you’re too famous.

I know lots of nice guys, fellows who are much nicer than me, and nearly all of them have what ’70s-era singer-songwriters call “special ladies.” Seriously, even guys that in college struck me as the sort that would have trouble sweet-talking a hand towel and a bottle of lotion into bed are married with offspring that are, presumably, theirs.

I also know tremendous jerks with girlfriends, but that just proves there’s someone for everyone.

I mean, let’s concede right here that there are people of all available genders who are messed up in the brainpan and because of this are only into people who treat them poorly. These folks are, thankfully, in the minority. They’re also not the sort of people you want to be dating. Self-loathing people are actually kind of a pain to be around.

Which brings us back to you! Given that nice guys get bedded and/or wedded all the time, you must have a more specific problem than that. Here are some specific behaviors I have witnessed in guys who think they’re “too nice” when actually they’re “unpleasant.” Is this you?

For some reason, you think “nice” means “completely devoid of sexual energy.” When you’re attracted to someone, you treat her like you’re her brother. Her brother the priest. Her brother the elderly Victorian priest who is actually a large stuffed animal. Then when some guy comes along and does a little thoughtful flirting and actually gets her attention, you think “Man, that guy’s a jerkface.”

When you say you’re trying to figure out “what women want,” you actually mean you’re trying to figure out what this one specific woman you’re friends with and have had a crush on for three years wants. (That one’s easy, by the way. The answer is “not you.” Now move on.)

You don’t know many women. Having been passed on by the six or seven ladyfolks you see on a regular basis, you are now ready to assume that all women are deeply broken individuals who don’t know what’s good for them. Somehow you think that treating all women as freely interchangable mentally damaged goods is compatible with being “nice.”

You’re one of those guys who wishes he lived in the Arthurian era — which is to say an era that never actually existed — and who actually uses the word prithee. You practice some sort of demented Hollywood version of chivalry. When women are creeped out by this, you assume they don’t like nice guys, rather than assuming more accurately that they have no desire to get involved with your little love-LARP.

You’re not actually nice. Ask yourself this question: All these nice, thoughtful things you do for women you have crushes on, do you do them for your friends whose panties you don’t want to chew off? Do you remember everyone’s favorite pizza topping? Listen to them ***** about work? Tell them when you see something neat on ThinkGeek that you think they’d like? Getting extra attention from someone who’s generally nice is flattering. Sitting under the laserlike niceness focus of someone who’s usually oblivious is actually pretty unnerving.

Finally, the most common affliction: searing, blinding desperation. There’s a big, inviting grassy area between being a schmuck and being an Alpha Jerk, and it’s called “self-confidence.” It’s nice for picnics! Seriously, if there’s any one thing that’s universally attractive to men, women and intersexed individuals of any and all types, it’s confidence. People like people who like being the people they are. The sort of guys who worry about being “too nice” don’t want to be who they are. They want to be Someone’s Boyfriend, as if that will solve all their personal problems. That’s as off-putting as real, true niceness is attractive.
Read More http://www.wired.com/underwire/2010...Wired:+Index+3+(Top+Stories+2))#ixzz0pJRH7wLl
 

DanelMadr

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Hmmm,

I have to say that most of the married guys I know are really truly AFCs.
Why?
Because they slept and married the first or second girl she gave them her pvssy.
And she gave them her pvssy because he was waaay above her league...he did not dig her and therefore acted like a DJ - not needy, nervous babbling chump.
These guys just panicked and married. And they are frustrated now with a girl they don't really like. And their girls eventually find out they are in core AFCs/weak, they start nagging and disrespecting him....boom divorce.

Some guys I know married a girl they found attractive. Mainly they knew each other for a long time, she was a virgin and no one is total weak all the time and they make some dough. How I know these guys? They are those extremely jealous boyfriends of girls I meet in clubs.

If I was desperate enough I could get married tomorrow, I believe. Just call one of the numbers girls /I'm not so much into/ gave me. I don't think I'm too picky though....just don't want to make a mistake most dudes do. Don't panic.
 

Trunks

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You’re not actually nice. Ask yourself this question: All these nice, thoughtful things you do for women you have crushes on, do you do them for your friends whose panties you don’t want to chew off?
Yes, I actually do, and I hate when people make this generalization that ALL of the so-called "nice guys" (in reality the only people who call themselves that are chumps) are really *******s in disguise who do nice things to cover up for the fact that they want pu$$y. Not everyone is putting on an act.

That being said, as a rAFC, I can tell you the problem is not being nice, but not being assertive. Women never give a wuss a second chance. And to muddy the waters even more, they reject wimps by saying "you're nice, but I see you as a friend", which only leads the AFC in the wrong direction as to why he effed up.
 

Lexington

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I agree with that article. But I don't think that when most people in the "community" are referring to "the nice guy" they mean a guy who happens to be nice. They usually mean a guy who is, as the article stated, devoid of sexual energy; basically a guy who tries to backdoor it into a girl's pants. This guy just comes off as creepy because he is hiding his intentions.

I don't think many people on these forums advocate being a d-bag or not being kind. They advise people to stop being doormats, to have some self-respect and to be upfront with their intentions.
 

Razor Sharp

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DanelMadr said:
Hmmm,

I have to say that most of the married guys I know are really truly AFCs.
Why?
Because they slept and married the first or second girl she gave them her pvssy.
And she gave them her pvssy because he was waaay above her league...he did not dig her and therefore acted like a DJ - not needy, nervous babbling chump.
These guys just panicked and married. And they are frustrated now with a girl they don't really like. And their girls eventually find out they are in core AFCs/weak, they start nagging and disrespecting him....boom divorce.

Some guys I know married a girl they found attractive. Mainly they knew each other for a long time, she was a virgin and no one is total weak all the time and they make some dough. How I know these guys? They are those extremely jealous boyfriends of girls I meet in clubs.

If I was desperate enough I could get married tomorrow, I believe. Just call one of the numbers girls /I'm not so much into/ gave me. I don't think I'm too picky though....just don't want to make a mistake most dudes do. Don't panic.
I have a good friend who is intelligent, fit and looks a lot like George Clooney. But his game sucks - actually scratch that, he has no game! GIrls are into him when they meet but as soon as he opens his mouth its game over.

Years ago he joined the Air Force and got deployed to Iraq. Before leaving he hastily got married to the girl he lost his virginity to. She was cute, but a terrible flirt with everyone and I told him to be careful, but "love" got the best of him and he got hitched.

Of course she cheated on him several times over, even offering me some of those sloppy seconds. I told him about it and like most people, he decided to shoot the messenger and completely cut me off. 2 years later he comes back from Iraq and calls me to apologize and all is fine. We stay in touch and soon enough he tells me he is getting married again and asks if I want to meet his fiancee. Of course I oblige and we meet.

Holy Jesus the H-Bastard Christ - this women was a warpig! Not a little battle piglet mind you, but a full-on, wild boar looking tank-b*tch with more rolls than Dunkin Donuts. It took a lot of self-control not to blurt out "ILLLL!!! ****in gross man - you are f*cking this whale???"

I played it suave though and kept an open mind. The chick turned out to be massively cool, funny and intelligent. I could see how she snagged him, but I cant figure out how he brings himself to hit that! They just had their first kid and seem happy. But I see his wandering eye when we go out and he sees a smoking hottie. Whatever you know - props to him for not being superficial and seeing someone's beauty beyond the physical, but dammit a man should have SOME standards!

I guess part of what plagues the "nice guy" is the fact that he doesn't believe he deserves any better and just takes "what he can get"

Trunks said:
Yes, I actually do, and I hate when people make this generalization that ALL of the so-called "nice guys" (in reality the only people who call themselves that are chumps) are really *******s in disguise who do nice things to cover up for the fact that they want pu$$y. Not everyone is putting on an act.
For me there is a difference between a nice guy, and a GOOD guy. The word nice is wimpy, and often refers to people who dont like to rock the boat, are polite and apologetic to a fault and generally lack backbone.

You are one of the good guys IMO - I am the same way and dont believe in special treatment for any person I dont know (hot or not). Unfortunately we are a rare breed and most guys do fall into the "nice" category - supplicating any way they can with their hidden agendas to trick women into their beds.
 

Maxtro

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I don't agree with that article. It just didn't click with me and I've been a "nice guy" my whole life.

The problem is that the world isn't black or white. There's middle ground between jerk and pushover nice guy.

I'm not a wimpy nice guy and I'm trying to be a good guy. The hard part is trying to develop good social skills from nothing and actually attract girls.
 

Razor Sharp

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@Rollo, I really dont care about the source, if something rings true it stands on its own. But I guess for some it may be relevant that the author is a comic book nerd, disclaimer duly noted :p

@Maxtro, I don't see how this article falls into black or white territory. The premise is simple - if you dont want to be considered too "nice" to be intimate with a woman, then you should not have ulterior motives or pretend that you are not a sexual being. However if faking your own androgeny is working out for you I'm sure it would make for some interesting reading.
 

zekko

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I agree with the article, and I think the quote from it below sums it up best:

They undertake a deep self-assessment, questioning all their long-cherished beliefs about themselves, and this is what they conclude: They’re too nice. And that’s hilarious!
I definitely believe this. The problem isn't that they're too nice, there's something else going on. To conclude that they're too nice is some sort of conceit and self delusion they have going on.

Like Maxtro said:
I'm not a wimpy nice guy and I'm trying to be a good guy. The hard part is trying to develop good social skills from nothing and actually attract girls.
See, the problem here is there are social skills that have to be developed. It's got nothing to do with being nice or not. I absolutely hate the term "nice guy" as used in the pickup community because it's so misleading. It encourages guys to want to go out and be jerks, when most of the time that just isn't what's necessary for them to get girls.
 

Maxtro

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Thanks zekko.

Now that I think about it, 'nice guy' is actually to broad of a term.

If anything I'm a, Trying hard but still kind of awkward guy.
 

Ease

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true niceness is attractive
So true.

All this time we should have been displaying our confidence by giving girls flowers. I knew it.
 

zekko

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All this time we should have been displaying our confidence by giving girls flowers. I knew it
Giving flowers has nothing to do with being nice. It's social conditioning and brainwashing by florists.
 
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