The Main Event: DJ's vs. Rules Girls!

[BGMan]

Hmmm... come to think of it, I do believe that yours truly is currently in a spar with a Rules gal; in fact, I have been for the last year (of course, I keep my options open

. That's the same one who gave me headaches a few months back.

I guess it's just something that I find attractive about her, the fact that she exhibits classic Rules behavior even while I do my best to DJ her. And, apparently, I'm the only one whom she has dated in the last year, even though I personally have seen several guys either hit on her or act smitten with her but unable to make a move. Heh heh! Of course, she'll do little things for me, and we'll do some light flirting occasionally (started by me, always), just to(I guess) keep me from dumping her a$$ totally. Sneaky, huh?

I don't know if she reads The Rules or is just a natural, but her behavior sort of makes me think, dang, what a woman! Just like DJ behavior makes them think, dang, what a man?!

Of course, I'm continuing DJ behavior on her (and others), so I'm not getting stupid. Maybe I'll get a copy of that Rules book too?

Cheers,
BGMan

[This message has been edited by BGMan (edited 05-23-2002).]

 

[aurora]

Blitz, can you elaborate on the inverse roller coaster method and how it works. Also, I had a recent bout with a Rules chick recently and it seems that unless one side gives in to the other at some point, it will never be possible to establish any kind of relationship. The scenario is as follows:
I was dating this hot chick who showed Rules tendencies, although I didn't know it at the time until after the fact (I too bought the book and read it). Although she too accepted dates and returned calls, she seemed distant and uninterested so I nexted her after the third date. After about two weeks, her pretentious behavior seemed to have evaporated overnight and she began to call and set up dates, etc. I thought she was playing me and didn't trust her intentions, so I just didn't give in and remained distant (Challenge). I followed Doc Love's advise that if a girl plays games, then that's a sign of low IL. I also read articles distinguishing the different types of chicks, i,e. strokers, attention *****s, professional daters, etc. and just assumed that she was one of these undesirables. The point is, I realize now that this girl probably was interested in me, but I misinterpreted her signals and blew her off prematurely. If I knew her game plan beforehand, then I would have called her bluff like Blitz did and maybe I would still be seeing this girl. Like Blitz, I DJed the hell out of this girl with great effect, but wasnt' sharp enough to realize that she was doing the same to me.

 

[wafer]

Originally posted by Master of the Universe:

At the moment she told that she needs to check her Rules, you had your confirmation that she was a Rules Girl.

>>And now you gain control of the situation


Another option that was available to you, would not have been to let her know you know her game plan. Think about it, when the Allied forces in WWII found out how to decode the German's Enigma messages, they could have called the German's on it. And had they done that, it surely would have created hell in the German's systems, but only for a short time until they came up with another coding method.

However, by keeping silent about their knowledge, the Allied forces knew exactly what the Germans were going to do in advance.

The same would have been the case with you. You would almost always be able to predict your chicks next move, and plan accordingly. Of course, the drawback in this, is that there's no challenge it, and hence not much fun. But just for heck of it, you could have thrown in a monkey-wrench whenever you wanted by acting in a method that you knew the Rules did not address. And then, if at any time you felt it was in your best interest to let her in on your awareness of the Rules, then you could have done so at your choosing.

Sometimes, you're better off being as dumb as a fox...

Master of the Universe

[/B]

I LOVE this option

 

[VeryBadGirl]

I'm with Jake here - Rules girls make me want to puke.

Perhaps that is because all the things in their book go directly against what seems natural for me. It seems to be a very inauthentic and manipulative way to act, in my opinion.

Good relationships are about a equal partnership, in my mind, and Rules girls are never going to achieve that.

 

[xblitz44x]

Hmmm...

I followed Doc Love's advise that if a girl plays games, then that's a sign of low IL.

I also follow Doc Love's advice. He is the guy who initially made me realize my game needed a serious make-over. However I do not agree with the above statement. When he says "playing games" I assume he means using techniques and strategies to make the other person interested. This is what we DJs do. We use what works, to get women interested in us. That does not mean that we are not intersted. In fact, the more interested we are, the more strict we are with our DJ ways!

BGMan,

I don't know if she reads The Rules or is just a natural, but her behavior sort of makes me think, dang, what a woman! Just like DJ behavior makes them think, dang, what a man?!

I don't know that her behavior is woman-like at all. I guess it depends on your definition of woman. I understand what you are saying though, it's nice that she has a life of her own, and puts things ahead of you...that can be attractive.

Page,

I think your right. The Rules are more techniques. Step by step rules to follow. Whereas DJing is an entire lifestyle, that can be applied to any aspect of your life. It is much more versitle.

I have come to the conclusion that DJs and hardcore Rules Girls cannot work it out. The Rules say that a man should take control of the situation (heh, a little hypocritical eh?)...and make the decision to move forward in the relationship. And of course us DJs say that the woman must initiate talks about being exclusive first. This is why there was never, and probably will never be an LTR between me and this Rules Girl because I AM NOT BUDGING.

-Blitz

 

[BGMan]

How about the "boil the frog slowly" method?

You don't say anything about a "relationship", but you do things that would be expected of people in a "relationship". You crank it up enough so that eventually she'll probably consider you her BF even without you or her actually discussing the matter.

In the case of Rules Girls, I believe that talks of "exclusivity" don't really matter. If she acts like your GF for month after month, even after a couple of years, then if you want to marry the chick, do the engagement-ring shtick (of course, in a creative manner, I'm not talking about the same ol' AFC genuflecting and saying "will you marry me?").

BGMan

 

[Pancho]

Originally posted by Page:


Despite what an article somewhere on ss.com says, I can't really criticise women for following The Rules, b/c we do a similar thing with the Dj Bible, and it would be rather hypocritical for me to say that they shouldn't be following the Rules whereas it would be okay for us to read the Dj Bible.

There are two major differences between the DJ Bible and the rules book. First of all, one is necessary, while the other is not. Women dont need the rules to land a man, while men need the DJ bible just to survive the dating world. Okay, maybe "need" is too strong a word, as even AFC usually get married in the end...

The second way is that the rules is a book, a tool, that women use to get a man to marry them. They follow the rules, but never internalize them. Being a DJ is about soo much more than just banging chick or getting married...its a lifestyle change. Its about becoming successful in all areas of your life. Its something YOU ARE, not something you DO


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If all men are created equal, then how is it im better?

[This message has been edited by Pancho (edited 05-24-2002).]

 

[DeepBlue]

xblitz44x wrote:
So I'm wondering if you guys ever had to deal with a Rules Girl before?

Yes. I remember one chick was actually complaining to me, while she and I were out on a date, about there being "all these rules" in dating, but then she left it vague and didn't want to elaborate. I didn't know right away what she meant, but then it gradually dawned on me that she was trying to follow that book.

We were having such a great conversation together, I could see her enthusiams and emotions getting higher and higher, and then she suddenly panicked, like it suddenly hit her that she was in the midst of "getting swept away" by her feelings of enthusiasm and desire. However, according to "the rules" she was supposed to be the one to end the date, cutting it short, as if she had to urgently go somewhere.

But it was so weird for her to do it in the midst of having such a great time. So suddenly, out of the blue she exclaims in a panic "I have to go" and rushes to grab a taxi home.

We got together again, but when I put her behavior together with her mysterious comment about there being "all these rules" it hit me that she was trying to follow that book.

Like yourself, I also bought and read that book as soon as it became apparent that many women were going to be following it.

It's ironic that a lot of the rules are aimed at making a woman seem mysterious and unpredictable, however when you've seen the rigid game plan, no one is more predictable and boring than a "rules girl."


If you have, how did you handle it?

I NEXTed her. After our second date I gave her a long, passionate goodnight kiss, and then never called her again.

People whose behavior is guided by predictable rules bore me. When I touch a woman with my words or my hands, I want to know that I am touching a real person, not some put on mask.


Also, if you never did have to deal with a Rules Girl, how would you have handled my situation differently?

I would not have told her about having read the book. In general, you lose more than you gain by letting her know the full extent of what YOU know.

If I were still interested in the chick, then I would have pointed out the flaws in some of the rules concepts, but I would have done it indirectly by describing ideal relationships or happy, successful couples that I know, without revealing any awareness of that book. That way she can be led to discovering the flaws with it, without the complications of feeling judged for it.

Having her know you read the book creates a problem on many levels. One of those levels is this: even if she decided to give it up entirely, she still has to deal with the possibility that you will always be viewing her as following rules, even when she no longer is.

DeepBlue

PS. You realize of course that the author of The Rules ended up getting a divorce from her husband, right as she was about to embark on promoting her new book called, "The Rules for Marriage: Time Tested Secrets for Making Your Marriage Work"! How is that for the ultimate irony! People never give up hoping for a simple formula that promises to save them from having to think for themselves.


[This message has been edited by DeepBlue (edited 05-24-2002).]

 

[Gaming111]

I thought this was really funny... Here's the Rules website, with the top 10 rules: http://www.therulesbook.com/topten.html It's amazingly similar to Dj-ness.

Odd, huh?

 

[Chubbs Peterson]

Good post, agent xblitz44x. We're all proud of you.

 

[DonJuan'sGirl]

WOW!!
JEEZ...There are alot of posts and I"m probably going to miss somethings, but I"ll do my best to kee up with this topic and give my opinion.......
xblitz.....
The girl you are dating is not a 'Rules girl'
she is trying to be, but is failing badly

LOL....as wsa Jake's girl AND Deepblue's girl.....sure these girls are reading the book, but they are not true rule's girls since they are breaking rules here and there.........Xblitz....if she was a true rules girl, she NEVER would have said,'lemme check my rules book'...COMEON!!!!That's not going to happen.....DeepBlue's girl kissed him pationately on a second date!! That's not the rules!!!!!!
Like I said...they are trying and failing!!
hmmmm what else.......
oh! VeryBadGirl said that Rules girls make her puke! That its going against what is natural for her.....I don't know about her, but I don't think its unnatural not to sleep with a guy on a first date...how low is that?!?!
I don't see what's wrong with a man paying for a date either....it doens't make the relationship any less equal.....when a woman pays for a date, or even HALF....all men think it's because of lowinterest....right??
so why would you want her to offer to pay??
it's hypocritical.....
I can take everyrule and justify it......there is nothing demeaning about them....I've read the rules and I've partaked with them....and There is nothing horrible about it...its the exact opposite of the dj bible......and because of this, a DJ and a RG can not be matched together...at least not for the long run KWIM???
um, I might have forgot somethign, but i"m sure with the replies I"m goign to get for this..I"ll remember

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Look Deeper and You Shall Find What You Seek

 

[DeepBlue]

DonJuan'sGirl wrote:
DeepBlue's girl kissed him pationately on a second date!! That's not the rules!!!!!!
Like I said...they are trying and failing!!


It was the least she could do, since I was lying on top of her.

But the point isn't whether they are succeeding or failing at following "the rules".

The point is that even attempting to follow those rules introduces an inauthenticity to a woman's interactions with men that keeps her from connecting with men on an authentic level.

Even if some of the rules are based on ideas with a grain of truth to them, the authors cast those principles into a simplistic mold to produce some overly rigid and formulaic rules that practically turn the woman into a puppet! All a guy has to do is read "The Rules" and instantly every "rules girl" becomes thoroughly predictable and boring.

DeepBlue

 

[BGMan]

Hmm... I'd have to agree that these girls do seem rather like computers, acting on cue, eh? I suppose that the authors of "The Rules" make a lot of good points for the chicks, but they leave a lot out. As Pancho said, DJ is a lifestyle change.

I guess the differences between Doña Juanitas and Rules Girls is that the former go with the flow more and don't try to act so artificially hard to get, like DeepBlue's date. That story was actually funny. Sort of a female AFC in my estimation!

I guess that girl I mentioned before isn't really an RG after all. I mean, she does act hard to get a lot, but yours truly is ALWAYS the one who ends chats and dates. The first date we were on, she tried to drag it out! LOL

BGMan

[This message has been edited by BGMan (edited 05-25-2002).]

 

[IntermediateDonJuaner]

DAMN, this is very interesting.

Frankly speaking, I am also one of the crazy rules person. I followed what Doc Love said till the end and I feel that if a girl is going to follow rules, I think it's nothing big.

The difference is following rules are dangerous because we can mess-up. And there are lots of grounds to cover....

So blitz, mess up her script by doing the opposite of what the rules said. For example, if the rules said " Wait for him to call" , you better not call. Let her wonder what is wrong with the rules. And she will stop following it.

 

[SoSuave.com]

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