The idea that rejection is nothing personal

[CornbreadFed]

It is easier to get results as a top tier guy (aka Chad Thundercocck). However, if a normie tier man does enough self-improvement, he might not reach Chad status but he can see some results.

I practice natural looks maxing, know my target market, and pull back from women with interest levels that’s not high.

 

[CornbreadFed]

Chads are the type to take steroids, drink whey powder, get tribal tattoos, and have a buzz cut beard trim job that looks mechanical. He probably played football in high school, has puffy muscles from inflammation, a bald chest, was in a college fraternity, probably had gay sex before, and says bro a lot.

That’s my stereotype of whatever a Chad might be

A Chad is a white guy above 6ft with masculine and a good mix of feminine features to make him appear pretty but intimidating at the same time. The stuff you mentioned just comes naturally for him.

Nate from the show Euphoria is a good example of a Chad.

 

[SW15]

Nate from the show Euphoria is a good example of a Chad.

I had never heard of him or watched that show. There's online discussion that Nate is either bisexual or gay.

In real life, Tom Brady in the 2000s-2010s is a well known example of a man that would have been perceived as a Chad. Brady's 'Chad' status is debatable and has been debated on other threads on this forum.

 

[CornbreadFed]

I had never heard of him or watched that show. There's online discussion that Nate is either bisexual or gay.

In real life, Tom Brady in the 2000s-2010s is a well known example of a man that would have been perceived as a Chad. Brady's 'Chad' status is debatable and has been debated on other threads on this forum.

Tom Brady feels more like a Brad to me lol. Chads are pretty much stronger more projecting pretty boys.

 

[SW15]

Tom Brady feels more like a Brad to me lol.

It's difficult to give a good example of a Chad that will be well known to a lot of people.

Since the topic of this thread of rejection, the top tier guys (aka Chads) are the ones who are less likely to be rejected.

Tom Brady in Boston in the 2000s-2010s had women throwing themselves at him. If he were approaching in bars in Boston during that time, he could have had sex with many of them and gotten a lot of IOIs. This likely happened at some point in that time.

Tom Brady going for older Bridget Moynahan in 2004 was not a Chad maneuver.

While there's a good case for Tom Brady in the 2000s-2010s being a Chad, there are also arguments against it. The Tom Brady-Gisele Bundchen marriage deteriorated in the early 2020s and had some strong blue pill ideology themes.

 

[CornbreadFed]

Since the topic of this thread of rejection, the top tier guys (aka Chads) are the ones who are less likely to be rejected.

Brady is a high smv guys even without the football status. I could see him being a chad back then, but there’s a lot of guys looking more feminine today.

Chad’s do not get a lot of rejections, but they tend to stick to their social circles and not do much approaching outside that. I have witnessed women rejecting/cheating on their Chad boyfriends so I wouldn’t call them
Completely unstoppable.

However, the guy that beats Chad in dating is the pretty boy/ or the bad boy(edgy pretty boy). These guys have the most op advantage in dating out of any man.

 

[SW15]

Brady is a high smv guys even without the football status. I could see him being a chad back then, but there’s a lot of guys looking more feminine today.

If Brady had never played collegiate or professional football, he would have been a 6'4" guy who was in shape. He likely would have been in a top fraternity in college, majored in business/some social science, and become a sales rep.

He would have had top tier looks status on that path and had sex with multiple sorority women at his college. Maybe he puts a ring on one of them, maybe he doesn't

Alternate reality non-competitive athlete Tom Brady is still going to be near the top tier due to height and facial aesthetics.

Chad’s do not get a lot of rejections, but they tend to stick to their social circles and not do much approaching outside that. I have witnessed women rejecting/cheating on their Chad boyfriends so I wouldn’t call them
Completely unstoppable.

I have seen Chads take all different routes to getting pussie.

Some Chads will put up shirtless pics on Tinder/Bumble/Hinge, rarely nightlife approach, set up dates off of the apps, and have sex.

Some Chads will nightlife approach, but this is less common now than 15-30 years ago. When I first turned 21 in the mid-2000s, this would have been more common.

 

[CornbreadFed]

I have seen Chads take all different routes to getting pussie.

Chads still have to put in effort even if it is much less than a regular guy. In addition, there’s plenty of girls not in to Chads because they see a conflict in interest/lifestyle with them. For example, frat boy Chad is not going to have it easy outside women not affiliated with his lifestyle and interests. Chad’s still have to hold frame and game their women because they can get cheated on/manipulated by women as much as any other guy. I’ve witnessed plenty of super chads get taken to the cleaners by even average looking women too. They still have to put in work for women, but it’s not as much as an average guy.

Now pretty boys don’t have to do jack shvt. I’ve seen them sit in corners and still have women magnetically pull to them. In addition, pretty boys can fvck any type of woman while Chad’s are going to struggle outside his social group. It’s impossible for them to get dumped, so they are always the ones dumping women. Pretty boys are the guys permanently imprinting women and turning them in to alpha widows. I’ve seen Chad in low spots/getting rejected, but I’ve never seen a pretty boy get rejected ever.

 

[GoodMan32]

See you make the quite faulty assumption that I have never been rejected. The difference is that if someone wasn't interested, I did not take it personally. And I moved on immediately, like nothing happened. Yes I am a beautiful woman so have the fortune of many options, that is true. But I do not get to pick just whoever I want, given the fact the I do not have indiscriminate sex, which I easily could, but there is no value in that for me.

But men will happily use a pretty woman if she has no discernment; if she undervalues herself.

So I have had to learn to read men's intentions very well, and I have also learned to walk away from men I liked who did not have long term intent. And not take it personally.

Do not make assumptions. You think because I am beautiful I have never experienced disappointment. You are dead wrong. Your faulty worldview thinks everything is easy for me. Not so.

As I espouse here, I had to look in the mirror and take ownership of my mistakes, assumptions, and at that time (having been a naieve 20 year old geeky virgin who didn't realize she was pretty) things I didn't know about men and their motivations.

So I had to learn a whole knowledge set and face reality. And not take it personal.

Each of you must calibrate yourself similarly.

What I said was you wouldn't understand getting rejected the vast majority of the time.

I never said you haven't been rejected. All I'm saying is it isn't something that's happened the vast majority of the time.

When you mention how you don't have casual sex, nor do you stay with men whose intentions aren't the same as yours, that's a matter of you choosing to refrain from certain stuff with men.

In other words, you have opportunities you turn down (because the opportunities aren't the exact thing you want). I, on the other hand, have a hard time getting anything at all with the opposite sex.

With me, I don't have the luxury of being the chooser.

There's a big difference between complaining about having a hard time getting your ideal scenario with the opposite sex (what you're doing) vs complaining about having a hard time getting anything at all with the opposite sex (what I'm doing)

That's a challenge for a lot of women who desire commitment.

It's easy for women to get sex. It's more difficult to get sex with commitment.

It takes social skill to enforce a boundary that you desire commitment in order to have sex.

You rejected plenty of men. Fewer men likely walked away from you initially.

I can imagine that you'd be upset if a guy deceived you on commitment. You'd be upset if you misread a situation and had sex with a man who left after a few instances of sex.

As I said to her, there's a big difference between having a hard time getting the exact thing you want vs having a hard time getting anything at all.

 

[GoodMan32]

Btw if a girl gets the " ick" and rejects you because of something you said then she never really liked you to begin with.

A girl will make excuses for the worst most cringe behavior if she is truly into your look.

Its never personal when they like you or dislike you. They are random af and the template for what they find attractive ( outside of Chads) is preset by their childhood.

I've posted at length on this forum before about a date I went on in 2023.

• We sat on a bench chatting for 2 and a half hours after the date.
• Even though there was no sex, she told me to tell another guy we had sex just to make him jealous (if a woman isn't into me, the last thing she'd want is for other people to think we had sex...even if it's just to make somebody jealous)
• She texted me nonstop the next few days (including begging me for a 2nd date multiple times)
• She offered to drive me to work (which was way out of her way), drive me to an appointment, etc

Certainly sounds like that woman was highly into me.

Yet before the 2nd date even had a chance to happen, she ended up hating me because my autism caused me to say/do some socially clueless stuff (in other words, yeah, it is possible for a high interest woman to lose interest because you said/did something that gave her the ick factor)

 

[GoodMan32]

The problem with “school” is that it’s not real life. It’s a bubble. Sure, I know these couples too who are my age but have been married for 20 years already. What’s your point? This refutes nothing.

Stop living in the past and worrying about how you were perceived back in grade school by girls who were children at the time (as you were as well). It’s never too late to turn it around. But you have to desire it. You just want to make excuses

It's been said on this forum that your social standing as a kid can impact your dating opportunities as an adult too (in the sense that: men who stay in the same geographical area they were raised in, and weren't total rejects growing up, have the easiest time dating)

And you can be overcome by anguish when this happens, or you can say to yourself: "Might they be onto something? Could I be more well-socialized than I currently am? Could there be a more deft way of approaching besides what I'm doing now? I.E. Walking up to some chick I'd like to bed wearing a T-Shirt with "Winger" emblazoned across the front, then trying to woo her with a compendium of my favorite Lily Singh quotes, and photos of The El Mozote Massacre"

I went to school with a guy who got expelled for purposely starting a fire in the bathroom.

I also went to school with a guy who'd make comments in class about wanting to kill babies (teachers and students would brush it off as a joke).

I'd say both of these dudes were creepier freaks than me. Yet somehow I was viewed as the creepy freak of the school.

My social/emotional age was 5-6 years younger than my biological age (in other words, when I was a sophomore in high school, I might as well have been a 4th grader). That was my only "crime" that led to me being viewed as a creepy freak.

Unreal how being socially stunted was viewed as worse by my peers than arson or comments about killing babies. The 2 dudes I mentioned are neurotypical; that's seriously the only thing that sets us apart.

In addition to being more popular than me at school, these 2 dudes I mentioned also did better than me with the ladies (and both are married now)

 

[GoodMan32]

And you can choose to leave your fixation on bedding women much older than yourself in the past where it belongs, alongside fanny packs and The Plague Of Justinian...

You're reminiscent of a certain political party here in The US, who's doubling down on tactics and a strategy that's failed to win elections, all for the sake of FEELING real righteous

My pregnancy phobia. Nuff said.

The older women thing is not helping one bit. It hurts a lot.

For extended dating, the most probable options are close to his age. @GoodMan32 has wasted some good years where he might have had options with young-ish women. A generic guy who is 33-34 can get a 29-31 year old and has better odds with a 29-31 year old than a 45-50 year old.





Agree with the idea that school is a "bubble". Middle school and high school aren't at all relatable to dating as a working age individual.

College is the closest to be relatable to dating as a working age individual, but even is differnt. There's a reason that a specific college sex thread has done well on this forum.

Observations about college sex life from someone that went to a party school.

I thought I'd share this as someone who went to a party school and was in a fraternity there as well. Not wanting to give too much about myself but I went to UGA and graduated a few years ago. While Athens has its hot girls, I do feel like the quality got worse every year due to the admission...

www.sosuave.net

With middle/high school, bad experiences in those years can linger into well into adulthood. It's a common thing. It's a setback that many people can overcome with time, effort, self-improvement, and healing. It isn't an easy task.

When one looks at statistics, it's quite uncommon for high school or college relationships to stand the test of time. While school-formed relationships were common in the latter part of the 20th Century, they haven't been common in the 21st Century.



This was a joke in Beavis & Butthead in the 1990s. The dorkiest kid wore a Winger t-shirt.

Despite my preference for older, when I was in my early 20s, I went on dates with (and had some one night stands with) some gals in the 18-24 range. Yet I still had a hard time keeping a woman (the longest was a 23 year old I dated for 8 months shortly after college; the rest were much shorter-lived)

My point? The idea that I'd somehow do better if I focused on gals born around the same time as me isn't necessarily true.

The only real difference I can think of is: A gal around my age is more likely to let me initially get my foot in the door (but that's no guarantee I'm going to hold onto her)

 

[SW15]

My point? The idea that I'd somehow do better if I focused on gals born around the same time as me isn't necessarily true.

The only real difference I can think of is: A gal around my age is more likely to let me initially get my foot in the door

You need to get your foot in the door so to speak. If you don't get your foot in the door, nothing happens.

That real difference that you perceive is everything.

I'm going to hold onto her

How important is retaining women to you right now? This changes over the course of men's lives.

Some men are "Thrill of the Hunt" men. These are men who are not motivated by retaining women. Thrill of the Hunt men get impatient in extended relationships because they are most motivated by the seduction of new women rather than consistent sex from any one woman. Neil Strauss (one of the most successful pickup students of all time) has been a well known Thrill of the Hunt guy.

Pleasure of Sex men are motivated more than sex than the act of seduction. I think more men are Pleasure of Sex men. Pleasure of Sex men can be both alpha/sigma and beta.

Thrill of the Hunt Men vs. Pleasure of Sex Men - Alpha Male 2.0

-By Caleb Jones This is such a big topic that it will likely be the first of several posts I make about this. This will clear up a lot of confusion you may have regarding conflicting advice in the seduction realm. Few men are aware that...

alphamale20.com

With me, I don't have the luxury of being the chooser.

there's a big difference between having a hard time getting the exact thing you want vs having a hard time getting anything at all.

Women are the gatekeepers of sex. Relationships don't happen without sex. Without sex, all that's there is a friendship or an acquaintanceship.

Men can choose who to approach or who to swipe right on. However, men's options depend on who swipes right back on them (usually less than 1% of men's right swipes) or who is receptive to their approaches.

Most men end up taking whatever they can get. That's the patten for sub-5s and most normie tier men. Only the upper tier of men have some choice.

Men are often trying to get something at all.

Up until menopause, most women have multiple options for sex and are trying to get sex within a specific situation.

I find your second sentence to be based in reality.

Chads still have to put in effort even if it is much less than a regular guy. In addition, there’s plenty of girls not in to Chads because they see a conflict in interest/lifestyle with them. For example, frat boy Chad is not going to have it easy outside women not affiliated with his lifestyle and interests. Chad’s still have to hold frame and game their women because they can get cheated on/manipulated by women as much as any other guy. I’ve witnessed plenty of super chads get taken to the cleaners by even average looking women too. They still have to put in work for women, but it’s not as much as an average guy.

Now pretty boys don’t have to do jack shvt. I’ve seen them sit in corners and still have women magnetically pull to them. In addition, pretty boys can fvck any type of woman while Chad’s are going to struggle outside his social group. It’s impossible for them to get dumped, so they are always the ones dumping women. Pretty boys are the guys permanently imprinting women and turning them in to alpha widows. I’ve seen Chad in low spots/getting rejected, but I’ve never seen a pretty boy get rejected ever.

I think "pretty boys" are a type of Chad. "Pretty boys" are upper tier in looks. If a "pretty boy" is upper tier in looks and is interested in seducing multiple women, that's a variant of a Chad.

To me, Chads are upper tier men in looks who seduce multiple women. They are usually 6'0"+.

I think the 'Chad' stereotype gets laid on men with bigger muscles. "Pretty boys" might not be as muscular as 'Chads' but they have lower body fat and often visible abs. The "pretty boys" will have good physiques.

Men in the top tier will have to put in effort, but it is far reduced compared to some mid range man.

 

[GoodMan32]

I practice natural looks maxing, know my target market, and pull back from women with interest levels that’s not high.

One problem I run into is: The more clues of interest a woman shows, the less likely I am to pursue her.

A Chad is a white guy above 6ft with masculine and a good mix of feminine features to make him appear pretty but intimidating at the same time. The stuff you mentioned just comes naturally for him.

Nate from the show Euphoria is a good example of a Chad.

I looked up Nate. His hair and facial features aren't a whole lot different than mine. Yet I haven't had free sex in 4 years.

 

[GoodMan32]

You need to get your foot in the door so to speak. If you don't get your foot in the door, nothing happens.

That real difference that you perceive is everything.



How important is retaining women to you right now? This changes over the course of men's lives.

Some men are "Thrill of the Hunt" men. These are men who are not motivated by retaining women. Thrill of the Hunt men get impatient in extended relationships because they are most motivated by the seduction of new women rather than consistent sex from any one woman. Neil Strauss (one of the most successful pickup students of all time) has been a well known Thrill of the Hunt guy.

Pleasure of Sex men are motivated more than sex than the act of seduction. I think more men are Pleasure of Sex men. Pleasure of Sex men can be both alpha/sigma and beta.

Thrill of the Hunt Men vs. Pleasure of Sex Men - Alpha Male 2.0

-By Caleb Jones This is such a big topic that it will likely be the first of several posts I make about this. This will clear up a lot of confusion you may have regarding conflicting advice in the seduction realm. Few men are aware that...

alphamale20.com

Women are the gatekeepers of sex. Relationships don't happen without sex. Without sex, all that's there is a friendship or an acquaintanceship.

Men can choose who to approach or who to swipe right on. However, men's options depend on who swipes right back on them (usually less than 1% of men's right swipes) or who is receptive to their approaches.

Most men end up taking whatever they can get. That's the patten for sub-5s and most normie tier men. Only the upper tier of men have some choice.

Men are often trying to get something at all.

Up until menopause, most women have multiple options for sex and are trying to get sex within a specific situation.

I find your second sentence to be based in reality.



I think "pretty boys" are a type of Chad. "Pretty boys" are upper tier in looks. If a "pretty boy" is upper tier in looks and is interested in seducing multiple women, that's a variant of a Chad.

To me, Chads are upper tier men in looks who seduce multiple women. They are usually 6'0"+.

I think the 'Chad' stereotype gets laid on men with bigger muscles. "Pretty boys" might not be as muscular as 'Chads' but they have lower body fat and often visible abs. The "pretty boys" will have good physiques.

Men in the top tier will have to put in effort, but it is far reduced compared to some mid range man.

Right, I need to get my foot in the door for something to happen.

My point, however, is: A lot of times with the young gals back when I was in my early 20s, sex didn't end up happening, despite the fact I got my foot in the door. And even in the instances where sex happened, I couldn't get repeat sex.

Which brings me to your question of how important it is for me to retain a woman. Pretty important. Constantly pursuing a woman is exhausting.

The fact I got repeated sex from the 45 year old married woman who had the affair with me many years back probably played a role in why I (to this day) describe her as the best sex I ever had.

As for pretty boys, I'd describe the lead singer of the All American Rejects as a pretty boy in his younger days. Here he is in 2003 when he was 19. Not particularly muscular, yet has decent definition.

 

[SW15]

Which brings me to your question of how important it is for me to retain a woman. Pretty important. Constantly pursuing a woman is exhausting.

That sounds like a 'Pleasure of Sex' motivation. A 'Thrill of the Hunt' man enjoys the pursuit.

A lot of times with the young gals back when I was in my early 20s, sex didn't end up happening, despite the fact I got my foot in the door. And even in the instances where sex happened, I couldn't get repeat sex.

Sex doesn't end up happening a lot of times when a man gets his foot in the door.

I have had more "one date, no sex, no second date" interactions than you have due to my past use of dating websites (prior to apps) and dating apps. I had my foot in the door due to arranging those dates from a tech method. Those dates were mainly with similarly aged women.

As for pretty boys, I'd describe the lead singer of the All American Rejects as a pretty boy in his younger days. Here he is in 2003 when he was 19. Not particularly muscular, yet has decent definition.

View attachment 14174

Trying to imagine him without the guitar and microphone.

Lower body fat and medium physique is a pretty boy.

He doesn't quite have pretty boy hair.

It's a decent example overall.

 

[CornbreadFed]

I think "pretty boys" are a type of Chad. "Pretty boys" are upper tier in looks. If a "pretty boy" is upper tier in looks and is interested in seducing multiple women, that's a variant of a Chad.

You are correct because every desirable male archetype from a female's point of view is just a modification of a Pretty Boy being more masculine (Brad), more edgy (Bad Boy), more alpha(Chad), and etc. I would still rank pretty boys the highest out of any of them though.

 

[CornbreadFed]

One problem I run into is: The more clues of interest a woman shows, the less likely I am to pursue her.

I looked up Nate. His hair and facial features aren't a whole lot different than mine. Yet I haven't had free sex in 4 years.

Where do you live? Where do you interact with women the most? Where would you rank yourself in SMV? Are you white or Indian and what type of women do you generally go for?

 

[SW15]

You are correct because every desirable male archetype from a female's point of view is just a modification of a Pretty Boy being more masculine (Brad), more edgy (Bad Boy), more alpha(Chad), and etc. I would still rank pretty boys the highest out of any of them though.

I tend to think of men as upper tier, mid-tier, and lower tier. Both pretty boys and Chads are the upper tier for the most part, though some pretty boys might be the upper range of mid-tier. The upper range of mid-tier can be called 'Chad Light' by some.

 

[GoodMan32]

That sounds like a 'Pleasure of Sex' motivation. A 'Thrill of the Hunt' man enjoys the pursuit.



Sex doesn't end up happening a lot of times when a man gets his foot in the door.

I have had more "one date, no sex, no second date" interactions than you have due to my past use of dating websites (prior to apps) and dating apps. I had my foot in the door due to arranging those dates from a tech method. Those dates were mainly with similarly aged women.



Trying to imagine him without the guitar and microphone.

Lower body fat and medium physique is a pretty boy.

He doesn't quite have pretty boy hair.

It's a decent example overall.

Interestingly, while I have a harder time getting my foot in the door with the typical older woman (compared to my age contemporaries), in the instances where I have gotten my foot in the door with an older woman, I've gotten laid at a higher percentage rate than I have with age contemporaries who've let me get my foot in the door.

Perhaps focusing on older isn't such a bad strategy after all. Harder to get my foot in the door, yet more likely to get lucky if they do let me in the door.

Where do you live? Where do you interact with women the most? Where would you rank yourself in SMV? Are you white or Indian and what type of women do you generally go for?

I live in Arizona.

As for where I interact with the opposite sex the most, I unfortunately have a majority of my opposite sex contact in settings where many would say it's inadvisable to pursue a partner (work, neighbors in the building where I live, etc)

The venues where it's most socially acceptable to pursue a partner (bar-hopping and night clubs) are miserable for me (miserable in the sense that the nightlife scene doesn't interest me at all)

I attend organized singles events from time to time, however. I had a mini-victory (but no sex) from an organized singles event earlier this year.

I'm White. I'm pretty open-minded in terms of the race of my partner. I mainly interact with White and Latina, simply because those are the 2 dominant ethnic groups where I live.

As for SMV, I'd say my looks alone are 6-7/10. I won't share a picture of myself on the public forum. I will, however, share a pretty accurate AI depiction of me.