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the greater context and why people behave as they do

joekerr31

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so as we inspect human being, both male and female, the one obvious thing that stands out over and over again is people not doing what is in their own best interest, or any one elses for that matter.

both men and women behaving 'immaturely'.

and the question should be asked, why? why do humans behave this way.

in the greater context, the reason i believe, is that the human being is trapped in an absurd context.

life is a damned if you do, damned if you don't experience. no matter what you do in life, time marches on, you get older, and you die.

and anyone who has gotten older will tell you that the future never lives up to the expectations of the fantasies one has as a teenager. ever.

because even if you get everything you could ever desire - even if you become the president of hte united states or the most famous rock star - you are still, like everyone else, a 'dead man walking'.

when you are young they hide this from you. we live in a sterilized society. when people get sick and die, they do so in hospitals. the food we eat comes in neat little packages and we never had to cut the head off a chicken etc.

because most people today have been sheltered from life's ugly basic realities, we have all grown up with a sanitized, fantasy-like view of life.

and so as people get older they find themselves faced with aspects of life they have never experienced close up - primarily the notion that time IS passing, that death WILL come and that many windows of opportunity have passed by.

it is this clash - the clash between the fantasizes and unrealistic experience of the world that we had as children and the reality that the end closer than it was 20 years ago - that causes people to behave irrationally.

people become DESPERATE. desperate to find something that either takes their mind of their own mortality or somehow makes it less difficult to accept (hence the whole legacy issue most people struggle with).

this is why presidents invade other countries even knowing that it could blow up in their face. its why women lie and manipulate a man in the hopes of getting married nad having children. its why people will lie and backstab each other in the corporate world. its why people get surgery to look better. etc.

man is a creature who is desperately attempting to find some kind of meaning / value to his life. trying to busy himself enough so as to not think about the grim reality that awaits him one day. yes, of course he will admit that he will die one day, but he refuses think about that event in a realistic way. instead he chases after cars, money, fame, legacy, etc.

if there were more time, i think most people would behave more maturely. if we lived to be 300 years old, if women could have kids for 50 years, etc. peopel would not be so DESPERATE to 'get' things.

humans do not act rationally because they perceive that there is no time to do so. and in a way they are correct. the imperative to ACT is paramount because there is no time to waste. but at the same time, the key to maturity is taking the time to learn and evolve so that when you do act you are doing so with wisdom on your side.

i put forward the notion that the biggest and largest determining factor in how one experiences life, is how they view death.

many who have had near death experiences experience an awakening. they unplug from the matrix instantly. where before they chased after endless distractions, afterwards they seem to approach life as an 'experience'. every day simply another day filled with various experiences - and they make the most of those experiences.

albert camus put forward the notion that the only real philosophical question of any importance was whether suicide was an acceptable act - whether life was worth living. he felt if one answered that question then all other questions fell into place.

and there is something to that. it is only when one embraces their mortality, their finiteness, can they begin living in what we might call the 'infinite now', in the moment if you will.

when a man overcomes his fear of his own mortality then he overcomes all his fears - whether they be women, rejection, etc.

this is often why we see such a peaceful demeanor in those who have found a higher spiritual power to believe in. that belief washes away their fears.

it is only when a man has conquored his fear of the life to death context in which we all live, that he can even begin to truly live authentically (nietzsche espoused this as well).

anyway, something to think about. how much of the irrational, immature behavior that we see around us every day is actually, fundamentally rooted in the basic human paradigm of 1) limited life expectancy and 2) a FEAR of ones own mortality.

these two factors alone, when you drill deep into the core of the human experience, seem to be major drivers behind the very fallible human decisions and behaviors that we see going on in the world every day.
 

iqqi

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joekerr31 said:
anyway, something to think about. how much of the irrational, immature behavior that we see around us every day is actually, fundamentally rooted in the basic human paradigm of 1) limited life expectancy and 2) a FEAR of ones own mortality.
For some reason I strive to live my life to the fullest, and most valiantly, because of that there. HAPPINESS, mine and those around me.
 

KarmaSutra

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I think it comes down to blunt curiousity. People always want to push the envelope and see what happens when they do X. We want to know the Y.

There isn't any rationality or political correctness about it just dumb curiousity and the want to know. We can go on and on about the motives and purposes behind the reason for it all but the bottom line is we just don't know enough about ourselves to become comfortable with our current position.

It's the constant external stimulation which deluges us with inane questions without any concrete answer as to the Y of it. Only once the internal chatter ceases can clarity of vision and voice overcome the forces outside of ourselves.

I'm reading a tremendous book about Zen Master Keizan Zenji entitled:

The record of transmitting the light.

It follows the Dharma through years following Buddha's teachings and is absolutely thralling in it's pronouncment of what the thread encompasses.

I wholeheartedly recommend it to everyone interested in Japanese Zen philosophy.
 

RedPill

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We are ALL economic rent seekers. Sometimes though, due to a lack of life experiences which teach us to be accountable for our behaviors, people will attempt to seek rents which do not ultimately produce a profit.

Translation:
People will chase after some fukked up ideals, thinking they will deliver happiness, meaning, and prosperity. Those ideals are mundane placeholders to distract the ego from the cold reality that one isn't participating in any powerful, meaningful ideas which transcend time.

Most people don't respect the clock. They've denied and deferred the idea that the sand of their time here is slipping through the hourglass of their life 24/7. They won't plan and prioritize accordingly.

If one has truly, truly internalized the brevity of their life span - and this is a practiced habit - there will be a fundamental shift in how they treat life. I sincerely hope that as many people as possible will wake up to their own potential through this realization, but unfortunately most won't, and that's okay. Not everyone will choose to be a leader.

This body holding me
Reminds me of my own mortality.
Embrace this moment. Remember -
We are eternal, all this pain is an illusion.
 

ducaro

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joekerr31 said:
so as we inspect human being, both male and female, the one obvious thing that stands out over and over again is people not doing what is in their own best interest, or any one elses for that matter.

both men and women behaving 'immaturely'.

and the question should be asked, why? why do humans behave this way.

in the greater context, the reason i believe, is that the human being is trapped in an absurd context.

life is a damned if you do, damned if you don't experience. no matter what you do in life, time marches on, you get older, and you die.

and anyone who has gotten older will tell you that the future never lives up to the expectations of the fantasies one has as a teenager. ever.

because even if you get everything you could ever desire - even if you become the president of hte united states or the most famous rock star - you are still, like everyone else, a 'dead man walking'.

when you are young they hide this from you. we live in a sterilized society. when people get sick and die, they do so in hospitals. the food we eat comes in neat little packages and we never had to cut the head off a chicken etc.

because most people today have been sheltered from life's ugly basic realities, we have all grown up with a sanitized, fantasy-like view of life.

and so as people get older they find themselves faced with aspects of life they have never experienced close up - primarily the notion that time IS passing, that death WILL come and that many windows of opportunity have passed by.

it is this clash - the clash between the fantasizes and unrealistic experience of the world that we had as children and the reality that the end closer than it was 20 years ago - that causes people to behave irrationally.

people become DESPERATE. desperate to find something that either takes their mind of their own mortality or somehow makes it less difficult to accept (hence the whole legacy issue most people struggle with).

this is why presidents invade other countries even knowing that it could blow up in their face. its why women lie and manipulate a man in the hopes of getting married nad having children. its why people will lie and backstab each other in the corporate world. its why people get surgery to look better. etc.

man is a creature who is desperately attempting to find some kind of meaning / value to his life. trying to busy himself enough so as to not think about the grim reality that awaits him one day. yes, of course he will admit that he will die one day, but he refuses think about that event in a realistic way. instead he chases after cars, money, fame, legacy, etc.

if there were more time, i think most people would behave more maturely. if we lived to be 300 years old, if women could have kids for 50 years, etc. peopel would not be so DESPERATE to 'get' things.

humans do not act rationally because they perceive that there is no time to do so. and in a way they are correct. the imperative to ACT is paramount because there is no time to waste. but at the same time, the key to maturity is taking the time to learn and evolve so that when you do act you are doing so with wisdom on your side.

i put forward the notion that the biggest and largest determining factor in how one experiences life, is how they view death.

many who have had near death experiences experience an awakening. they unplug from the matrix instantly. where before they chased after endless distractions, afterwards they seem to approach life as an 'experience'. every day simply another day filled with various experiences - and they make the most of those experiences.

albert camus put forward the notion that the only real philosophical question of any importance was whether suicide was an acceptable act - whether life was worth living. he felt if one answered that question then all other questions fell into place.

and there is something to that. it is only when one embraces their mortality, their finiteness, can they begin living in what we might call the 'infinite now', in the moment if you will.

when a man overcomes his fear of his own mortality then he overcomes all his fears - whether they be women, rejection, etc.

this is often why we see such a peaceful demeanor in those who have found a higher spiritual power to believe in. that belief washes away their fears.

it is only when a man has conquored his fear of the life to death context in which we all live, that he can even begin to truly live authentically (nietzsche espoused this as well).

anyway, something to think about. how much of the irrational, immature behavior that we see around us every day is actually, fundamentally rooted in the basic human paradigm of 1) limited life expectancy and 2) a FEAR of ones own mortality.

these two factors alone, when you drill deep into the core of the human experience, seem to be major drivers behind the very fallible human decisions and behaviors that we see going on in the world every day.

A very natural trait of any living organism - Greed. Choice. Better. For humans it all starts with the material world anyway.. you want a vacuum machine, you go to the store and 'choose' one over the other. For humans there is another complication that compounds the existing model. Social acceptance. Humans want to please one another.

Recognition. Fame. Popularity. in a societal context, this is powerful. This helps you move from one situation to a 'better' situation. Sadly, most people do not discover themselves and see any depth in anything. Ultimately what is happenig is that pople end up living for others.even if they subconsciously do not really want that - they have no choice because 'societal association' has its benefits!)

Everyday we choose, we make choices on a regular basis. Its easy to see how we demonstrate the power of choices when it comes to human relationships and interaction.
 

If you want to talk, talk to your friends. If you want a girl to like you, listen to her, ask questions, and act like you are on the edge of your seat.

Quote taken from The SoSuave Guide to Women and Dating, which you can read for FREE.

romangod

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Excellent post JoeKerr31.


You've hit on many of the things I am dealing with at the moment. In August, I suffered a brain aneurysm which would have killed me if I wasn't smart enough to call an ambulance.

After 6 weeks in the hospital, I came out a different man with many dormant demons and issues that rose to the surface. Life definitely changes and new fears and anxieties that were'nt there before start to rear their ugly heads.

Apparently, my recovery was amazing and my friends and family look at me with wonder as I realize how much it affected them as well. I have to be strong not only for myself but for them as well. The love and caring they showed me can only be repayed with the return of love and caring for them and I have no problem showing them regularly.


I pray regularly now. Every morning and every evening I ask for guidance and patience on the new path in my life. It helps immensely. I also pray for others. I've even prayed for a few posters here.


I have been blessed with a second chance to get closer to God and to Love completely without fear of disapproval or emotional pain.


I am on the path of over-coming many dormant fears and I do believe I will succeed. I have to.
 

bornyesterday

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Fear of death is one of the reasons religion is so important to humans.

It is paradoxical that humans undertake so much action out of fear of death that actually undermines their own life force. But I do think that somehow people aren't just afraid of death (or the 'will to death' or 'thanatos') but also of the will to live (freudian 'eros' or nietzschian 'will to power'). That can scare people too.
The fear of losing something when you take a risk is both a fear of death and life. As losing something is a small reminder of the big loss (life) but also the fear that it infrinches on your drive to enlarge yourself.

joekerr31 said:
it is only when a man has conquored his fear of the life to death context in which we all live, that he can even begin to truly live authentically (nietzsche espoused this as well).
I think many of the themes you mention in your post are about giving meaning to live and embrasing life. As you mention Nietzsche I'd recommend you a thought of him that has been very inspirational to me. It's his idea of the eternal recurrance (that's the english translation of it if I'm correct). Although it's not correct in physical science kind of way, it is a beatiful and deep thought which is all about you, power, the now and meaning. Resembling the idea of 'seize the day' but with adding a reason to it.
I suggest you read and reread aforism 341 of the 'frohliche wissenschaft' ('the gay science' it's called in english I think).
 

Señor Fingers

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Wow, joekker

This is the second time you touch on something that I am covering in a post in progress. Was considering posting it in this thread, but I've expanded on the topic significantly and I think a lot of the younger cats need to see this message, so I will post in tips and paste a link here when its done.
 
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