The Art of Seduction Book Study

[Reyaj]

So I read the next 2 sections "Use Spirtual Lures" and "Mix Pleasure with Pain"

Starting with "Use Spirtual Lures" here is my analysis

Using "destiny" has proven to be effective for me as girls seemed to be obsessed with fate... It actually helped me lay a girl recently whom I started talking to by "chance encounter" haha even though it was anything but that...

In the lesbian seduction example he uses the things that stand out are giving a "strong look" and using beauty, poetry and innocence..

"Make Physical pleasure seem sublime and transcendant"

This is true and has worked for me recently...... I made sure to stop when the girl pulled back but then re-engaged later.... until I finally I got in

"Capture targets soul to build the foundation of deep and lasting seduction, because all of us are plagued by an underlying unease with our animal nature"

Makes sense...

"Talk of sublimity, as a banal life does not satisfy"

True....

"You are not motivated by Money or Sex, Picasso's appeal is that he would immortalize them in his paintings"

This is true too however you need to make sure you escalate physically.

Take girls to theatres, operas, museums.... I never tried this but has anyone else? Does it give you a deeper attraction since we are talking about aesthetics?

Here is an interesting technique that was used "Talk of different kinds of love, friends, God, lover and then combine them into one" This is supposed to get the target attracted to you subtely......

The reversal portion of this has good advice in that it says to seduce but don't scare them with LTR commitments....


Now onto "Mix Pleasure with Pain" I think this chatper closely resembles what this board teaches and advocates... (the majority of this board anyway)

The example of the virgin girl playing the rich guy is typical.... girls can always play with a guys emotions.. this just happend to me and I went bezzerk

Here's the important points'

"Being too nice =trying too hard to please=insecure"

I agree... but nice at times is advantageous

"Give focused attention, then appear uninterested"

This has back fired on me.... even though its what this board seems to advise... a lot of times I've appeared to uninterested and the girls just flaked..... making them smiled and be happy has worked more for me than this game

"Instigate break up, make them feel empty, then approach, the lower the lows, the higher the highs"

Again this to me is like playing with fire. You can easily get burned and lose her!

"Alternate harshness with kindess" "Being harsh creates inner tension - targets are upset but want to validate themselves, when you are kind they feel relieved but concerned that at any moment they may displease you again"

This definitely works on insecure women. Thought I must admit its something a sadist would practice....

"Be subtle, indirect digs and compliments are best"

Can we say Mystery method??????

"Being too nice can literally push targets away. Erotic feeling depends on the creation of tension. Without tension, anxiety, and suspense, there can be no feeling of release of true pleasure and joy"

As long as the tension is positive I agree. Negative tension will just make someone feel uncomfortable.

"Stir up jealousy, make them feel insecure and validation you later give their ego by preferring them over their rivals is double delightful"

I agree with the theory though I've had problems executing this...

"You have more to fear by boring your targets, then by shaking them up"

Definitely!

The reversal says that people who have recently experienced a lot of pain or loss will flee if you try to influence more on them, surround them with pleasure......


Absolutely!


Thoughts everyone?

 

[Reyaj]

Ok I'm almost done with the book. I went through the following sections "Give Them Space to Fall - The Pursuer is Pursued" "Use Physical Lures", and "Master the Art of the Bold Move"

All these chapters were great.... let me go through each one and highlight some beneficial points....

Give Them Space to Fall - The Pursuer is Pursued

"Once they are under your spell take a step back and they will start to come after you."

This is true I have found..... however the key and difficult part is making sure your timing is impeccable. If you do it too early you risk losing them or lowering their IL

In the example Greene uses he shows the man sending letters of secret admiration to the victim and then stopping..... this is probably more of a class example but I suppose it could work today if you are an excellent writer and know how to evoke feelings in your target...

"Your withdrawl triggers anxiety, the only way to relieve this anxiety is to pursue and possess you"

Agreed

"Ending seduction at climax makes you miss the chance to make it more heated"

Well I think that striking at the climax is key before it fizzles... so I disagree with this. However setting an anchor could be useful to stir up future feelings when another encounter takes place.

"Use jealousy"

This works but its like playing with fire... you must know what you are doing or you could f$*# up everything.

The mother examples he uses of behaving or being rejected I didn't really I find useful...

The next chapter Use Physical Lures

"Act nonchalanet but your glances, voice, and bearing ooze sex and desire"

Sounds good.... but must take a lot of practice.... this should arise sexual tension

"Lead them into a moment, an intensified present in which morality, judgement, and concern for the future all melt away"

Agreed.... but very difficult to pull off... still that is the goal of a seducer.

The example of a chick seducing a guy is easy... girls can do this to us easily... the guy example of him using vacations to take chicks on... well that must work also... but you would need the means to do it aka $$$$

He says to be interesting though and to talk of cool items and adventures...


"Make desire, pleassure, and sex seem natural and not negative"

100% true

"Exhibit a lightness of spirit 0 nothing bothers you, nothing daunts you, offer the rare thrill of losing oneself in the moment, where the senses come alive and mind is left behind."

Agreed

"Make target focus on you"

Agreed

Greene mentions using an intense gaze while focusing on a woman a lot in the moment..... I'm a little iffy on this only because he first said to make her focus on you.... plus in my personal experiences girls seem to get freaked out if you look at them too sexually..... but maybe this is more towards after the girl is hooked....?

"Look short and to the point, then look away, make a smile will spoil the effect"

ehhhhhhh...... smiles have worked for me

"Use flattery, make target feel alluring"

Well I think timely flattery is good... too much makes you look like an AFC

Ok now onto Master the Art of the Bold Move

"shows great release, overwhelms by victims charms, hesistation or awkardness shows you are thinking of yourself, be seductive, not polarized, one person must go on the offensive"

"Boldness is bracing, erotic, and absolutely necessary, this is an arena for pleasure not politics"

"It should come as a pleasant surprise, but not too much of one"


This is a very important chapter..... there needs to be more mention of agressive moves on this forum... they work and are necessary when the time is right.... This forum seems to mention playing games... not answering calls right away.... calling back.... flattering etc.... too much of this puts us in the mindset where we don't look to make a bold move

from my personal experience its neccessary!

 

[Reyaj]

So I finished reading the book... let me sum up the final 3 chapters...

"Beware of the Aftereffects"

This chapter basically says that after a seduction hits its climax it naturally starts to fizzle.... if you are interested in your target you should do do a re-seduction... but then it also says to take a step back... so that kind of contradicts itself...... The reversal is true which says you can let a little familiarity to creep in. The target wants to feel that she is getting to know you. Too much mystery will create doubt. It will also be tiring for you, who will have to sustain it. The point is not to remain completely unfamilar but rather on occasion to jolt victims out of their complacency, surprising them as you surprised them in the past. Do this right and they will have the delightful feeling that they are constantly getting to know more about you- but never too much"

"Seductive Environment/Seductive Time"

This basically talks about using festivals or large social gathering... or private social clubs to make targets lose themselves and forget their everyday routines... That's whats seduction is about

"Soft Seduction: How to Sell Anything to the Masses"

This basically talks about selling yourself to the masses such as politically or business like.... "Appears as News" basically says let others do your advertising for you without you advertently doing it... in which people become defensive.... "Stir Basic Emotions" Aim for the heart and not the head"

"Make the medium the message" Images are more seductive than words...

"Speak the target's language" At all costs avoid appearing supperior to your audience.

"Start a chain reaction-everyone is doing it"

"Tell people who they are" Give people an identity they'd want to assume

Well thats a wrap.... anyone who has found this book practical to their real world seductions please chime in...........

 

[BeyondCharm]

Jayer,

You've done a great job and this book will undoubtedly resurface in your thinking during encounters and situations as it has mine. The key I've found is to develop an intuition so that in every questionable situation, we have the answers to the problem we are facing intuitively. I use a book like this more as a measuring stick of my intuition than I do as a "If this happens, do that", otherwise my actions seem forced and contrived and people will see that.

My perspective is that to be a man, you must be congruent. Your actions and words, your ideals and actions, your beliefs and ideals, they must match up. They must function in a working relationship with the way you interact with people.

This is a very important chapter..... there needs to be more mention of agressive moves on this forum... they work and are necessary when the time is right.... This forum seems to mention playing games... not answering calls right away.... calling back.... flattering etc.... too much of this puts us in the mindset where we don't look to make a bold move

from my personal experience its neccessary!

 

[Reyaj]

Jayer,

You've done a great job and this book will undoubtedly resurface in your thinking during encounters and situations as it has mine. The key I've found is to develop an intuition so that in every questionable situation, we have the answers to the problem we are facing intuitively. I use a book like this more as a measuring stick of my intuition than I do as a "If this happens, do that", otherwise my actions seem forced and contrived and people will see that.

My perspective is that to be a man, you must be congruent. Your actions and words, your ideals and actions, your beliefs and ideals, they must match up. They must function in a working relationship with the way you interact with people.

Thank you..... The reason I wanted to study this book is because I feel it really tries to grab the essence of the underlying premises of seduction... more so than a lot of modern books i.g. mystery method

I think your short paragraph is profound... and probably the real key to being a DJ as opposed to all this DHV, wait 3 days and call, BS.... I don't mean to trounce on the methods here because I do use a lot of them and they have helped me tremendously.... I just think a lot of us take it too literal at times.. and as you say try to use it as a science instead of an ART

I'd love to hear any real world seductions you've pulled off using congruency...

 

[dingdongbell]

Master the Art of the Bold Move

Could someone please elaborate more on this chapter.

Making that first move is something that has always made me rather nervous... I know what I need to do .. but why then does my damn mind not do what it knows......

 

[Blue Phoenix]

The beginning

Never got curious how Greene could come up with this wealth of info about seduction? Probably it was not from sosuave!

Guys I don´t know if this has been posted but that´s how everything started:

"When I began to work on this book, I very quickly encountered a problem. The problem was that unlike with my first work on Power, in which there were hundreds of excellent books that I could draw upon as sort of primary source material, with seduction there was virtually nothing. You could count on one hand the number of interesting books written on the subject. And so I realized rather early on that I was basically on my own, that I would have to formulate my own ideas and theories on the subject. And so I decided to devise a method. The method was that I would make a grand sweep through history. I would read biographies and memoirs of the greatest seducers and seductresses in history. And I would read accounts of great political seductions. And perhaps in this way the ideas and theories that I needed would come to me. And so I started this rather painstaking process of research. And soon enough certain themes began to emerge; although each of these seductions that I was reading about were quite different, I noticed the same pattern repeating over and over.

The problem is that in the modern world, if you seem too obvious, if you are too manipulative, too forceful, too imperious with your power, people will hate you and their resentment of your power or ambition will create a backlash—they will work against you, sabotage you, limit your power. With seduction, however, there is rarely any backlash or resentment. The seducer is a person who in some ways attracts transgressive thoughts, gives us pleasure, leads us on an adventure, injects some drama in our drab lives. We do not resent their power because they have given us something positive that we cannot get on our own. And so that is why I call seduction the ultimate form of power, particularly in these delicate times. There is really no defense against an expert seducer.

The truth is that every human encounter has a sexual undertone, every interaction is a potential seduction. And so, I want to finish tonight by talking about a particular seducer in the book who illustrates this idea, and one of my favorite characters in the book, Benjamin Disraeli. One princess who fell under his spell, wrote about Disraeli and his arch nemesis, William Gladstone: “When I left the dining room after sitting next to Mr. Gladstone, I thought he was the cleverest man in England. But after sitting next to Mr. Disraeli, I thought I was the cleverest woman in England.” He was a charmer, and if you read his diaries you know that this was all a conscious effort on his part.

Source: http://www.seducersworld.com/articles.html

 

[Blue Phoenix]

So How Seductive Are You? Rate Your Skills

SEDUCTION QUESTIONAIRE-your seduction IQ

1. Of the following four types of people to seduce, which one would you choose?

a. A man or woman who is your opposite-physically and emotionally.
b. A man or a woman who seems to have a lot in common with you-you have great and lengthy conversations.
c. A man or woman who fits your physical type, shares characteristics of your previous lovers.
d. A man or a woman who effects you in ways you cannot verbalize, does not fit any previous type.

2. At a social affair you spot the man or woman you would like to seduce. Your goal is to attract their attention and get them to think about you, after the night is over. The best way to do this is to:

a. Never say a word, but flirt with your eyes. They won´t forget the looks you give them.
b. Confuse them, play hot and cold-you seem intriguing, hard to figure out.
c. Stand out from the crowd, say something provocative, do something daring.
d. Play coy, ignore them, make them come to you.

3. The seduction has begun and you are getting to know each other. In talking about your past experiences and conquests, you should:

a. Downplay the others, give them the feeling that they are the first real love of your life, that you have never really ever seduced anyone.
b. Keep them in the dark, refuse to open up about this-the less they know the better.
c. Brag about your past conquests, make it clear they're not the first nor the last, make them feel jealous.
d. Let them know indirectly-old love letters "accidently" left in the open, etc.-that you have had many passionate affairs.

4. You have had a few dates and you are trying to decide where to go on the next one. A good ploy is to:

a. Be pliant and let them decide, showing how agreeable and easygoing you can be.
b. Without asking, take them to a place that fits their tastes, as far you have been able to ascertain in your first few encounters.
c. Without asking, take them to a place of your choosing, a place you think is exciting. This will show how bold and decisive you can be.
d. Take turns. You decided last time, so they should decide this time. Everything should be 50/50.

5. Early on in the seduction it is best to:

a. Let them know how strongly you feel towards them, with words or a poem or an extravagant gesture. This will bowl them over, sweep them off their feet.
b. Assume the role of the caring friend, while hinting at the possibility of something more between you. This will create an intriguing sexual tension.
c. Suddenly ignore them, turn a cold shoulder. This will shake them up and want you more.
d. Make them feel completely comfortable and relaxed in your presence-they can trust you. This will lower their defenses.

6. We are all a mix of masculine and feminine qualities. To be a more effective seducer you should:

a. Display those qualities that are unabashedly masculine or feminine, appropriate to your gender. There's not enough of this in the world.
b. Occasionally display a touch of the opposite sex, some sensitivity or aggressiveness.
c. Be overtly androgynous. There's nothing as exciting as outright gender-bending.
d. Be yourself and not worry about it.

7. A few weeks into the seduction it is time to do something that will create a lasting impression, an act that will surprise and charm them. The best way to do this is to:
a. Whisk them away to an exciting location, without any advance notice. You are so unpredictable.
b. Do something that reveals a new aspect to your character-show an unsuspected boldness or kindness.
c. Give them an expensive gift-you sacrificed your savings and will do anything to please them.
d. Get them in bed. Nothing will seal their affections faster.

8. The best way to seduce with words is to:

a. Tell the truth. Nothing is more seductive than honesty and sincerity.
b. Say things that are humorous, lighthearted and occasionally poetic, avoiding the sentimental.
c. Say things that will flatter and stroke their ego, making them feel the center of attention.
d. Say "I love you," and other romantic expressions. Nobody tires of that.

9. The person you are seducing is coming over to your house for the first time. You should:

a. Leave the house the way it is. It is better for him or her to know the real you, to show no insecurities on your part.
b. Not change much but enhance the atmosphere with flowers, a gift, good food, little details.
c. Create a total sensual atmosphere to overwhelm them with desire, crowned by your luxuriant bedroom.
d. Keep it sparse and clean-they should be paying attention to you, not the atmosphere.

10. You want the other person to be thinking about you more and more, when you are not in their presence. After a few weeks of involvement, the best way to stimulate such thoughts is to:

a. Go away for a while. Absence makes the heart grow fonder.
b. Give them lots of gifts, flowers and mementos. When they see such things, they will think of you.
c. See and phone them less often, but send them insinuating letters, emails, messages.
d. Assail them with phone calls and visits. You are literally everywhere and they can't help but think of you.

 

[Blue Phoenix]

11. To advance the seduction, you may want to take them away for a few days, go on a trip. The ideal location would be:

a. A beautiful, somewhat isolated island, one they have never been to before.
b. A place with lots of entertainment and diversions. They won't be able to think of work or worries, and will associate you with pleasure and fun.
c. A city or place where they have some friends and/or memories, a place they know and cherish. The thoughtfulness of such a gesture will charm them.
d. A very expensive hotel. There are no limits in what you will spend or do for them.

12. After a few weeks of seducing you sense that your victim has become more resistant and suspicious. You should:

a. Do some action that is self-sacrificing-help with some problem, go out on the limb for their sake.
b. Take a step back, give them room to breathe, leave them alone for a while.
c. Give up and find a better person to seduce. Life is too short.
d. Push and advance your cause with even more zeal, even going so far as to make them feel bad for resisting you.

13. We all have a dark side. As far as you can help it, it is generally best to:

a. Play up this dark side, show off your devilish qualities. People are drawn to those who are overtly transgressive.
b. Cover up the dark part of your character and play up what is good and kind about you. Those are rare and seductive qualities.
c. Relax and be yourself. It is not seductive to play games or mislead people about who you are.
d. Reveal a slight devilish streak, a touch of the sinister. This will fascinate instead of frighten your seductive victims.

14. A point is always reached in which you want to turn the psychological seduction into something physical. The best way to heat up the other person and put them in a lustful mood is to:

a. Initiate some slight physical contact-a brush up, a whisper in the ear-enough to get them thinking.
b. Utter some intoxicating, romantic words, insinuating but easily understood.
c. Initiate some strong physical contact, go on the attack, giving them no time to have second thoughts or become defensive.
d. Give them some provocative, flirtatious looks. That will get their blood racing.

15. You sense that the other person is ready and the time has come to finish off the seduction. In general, the most exciting climax is achieved by:

a. Waiting a little and then surprising the victim with an unexpected bold move.
b. Taking a step back, so that the other person has to become the aggressor, an exciting turning of the tables.
c. Going halfway. It is much more satisfying if the final move is shared and equal.
d. Attacking the moment you sense they are ready. No good can come from waiting or postponing.

16. The seduction is over and the two of you are settling into a relationship. Now it is time to:

a. Keep seducing. You can't let up for an instant. The best relationships involve constant seductions and tension.
b. Settle down and get to know each other. If you keep playing seductive games, it will backfire.
c. Withdraw a little and make the other person seduce you. No one should take you for granted.
d. Let things slow down, but occasionally inject a seductive surprise, or coquettish maneuver.

17. The seduction is over, you're bored and you want to move on to greener pastures. The best way to do this is to:

a. Let your victim down gently and slowly. There's no good in hurting people with an abrupt breakup.
b. Make the break clean and quick. You have to be cruel to be kind.
c. Don't break up but keep them in your stable, while you secretly move on to your next victim. If they find out or complain, then let them go.
d. Overwhelm them with love and relentless attention. They will grow bored and initiate the breakup.

18. The person you want to seduce was once a promiscuous rake or siren, but now has settled down or changed his or her ways. The best way to approach such a type is to:

a. Leave them alone. They have reformed, want to settle down and will be unwilling victims, not what you want.
b. Go on the attack. Be as seductive and alluring as possible-the old desires will quickly return to life.
c. Befriend them. Take the slow, cautious approach, appealing to their newfound desire to settle down.
d. Play the coquette. Show you're interested, then pull back and make them chase you. They live for the hunt.

19. The person you want to seduce is physically beautiful and admired by many for his or her beauty. The best way to seduce such a type is to:

a. Play to their strengths and flatter them about their body, worship their beauty. You dare not stir up any insecurities in this area.
b. Play to their weakness and flatter their mind, making them feel that you are interested in them because of their intellect or character.
c. Don't bother. Such types are very difficult to seduce and there's way too much competition anyway.
d. Make them feel validated about both their mind and body-you can never go too far with such types.

20. The person you want to seduce is quite shy, cautious and even conservative in their behavior. The best way to ensnare such a type is to:

a. Don't try. Such people make for unsatisfying, resistant victims.
b. Enter their spirit-be somewhat cautious and timid as well. They will slowly open up.
c. Play up your naughty, rebellious qualities. They secretly crave adventure, and through you they can have it.
d. Play the coquette and get them to do some of the chasing. They yearn to break out of their shell and play such a role.

Source and key:
http://www.seducersworld.com/rateskills.html

 

[BlackJackal]

bump

 

[Proselytiser]

Anyone else read 33 Strategies of War and found it a great book for guiding your strategics in LTRs? I guess you have to first accept that LTRs are like battlegrounds where strategy is imperative... I have no problem appreciating this. Any woman worth her salt should be a challenge...

 

[Reyaj]

I actually haven't Proselytiser but its definitely one I'd like to read. Can you share some of the wisdom this book provides?

 

[Poonani Maker]

http://www.humanthermodynamics.com/RP/Seduction.html

 

[Proselytiser]

I actually haven't Proselytiser but its definitely one I'd like to read. Can you share some of the wisdom this book provides?

I'm in the middle of it, but some I found especially useful

Offensive warfare is the best section, with

Know Your Enemy: The Intelligence Strategy - should be clear how this is useful. Can't really get anywhere without it

Control the dynamic: forcing strategies - 'Instead of trying to dominate the other side's every move, work to define the nature of the relationship itself' - pretty much common sense here I guess

Hit them where it hurts: The centre-of-gravity strategy - 'Everyone has a source of power on which he or she depends'. An example from the book is Scipio Africanus defeating Hannibal: 'at every turn he looked not at the enemy army, not even at its leader, but at the pillar of support on which it stood', and attacked the money, supplies, public goodwill and allies that were the army's 'foundations'.

Divide and conquer: 'look at the parts that make up the whole' and separate them. Ie, pick apart a girlfriend's attempts at controlling behaviour and react to each aspect separately

Maneuver them into weakness is another

Sorry I can't go into much greater detail at the moment

 

[Trader]

This book is such a gem

I have applied and used so many of the principles in this book

2 caveats

1) If you are interested in quick sex - don't bother opening this book. This book is on seduction, which requires, yes REQUIRES time and patience. This is not pick-up

2) If you are interseted in *tactics* and quick tricks such as negs, - don't bother opening this book. This book is designed to mould your PERSONALITY into a seductive and attractive one.

I have used this book for over 2 years and I really notice the difference now in my interactions with people. In social situations, people will start to flock to you and want to get to know you.

 

[Crissco]

Im looking to expand my reading on seduction. Are there any other books anyone would recommend?

 

[Blue Phoenix]

Emotional Blackmail by Susan Forward.

It may seen counter intuitive, however it teaches you all kinds of manipulation people will try to use against you. With this knowledge you will be able to stick to your frame and not give in to their demands. In the end it will make you wayyy more attractive because you´ll be strong.

 

[Reyaj]

Emotional Blackmail by Susan Forward.

It may seen counter intuitive, however it teaches you all kinds of manipulation people will try to use against you. With this knowledge you will be able to stick to your frame and not give in to their demands. In the end it will make you wayyy more attractive because you´ll be strong.

I will have to check this out!

 

[020204]

Am in the process of reading this book and finishing off The 48 Laws of Power. This is great reading. I am also doing a self hypnosis program based on The book which goes into a trance like state into the archetypes of seduction, the rake, the star, the charmer, the charamastic, perfect lover. I will tell you how I go. It is a 90 day program which thoroughly programs these traits and techniques through deep trance and self hypnosis. David Greene is a great writer. It is very powerful knowledge.

 

[Reyaj]

Am in the process of reading this book and finishing off The 48 Laws of Power. This is great reading. I am also doing a self hypnosis program based on The book which goes into a trance like state into the archetypes of seduction, the rake, the star, the charmer, the charamastic, perfect lover. I will tell you how I go. It is a 90 day program which thoroughly programs these traits and techniques through deep trance and self hypnosis. David Greene is a great writer. It is very powerful knowledge.

wow that hypnosis program sounds very interesting.... definitely post your feedback. Do you have a link to where I can check it out?