Testosterone

cheeseater

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How do I raise test levels? Mine are pretty average but I enjoy having them high. It really affects what I end up doing and how much energy I have. I always want to do things and have laser focus when I'm on a test high, you know what I mean? Socializing and having fun become so much easier. The difference is astronomical, like some days I'm bored and tired and other days I'm on NZT. I noticed going to the gym helps a lot. If you guys have any other experience with what I could do to boost test levels some more help a bro out!
 

VladPatton

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muscleman said:
Lift weights regularly and eat enough protein to gain muscle mass. Train your legs. Go to bodybuilding.com to get started if you're newer to lifting.

True that...everything you ever want is on that site
 

.50Cal

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Your age is also a factor. If you're young your test level should be soaring. Its when you hit 35 or so that the decline is noticeable. There is always HRT if it is effecting you badly. Working out and getting plenty of sleep is about the best test booster there is aside from injecting.
 

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foreverAFC

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if you are older you can get it legally as anti aging therapy.
 

d!ckmojo

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Eating a diet high in saturated fat and mono-unsaturated fat certainly helps the body to produce T.

ON the herbal/supps side of things, I personally take ZMA, nettle root extract and chrysin, not specifically to raise T, but to prevent the conversion of existing T into DHT/estrogen, and to reduce the activity of Sex Hormone Binding Globulin.

It works good. But yeah, you got to lift heavy weights, every day if possible. In fact, more than once a day would be ideal, just like short bursts. I go to crossfit every day, but at all other times, like, I'll just be like, on the hour every hour doing 15 pushups. And then the next day do 5 pullups on the hour every hour, you know, in addition to my crossfit training. I feel it helps to keep T elevated.
 

muscleman

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^ don't do what he said. A diet high in SATURATED fat? I hope that was a typo. Saturated fat = heart disease = death.

If you're newer, educate yourself on the fundamentals and this isn't the site for it. If you're new to lifting and want to build a good foundation, Starting Strength book by Mark Rippetoe/Ron Kilgore is very good.



This should be moved to health and fitness if it's a discussion about exercise as opposed to just test boosting (of course exercise is the only natural way).
 

In2theGame

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Anadrol lol nah just Lift heavy weights, Keep your diet in check and Take some Vitamins.
 

JohnChops

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high in saturated fat ... lol dont eat to much of it unless you want to go to the ER with clogged arteries. Just lift and control your diet. More fat= more estrogen in your body.

You could take something like PES Erase to reconfigure your t-levels if you wanted but honestly stick to a good diet and working out. Lean your body out on its own.
 

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Quiksilver

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lol

so much misinformation in this thread, especially in the last few posts.
 

DonJuanabe

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Have you gone to an endocrinologist and had your testosterone level checked? What about other hormones? Often the problem isn't testosterone per se but other hormones that interfere with it. Assuming you've had it checked what is your level and what is your age?
 

d!ckmojo

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EDIT: I didn't just make that up, I research things before I try them, and then if they work for me, then I advise others. You don't have to believe me, but at least respect the research I've done.

Now, a 5 second google search could have yielded you this article: http://www.t-nation.com/free_online_article/most_recent/the_truth_about_saturated_fat

which says:
• Saturated fats positively affect hormonal function. To be more specific, free Testosterone levels tend to be higher in those who include saturated fats in their diet. Free Testosterone should be a big deal to you, as it helps with muscle growth, tissue repair, immune system strength, and your sexual function.

Low-fat diets also increase Sex Hormone-Binding Globulin levels (SHBG). SHBG is a protein that grabs or binds to Testosterone, effectively making less free Testosterone available for your body. In my experience in working with athletes with low Testosterone levels, diets rich in saturated fats are the best way to deliver increased strength and size by natural means.
Don't disagree with me w/out evidence, please. It pisses me off.

EDIT: Also, regarding the supps, there is scientific as well as narrative evidence to support their use. I personally don't put as much weight on Random Placebo Controlled Trials as I do on people's own reported narrative experience (and my own experience), because I believe placebo is a good thing, that we should be trying to maximise the placebo effect, not trying to eliminate it. And anyway, I don't believe those RCT trials are accurate, because they pretend to be able to control for all variables, whereas, in real life, there is no way to control for all variables, because there are causative factors too subtle for us to even be aware of, for e.g. Quantum Physics shows that even just the act of observing alters the outcome of the experiment.

But anyway, here is a story I just found with a 5 second google search about Nettle Root Extract and SHBG: http://anabolicminds.com/forum/male-anti-aging/77770-nettle-root-extract.html

I had "okay", but not really decent levels of Total T - but very poor Free T while on various transdermal gels (AndroGel, Testim). I was - it turned out - a very poor skin absorber. I also had elevated Total Estrogens and elevated E2. And elevated (high normal range - but very high normal range) of SHBG.

We switched to Test Cyp IM injections (first 100 mg a week and then 50 mg twice a week). E2 was helped significantly - but still above reference range noticeably. SHBG pretty much unchanged. Total T now pretty darn good... but Free T still on the poor side (my Lab switched from numbers of percentage figures during the course of this, but the reference range was - as I recall - 1.0% to 3.1%). Prior to switching to IM injections, my Total T was generally (even with higher doses of gels) under 475. I hit 500 once (reference range of 220 - 1000). Anyway, after switching to IM injections, SHBG was still up there and so Free T levels were around 1.9 - 2.1 range.

I then began a regimen (with NO other changes) of taking nettles root extract (300 mg tablet of 5% extract ONCE a day). When I was next tested (about 6 weeks later), my SHBG was in the range of 18 - 20... and my Free T was 3.3%. Since then, my SHBG has stayed in that same range and my Free T levels have ran in the range of 3.0 - 3.4% consistently.

I cannot say this will work for everybody simply due to the fact that there can be multiple unrelated reasons for elevated SHBG. And then we are all different when it comes to how we respond to various medications, herbals, etc.

For example, I have read many anecdotal stories of males who have done well (or at least "okay") in regards to controlling their estrogens via either DIM or transdermal Chrysin (as long as it has been micropulverized) or even a micropulverized DIM / Chrysin compounded mixture. Yet I personally had NO real help in using any of those combinations. The best that I got was in using very high doses of Rite Aid's brand DIM (about three times the recommended amount)... and yet I only achieved an extremely small improvement in my E2 levels - while Total Estrogen levels increased by over 25%!

Also... going by how you feel obviously has a degree of importance, but I would also recommend getting the Labs done - even if just SHBG and Free T - to see if the compound or extract is doing what it is supposed to be doing... or are you simply obtaining a placebo effect that is going to be only short to medium term?

BTW....

It HAS to be nettles root EXTRACT... not powdered nettles root (not strong enough) nor nettles leaf powder or etract (the leaves don't contain the active ingredients necessary.

And it should be a strong extract (8:1 ratio for example means that 8 unts of nettles root barks was concentrated down to 1 unit of extract). Also, it is NOT really dose dependent. I achieved my results on taking 300 mgs of the root extract at a level of once a day. I imagine that it might be possible that too strong a dose of too much root extract could drive SHBG levels too low... IF they work for you.
 

muscleman

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I give up. Yes, eat your saturated fats, just go buy a gallon of butter now.

Heart disease is the #1 cause of death. Obesity (and its side effects) is the #1 cause of heart disease. Consumption of high amounts of calorically dense foods (which are primarily stuffed with saturated fats) is the leading cause of obesity.

Forget all these supplement websites. Just go to pubmed. Better yet, go to your local hospital.

Or keep posting 'scientific' studies that have never had any significant testing comparative to that of the medical community.

Fvck it, I'll go put some sugar in a pill, call it a 'proprietary blend', and make it a supplement. Legally, I can do that.
 

d!ckmojo

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muscleman said:
I give up. Yes, eat your saturated fats, just go buy a gallon of butter now.

Heart disease is the #1 cause of death. Obesity (and its side effects) is the #1 cause of heart disease. Consumption of high amounts of calorically dense foods (which are primarily stuffed with saturated fats) is the leading cause of obesity.

Forget all these supplement websites. Just go to pubmed. Better yet, go to your local hospital.

Or keep posting 'scientific' studies that have never had any significant testing comparative to that of the medical community.

Fvck it, I'll go put some sugar in a pill, call it a 'proprietary blend', and make it a supplement. Legally, I can do that.
No, I never said eat a gallon of butter. But for example, a diet high in Animal Tissue is not just high in Protein, but is high in Saturated fat as well, and THAT is the sort of diet that our species evolved on.

From that awesome Chaos and Pain blog Krueg put me on to: http://chaosandpain.blogspot.com.au/2010/03/metabolic-typing-gets-in-mix-finally.html

Paleolithic nutrition is still the basis of any sane dietary prescription due to the fact that the human genome has changed less that .02% in the last 40,000 years.(PD 9) In the grand scheme of things, that seems unimportant, as homo sapiens have been around for around a million years. They, however, didn't diverge from Neanderthals, who were almost exclusively carnivorous, until around 250,000-500,000 years ago, however. That means that as recently as 250,000 years ago, humanity was as carnivorous as tigers. Cro-magnons, who sort of bridged the physical gap between neanderthals and homo sapiens sapiens didn't even arise until 36,000 years ago, so the fact that we've only had a deviation of .02% of our genetic code since before Cro-magnons arose is significant.(TPG 157-158) Given our similarities to pre-modern humans, it would stand to reason we share many of the same dietary requirements as our pre-modern ancestors.
The other point from that same article which I found interesting was this
Roger Williams, the father of the modern concept of Biochemical Individuality, claimed that "every individual organism that has a distinctive genetic background has a distinctive nutritional need which must be met for optimal well-being." (BI 190) The American Medical Association, supplement companies, and your doctors will have you believe differently- we're all exactly the same organic machines propelled through life utilizing the exact same nutritional regimen, and requiring precisely the same fuel for our biological powerplants. until recently, most in the scientific community refused to even acknowledge the need for differing nutrition in elite athletes, believing instead that a Centrum was nutritional overkill, and that everyone needed the precise 60-30-10 ratio of carbohydrates, protein, and fat to achieve optimal health. If that makes sense to you, consider this- the Roman philosopher Lucretius, who was a student of Epicurus (the founder of the eponymous school of philosophy based on the belief that pleasure is the chief good in life), stated 2300 years ago that "what is food for one man may be fierce poison to others."(MM 185) Thus, practitioners of modern medicine have actually regressed in their understanding of human nutrition, much like the astronomers' adoption of geocentrism and abandonment of heliocentrism in the Dark Ages.
You see? Medical science can get fvcked. Oh sure, some of it is good, but to take it as the be all and end all of knowledge? Get fvcked. For example, people nowadays say that ZMA is useless, because of some tiny study with 27 people in Germany which found no effect on Testosterone from taking ZMA.

But hang on a minute! Each and every human being's metabolism and hormonal/endocrine system, digestive system, their whole organism potentially reacts differently to the same substance!

How do you know that those 27 people weren't all part of the same specific (yet currently unknown) endocrine/metabolism sub-type, and thus reacted to the ZMA in a way that was atypical?

Or, to put it another way, say ZMA only works for 5% of the population, and since "scientific" testing is cut off at P=0.05, all the science types come to the conclusion that ZMA is completely ineffectual.

But, well, what if the OP, is part of that 5% of the population that ZMA DOES work for? If he listened to your type of advice, he'd never get the benefits from in that he could've had, because you're a close-minded fool.

In reality, I think its far more likely that ZMA works for 80-90% of the male population, and that that German study was just an outlier, probably due to subtle variables that weren't controlled for because they weren't even recognised as causative factors, because there's no way they could even have known about ALL the myriad subtle causative factors. Like, say the particular water that they drink in Berlin is high is zinc, right, higher than anywhere else in the world. So then, when they test ZMA, they say "oh, it has no effect on the 27 guys from Berlin so ZMA must be useless".

But infact, it useless precisely because of an uncontrolled-for variable, which no one even knew about, and so this is the reason why I am always sceptical of "scientific" studies, and trust way more in the narrative experiential evidence of real life people in real life situations.
 

Voice

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muscleman said:
I give up. Yes, eat your saturated fats, just go buy a gallon of butter now.

Heart disease is the #1 cause of death. Obesity (and its side effects) is the #1 cause of heart disease. Consumption of high amounts of calorically dense foods (which are primarily stuffed with saturated fats) is the leading cause of obesity.

Forget all these supplement websites. Just go to pubmed. Better yet, go to your local hospital.

Or keep posting 'scientific' studies that have never had any significant testing comparative to that of the medical community.

Fvck it, I'll go put some sugar in a pill, call it a 'proprietary blend', and make it a supplement. Legally, I can do that.
Obesity is absolutely an epidemic but most likely the population looking to "increase their testosterone levels" are the the body building/athletic types. How many of these types are fighting to ward off their obesity? Very few, if any. Those who are healthy and exercise regularly won't really have a problem with increasing their saturated fat intake slightly. It's those who are already unhealthy and are already eating high levels of saturated fats that should worry (along with those who have a genetic predisposition for high cholesterol/heart disease).

Obesity has more to do with a sedentary lifestyle combined with cheap food that is generally unhealthy to consume along with the amounts of HIGH FRUCTOSE CORN SYRUP in foods made in the US. There have been studies that have shown that rats who have taken a specific amount of calories in high fructose corn syrup compared to rats who consumed an equal amount in glucose gained significantly MORE weight. Other studies show that those with diets high in HFCS had more layers of fat around internal organs such as the heart and liver when compared to diets low in HFCS. It doesn't help that our government subsidizes HFCS which makes it cheap for companies to make their foods with it.
 

Voice

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d!ckmojo said:
Medical science can get fvcked. Oh sure, some of it is good, but to take it as the be all and end all of knowledge?
Medical science doesn't say that one study is the end all of all knowledge. You need repeated results to increase certainty. There was another study in 2004 that said ZMA did not increase free testosterone levels as well. Two studies is a hell of a lot stronger than one study. It is statistically highly unlikely that ZMA does what balco labs says it does. If you wanna call ZMA a testosterone booster than that would make sense if someone was low in zinc but then again I could call water a testosterone booster if someone was dehydrated.
 

marmel75

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muscleman said:
^ don't do what he said. A diet high in SATURATED fat? I hope that was a typo. Saturated fat = heart disease = death.

If you're newer, educate yourself on the fundamentals and this isn't the site for it. If you're new to lifting and want to build a good foundation, Starting Strength book by Mark Rippetoe/Ron Kilgore is very good.



This should be moved to health and fitness if it's a discussion about exercise as opposed to just test boosting (of course exercise is the only natural way).
muscleman said:
^ don't do what he said. A diet high in SATURATED fat? I hope that was a typo. Saturated fat = heart disease = death.

If you're newer, educate yourself on the fundamentals and this isn't the site for it. If you're new to lifting and want to build a good foundation, Starting Strength book by Mark Rippetoe/Ron Kilgore is very good.



This should be moved to health and fitness if it's a discussion about exercise as opposed to just test boosting (of course exercise is the only natural way).
No, this is WRONG, WRONG, WRONG!!!!!

Actually he is correct. Saturated fats->cholesterol->testosterone

Saturated fats get an undue bad rap. Trans fats and hydrogenated fats are much, much worse for the body. No legitimate study has ever shown that saturated fats are bad for your health. All of this stems from one flawed study in the 1950's by a researcher named Ancel Keys blaming the increase in heart disease on dietary fat intake, specifically saturated fats.

The problem with the study was that he only used data from certain countries that seemed to support his position and ignored others where it didn't, and that he took no other factors into consideration. In fact, many studies after him have been done and there has never been any correlation to saturated fats and heart disease found in any of them. When researchers went back and looked over the same data he looked at, they still found no correlation between the two, so his conclusion was simply erroneous. However, as is usually the case, the first study done and its conclusion is what is ingrained in people's minds and is constantly repeated even though it has no basis in reality.

To dispel this notion, look no further than native eskimos who eat very few fruits and vegetables, and get roughly 50% of their calories from animal fats, yet have lower rates of heart disease and cancer than Americans. In fact, Dr. Weston Price a dentist who became absolutely obsessed with finding out about the health of indiginous peoples throughout the world and traveled extensively to these places to research and live among them. What he found was that diets high in fat and meat were the secret to their health. In fact, he found that once Native Americans switched their diet from animal based to grain based(maize, etc), their incidence of disease skyrocketed and diseases they had never had before suddenly became rampant. Not surprising since grains are actually "anti-nutrients" due to their high levels of phytic acid, which actually steals vitamins and minerals from the body and flushes them out.

A group of African tribes, the Masai, Samburu, and Fulani, also eat tons of red meats, raw milk and cows blood, and have a dietary saturated fat intake over 5 times the level of Americans. They also have low body fat percentages, and heart disease and diabetes are almost unheard of there. Pacific Island nations who have very high intake of saturated fats from coconut and palm oils have similar rates of heart disease and diabetes---that is almost none.

However, when these native people moved away from their tribes and started eating a typical "Western diet", their disease profiles and factors skyrocketed.

What most people don't realize, is that saturated fats, while they can increase your LDL cholesterol("bad" cholesterol), they actually INCREASE your body's HDL cholesterol("good" cholesterol) MORE, thereby making you healthier, not sicker by increasing the ratio of the two.

In fact, diets high in processed carbs and LOW in saturated fats have been found to be the most likely to result in heart disease. The REAL heart disease risks are:

-Trans fats also known as hydrogenated oils
-Inflamation causing heavily refined vegetable oils such as soy, cottonseed, corn oil, etc which typically throw the omega-6/omega-3 balance out of whack..
-Too much refined sugar of any type in the diet - especially HFCS (high fructose corn syrup)
-Too many processed, denatured refined carbohydrates such as white bread, flour, white pasta, low fiber cereals, etc
-Smoking
-Stressful lifestyle
-Lack of exercise
-Lack of sleep and Other lifestyle factors

as you can see, the top 4 food related causes are rampant in America and its no wonder we are a nation of fat @sses that is getting fatter every minute of every day.

Please lets stop the misinformation from flawed studies 60+ years ago that have since been proven to be false many times over and lets get our facts straight.

If you want to increase testosterone, increase saturated fat intake. Coconut Oil and Olive Oil(although this is a monounsaturated oil) have been shown to be tremendously helpful in boosting testosterone levels by enhancing the ability of the leydig cells in the testicles to absorb cholesterol and enhancing the ability of the enzymes that convert cholesterol into testosterone. The more readily absorbable the cholesterol is, the easier it is to supply to the enzymes for conversion. When the enzymes are enhanced, the conversion is made faster and easier. Eggs are also a tremendous source of saturated fat.
 
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